9/11 oddity I've always wondered about

[wiggs]

John O'Neill worked in the administration's counter-terrorism office, but left to become head of security of the WTC. He died in his first day on the job...9/11/01. This has always seemed amazing to me. Is it weird coincidence or has another credible explanation for this been discussed?

[malaise]

1. You mean like who wanted him

dead? Interesting indeed. I've always wondered about Ted Olden's wife. That was so neat. He got married again shortly after that fable about Flight 93.

Sp.

[alcibiades_mystery]

11. Barbara Olsen was not on Flight 93

She was on the plane that hit the Pentagon.

[EFerrari]

12. Right. Making cell phone calls. Has anyone figured out if that

was even possible?

[flashman2006]

13. not quite correct

She used an airfone and made a collect call.

[EFerrari]

14. Ah. So, how did she make that cord reach all the way to the back

of the plane where she reported the passengers had been herded? Aren't those cords about 10 inches long?

[flashman2006]

um...

Are there no airfones on the seats at the back of the plane??

[alcibiades_mystery]

22. This is about the speed of it

1) She was on 93, eh? Huh? Huh?

No, she wasn't. (That would be one wrong)

2) But she was supposedly on a cell phone, right? Bah! Preposterous!

No, she was on the plane phone. (That would be two wrong)

3) Plane phone! As if it could stretch all the way to the back of the plane! Do you take us all for fools???

Um, plane phones are attached to the backs of seats, and there are some in the back of the plane, too... (Three wrong, and you'd think this pack would be embarrassed by now, but wait for the next incisively incorrect retort...)

[EFerrari]

25. Why would anyone be embarrased for asking an honest quesstion?

That's just stoopid. It may work on some posters but won't work on me, not even a tad.

It was widely reported that this lady was using a cell phone. And then a few months later, the airlines made a huge deal about making cell calls available in the air.

Was it sloppy reporting or what?

And please don't strain your eyes any more because the effect is lost on me. lol

[RedSock]

51. accoredng to evidence presented at the moussaoui trial

according to evidence presented at the moussaoui trial, olsen made zero calls.

wtf?

...

(someone started a thread about this with pics from the government's powerpoint presentation in court)

[alcibiades_mystery]

18. They're attached to the backs of the seats

Ever been on an airplane?

:eyes:

[EFerrari]

19. You miss my point. My point is, she clearly said she was with

the passengers that had been herded to the rear of the plane.


How could she be on that air phone AND be even a foot away from her seat?

She would have had to be using a cell phone or telepathy because the air phone wouldn't allow her to be in the back of the plane AND be on the phone.

So :eyes:

[alcibiades_mystery]

23. That they were herded to the back doesn't mean that they were standing

It just means that6 all the passengers were pushed to the back of the plane. They could just as easily be seated in the back of the plane, and I see no reason to think they weren't. Certainly, 40+ people can't fit in the kitchen area and aisle in the back of a plane.

[EFerrari]

26. You're making a lot of assumptions and I see that is your m.o. n/t

[alcibiades_mystery]

29. Yes, I'm curling my evil curly moustache while making assumptions

That's my m.o.

:rofl:

Why would you assume she was standing at the back of the plane? Because the word used was "herded"? That's the only reason I can see for your assumption.

Let's hypothesize as if there really were hijackers and not remote control robot killers (supposing there were planes at all, or people, or actual explosions). The point of moving the passengers to the back of the plane would be to have them in a controlled area, and to put as much distance between them and the cockpit as possible. Why they should be standing for such an operation is a mystery. The point is merely to concentrate them. So, when I hear "herded to the back of a plane," I take it to mean that they were removed from their disparate seats (ever been on an early morning transcontinental flight?), and concentrated in one area. Herding does not mean "made to stand" in such an instance (or ever, as far as I know). But again, I suppose I'm assuming that there were actual hijackers involved, and that there were actual passengers on the planes. I know that might make me a "radical" on these boards, but I guess I trust the evidence of my own two eyes when I see a commercial jet fly over my head and smack into a building not 700 yards from my position. I've been conned by the gubmint, sho nuf...

[flashman2006]

40. hold on...

hold on to your tinfoil hats...

There are even people who believe that there were NO planes that flew into the WTC towers, but that they were holograms timed to fool everyone as the Gubmint set off the bombs it had planted.

[Virginia Dare]

45. Okay, I'm following you...

they were herded to the back of the plane...

Then they were just cut loose? Nobody was guarding them? They were allowed to make last phone calls to their loved ones? Doesn't compute, at least not to me.

