Israeli fence 'blocks peace talks'

[Scurrilous]

http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,8395629%5E1702,00.html

<snip>

"ISRAEL'S construction of a barrier through parts of the West Bank is blocking a revival of peace negotiations with the Palestinians, US Middle East envoy William Burns said today.

"We have made it clear (to the Israelis) that the core of our concern is about the course of the separation barrier," he said.

Burns, assistant secretary of state for Near East affairs, was speaking at a news conference following talks with Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak.

He pointed out that Washington had raised its concerns with the Israelis, publicly and privately, pointing to the need to ease the humanitarian problems posed by the barrier and also to show how the barrier is an obstacle to resuming peace talks."

[Gimel]

1. Diplomacy is like that

I doubt that he believes a word of it.

[dudeness]

3. you are quite possibly correct Gimel..

still , I view any attempt to revitalise peace talks as a positive .

[Resistance]

2. comparisons ...

Berlin Wall: 96 miles

Israeli Apartheid Wall: 220 miles


_______________


Berlin Wall: 3.6 metres high

Israeli Apartheid Wall: 8 metres high


_______________

Wire mesh fencing of Berlin Wall: 41 miles

Israeli Apartheid Wall: (?)


_______________


Persons killed along the Berlin Wall: 192

Persons killed along the Israeli Apartheid Wall: 35 (so far)

_______________

Land stolen by Israel: 200 square kilometers

_______________


Berlin Wall info source

Israeli Apartheid Wall info source

[cantwealljustgetalong]

4. the Berlin Wall did not have to prevent...

the deliberate targeting and intentional murder of children and babies...

necessity is the mother of invention...

[Resistance]

5. ah

so who is going to prevent the Israeli army from continuing to target and intentionally murder Palestinian children and babies?

[cantwealljustgetalong]

6. voila...

the Suicide Bomber Prevention Barrier should reduce the need for the operations that have resulted in unfortunate consequences...

[Resistance]

7. ah

so, murders of Israelis is deliberate targeting and murder, yet murders of Palestinians is merely "unfortunate consequences"

:crazy:

[cantwealljustgetalong]

8. ah...

to get back to my original point, Israel does not in reality deliberately target children and babies and intentionally murder them even if, in Goebbals-like fashion, it is repeated over and over again that they do...

[Resistance]

9. yes they do deliberately target innocent civilians

even if the facts are denied over and over again

[cantwealljustgetalong]

10. since it cannot be fudged that...

there is one and only one side that has a policy of deliberate targeting and intentional murder of children and babies, it is understood that you prefer to broaden the focus to civilians to allow for the blurring to creep in...

[Gimel]

12. Maybe your tax dollars

Should be a bit more generous. Israel could spend more money training soldiers and screening out those who might shoot indiscriminately, either through fear or malice.

[The Magistrate]

29. To Answer Your Question In No. 5 Above, Mr. Resistance

The people who can prevent that are the various armed irregular Arab Palestinian bodies, and they can do it by downing arms, and ceasing to attempt to attack Israeli civilians. That will bring these actions by the Israeli forces which so distress you to an end.

[Gimel]

11. How many killed

Of those you mentioned that were killed along the wall, how many of them were Israelis or workers building the wall or security for the workers building the wall? I'll bet close to all of them.

[meti57b]

13. there is wall only in those areas ....

where there exists high vantage points that Palestinian terrorists use to fire weapons into Israeli population centers and highways. The 26ft high wall is for the purpose of blocking the line of sight and fire. Most of the peace fence is chain link fence with a electronic intrusion detection system. This is easily removed or relocated.

[The Stranger]

27. It is actually situated to take in as much land as possible and

for this reason is not a "peace fence" at all.

[meti57b]

28. It is actually situated ... for security and defense ...

to provide warning of intrusion and to block line of sight and fire into centers of population and highways in Israel.

[number6]

31. wrong !! wrong !! wrong !!

..:(

[number6]

30. exactly Right

you got it :thumbsup: ;) "is not a "peace fence" at all."

[cantwealljustgetalong]

14. gee, that sure was interesting...

for an encore, can you provide us a meaningless smoke and mirrors comparison to the Berlin Wall for these other "walls" too?...thanks in advance...


Cyprus
Belfast
India/Pakistan
India/Burma
India/Bangladesh
Spain(Cueta)/Morroco
Botswana/Zimbabwe
Kuwait/Iraq
USA/Mexico
North/South Korea

[bemildred]

15. This is the I/P forum.

Otherwise, I would suggest we add the Great Wall of China,
Hadrian's Wall, The Maginot Line, and the Bar Lev line,
among others, plus some poetry by Robert Frost for the more
sentimentally inclined.

[vierundzwanzig]

16. He is merely making a point

n/t

[bemildred]

19. Who would "he" be?

Resistance I would guess, not CWAJGA.
I am merely making a point too.

I am not without sympathy with Resistance' point of view,
but the situation in Palestine (the geographical area, for the
overly-sensitized) is really quite different from that in Berlin
during the Cold War, and dragging the Berlin Wall into this in
detail tends, in my view, to make an already messy situation even
harder to untangle.

[bluesoul]

20. The Berlin wall

is nothing compared to what is today built...

[Resistance]

17. I like Robert Frost.

[bemildred]

23. Me, too, a little, but I am sadly deaf to most poetry. nt

[GabysPoppy]

18. Just maybe

It should be pointed out that Israel is not the first country that has found it necessary to build a security fence. It seems to have escaped notice. In that context it DOES belong in I/P.

It would hardly be fair for any of your posts comparing situations to events in recent and non recent history to be considered irrelevant because they are not limited to I/P.

[Resistance]

21. If Israel's Berlin Wall had anything to do with security

you might have a point.

[GabysPoppy]

24. So why did you make your post at all?

[bemildred]

22. It was not I that said "meaningless smoke and mirrors comparisons". nt

[cantwealljustgetalong]

25. pardon me for deviating from fundamentalist I/P...

how about we get a meaningless smoke and mirrors comparison between the I/P wall and the walls on my list plus your list...

[bemildred]

26. No pardon required.

Nothing offensive in what you posted.

I partly agree with you, I think one can draw some useful
comparisons among walls and fences and the like in history,
in a general way, but detailed comparisons add little but
rhetorical effect; which I am sure is what Mr. Resistance
was aiming for, and from the reaction I would say that he
succeeded.

[number6]

32. The Maginot Line, would be a good one..

totaly useless

[bemildred]

33. Awwww, you discovered the secret.

:thumbsup:

[lotteandollie]

35. Only because...

...the French were involved.

[Muddleoftheroad]

36. The Great Wall

In another thread, Mr. Scurrilous made the Great Wall of China comparison and I confess I see some similarity. Israel must indeed keep out the barbarian hordes of Palestinian terror groups.

As for the Maginot Line, it was a fine idea, but underfunded, understaffed and incomplete.

[Jim Sagle]

34. With the Peace Fence, no talks are needed.

:thumbsup: