I have a serious question for the dungeon dwellers!

[Joanne98]

I know you're probably not going to believe me but here goes. I just watched, for the first time last night, Alex Jones's "Cremation of CARE" video. I can't believe I didn't even know this film existed. It was made in 2000 for Christ's sake. I don't know how I missed it. I guess it's never been on DU. Why? In his new video, The Order Of Death, he saz that the Owl Worshippers are almost all Republicans. Do you know what a gift from God this is. All those "Christians" worshipping Bush while he's worshipping an OWL GOD? If there is a reason why nobody is using this film to confuse, depress and keep the fundies home in Nov, please let me know what it is. Because it there's not a problem, I'M going to use it.

[DoYouEverWonder]

1. Are you referring to the Bohemian Grove stuff?

Pretty kinky from the looks of it.

I'd love to see these perverts exposed.

[Joanne98]

5. Yes and the film is real the "Grovers" aren't even denying it.

They ARE getting exposed but it's never on DU and I don't understand why? I'd post it on GD but I'm afraid I'll get tombstoned.

[FoxOnTheRun]

2. The problem is that it is not only Rep issue

Our Ex-Chancellor of Germany admits he goes to those druid rituals in Germany and loves the Grove in the USA.

The problem is you have different layers of reality, most higher up peoples in media, military, industry or politics know that everything is a joke.
And they see the normal people as cattle or profane.


It's how the world works and why somebody like Kennedy died, or someone like Cynthia McKinney has no chance to be president


Have a look at Hitler and why he loved catholics
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2075095

[Joanne98]

6. I know but I'm talking about winning elections. That film is priceless.

For us Dems in a state like Ohio where we have to fight the Preachers over every vote. Do you have any idea what a weapon that is? I'm furious that nobody's using it.

[FoxOnTheRun]

9. The problem with preachers is that they get funded by the gov.

I think its called faith based initiative.

It's like "no child left behind", if schools object to military recruiters on school campuses they get no money from "no child left behind".

I would say the voting machines an voter fraud are greater problem in OHIO

[Joanne98]

16. I know. I have paperless Diebold in my precinct.

The preachers are a HUGE problem. BUT their flocks just listen to them and never fact check. I think this film will help break the spell.

[FoxOnTheRun]

20. It will work for the folks but not for the greedy preachers.

If you want to drive your preacher nuts, you can ask him about the secret FEMA plan and if he will participate it.

Here is the pdf link
http://www.infowars.com/images2/ps/pastor_fema_docs.pdf

A Pastor has come forward to blow the whistle on a nationwide FEMA program which is training Pastors and other religious representatives to become secret police enforcers who teach their congregations to "obey the government" in preparation for a declaration of martial law, property and firearm seizures, and forced relocation.

In March of this year the Pastor, who we shall refer to as Pastor Revere, was invited to attend a meeting of his local FEMA chapter which circulated around preparedness for a potential bio-terrorist attack, any natural disaster or a nationally declared emergency.

The FEMA directors told the Pastors that attended that it was their job to help implement FEMA and Homeland Security directives in anticipation of any of these eventualities. The first directive was for Pastors to preach to their congregations Romans 13, the often taken out of context bible passage that was used by Hitler to hoodwink Christians into supporting him, in order to teach them to "obey the government" when martial law is declared.

http://www.infowars.com/articles/ps/fema_plan_use_pastors_pacify_for_martial_law.htm

[Joanne98]

25. Bookmarked. Thanx. BTW! I know it won't work on the preachers

I want to use it on the flock. Do you have any problems with the film itself? Is there anything I should know about?

[FoxOnTheRun]

34. Here is a documentary about the documentary

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1557513752286923372&q=secret+rulers&hl=en

[Joanne98]

38. That was good. Verifies that the tape is real. Thanx

[salvorhardin]

3. Well, if you don't care at all about living in the reality based community

Or further undermining it, or further promoting the meme that lefties are antisemitic moonbats then I'd say go for it. To use a religious metaphor though, you reap what you sow.

