Lesbian activist fights deportation in Israel

[La_Serpiente]

Lesbian activist fights deportation in Israel

Lesbian human rights and peace activist Kate Raphael remained in custody Tuesday in an Israeli detention center following her arrest last Wednesday while videotaping Israeli military actions in the Palestinian village of Budrus.

Raphael is now fighting plans by Israeli authorities to deport her.

Raphael's supporters planned to demonstrate Tuesday afternoon outside the Israeli Consulate in San Francisco to protest her arrest and pending deportation, and to demand a meeting with the Israeli Consul.

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Lesbian activist fights deportation in Israel

[DarkPhenyx]

1. Gee...what's more important in this story?

That she is a peace and human rights activist or that she is a lesbian?

Why do we feel so damn compelled to highlight what people are as opposed to who they are every damn time someone is gay, or black, or whatever. Jesus H. Christ!

I swaer, one day I am going to hear some reporter say "and today mongrel asshole peace activist Phenyx Darkstar..."

Let's all give it a break already. We know that ya'll are everywhere. So is an equally persecuted group called the Pagans. They, however, don't feel it particularly necessary to wave it out there everytime it isn't germain to the issue.

[La_Serpiente]

2. I was going to say the same thing

maybe I should have put it in my original post.

But it's from a GLBT publication - that is why they mentioned "lesbian".

[DarkPhenyx]

3. And there is that.

Much as I'd like to sometimes I can't fault niche publications for marketing to their niche readership. I just gets vexing sometimes. I know it definately feeds into the RW hysteria that we are "pushing the homosexual agenda" on America.

[mobuto]

5. Reminds me of a headline seen

in a newspaper from the shtetl Plonsk in prewar Poland:

"Revolution in China: Good for the Jews."

When you're interested in only one issue, it makes for a rather bizarre news coverage.

[VelmaD]

18. You forgot "cute"

"and today CUTE mongrel asshole peace activist Phenyx Darkstar..." ;-)

Otherwise you know I agree with your basic point. It would be really nice if we lived in a world where people either didn't notice or didn't care about the differences that are used to divide us. :-)

[Muddleoftheroad]

4. Foreign activists

Have no legal right to stay in Israel and stir trouble.

I will say, that I agree with the above statements about her sexual preference. In effect, who cares?

[bluesoul]

6. LOL

so much for democracy. Stirring trouble?

[Muddleoftheroad]

7. Citizens

Have a perfect right to protest. There is no inherent right to visit and stir trouble. Most nations take a dim view of that.

The irony here is imagine what would happen if you tried the reverse. How long would one of the pro-Israel posters here last if we went to the West Bank and tried recording what the enemies of Israel were doing?

[bluesoul]

8. So because THEY do it WE can

Then you're no better...

[Muddleoftheroad]

9. Huh?

Pretty much every nation doesn't give carte blanche to visitors. If you are here and you cause trouble, you get deported. In the Palestinian West Bank, you wouldn't live through the experience.

No comparison.

[GabysPoppy]

10. Makes you wonder

Why that is a hard concept to grasp.

:shrug:

[Gimel]

27. I think that the QUIT

seminars should be reversed. That is Israelis giving the American activists a tour of what's been happening in Israel over the past 3 years. Sounds like they need an education.

[Aidoneus]

11. she wasn't staying in "Israel"

the IWPS is based in Hares, the demonstration in question was at Budrus.. not within a single inch of "Israel".

[Muddleoftheroad]

12. Territory

Territory that is under Israel's control counts as well.

[bluesoul]

13. Oh

really? :crazy:

[Muddleoftheroad]

14. Yep

[Jack Rabbit]

15. Under the present circumstances, yes

Israel is occupying the PT and can determine who comes and goes.

Please don't interpret that as my saying they're doing a nifty, neato keeno job of occupation. Quite obviously, I don't believe that.

However, Ms. Raphael knew that she was engaging in acts that amounted to civil disobedience. She certainly knew that being deported or even killed was among the risks. If she didn't, she should have.

Also, the fact that she is being deported should not be a matter that raises some of the passion here that it does. Again, Israel is within her rights to do so. Now, if IDF soldiers were to start rounding up Palestinian villagers and marching them at gunpoint across the Allenby Bridge, then we'll really have something about which make a hue and cry. If that happens, we'll be tripping over each other to enter the territories, legally or illegally, and "stir up trouble."

[bluesoul]

16. If only Israel held up to all it's obligations

as an occupying power towards Palestinians...

After all it's not only about what favors them, but also their responsibilites. Which they virtually ignore...

[Jack Rabbit]

17. I agree, but not completely

(Sorry to hit and run, but I'm about to go to work.)

First of all, Israel's obligations as an occupying power to the Palestinian people, not visitors to the occupied territory. Again, Ms. Raphael engaged in activity she knew could get her in trouble with authorities. It has. She is putting up token resistance, will lose her case, and leave the country.

Second, that is what civil disobedience is about. One sees an unjust situation and breaks the law as a way of telling the authorities that their authority is an illusion. However, one still accepts the consequences of the action from the authorities. Gandhi operated that way and so did Martin Luther King. Those who go to the Occupied Territories to protest the injustices of the occupation should do no different.

[IndianaGreen]

19. She is Jewish! Under the Law of Return she is an Israeli

"Kate is Jewish, so this is very important to her," said Raphael's friend and fellow activist Julie Starobin.

She is Jewish, which means she is eligible for Israeli citizenship under the Law of Return, unless only rightwing Jews that set foot in Israel can become Israelis.