[alcibiades_mystery]

49. This is a reasonable objection

My guess is that the hijackers didn't want to be among and amongst them, micromanaging their behavior. This was the biggest problem for the Flight 93 group, but primarily because the plane left so late, and the hijackers didn't act soon enough. For the Pentagon flight, they pobably figured that it didn't matter, since the time to target was so fast, and they were barely off schedule with the New York flights. Yes, yes. That's just an assumption, but I think it is a reasonable one. What would it have actually taken to prevent everybody from getting on those phones? It would have taken wading into the group, making yourself vulnerable on all sides, and for what? Cost benefit would explain that one. Which is not to say that people were openly chatting in front of them. It's likely that whoever got on an airphone was doing his or her damndest to conceal it. But I just don't see the hijhackers walking the aisle like row-slave supervisors making sure that nobody was on the phone. If they stay at about 20 feet from where the group is, they have everyone in front of them. If they walk into the group, they can be attacked from all sides. Why bother?

[Virginia Dare]

60. I don't suppose we'll ever know...

but for me, there is still a shadow of a doubt.

[Nozebro]

61. First, they'll have to prove there were terrorists on the planes.

That little basic point has never been proven.

[alcibiades_mystery]

62. Of course

But one can say this about damn near any event. At the end of the day, most people settle on what is plausible given their experience and the scattered facts at hand.

[Virginia Dare]

67. True, any event where there are no survivors anyway...

so the events on the airplanes will always be somewhat shrouded in mystery. I'm sure this is what the conspirators had in mind, whoever they may be, which is why the telephone calls still puzzle me.

[INDIA]

64. You are getting destroyed in this argument. n/t

[EFerrari]

65. That's okay. I'm a big girl, I can take it. lol

[flashman2006]

24. really?

You mean it's not possible to be herded to the back of a plane, sit in the last row of seats, pick up an airfone and make a collect call??

Interesing...

[EFerrari]

27. Okay. You convinced me. This lady was re-seated to the rear

in a seat with a working air phone and she called her husband to ask for his advice.

:)

[Virginia Dare]

46. It's possible...

but, why weren't they being guarded? Why would they be allowed to make phone calls to tip the outside world to what was going on?

:shrug:

[INDIA]

63. Have you been on a plane in....

The last eight years or so?

[leftchick]

21. no

<snip>

No, it was not. Though at the time the little white lie was flagged with a powerful political name, there was and remains no evidence to support the connection. Just like the corrupt and premature Lee Harvey Oswald story in 1963, there are verifiable fatal errors which ultimately prove the little white lie was solely the work of members of the media. Only they had access, and only they had the methods and means.

The little white lie was about Barbara Olson, a conservative commentator for CNN and wife of US Solicitor General Ted Olson. Now deceased, Mrs Olson is alleged to have twice called her husband from an American Airlines Flight 77 seat-telephone, before the aircraft slammed into the Pentagon. This unsubstantiated claim, reported by CNN remarkably quickly at 2.06 am EDT <0606 GMT> on September 12, was the solitary foundation on which the spurious “Hijacker” story was built.

Without the “eminent” Barbara Olson and her alleged emotional telephone calls, there would never be any proof that humans played a role in the hijack and destruction of the four aircraft that day. Lookalike claims surfaced several days later on September 16 about passenger Todd Beamer and others, but it is critically important to remember here that the Barbara Olson story was the only one on September 11 and. 12. It was beyond question the artificial “seed” that started the media snowball rolling down the hill.

http://www.vialls.com/lies911/lies.htm

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

28. What a curious website.

This got me right in the funny-bone:

With 'Fortress Americas' now in tatters because of Russia's coalition with Brazil and Venezuela, Wall Street's neocons and other Zionist traitors will desperately try to avoid War Crimes Tribunals and the waiting hangman's noose, by fleeing aboard special jets to a little-known Australian island



http://vialls.net/cowards/byebye2.html

This was fun, too:

In a desperate attempt to slow down their forthcoming defeat in Palestine, Jewish Special Forces micro-nuke former Prime Minister Rafik Hariri, then instruct western media outlets to falsely blame the atrocity on Syria

Gotta hate those Jewish micro-nukes.

Lovely website there. Gotta spread the hate around, eh?

