Was JFK's Son - John Jr. Also assassinated?...

[Indi Guy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xm7VDfmjnk

While I don't like some of the cheesy animations in the full video, and I don't necessarily buy into the Bush connection here -- I do find that the verifiable facts presented here are quite compelling...

Full video --http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3179462717908405974&ei=MUmwS63hNYveqwLEiojkBg&q=assassinated+jfk+jr&hl=en#

[Indi Guy]

1. Please take your time to respond...

...after you've digested the important info here.

[hack89]

2. No. nt

[SDuderstadt]

3. Three questions, dude

1) did you bother to fact-check any of the "verifiable facts" from this remarkably stupid video?

2) have you bothered to read the NTSB report on the crash and taken note of the fact they found nothing wrong with the plane?

3) is there ANY conspiracy theory so goofy that even YOU won't embrace it?

[Indi Guy]

8. Please stop with the propaganda and mischaracterizations...

Where did I say I "embraced" this version of events? You should read more carefully. And btw -- the "conspiracy theory" dog is getting really old, and doesn't hunt as well as it used to.

[OnTheOtherHand]

14. you're certainly leaving your position to our imaginations

While I don't like some of the cheesy animations in the full video, and I don't necessarily buy into the Bush connection here -- I do find that the verifiable facts presented here are quite compelling...

OK, so, how are you compelled? :shrug:

[SDuderstadt]

21. Dude...

you started this in another forum and it's clear you embrace this video.

Please show me where asking you questions is "propaganda", dude.

[defendandprotect]

33. Hi Indi ... What do you think about this version . . . or any part of it?

[SDuderstadt]

49. Why don't you answer the questions I asked?

Did you "fact-check" this video?

[zappaman]

4. No

What is the next ridiculous conspiracy theory you're gonna embrace?

[defendandprotect]

5. Yes -- and the only way the right can rise is via political violence --

and we've certainly seen that over the past 50 years -- and more!

Lies, right wing propaganda -- and stolen elections, of course, as well!

I have no problem with W Bush being involved, even if making a symbolic presence

among the plotters. Obviously, someone has been clearing the pathways for right

wing candidates from Nixon to Bush, Sr. and for Bush, Jr. as well.

Schwartzenegger is also an alarming right winger suspiciously planted within the family now.

And, I'm concerned whenever Schwartzenegger is involved with politics/government.


This was a highly complicated assassination plot because of the flight instructor.

And because of the complications and compounding of the lies by those involved.

I think this is an excellent video -- and I've watched it a few times.

Thanks for the reminder --

there has been so much r-w political violence over the years-- and continuing violence and

political intrigue that it is difficult to keep track of it all!!


This is another right wing assassination which depends largely on cover up --

they may have been trying to keep a particularr flight instructor from being on board

originally and substituting one they preferred -- and the "recovery" of that flight

instructor's body had to be hidden -- from the world!


Also hard to miss the very heavy right wing propaganda surrounding JFK, Jr.'s personal

responsibility and the attacks centered on that.


Fuel selector valve on OFF . . . !! Idiot button -- !!!

[KatieW]

6. No, JFK Jr. was not assassinated. Some people really have way too much time on their hands.

I recall hearing some on the far right say that the Clinton's were the ones behind his death because the Clinton's wanted Hillary to run for the Senate from NY to give her some gravitas to go on and run for President later on. There was talk that JFK Jr. was considering a run for the NY Senate spot, so those wacky far right nuts figured the Clinton's were behind JFK Jr's death to get rid of him and leave it open for Hillary to run. Sorry, but that is as far fetch and wacky a theory as those who think Bushco was behind JFK Jr.'s death.

[Indi Guy]

7. Another person who did not read the OP...

...let alone watch the video.

Please watch the video before rambling on with no factual basis behind what you say.

[SDuderstadt]

9. This is one of the most unintentionally ironic posts in this forum today....

Talk about rambling on with no factual basis. Again, did you fact-check the video?

[thinking man]

11. Hankey

I thought Hankey did a great job with both JFKII and JFK jr.
Both had cheap animation which I developed a taste for. He could use a good animator, true enough. I thought he laid out the case very well. It took waaaaaayyy too long to recover the wreckage. That and the fuel supply dummy switch are two major smoking guns.

Sdude,

what was inaccurate? if there was nothing wrong with the plane (who said otherwise? Wouldn't that help your argument if the plane had mechanical problems?) then why'd it crash? Do you believe Jr. committed suicide?
When you look at the deaths of the Kennedy's together, it seems like a no brainer that at least one was a conspiracy, if not all three. 2 lone nuts and a suicide, shifts in power.. that seems coincidental?

[SDuderstadt]

22. CT logic....

If there was nothing wrong with the plane,"JFK, Jr. must have committed suicide".

Oh, wait...pilot error is the # 1 cause of plane crashes.

Pilot or flight crew errors – Pilot errors are the number one cause of aviation accidents and account for the highest number of fatalities.

http://www.aviation-law-news.com/html/causes.html

Stupid post to a stupid OP

[SDuderstadt]

29. What was inaccurate?

How about this statement?

You don't need your feet to fly a plane

Here's a picture of the controls of a Piper Saratoga:

http://www.aviatorsale.com/images/aircraft/specsheet/3437_5174_1.pdf

See the foot pedals?


Stupid fucking film. The section with Alex Jones should have been the first clue.

Duh.

[defendandprotect]

10. Obvious to see . . . didn't read and didn't watch, but taking in info can be dangerous!!

:)

[apocalypsehow]

12. I knew that if I watched the silliness long enough the anti-semitism would emerge - CT theories are

so predictable that way, most of the ones I've run across, in any event: talk to many CT'ers long enough, and they'll usually get around to the Big Bankers, the Rockefeller's, the Mossad, and eventually, they'll confide to you, those sinister Jews. Not that they're anti-semitic, or anything - but... Just like clockwork, there's always that "but".

And sure enough, about eight minutes into this "documentary" the narration swings over to an ominous - supposedly - coincidence: THE PRIME MINISTER OF ISRAEL WAS IN THE COUNTRY THE DAY JFK JR DIED! AND WHAT'S MORE AN ARMY OF MOSSAD AGENTS WERE WITH HIM! ONE OF THEM PLANTED A FALSE STORY ABOUT JFK JR'S DEATH IN THE PRESS THE VERY NEXT DAY!

What's extremely offensive about the "cheesy animations" of this rambling pastiche of strung-together nonsense is that at this point in the "documentary," around the 8:45 -9:00 minute mark, the screen starts to fill up with stereotypical images of Jews right out of Joseph Goebbels propaganda playbook: evil-looking men with prominent hook noses, trench-coats, hiding behind sun glasses. The implicit message of the video is clear at this point: the Jews had a hand in killing JFK Jr.

It really is slimy stuff, little different than the racist blathering of a Klan video.

I'll say it again: what swell chums the CT'er "community" so often seems to find itself acquainted with!

[Behind the Aegis]

13. I thought it was a parody at first, then I saw the "Mossad did it" and knew it wasn't.

It is astonishing how many of these CT come down to the "Jews did it/had a hand in it." This particular person was good though, covered his ass by adding in the how the "Jews" were victims of various things, including the Holocaust, which of course was perpetrated by American Jews and a few others (I am sure they are just shabbos goys). I watched all but two parts, the other parts were as disjointed and conjecture-filled as the first section, but by exploring the others I did learn Obama is a member of the Zionist Illuminati. :eyes:

[thinking man]

15. I didn't get that..

from the documentaries. He suspects Mossad played a small hand. Is that organization representative of all jews? So if Israel sunk a US ship, you'd say "the jews did it"?

[thinking man]

16. I do want to say

I have noticed an under current of what could be perceived as 'the jews did it' mentality. Which I don't get at all. I don't think Hankey's docu's are steering me in that direction, I believe I'd have noticed insensitive implications if he had. The Mossad connection is weak in the JFK Jr. case, stronger in the 911 case. Either way though, Mossad/Israel does not equal 'the jews'. Only the mass of awesome people that share they jewish faith and bloodlines equal 'the jews'

[defendandprotect]

26. We also need to be clear that every nation/ethnic group has it's right wing . . .

just as the Israelis do --

In fact, Nixon armed right-wing fundamentalist Israel --

What we need to do is reassert our support of peace-loving liberal Israelis who were buried

by this warmongering right wing!

[apocalypsehow]

17. Then you weren't paying attention. Cute sideways reference to another CT'er bugaboo and famed

anti-semitic casus belli with that "Israel sunk a US ship" business, BTW.

[thinking man]

23. well

What happened with the Liberty then? Enlighten me.

[apocalypsehow]

35. Right on cue - and oh so predictable. n/t.

[defendandprotect]

28. Right wing Israel has come close to commiting genocide against the Palestinians . . .

but, I presume even mentioning that is "anti-semitic" --

!!!!

:rofl:

Or, should we mention that we need to cut off funding for right wing Israeli fundamentalists

that would also be "anti-Semitic" !!!

And likewise, if we suggest that we should stop arming right wing Israel, that would be

"anti-Jewish" --

Try dealing with some of the info in the video --

Like the fuel selector being in the "off" position --

are you saying JFK was suicidal?

[Behind the Aegis]

18. Learn about anti-Semitism.

For many, especially in the more over-the-top CT, "Israel" and by proxy "Mossad" does mean "Jews." (Look up "Zionist conspiracies," "Illuminati," and "Jewish cabals.") It is a code word so as to not sound anti-Semitic, a conspiracy of sorts. One has to watch more of the painfully ignorant and disjointed videos to see this.

"So if Israel sunk a US ship, you'd say "the jews did it"? "

I wouldn't, but more than a few would.

[defendandprotect]

30. Criticism of Israel nor MOSSAD adds up to "anti-semitism" except in your mind .. .

and, your mind seems to be fixed on not responding to the topic under

discussion --

In fact, United Nations was "anti-semitic" in their criticism of Israel calling

their last ventures into war making a "full scale war" on Palestine?

Tsk, tsk --


Move on . . .

[Behind the Aegis]

51. As you aren't making much sense, I will simply say, you don't know what I think.

Therefore, do not state you do.

[defendandprotect]

25. Correct . . . neither would anyone else -- but it's all they have . . .!!

[apocalypsehow]

19. "Zionist Illuminati" - Hah! All that's missing is a reference to the Bildebergers....

I haven't watched all the videos, just the first one and that trope jumped out at me right away toward the end. The images are blatant.

One of my rules of CT theories is: the longer one discusses a CT theory with a true believer, the likelihood "the Jews did it" meme will emerge approaches 100%. Not always true, of course, but enough so that exceptions almost always prove the rule.

Another one: not all CT'ers are anti-semites, but all anti-semites are CT'ers.

It is striking, how many CT theories and rank anti-semitism so often seem to go together like rancid peas & carrots.

[Behind the Aegis]

20. Just to be clear...this 10 part suckfest didn't make mention of "Zionist Illuminati."

As I was looking at the different videos, I also checked the "related videos" off to the side and saw "Obama is a member of the Zionist Illuminati." It was a different "producer" too.

I can discuss some theories with some people as long as they are grounded and realize their "proof" is speculation and conjecture...kinds of proof according to Lionel Hutz, attorney-at-law for the Simpsons, his office is next to the Orange Julius stand. ;) Some of the ideas are interesting, but are often very wild.

"It is striking, how many CT theories and rank anti-semitism so often seem to go together like rancid peas & carrots. "

It isn't really that striking to be honest. I have studied anti-Semitism for years, including very specific issues (the expulsion of Jews from the UK, anti-Semitism in countries with no Jews, and recently looking into anti-Semitism in Imperial WWII Japan). I have found there tend to be certain 'triggers' that cause people to look to the Jews as the source. But, if you are really interested in reading some really bizarre, and I mean bizarre anti-Semitic CTs, I have a site for you to explore. You will be amazed at the lengths this person goes to in order to ties Jews to everything from the disappearance of Natalee Hollaway to modern day blood libels.

I find some aren't interested in things unless there is some conspiracy involved and only become more interested if Israel and/or the Jews are somehow involved. Another poster asked why there so few posts about the Moscow terrorist attack and I so wanted to post "no one has tied it to Israel or a cabal of Jews yet."

[defendandprotect]

32. Other than your suggestion that we are not permitted to criticize MOSSAD and Bilderbergers . . .

what other red herrings are you offering?

Try debating the subject --

[SDuderstadt]

34. Yes, be very careful or....

you'll join the rest of us on D&P's ignore list.

[Behind the Aegis]

47. Well, given his posts, I won't cry too hard. He won't be the first, nor the last.

I have found some like to "debate" by telling you what your position should be, rather than what it is, as well as including speculation as "fact." That isn't really debate especially when people try to make opinion or conjecture into fact based on belief alone.

[Behind the Aegis]

78. It has happened!

Oh noes! At least I join the ranks of some cool people.

[zappaman]

79. Welcome!

It is an honor to have you in this fine club!

[Behind the Aegis]

45. Any more logical fallacies?

I said nothing about not discussing Mossad. However, given your lack of critical thinking skills evidenced in your posts and failure to distinguish actual fallacies, I can see why this would be distracting to you. There is nothing to debate. It was a crap piece of disjointed, speculative bullshit. It wasn't even one of the better conspiracy theories I have seen at this site or on you tube.

[defendandprotect]

60. You were not suggesting that criticism of MOSSAD or Bilderbergers was "anti-semitic" . . .???

Interesting delusion . . .

[Behind the Aegis]

63. Are you not changing your accusation?

[defendandprotect]

66. My accusation remains the same . . . you are waving red herrings . . .

and showing a high interest in avoiding the actual subject of the thread --

No -- discussing MOSSAD and the Bilderbergs and their evil agenda is not the equivalent

of anti-semitism . . .

Any more than discussing Israeli right wing fundi policy of warmongering anti-Jewish!

Every nation has a right wing -- and in every nation they do despicable things --

America is no different from Israel, MOSSAD no different from our own CIA.

[Behind the Aegis]

68. Given your desire to post inaccurate information...

...I fail to see how you can make a valid point. No one said discussing Mossad or the Builderbergs (when did that get introduced? I didn't say anything about them.) is anti-Semitic; that is your own strawman. I said it could be used as code or lead to anti-Semitic rhetoric or be based in such. There is a difference between what I actually said and the strawman you created.

[defendandprotect]

69. Here's your post . . . reread it -- Your Message #55 --

Behind the Aegis (1000+ posts) Tue Mar-30-10 01:26 AM
Response to Reply #54
55.

Sometimes it is; after all, sometimes a cigar is sometimes just cigar.
However, in the mind of CT-ers, cigars are rarely cigars, so taking that analogy and stretching it,

it becomes easy to see how many use "Mossad" as a code for "Jews."

This is not to say all do it or even all are aware of it, but it happens quite often. I doubt the creator of this crapfest is a Jew-hater of drooling sorts, but the sly accusation is reminiscent of other CT that do lead down the road to the "Illuminati", then the "Zionists", until it finally lands smack dap onto the "Jews." I don't see anti-Semitism around every corner, but I do know when I see it and when I see its lead up.
Force without wisdom falls of its own weight -- Horace

[Behind the Aegis]

71. You forgot to increase the size in the following:

This is not to say all do it or even all are aware of it, but it happens quite often.

[defendandprotect]

74. What it says is that you can't debate the issue and took the low road

to tossing red herrings -- and have tried to deny even what you've posted!

Try to get onto the high road -- try to debate the actual subject --

and if you can avoid disingenous posts, you can stay off of ignore.

[Behind the Aegis]

75. The disingenuous posts are yours, as demonstrated by your "attacks."

Do learn what a "red herring" is before using the term. If you can avoid intellectual dishonest posts, logical fallacies, and disingenuous allegations a discussion might break out.

[defendandprotect]

76. You're denying your own posts . . .

You're on "ignore."

Bye --

[Behind the Aegis]

77. You are denying reality.

I guess it will be a sunshiney day!

[SDuderstadt]

81. You were probably one of the few posters D&P doesn't already...

have on "ignore", as all you have to do is disagree with her to earn that honor. Over time, her threats to put others on "ignore" and subsequent follow-through have become something of an inside joke, as have her disjointed, incoherent posts.

[defendandprotect]

31. Try discussing the topic under debate -- and leave the red herrings for some other website ...

And, The Bilderbergers are now the "good guys" .... ???

:rofl:

[apocalypsehow]

36. Non-responsive - per usual. n/t.

[defendandprotect]

37. Where is your debate on the subject . .. non-responsive, as usual . . .

Now if you want to discuss this video and anti-semitism, open a thread on it --

if you want to join in this debate -- go to it --

If you want to continue being disingenuous and childish . . .

you'll be on ignore --

take your pick --

[SDuderstadt]

40. "you'll be on ignore "

I didn't know anyone WASN'T on ignore.

[apocalypsehow]

44. My discussion of the rank anti-semitism proffered in this "documentary" is right where it should be-

in this OP.

I don't do *ignore*, since I don't have an intellectual inferiority complex and am not afraid to face debate & discussion with my opposite numbers forthrightly.

But, hey, whateva floats your boat...

[SDuderstadt]

38. If D&P actually was responsive....

how could you tell? Most of the time she's so incoherent, I have no idea what the fuck she's talking about.

[apocalypsehow]

42. Excellent point - one has to have an initial standard by which to measure the "logic" of any given

person's ongoing argument(s), and I've yet to see any coherent benchmark in the content of her replies yet.

Well said. :thumbsup:

[defendandprotect]

43. OK . . . guess you've made your choice clear . . .

:thumbsdown:

You're on "ignore" --

bye

[apocalypsehow]

46. Say it ain't sooooooooo!!!

:cry: :cry: :cry:













( :eyes: + :beer: = :rofl: )

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ter]

50. Big difference in blaming "the Jews" vs. the Mossad

The Mossad isn't "Jews did it." I thought you were a parody at first, then I saw your avitar and knew you weren't. Not everything is anti-Semitism.

[Behind the Aegis]

52. No, not everything is, so anymore strawmen you wish to attack?

Of course, given your past posts, I am not surprised by your remarks and lack of critical thinking skills.

[Ter]

54. I am just saying blaming the Mossad is the same as blaming...

The CIA, KGB, or whoever. No race/religion has been blamed, it's just you putting an invisible spin on it. What past posts are you referring too?

[Behind the Aegis]

55. Sometimes it is; after all, sometimes a cigar is sometimes just cigar.

However, in the mind of CT-ers, cigars are rarely cigars, so taking that analogy and stretching it, it becomes easy to see how many use "Mossad" as a code for "Jews." This is not to say all do it or even all are aware of it, but it happens quite often. I doubt the creator of this crapfest is a Jew-hater of drooling sorts, but the sly accusation is reminiscent of other CT that do lead down the road to the "Illuminati", then the "Zionists", until it finally lands smack dap onto the "Jews." I don't see anti-Semitism around every corner, but I do know when I see it and when I see its lead up.

[Ter]

56. I believe a lot of right-wing CT are anti-Semitic

The guy who made this video, however, appears to be on the (far?) left. He goes on to say Reagan was sleeping for 8 years, and praised every Kennedy (said Teddy was drugged when he was involved in the fatal crash), and had some kind words for Bill Clinton and Al Gore too. Then again, I'm certainly not saying the far, far-left is not anti-Semitic, because many are just like the far right is. I just don't see it in this case.

[Behind the Aegis]

57. I am not familiar with all of his "work," and therefore, cannot determine for certain.

However, I do recognize the "whiff" of anti-Semitism. It doesn't mean it will turn out to be such, but it does warrant a close, scrutinous eye. I said before, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, and this may be nothing more than an innocent "cigar," or it could be a huge, raging dick. The extreme right is more honest in their anti-Semitism than the far-left, and, if he is indeed on the left, as you suggest, it stands to reason the anti-Semitism may not be as blatant as "fucking Jews did it/helped!" It doesn't mean it is there, but the clues start to add up. What I find interesting is many will claim posters such as myself are seeing an anti-Semitic "conspiracy" in a thread/post about a conspiracy theory, yet, we tend to say our beliefs are suspicions based on a variety of things, but do not conclude it is so until further proof emerges.

[Ter]

58. Well, the same guy also did the JFK II film

He also said something about Israeli agents were seen right after the event or something. Maybe you're right and maybe it is anti-Semitism. Or maybe he just views the US and its closest ally in cahoots with each other, example meaning he dislikes the Bush right-wing governments and the right-wing Netanyahu governments. I don't know.

[defendandprotect]

61. "Mossad" is being used by DU'ers as a "code for Jews" . . . ???

And what is CIA a code for?

[Behind the Aegis]

64. Read it again, this time for what is actually written.

[defendandprotect]

65. Here's what is actually written . . . and I hope everyone rereads it . . .

However, in the mind of CT-ers, cigars are rarely cigars, so taking that analogy and stretching it,

it becomes easy to see how many use "Mossad" as a code for "Jews."

[Behind the Aegis]

67. And where is it written...

"Mossad" is being used by DU'ers as a "code for Jews"

[defendandprotect]

70. Here's your post . . . reread it ... Your reply #55

Behind the Aegis (1000+ posts) Tue Mar-30-10 01:26 AM
Response to Reply #54
55.

Sometimes it is; after all, sometimes a cigar is sometimes just cigar.
However, in the mind of CT-ers, cigars are rarely cigars, so taking that analogy and stretching it,

it becomes easy to see how many use "Mossad" as a code for "Jews."

This is not to say all do it or even all are aware of it, but it happens quite often. I doubt the creator of this crapfest is a Jew-hater of drooling sorts, but the sly accusation is reminiscent of other CT that do lead down the road to the "Illuminati", then the "Zionists", until it finally lands smack dap onto the "Jews." I don't see anti-Semitism around every corner, but I do know when I see it and when I see its lead up.
Force without wisdom falls of its own weight -- Horace

[Behind the Aegis]

73. And again, your post is nothing more than dishonest rehashing.

People will easily be able to read I said nothing about DU'ers, nor that all use/discussion of Mossad is anti-Semitic.

[defendandprotect]

24. The MOSSAD, like our CIA does only noble things in the world--!!!

It's good to see someone concerned with anti-semitic sentiments --

but accusing MOSSAD of involvement is only similar to accusing the CIA of involvement ...

and they certainly were involved --

Poppy Bush is a "Jew"?

Rockefellers were "Jews"?

Allen Dulles a "Jew"?

[thinking man]

27. yeah

what it seems like is this: you've taken in some ideas from dumb asses that say anything that the Massod does must be an indication of 'The Jews', which they tie into the zionist conspiracy. So now anytime the Massod is mentioned in a bad light, you get offended, because to you that means 'The Jews' etc. I understand this because of my similar line of thought in medias treatment of minorities. It's hard once you get that idea in your head to remember that most people actually don't think that way. Some do! you are right, but most don't. Your way of thinking is extremely conspiratorial by the way, which is fine.
To me, the Massod is the Israeli CIA basically, I don't see what it has to do with religion or bloodlines. Israel has done some shady things, just like our country has. These shady things have way more to do with individuals struggling for power, see game theory.

[apocalypsehow]

39. Hey, you're welcome to the scummy company of the anti-semites who proffer this bilge - most decent

folks prefer otherwise, and can recognize anti-semitic/racist filth when they see it. But keep twisting yourself into knots to try and excuse the rank anti-semitism offered up in that "documentary"...

[defendandprotect]

41. Well, the interest in killing this thread is certainly high--!! Interesting . . .

I'd stick with this subject, if I were you, Indi Guy!

:)

[SDuderstadt]

53. Here's the summary report from the NTSB....

if you'd bother to read it, I think you'll find the problem is Hankey simply doesn't know how to read the report.

http://ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?ev_id=20001212X19354&ntsbno=NYC99MA178&akey=1

[jberryhill]

59. And the entire Kennedy family - again - is too stupid or cowardly to figure it out?

I'll bet you think the Kennedys are the least curious people on earth.

[defendandprotect]

62. Right, they totally ignored the missing plane . . . !!!

. . . why would they think the FAA and Coast Guard/Pentagon wouldn't be

doing their jobs?!!

It is the stupid and cowardly among us who use violence as a political tool --

and that's the right wing.

[jberryhill]

80. Have You Contacted Caroline Kennedy With This Important Information?

Or doesn't she care?

[defendandprotect]

85. Have you watched the video . . . ? Do you understand the contacts made?

[defendandprotect]

72. Again, think you have a winner here from the very high ratio of

attacks on it --

This is another assassination just waiting to burst forth in truth with

some real investigation and power in the hands of the left for a change!

[SDuderstadt]

83. The reason there is a "very high ratio of attacks on it" is because it's...

fucking stupid.

[zappaman]

88. dude

that made me laugh!
this OP is the high point of ridiculous!

[SDuderstadt]

89. Thank you very much....

I'm here all week.

[Ter]

82. This was very interesting

Why was the fuel in the off position? However, I don't like the Bush link. He gave no evidence except that he was nowhere to be found the night of the crash. That's not good enough for an investigation.

[defendandprotect]

84. What's your guess re the fuel selector on "off" . . . ??

And, when someone is campaigning for president, it is unusual

when the press has no idea where they are -- or when their staff

can't say!

It is only intended to strike that note -- unusual.

Not unlike Poppy Bush and his disdappearance during "October Surprise."

[Indi Guy]

86. for the record - I was raised (like many of us) with images of the Holocost...

As a child I saw the pictures & movies of its aftermath -- the emaciated bodies, both barely living and the dead stacked like cord-wood outside their ovens, or in a trench.

(Aside from all the lands that they stole), I saw the loot the Nazis gleaned from their prey -- the sight of the mountains of suitcases & eyeglasses still disturb me as I write this. I also know that the Nazis pulled gold teeth from their prisoners & made lampshades from their skin, and soap from their fat.

There is not one iota of antisemitism on my part in this thread.

Every major government has its shadowy elements, diametrically at odds with its very own people. Sometimes these elements rise to the top of power. Beware the advertised party line?

[apocalypsehow]

87. Posting links to an *confirmed* anti-semitic video lends complicity to that video's odious message.

Own it.

[Indi Guy]

90. Facts are facts...

There are some facts worth noting in the video. I don't stand behind the whole thing, as I stated in the OP.

I don't post on DU often enough to know what is a "confirmed" anti-semitic, anti-black, or anti-whoever video.

I was taught to revere the unimaginable suffering of the Jewish people -- which I do to this very day, more than I can express in feeble words. This understanding I own within the very depths of my soul.

Fear, greed, hatred & arrogance seem to be at the root of all evil in this world.

I don't identify with this agenda.

[vincent_vega_lives]

91. Simple explanation

Based on the tight twists and turns he was making, and the known weather conditions, he got lost in the dark, lost situational awareness of the horizon, his altitude and rate of decent...and tragically flew into the ocean.

At 2139:50, the airplane entered a left turn, while slightly increasing altitude to 2,600 feet. The airplane reached a maximum bank angle of 28 degrees left-wing-down (LWD) and a maximum vertical acceleration of 1.2 Gs in this turn. When the maximum LWD bank angle was obtained, the altitude started to decrease at a descent rate close to 900 fpm. The LWD attitude was maintained for approximately 15 seconds until the airplane was heading towards the east. At 2140:07, the airplane bank angle returned to wings level. At 2140:15, with the airplane continuing towards the east, it reestablished a descent close to 900 fpm and then started to increase its bank angle in a RWD direction at nearly a constant rate. As the airplane bank angle increased, the rate of descent increased, and the airspeed started to increase. By 2140:25, the bank angle exceeded 45 degrees, the vertical acceleration was 1.2 Gs, the airspeed increased through 180 knots, and the flightpath angle was close to 5 degrees airplane nose down. After 2140:25, the airplane's airspeed, vertical acceleration, bank, and dive angle continued to increase, and the right turn tightened until water impact, about 2141.

The above would seem to point to this...

Graveyard spiral - In a prolonged coordinated, constant-rate turn, the fluid in the semicircular tubes in the axis of the turn will cease its movement...An observed loss altitude in the aircraft instruments and the absence of any sensation of turning may create the illusion of being in a descent with the wings level. The disoriented pilot may pull back on the controls, tightening the spiral and increasing the loss of altitude....

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?ev_id=20001212X19354&ntsbno=NYC99MA178&akey=1

[blavatsky3]

92. JFK Jr on Oprah 1996

JFK Jr said he was thinking of running for office.

He would have run against Bush.

If he won he would have re-investigated the Assassination of his father, JFK.

I guess some people like the Bush Family would have opposed that.

[zappaman]

93. This conspiracy theory is even goofier

than the "we never went to the moon" CT.
Hilarious!

[Codeine]

94. How many threads are you going to necro, dude? nt