Israeli Bulldozers Flatten 30 Gaza Houses

[DuctapeFatwa]

Israeli army bulldozers flattened 30 houses and a mosque in this refugee camp Tuesday, Palestinian officials said, accusing Israel of systematically razing homes to widen a military buffer zone.

The military said it only targeted buildings from which shots were fired overnight at Israeli forces, but did not know how many structures were demolished. The governor of Rafah, Majed Agha, said about 400 Palestinians were left homeless.

Frantic residents threw mattresses and blankets from second-floor windows as beams and walls came crashing down around them. One woman, standing near a bulldozer, waved a white flag in a failed attempt to slow the demolition and buy time to salvage her belongings. A crying girl helped her mother carry a mattress.

Army officials initially insisted the razed houses had been empty, but then said the claim was still being checked.

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/World/ap20040120_945.html

[tinnypriv]

1. Clever

While everyone else is focused on the nonsense at Kahana College.

Smart bunch, the IDF.

[tinnypriv]

6. Just noticed

That Ha'aretz Hebrew runs both the story of Kahana and the Gaza demolitions side by side (stories "related").

Kudos to them. :thumbsup:

[Bozola]

2. They were terrorist squatters who were trying to set up

propaganda-ridden Swedish art galleries.

The fiends.

....

Why the f*ck does anyone believe a single f*cking word that that f*cking Likud government utters?

[GabysPoppy]

3. I guess

"propaganda-ridden Swedish art galleries.'

makes more sense.

:shrug:

[mmm]

4. what are you talking about?

[GabysPoppy]

7. what did you have a problem understanding?

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ET Awful]

5. From the story . . .

Does this paragraph strike anyone else as being self-contradictory?

"The military said it only targeted buildings from which shots were fired overnight at Israeli forces, but did not know how many structures were demolished."

How can you not know how many buildings you target and only target specific buildings at the same time?

[mmm]

8. for the IDF that is business as usual

sometimes they don't even bother making up excuses.
This unilateral violence is wholly unrelated to Palestinian activity and will continue regardless of whether Palestinians fight back or not.

[Scurrilous]

10. I don't see how they justify this.

I knew someone who lived in Nicaragua during the fighting between Somoza and the Sandanistas. She said her family would lay in bed at night listening to people running across their rooftop firing weapons at each other. All they could do was cower in their beds and pray they didn't get shot.

The IDF knows that the Palestinian fighters are hiding amongst civilians. Do they really think the occupants of these homes gave permission for them to be used as sniper positions? Why does the IDF punish these people for something they probably have no control over?

[frylock]

11. why does the idf punish these people..

because they can, and nobody seems to give a damn. This shit will go on for weeks, with untold casualties. But as soon as someone straps a bomb to them self and explodes a bus or cafe, then you will see the outrage.

[GabysPoppy]

13. Question

Will join in that outrage?

[frylock]

16. absolutely..

I abhor violence on any level. But, it seems to me that killing is just fine for some folks on this board.. so long as it's the right people being killed.

[GabysPoppy]

18. Who might they be?

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[GabysPoppy]

23. I think you are painting with a very broad brush

"They" know who "they" are.

It seems you can make any charge you like with a brush that wide and hope it fits. As far as "big ass stinks", it might be helpful to peruse previous threads here at I/P and you will find quite a few "big ass stinks" if a building is demolished or if a protester is shot.

"they" is a bit of a generalization which other posters have taken a great and horrified stance against.

Enjoy your visit here.

[frylock]

25. enjoy my visit?

I've been a member for two years now. I'm not goin anywhere!! There has been what, one whole suicide bomber over the last several weeks. How many Palestinians have been murdered in that time frame? Where is the outrage at the young pallbearer who was capped by the IDF while carrying his dead friend, who incidentally, was capped by the IDF? Were you as upset about that as you seem to be when Jewish settlers are murdered? Didn't think so.

Thank you, please drive through!!!

on edit: Gaby, I can retract my "they" statement, and name names, but that would constitute a personal attack, which is strictly forbidden.

[Resistance]

26. There was one "lull in violence"

in which 117 Palestinians were killed, mostly civilians, and many children in that group. 500 Palestinian homes were demolished by the IDF during that period.

[lefty_mcduff]

27. I also remember that CNN

Began the story of a suicide bomber with 'six weeks of peace was shattered today". During that six week lull something like 45 Palestinians had been shot, run over by tanks and blown up by Apache Helicpoter strikes (I think targeted killing is the current phrase). The double-standard is sometimes breathtaking.