[Joanne98]

7. Look

I know they're rich and powerful frat boys doing stupid hazing crap but that not the point. NO, I DON"T CARE about being called a moonbat. The fundies in Ohio have NO idea they're doing that shit. Why can't I use it?

[salvorhardin]

12. Because Alex Jones is an anti-semitic conspiracist bigot

If you want to engage people, try factual reporting. Don't just ape the tactics of the far right.

[Joanne98]

14. Why is he anti-semitic? I never even heard of him till recently.

[FoxOnTheRun]

17. What do you say about Barry Chamish?

A Jew who gets on the Alex Jones show to criticize his government, he must be an anti-semite, too.

I think you should re-examine publiceye.org

[Joanne98]

19. I don't even know who Barry Chamish is.

[John Q. Citizen]

31. Do you have any evidence to back up your claim that Jones is

anti-semitic and a bigot?

I just searched a few pages on google and couldn't find anything to support your claims.

Please advise.

Thanks.

[FoxOnTheRun]

32. He is always criticized by others mostly disinfo types for not

saying it's all israels fault.

He knows history and pinpoints it to the bankers sitting in london

[John Q. Citizen]

35. So it appears that a poster may be engaging in the right wing tactics

the poster claims to abhor?

Why am I not surprised?

To be honest I don't know a lot about Alex Jones. So I'm trying to find out. But, I looked for a while and couldn't substanciate those charges made against Jones, myself.

It does, at this point, appear to be dis-info.

[FoxOnTheRun]

36. It's so 3d grade style

I'm from Germany and don't understand how a sane person can watch people that engage in name calling.
Like O'Reilly, Coulter, Hannity and Co.

[tenseconds]

45. socially conservative

Jones used to support socially conservative Republican candidates but the anti-semitism accusation is truly out of line.

[DrDebug]

4. The story is even more complex. There is a chance it is Moloch

And that is a God which is mentioned in the Bible. It was a cult where first born children were sacrifised to that god while the priests masturbates, danced and had lots of fun. According to the Old Testament that cult existed during the time of Solomon and there are records that cults like that did exist in the Middle East and North Africa so there are historical records. In the Bible it is called an abomination. It also discussed in great detail in John Milton's Paradise Lost.

The thing which is unclear whether the Bohemians is the same cult, however there are several things which seem similar and there are plenty of rumors.

In this case it is not so much what you believe or whether the bible is correct, but there are indications and it is likely that a cult like that had existed and if this cult is inspired by the same cult, it is simply a pure evil cult. You are better off following Osho than Moloch to put it bluntly.

Remember that very few people will believe that things like this are possible and that things like this happen. I guess I've read and researched too much, because it really wouldn't surprise me anymore if the Bohemian Grove is the Cult of Moloch.

[Joanne98]

8. I don't care if they're worshiping the great salamader....

It's a PRICELESS campaign tool. Why aren't wwe using it?

[DrDebug]

11. Everybody will deny and ridicule it. That's why it can't be used

There are many things which they will never allow. For example, 99.9% of the population think that JFK is a complete mystery. It is only tiny fraction who know that it has been more or less solved for years now. That's the power of propaganda. They'll never allow discussion of the Bohemians. Groups like Bilderbergers, CFR, etc can be more easily discussed because at least that is not on that level of depravity.

[Joanne98]

13. Have you watched the film?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2500924140588760933&q=alex+jones+bohemian+grove

They can't deny it. They put out a guest list each year.

[DrDebug]

15. Yes. I watched both movies and have studied the subject

Personally I prefered studying 9/11 and I mean that seriously, because this stuff is completely and totally twisted with stories about snuff movies, child rape. Everything about Bohemian is about death, hell and group sex.

[Joanne98]

18. I think you're underestimating the effect this will have on Bush Xistians.

I know THEY HAVE NEVER HEARD ABOUT IT.