[alcibiades_mystery]

53. How dare you insult the "research"

(The "research method" here means trolling the internet for any article or source that may reinforce your previous belief, no matter how spurious, while ignoring any article or source that might contradict you, no matter how credible or corroborated...ah, the famous 9/11 "research"....:rofl:)

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

30. But wait! There's more!

Did New York Orchestrate The Asian Tsunami?
With Afghanistan and Iraq already lost, the Wall Street bankers were all desperately looking for other ways to control our world, when suddenly and very conveniently, the Sumatran Trench exploded. Trick or Treat?

http://www.joevialls.net/subliminalsuggestion/tsunami.html

[leftchick]

32. here ya go

does this site make ya feel better? :eyes:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/nation/terror/firstweek/20010912-9999_1n12olson.html

WASHINGTON -- "What should I tell the pilot to do? We've been hijacked," Barbara Olson, a former Southern California prosecutor, said matter-of-factly into her cell phone as she sat huddled with other passengers forced by knife-wielding assailants to the back of the jetliner.

On the other end of the line was her husband, Ted Olson, sitting in his Washington office, where he serves as solicitor general of the United States. Ted Olson, a former Los Angeles lawyer who argues President Bush's cases before the U.S. Supreme Court, had no immediate answers for his wife, said a close friend of the couple.

But Ted Olson told her something grim that she didn't know: Two airliners already had crashed into New York City's World Trade Center that morning.

It was then they realized she probably was doomed.

.... pure fiction.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

36. Indeed.

Just like her being spotted on the Argentia/Uganda border, or whatever other bullshit the Madsen Ltd. enterprise has been spitting out. If you're going to cite racist sites, I'm sorry but I'm just going to fucking laugh at anything you might attempt to tell me about 9/11. Or anything else for that matter. How can you promote such monstrous filth? Why do you read it? Why do you link to it? I'm sorry, but I just can't bring myself to take anyone seriously who takes information from a site that believes that jewish micronukes are eating baby jesus.

Please, for the love of God, stay away from that right-wing crap.

[leftchick]

37. LOL!

yeah, like I would heed your advice.

:rofl:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

43. You don't need my advice.

The website you posted from contains all the answers you seek.

Zionists Nuke The Australian Embassy in Indonesia
For the first time ever, this report shows a sub-surface micro nuke as it actually explodes in real
time on security video. The page is graphic intensive and will take a very long time to load.
Please be patient while you wait for the official American and Australian claims about the
bombing to be exposed as ruthless disinformation. Remember, the camera cannot lie.


Russia Proves 'Peak Oil' is a Misleading Zionist Scam
While Moscow invests heavily in unlimited oil production for the future, New
York squanders America's dwindling oil profits on fast cars and fast women

AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT AGENTS BOMB SYDNEY
Agent Provocateurs prepare weapons for lethal false-flag "Terrorist" attack


That's some swell bedtime reading you've got there.

[EFerrari]

66. Her CELL phone, not the airphone that she used to call collect.

Geezus.

People will believe ANYTHING, won't they?

Bet me that all calls to Ted Olsen are on tape somewhere and were we to hear his tape for 9/11, nada on them from his wife. Bet me.

[malaise]

34. That was one unbelievable piece

of bullshit from MSM. My tin foil hat is more credible.

[salvorhardin]

50. Why would you be referencing Joe Vialls?

Don't you think whatever he had there is meant to support his racist views?

Now there's a lovely piece of work. Take a look at one of Joe's websites: http://www.joevialls.co.uk

In addition to being a raging nutcase, let's take a look at some of his headlines...

Zionists Nuke Downtown Beirut Again! (Updated)
Zionist Elite Prepares to Desert America, Pt 1
Zionist Elite Prepares to Desert America, Pt 2
Zionists Nuke The Australian Embassy in Indonesia
Russia Proves 'Peak Oil' a misleading Zionist scam
Experts prove Policewoman Murdered by Zionists
Zionists Murder Policewoman & Blair Blames Libya!
Zionists Murder For Oil - Shekhinah Getting Closer
Israel Uses Blatant Subliminal TV Techniques Against America
Israel Plans Blitzkrieg to Capture Arab Oil Fields (Part I)
Israel Plans Blitzkrieg to Capture Arab Oil Fields (Part II)
Israel Plans Blitzkreig to Capture Arab Oil Fields (Part III)
Israel's Mossad Bombed the Paradise Hotel in Mombasa
Mossad Mind Control "kee betachbulot ta'ase lecha milchama"
Shock Jewish Double-Standard on Prince Harry
Russia Ready to Vaporize The Jewish State with Sunburn
Remote Control QU-22 Bombs Jewish Quarter in Hollywood
Jewish Terrorists Blow Up Orthodox Jews in Jerusalem
Female Jewish Bomber Kills 12 in Jerusalem
Jews Kick Home Goal to Open the Gaza Season
Israeli Jews "Do a Waco" on Birthplace of Jesus Christ
Jews Pose for Snapshot over "Trophy" Kill in Palestine

Also, Wikipedia...