[frylock]

28. but dude.. four people were killed by a palestinian terrorist </sarc>

thanks for the numbers. I think it helps to drive my point home.

peace.

[GabysPoppy]

29. Your visit to I/P I meant

"Were you as upset about that as you seem to be when Jewish settlers are murdered? Didn't think so."

Were you a "regular" at I/P, you're broad brush might shrink a bit. By using "they", you hope to appear to avoid that which constitutes a personal attack. It may not matter.

[Gimel]

31. There were other attacks

An Israeli was killed by sniper and two others wounded only a day before the suicide attack.

A time frame has no relevance except with other time frames. There is a significant decrease in the number of terrorist attacks in 2003 compared to 2002. Still, the war is not over.

Should Germany stop prosecuting WWII Nazis because no one has been killed in the war for 55 years? I heard one was arrested yesterday.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=384754&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

[Gimel]

14. The contradiction

The IDF claims that the houses were uninhabited, that the people showed up on the day of the demolitions, and weren't actually living there. Somewhat like the settlers who more in the day before the outpost is supposed to be razed.

I think that there may be some people residing in some of the buildings that were demolished. Some were undoubtedly empty. Sometimes the houses are actually built wall to wall next to one another, and it is difficult to determine how many are located in one complex.

One woman waving a flag, one girl crying. Not very much activity for so many demolitions. I also saw the film footage.

the IDF report says that several tunnels used for gun smuggling and drug trafficking were discovered and destroyed.
http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/385036.html

[bluesoul]

15. And we should all trust IDF

reports...

[Gimel]

30. Suit yourself

...but at least they were there, and also videos footage was taken and shown on TV news reports.


The Chinese repeat the same news as Haaretz.

[lefty_mcduff]

19. PR damage control by the IDF.

Accepted as gospel by the Pro IDFs. While we are outraged at suicide bombers, we are expected to understand this outrage as the IDF just taking care of business. Ignoring the mammoth double-standard, doesn't it strike anybody that this simply fuels hatred and resentment and thus more circular violence, suicide bombers and tit-for-tat retaliation.

And before you tell me how I don't understand, I do very well. I lived most of my child/teenage years in Northern Ireland. I know where my emotions would have led me, if the British used such heavy handed tactics, despite what ever feelings I would have had about the conflict in general.

I don't see the IP conflict as a B/W cartoon issue. If I was an Israeli perhaps I would. If I was an Israeli whose son was killed in an suicide bombing, no doubt I would. If I was a Palestinian I would likely see the world though the same B/W filters. If my son was shot by the IDF, or my mother's house bulldozed, there is no doubt about it.

But I remain an outside observer (as many on this board are) trying to phathom how two peoples would allow land, religion, and ideaology to fester into a hatred that spans generations and to continue with no end in sight.

I also see actions like these as militarily and strategically insignificant for the IDF, yet understand the enormous malice this will create with the Palestinians.

[ET Awful]

22. If there were as many tunnels as the IDF says there are

The whole frickin' middle east would collapse in on itself.

The IDF has been using tunnels as an excuse a hell of a lot.

[tinnypriv]

17. LOL

Good catch, but lying for these guys is par for the course.

Assuming anybody notices, they'll move onto the next excuse: the buildings were used as "observation posts" for terrorists.

The IDF actually used that piece of brilliance when demolishing a bunch of hi-rise apartments in Gaza BTW (the Israeli press carried some "before" and "after" photos the next day, as if anybody cared).

[DuctapeFatwa]

20. Swedish Bulldozers Flatten 30 Ukrainian Houses

Swedish army bulldozers flattened 30 houses and a synagogue in this refugee camp Tuesday, Ukranian officials said, accusing Sweden of systematically razing homes to widen a military buffer zone.

The military said it only targeted buildings from which shots were fired overnight at Swedish forces, but did not know how many structures were demolished. Ukraine's President Leonid Kuchma, said about 400 Ukrainians were left homeless.

Frantic residents threw mattresses and blankets from second-floor windows as beams and walls came crashing down around them. One woman, standing near a bulldozer, waved a white flag in a failed attempt to slow the demolition and buy time to salvage her belongings. A crying girl helped her mother carry a mattress.

Swedish Army officials initially insisted the razed houses had been empty, but then said the claim was still being checked.


Does the story sound better like that? Give it a shot, insert any countries you like.

[Resistance]

24. this is terrorism.

The IDF is no better than Hamas or any other Palestinian terrorist organization.

In fact, the IDF is worse.

[Darranar]

32. How do they know...

exactly where these shots were coming from?

If they do not know how many houses were demolished, how can they be sure that shots came from all of them?