[DrDebug]

22. It's beyond their realm of perception, so they will immediately ridicule

and deny it. A person can only gradually be introduced to deep depravity like the Bohemian Grove. Without the proper knowledge about the inner working of secret groups and organizations you cannot imagine that something like the Bohemian exists. Think of the human mind as a sort of a tunnel vision. You can gradually extend the tunnel, but if you are suddenly shown an entirely different view on reality then the brain can't handle it and will automatically deny it and probably respond in anger. I've seen things like that with even simple 9/11 discussions with people which I thought were quite intelligent, but it was beyond their scope of reality.

[Joanne98]

26. But Clinton's in the film. Wouldn't that give it credibility?

They already think he's depraved.

[Joanne98]

10. Here's the video I'm talking about...

It's fairly new. The Order of Death. Alex Jones saz that most of the Grovers are Republicans. Only two Dems. Clinton and NM Gov Richardson. I'm thinking nobody's using it because of Clinton. Am I right?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2500924140588760933&q=alex+jones+bohemian+grove

[Joanne98]

21. Okay I have one complaint about Jones. He's anti-semitic.....

So far nobody's disputing the film. Is there another complaint about Alex Jones?

[DrDebug]

23. He shouts too much. He is like one bundle of ADHD

I prefer to read his words from behind the computer, because he needs to chill a bit ;)

[Joanne98]

27. Complaint noted. His style sucks. It there another?

[rman]

43. He used t o be a conservative,

now he positions himself as neither left nor right, though he does vilify US foreign policy and now does support people like Hugo Chavez.
Ok so this isn't really a complaint. The only problem i have with him is his style of presentation; often shouting and sensationalist, exaggerating at times. Otoh, 'unpolished' does have its charm. Much to his credit, he doesn't seem to be dogmatic.

[FoxOnTheRun]

24. He was protesting the CFR in NEW York today

I don't know if this was a wise decision, but hey, he goes all the way up

[Joanne98]

28. He was I didn't know. He does have balls you have to admit.

[rman]

42. What makes you think Alex is anti-semitic?

[AZCat]

44. I think the poster is referring to a post upstream...

by salvorhardin where he claimed that Jones anti-semitic. I do not know whether Joanne98 herself believes that Jones is anti-semitic.

Of course I could be wrong... :shrug:

[rman]

46. I see. As usual, no substance to the claim.

I suspect Joanne98 is capable of making up her own mind.

[Joanne98]

29. Clinton's in the film. Is that why we don't use it?

[Joanne98]

30. Okay. I think I got it. Thanx. I got to go. Bye.

[DrDebug]

33. The picture of a father and son having fun at the grove

[Joanne98]

37. Thank you very much.

[Celebration]

39. Wikipedia on Bohemian Grove

With plenty of mainstream links--

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_Grove

Yeah I would think the fundamentalists might get a bit upset with the Cremation of Care. I mean, what a pile of crap. You would think people would outgrow this stuff after middle school.

The Cremation of Care was devised in 1893 by a member named Joseph D. Redding, a lawyer from New York. During the ceremony, which serves as the opening to the Grove encampment, a mock human sacrifice representing "dull care" is cremated to symbolize the liberation of the participants. The New York Times described the show in a June 25, 1899 article:

"Great attention was paid to all the details, and the Druid priests who figured prominently in the show bore all the insignia of their order on their vestments. Over 500 persons figured in the spectacle, and electric and calcium lights were used to illuminate the tableaus. There was a symphony orchestra and a grand chorus. A Druids' altar and sacrificial stone lent an air of realism to the scenes. Mr. Redding served as High Priest of Bohemia. Then came a procession of eight Druid priests bearing six chained captives-- a Gaul, a Celt, a Roman, a barbarian, and two men from the Far North. Each captive was in costume and each in turn pleaded his cause before the assembly, but was condemned to death. Only the Gaul, who represented Bohemia, was able to make a defense that lifted the sentence from the heads of the captives. A loving cup was then drunk by Druids, captives, and Bohemians. Mephisto and a number of devils rushed in and attempted to rescue "Care" from the catafalque . The devil made an impassioned address, saying that goodfellowship was a mockery and that "Care" could not be banished. Then the Druid leader drove them into the woods with a lighted torch, which he at once applied to the funeral pyre. After this came the "low jinks," a species of amateur minstrel show. Then the Bohemians retired to their tents and to such sleep as the wags and practical jokers of the club permitted them to take."(citation needed)
Today, the ritual consists of hooded members accepting the effigy representing "dull care" from a ferryman traveling across a creek. Music and fireworks accompany the ritual, for dramatic effect. The mock human sacrifice is placed on an altar and set on fire. The ritual represents the act of embracing the revelry of Bohemian Grove while setting aside the "dull cares" of the outside world.

The ceremony takes place next to a 45-foot concrete Owl statue. During the ceremony, audio plays through nearby speakers providing the illusion of a speaking statue. The voice of the former-newsman Walter Cronkite, a member of the Bohemian Club, is used as the voice of The Owl during the ceremony.

[Sir Jeffrey]

40. I ran this by my grandfather a few months ago...

he is a true bible thumper...third grade education, retired from the mines, we're all going to hell, etc.

In a rare moment of "I've had enough preaching", I started in on Skull and Bones' masturbation rituals, the Cremation of Care, mock human sacrifices, grave robbery, and the like...tying it all to "his boy" W. I asked him if, as a "bible scholar", he was familiar with Molech, the ancient Babylonian god. He said no. I then proceeded to tell him all about Bohemian Grove, tied that in with a dash of child sex slavery exposed in the late 1980's regarding Craig Spence, George Bush, Lawrence King, etc.(even offered to show him the info on line...no dice). I even got out a dollar bill and a magnifying glass and showed him that Molech is printed on every single dollar bill.

Side note...check this out if you don't know how prevalent Molech is in the US...my wife even freaked out over Molech on the dollar bill:

http://www.cremationofcare.com/illu_molech.htm

Anyway, he fell back to "this is the debil's domain" and said I had given him a lot to think about.

He never mentioned it again. He still has "Sportsmen for Bush" on his Jeep and is still bitching about the "ebil libruls".

Why do I mention all of this? Because your questions are based on a false assumption: that people given to irrational beliefs will respond when given rational reasons and evidence. Think about it...if people truly responded to evidence, learned to think critically, and questioned their beliefs, they would have noticed all this shit by now.

As far as why Dems don't use this politically: the sad truth is that there are a lot of powerful people out there...and it is not all Republicans. Hell, I remember reading somewhere that Walter Cronkite did the voice of the owl at one time (may still).

As far as why this type of thing never gets much traction on DU, I can only speculate. There is a certain area of debate that is "acceptable" on various subjects...anything outside that area is "kooky" or a "conspiracy theory" regardless of what evidence/facts are presented...such as, I don't know, video of Henry Kissinger worshipping an owl in San Francisco. It is too weird and unbelievably challenging to normal people's view of the world, so most would fail to process it anyway. I'm sure this video and others like it have been posted here numerous times but the post quickly falls off the pages and into oblivion.

[FoxOnTheRun]

41. Here the Nixon Tapes about Bohmian Grove

NIXON: You know what's happened ?

EHRLICHMAN: San Francisco has just gone clear over.

NIXON: But it's not just the ratty part of town. The upper class in San Francisco is that way. The Bohemian Grove, which I attend from time to time--it is the most faggy goddamned thing you could ever imagine, with that San Francisco crowd. I can't shake hands with anybody from San Francisco.

Decorators. They got to do something. But we don't have to glorify it. You know one of the reasons fashions have made women look so terrible is because the goddamned designers hate women. Designers taking it out on the women. Now they're trying to get some more sexy things coming on again.

EHRLICHMAN: Hot pants.

NIXON: Jesus Christ.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/032604nixontape.html


people love being lied to.