Vialls was an avowed anti-Zionist, alleging for instance that Zionists used a nuclear device in Bali. He also claimed most kidnapping of hostages in Iraq was done by the CIA and Mossad.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Vialls

Now, if you want to play the "anti-Zionist isn't the same as anti-semitism card", let's go to Thomas Friedman quoted at Wikipedia:

Thomas Friedman also wrote that, "Criticizing Israel is not anti-Semitic, and saying so is vile. But singling out Israel for opprobrium and international sanction - out of proportion to any other party in the Middle East - is anti-Semitic, and not saying so is dishonest".<15>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-zionist#Anti-Zionism_and_Anti-Semitism

The fact that CTists see people like Joe Vialls as legitimate sources, despite the utter crap and hate people like Vialls spewed (he died in 2005) is just one reason the 9-11 Truth movement is taken as, at best, a joke.

[leftchick]

33. this account says cell phone

of course I don't believe this even happened.

<snip>

WASHINGTON -- "What should I tell the pilot to do? We've been hijacked," Barbara Olson, a former Southern California prosecutor, said matter-of-factly into her cell phone as she sat huddled with other passengers forced by knife-wielding assailants to the back of the jetliner.

On the other end of the line was her husband, Ted Olson, sitting in his Washington office, where he serves as solicitor general of the United States. Ted Olson, a former Los Angeles lawyer who argues President Bush's cases before the U.S. Supreme Court, had no immediate answers for his wife, said a close friend of the couple.

But Ted Olson told her something grim that she didn't know: Two airliners already had crashed into New York City's World Trade Center that morning.

It was then they realized she probably was doomed.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/nation/terror/firstweek/20010912-9999_1n12olson.html

[niyad]

44. okay, let's see if I understand this correctly--she had been herded to

the back of the plane, along with the other passengers, a hijacker supposedly had control of the plane, and she calls her husband (of COURSE the hijackers let them use their phones!!) to ask him what SHE is supposed to tell the pilot? how in the HELL was she going to even GET to the pilot? and what expertise did her husband have in hijacking negotiations?

come on, someboy in this mess HAS to be able to write a more coherent story than that!!!

[Virginia Dare]

47. I agree, this is one of the weakest links in the OCT..

that those passengers were not being watched and/or guarded, and that they were able to make all of those phone calls. What motiviation did the hijackers have at that point to tip the rest of the world off to what was happening?

[malaise]

35. Thanks n/t

[snappyturtle]

2. Hope someone knows that answer too

I've always wondered? What did he know that "they" didn't want public? OR just coincidence.....

[ananda]

3. Convenient coincidence?

:-(

[astonamous]

4. Who was head of security before him at the WTC? n/t

[Karenina]

5. IIRC, Marvin Bush's company

was involved...

[wiggs]

6. More weirdness... nt

[Nozebro]

7. "weirdness"? -- or Business as Usual? I think it's the latter. EOM

nt

[Roland99]

8. Marvin Bush's company handled electronic security for the WTC

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

31. Nonsense.

A company for which he'd previously been on the BoD (i.e. not involved in day-to-day opearations) was involved. It was not "his" company any more than my old company was part of the Hearst empire just because one of them happened to be on the BoD for a while.

[leftofthedial]

9. so what if there are 25,000-plus weird cooincidences related to 9-11

It doesn't mean there was a big conspiracy or anything.

[Flying Dream Blues]

10. Exactly, LOTD!

[stranger81]

15. I remember Democracy Now running several stories,

some pretty speculative, on what O'Neill was up to. Those programs aired in the weeks after 9/11, and were all interesting. Wonder if they're in the archives somewhere?

[stranger81]

16. here's one of them

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=03/04/07/0253220

[stranger81]

17. here's a transcript of another

http://www.democracynow.org/print.pl?sid=04/03/30/1522243

[Show_Me _The_Truth]

20. Kennedy and Lincoln

had several related coincidences in their lives, but that does not mean that there is any link.

Or is there?