Is that what this is? Gay Jews need not apply! Peace loving Jews need not apply either!

[bluesoul]

20. Good point

Indiana! Glad to have you here ;)

[GabysPoppy]

21. I may be mistaken, but

wasn't Meyer Lansky rejected for citizenship and he was Jewish.

Would David Berkowitz be accepted?

I believe your indignation is misplaced.

[Aidoneus]

22. stop me if you've heard this one..

A mob boss, a serial killer, and a nonviolent activist walk into a bar.....

[GabysPoppy]

23. Ok, I'll play

They each ask the bartender for a molotov cocktail.

The mob boss says "no thanks we have guns under the mattresses"

The serial killer says "no thanks I know where the mattress is"

The activist says "thanks, I know where I can "regift" it"

[Noon_Blue_Apples]

25. and you speak of 'European humor'

tasteless as that kind of language is...

So you are against non-violent activism? Is it just 'activists' in general? Is it your belief that it is non-violent activists arming militants?

Bill

[bluesoul]

26. I guess some here don't like Europeans

too much...

[GabysPoppy]

29. Please point out the tasteless sentences

Feel free to start with the originator of the joke.

As for your questions:

1) I am not opposed to NON-Violent activism.

2) See answer #1

3) Seeing as I am not arming militants nor am I around when they receive these shipments, I wouldn't accuse or excuse anyone.

Now may I ask you some questions?

1) Are you opposed to the IDF and the GOI protecting the citizens of Israel? If you answer in the affirmative, please suggest who you would put in charge of protection. Pie in the sky answers are not permitted here in lieu of a serious answer.

2) At what point of time does an activist switch his/her status from non-violent to violent? A few examples would be appreciated at the same time.

3) Do you know who is responsible for the arming of terrorists?

4) If you do know the answer to #3 above, what would you do to prevent the loss of lives of innocents.

[Noon_Blue_Apples]

30. what is tasteless

is the use of terms like must be 'European humor' much the same as 'Jewish humor' would be to others. Even though Jackie Mason does kick ass.

1) No - what does that have to do with activists 're-gifting'

2) when they commit a violent act (excluding immediate self defense of life if required) - ie: followers of Gandhi getting chopped down dead by Brits - if he decided there to act to save his life (immediate threat) he would still be non-violent in my books.

3) No

So, why try to equate non-violent activists to mobsters and serial killers? You believe activists are arming militants?

"Seeing as I am not arming militants nor am I around when they receive these shipments, I wouldn't accuse or excuse anyone." No, you were not accusing anyone, certainly not 'Molotov re-gifting activists'

Bill

[GabysPoppy]

31. The term "European humor" does not appear in the post in question

If you are referring to grouping a gangster, serial killer and activist together, your issue is with the poster I was responding to.

I apologize for getting between you and s/he.

[Blitz]

35. Hell,

Crazy Eddie was rejected.

[Gimel]

28. If she wanted

to immigrate she should have gone through the Aliya process. It isn't automatic, you know. Now that she has caused trouble, her application would be rejected.

[IndianaGreen]

32. In other words, only rightwing Jews are welcome to emigrate

Liberal Jews need not bother emigrating to Israel. That's the message that I am hearing here loud and clear.

Israel allowed an avowed racist like Meir Kahane to emigrate, but won't allow Jewish peace activists to "contaminate" her.

[Muddleoftheroad]

33. Not liberal Jews

Just those who work against the state of Israel.

[IndianaGreen]

36. A Jewish version of "Amerika, love it or leave it"?

To oppose the Occupation and to support a peace settlement is considered a threat to the State, as much as it is to oppose the American occupation of Iraq. What's the difference then between Bush's Amerika and Sharon's Ysrael?

[Blitz]

37. You misspelled

both America and Israel. As for the similarities, they have this in common:

Both nations are better, in most every way, than any nation in the Middle East (other than Israel, obviously).

BTW, who is to decide who is and is not a threat to Israel if not Israel itself?

[IndianaGreen]

38. Israel has no "i" in the name, only a yod

as to America, it is more fitting to use the Germanic spelling that was so popular during the Vietnam quagmire.

The Occupation is the greatest threat to Israel, as Iraq's is to us.

[Gimel]

39. If you want to make "Aliya"

Just don't get arrested first. People with a criminal record are generally not accepted. Right wing, left or center.

She would be able to apply, and might get accepted. Being detained for visa violation isn't so bad.

[Blitz]

34. The Law of Return

does not give every Jew on earth the right to go into Israel to cause trouble for Israel. Specifically, the law reads, in relevant part, as follows:

. . .

(b) An oleh's visa shall be granted to every Jew who has expressed his desire to settle in Israel, unless the Minister of Immigration is satisfied that the applicant

(1) is engaged in an activity directed against the Jewish people; or
(2) is likely to endanger public health or the security of the State.

. . .

Really, I thought that you would know this. Right wing Jews are welcome to come live in Israel (but not in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, etc.). Left wing Jews are welcome to come live in Israel (but not in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, etc.). Gay Jews are welcome to come live in Israel (but not in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, etc. ... in fact, if you're gay and Muslim and living in one of those nations, you'd better make a run for Israel too). Straight Jews are welcome to come live in Israel (but not in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, etc.). Anti-Israel Jews, however, are not welcome (but, to be fair, they're not welcome in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, etc. - No Jews, please).

[Soul On Ice]

24. I admire her, after all,

if she had been demonstrating for the other side, she would be fighting decapitation rather than deportation

[Gimel]

40. It wasn't so dangerous after all/nt