Hamas leader: Pullout is beginning of the end for Israel

[Caleb]

Mashaal: Pullout is beginning of the end for Israel
Jerusalem Post
KHALED ABU TOAMEH
August 18, 2005

Hamas leader Khaled Mashaal declared on Wednesday that the Israeli withdrawal from the Gaza Strip and northern West Bank marked the beginning of the end of the Zionist dream in Palestine.

Mashaal was speaking to reporters in Beirut and his remarks were broadcast live by a number of major Arab TV satellite stations. He dubbed the pullout a "defeat in the face of Palestinian resistance and a significant step with historic dimensions."

"The resistance and the steadfastness of our people forced the Zionists to withdraw," he boasted. "The resistance is capable of ending the Israeli occupation and achieving all our rights. The armed struggle is the only strategy that Hamas possesses."

Mashaal reiterated his movement's refusal to lay down its weapons, saying Hamas's duty was to defend the Palestinians and help them restore their rights. "As long as Palestinian lands remain under occupation, Hamas won't lay down its weapons," he stressed.

Full story

[Caution]

1. What a complete and total ass

Israel was under zero pressure to actually pull out and finally decided to imply do the right thing and quit the west bank. I'm not a Sharon fan but this was the right thing to do. Instead of using the event to promote peace and stability theis assclown uses it as a method to incite violence.

[Ian David]

2. Oh, the poor oppressed Palestinian people! Oh, I grieve for them...

[Violet_Crumble]

8. Lack of compassion duly noted...

n/t

[tucoramirez2005]

4. The position was untenable

and the 1.5 million Palestinians knew it.

They have nothing but time, and demographics are in their favor.

If this was about "doing the right thing", they would also be leaving the Golan Heights, East Jerusalem, and the West Bank as well (at a BARE minimum).

[Caleb]

5. One step at a time

The Palestinians haven't stopped terrorism or disarmed any terrorist group.

And Jerusalem is the capital of Israel, so I highly doubt they will ever be "leaving."

[tucoramirez2005]

9. Why would they? It's working.

As far as Jerusalem being the capital, I believe that's what's being settled right now, by Al-Aqsa, Hamas, etc.

Two weeks ago Gaza was "land given to Israel by God"; today it is part of Palestine, and they can taste the victory now.

I won't get into who's right or wrong, but I have asked people if they could tell me in a million words or less how Israel possibly wins this fight, I'm all ears.

Nobody's even tried.

[pelsar]

10. Tucoramirez...

well...we dont like the alternative when we lose...you see we've been there before and its really "not to our liking"......demographics is only one weapon that is used here, education is another, guns are a third....useful idiotes are another......

it comes down to a very simply aspect.....if we lose, nobody will cry for us, nobody will complain to the UN about the poor ex israelis/jews.....so we simply dont plan on losing. Sometimes we do it right sometimes we screw up, we're kind of new at this business of being the strong one, even if it is localized

in 48 it was assumed that we would be overun, in 67 the same.....so we've gotten used to the odds being against us.....if the palestenians dont make a go of gaza.... i doubt well give them much of anything else.......

[tucoramirez2005]

11. They already have other territory

The question is not what you're willing to give them, but what are you able to hold.

In 1967, five countries were on the opposing side. In 1973, there were just two, and they almost won (to the extent that the Sinai had to be returned to one to keep some semblance of peace on that frontier). In neither of these wars did the Palestinians participate.

This is being lost from within.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. "Almost Won"

When the cease fire was declared the Egyptian Third Army was totally encircled and the Israelis were fifty miles from Damascus...




The best thing for both parties to this dispute is to abandon the jingoist rhetoric and work out an equitable peace...

[tucoramirez2005]

13. They certainly "almost won"

and the Sinai was returned in short order, as well as a large annual subsidy paid by the US to Egypt to keep the peace.

One party sees no reason to work out a peace; they're working it out with an intifada and suicide belts, and they know it just won them Gaza. This is not my opinion, but based on the very obvious.

There will never be 2 states living in peace on the land formerly known as Palestine.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

14. How Could You Almost Win

How could you almost win when your army is cut in half and you end up with less land than which you started which was the case with Syria...

And there were three Arab armies involved in the 1973 War... The Iraqis sent an expeditionary force to reinforce the Syrians which was of little use... This shouldn't come as a surprise...

"One party sees no reason to work out a peace; they're working it out with an intifada and suicide belts, and they know it just won them Gaza. This is not my opinion, but based on the very obvious."


That seems like a flawed strategy to me unless you want to use your people as cannon fodder in a quest for the unattainable...


Sun Tzu had it correct...When confronting an enemy leave an escape route or he will fight to the death for you have left him no choice....

Under your scenario that is the Israeli's option...

[tucoramirez2005]

16. They understand that.

The Palestinians obviously intend to let their enemies fight to the death. In fact, they are apparently insuring that it will be a fight to the death.

The "flawed strategy" just won Gaza; a few years ago it liberated souther Lebanon.

There has yet to be a failure attributed to this strategy.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

18. This Strategy Of Attrition Hasn't Worked In Sixty Years

I suspect it won't work in our lifetime...


It's funny for every post that I see here that attributes the pullout from Gaza to weakness I see four posts that say the pullout is a distraction by Sharon to consolidate Israel's hold on the West Bank and East Jerusalem...

[tucoramirez2005]

19. People can post what they want.

The people living over there deal with a desperate reality that drives these decisions.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

20. It's Desperate For Both Sides..

The way I see it given the fact that Israel retains the "Samson Option" they (all or the inhabitants of the region) can either live together or die together...

[tucoramirez2005]

21. I doubt it

If anything, the other side seems more willing to go that route.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

22. The Other Side Doesn't Have Four Hundred Nukes

nt

[tucoramirez2005]

24. And who left Gaza, southern Lebanon, Sinai?

The one with the nukes.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

25. They're Saving Them

You don't shoot your wad until you're ready to finish.

[Coastie for Truth]

23. The Muslims and Christians need an Israel and its people

it's in their genes (xenophobia is a part of human's genetic heritage, inherited from our hunter-gatherer stage; "fight or flight" is part of our vertebrate genetic heritage).

Demagogues need a scape goat and target. Some generations the target is called "Bolsheviks" other generations they are called "Neocons" or "Infidels". The scapegoats can be blamed for lack of economic progress or for too much economic and scientific progress - for pushing "evolution" or "stem cell research" or retarding economic development of the down trodden masses.

The Progressives need "Neocons" and the Conservatives need "Bolsheviks" and the Religious Fanatics need both "Infidels" and people to be converted at the time of the Second Coming.

My gosh - if there was no Israel who could the Saudis blame for their income disparities within the Kingdom.

[Igel]

15. And what, all treading water off the coast of Cyprus,

if they exceed the 'BARE minimum'?

[barb162]

6. I second your comments

[newyorican]

7. They didn't quit the West Bank....

The Israelis are dismantling the colonies in Gaza. However, they will maintain control over the airspace, borders, coastline and trade.

[Violet_Crumble]

17. Factuality? Who needs it?

n/t

[Coastie for Truth]

3. Khaled Mashaal should be careful about giving up his "Day Job"

Shell Oil company guru's M. King Hubbert and Kenneth Deffeyes and Cal Tech Prof David Goodstein say that the days of wine and roses are over for the terrorists.

And good old Saleh Al Oufi passed away yesterday.

So, Khaled Mashaal should be careful about giving up his day job.