[mikelewis]

41. coherent...

co·her·ent
Pronunciation (k-hîrnt, -hr-)
adj.
1. Sticking together; cohering.
2. Marked by an orderly, logical, and aesthetically consistent relation of parts: a coherent essay.
3. Physics Of, relating to, or having waves with similar direction, amplitude, and phase that are capable of exhibiting interference.
4. Of or relating to a system of units of measurement in which a small number of basic units are defined from which all others in the system are derived by multiplication or division only.
5. Botany Sticking to but not fused with a part or an organ of the same kind.

Hope this helps you when you post your next reply.

[razors edge]

42. lincoln was in the ford theater

kennedy was riding in a ford, has to be some relationship there.

all the "missile hit the pentagon" nonsense is just to make any questioning of the official story sound ludicrous. definitely planted by certain propaganda catapult operators.

[mikelewis]

38. It wasn't his first day on the job...

but he was there only a couple of weeks. It was on Sept 10 that he gave an interview to some reporter but it's still very ironic nonetheless. How funny that the one guy who kept pushing Bush to do something about Osama is killed in the attack. If Osama was really the guy who did, he had to have been helped a great deal by Capt. Edward A. Murphy (or at least his law).

[yasmina27]

39. He did not die on his first day on the job:

On the day he started at the Trade Center—August 23rd—the C.I.A. sent a cable to the F.B.I. saying that two suspected Al Qaeda terrorists were already in the country.

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?020114fa_FACT1

Still weird, nonetheless...

[dogday]

48. Just another one of those strange coincidences that

keep popping up with this story... Too many questions, not enough answers....

John O'Neill just happened to be killed by the very thing he specialized in... Terrrorist....

[BootinUp]

52. NYC was his territory

He was leaving the FBI. WTC security was ideal job for someone with his experience. I find it quite sad, and alarming, but not strange.

[dogday]

55. On his first day of work?

that is strange....

[BootinUp]

56. No, as someone else pointed out

up thread he began his job some short time earlier like in August.

[dogday]

57. Yes a few weeks makes all the difference...

[BootinUp]

58. Sarcastic comment?

I was correcting your error. It made little difference to me either way, perhaps to some it does though?

[dogday]

59. I am just saying a few weeks, first day,

he was there, it was very weird this man died by the hand of the very thing he tried to fight against.... I am not being sarcastic, realistic maybe, but not sarcastic....

[mirandapriestly]

54. It doesn't look like just a coincidence -Jerry Hauer

is the one who had dinner the night before with him (and some other interesting people ) Hauer seems to have had pre-knowledge of 9-11 and anthrax. Hauer also works in industries that profit immensely from "terror", some of these companies (Kroll) are like privatized CIA's which seem to operate above the law, and make money from "security" against things like terrorism.

http://www.911review.org/Sept11Wiki/Hauer,Jerome.shtml
...The watchdog group JudicialWatch decided to file a lawsuit against the NIH (National Institute Of Health), the FBI, CDC and the White House, for the same reason: Prior Knowledge. It is not known how long Hauer worked at the NIH before Sept. 11, but we can confirm that he was working on Sept. 10. http://www.lauriegarrett.com/wtc_day12.html But things get really interesting when we consider that in August 2001, Jerome Hauer arranged a new job for ONeill,John - the resigning chief of the FBI Terror Task Force - as head of security at the World Trade Center. How did Hauer know that the Twin Towers would be so important?
He started to work for the NIH under Tommy Thompson on September 10, 2001 as an adviser on national security. On September 11th, he told the White House to take Cipro, the antibiotic that works against the anthrax virus, without bothering to reveal his warning to the American nation. http://www.bayarea.com/mld/bayarea/living/health/3020501.hym
...There is a lot which has been hidden from us, but for what reason? This might have something to do with the FBI HQ (O'Neill complained about them), but also with Jerome Hauer - who is a friend of the current prime anthrax suspect, Stephen Hatfill, who was working for the military anthrax program USAMRIID at Fort Detrick and Battelle, a huge pharmacy company with many ties to the CIA. Hauer and Hatfill worked together at the SAIC's Center for Counterterrorism Technology and Analysis in 1999. The SAIC (Scientific Applications International Corp) later received a huge BioDefense budget in autumn 2001. http://www.saic.com/news/nov99/news11-30a-99.html - (Hauer) http://www.nandotimes.com/nation/story/455218p-3643441c.html - (Hatfill)

[mhatrw]

68. Yes. I might have thought this was just "one of those things" if it

weren't for the fact that Jerome Hauer directed him to the job.