Okay, "truthers"....

[SDuderstadt]

what does this mean?

Since you guys are always touting the "results" of self-selected DU polls that you claim indicate the "vast majority" of DU members believe in "MIHOP" or "LIHOP", what do you make of the following?

As you know, DU has a fund drive going and, for every $10 one donates, they can place whatever message they want on a "sticky". I am counting 113 "stickies" in the latest fund drive (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and round it down to 100)and, of those, only one has a clear "9/11 was an inside job" theme and one makes some sort of cryptic reference to another relatively well-known "truther" here, so I'll give you that one. Even rounding the number down dramatically and counting two instances, doesn't that suggest that, at best, "9/11 was an inside job" enjoys a 1-2% endorsement?

So, tell me...what does that mean?

Oh, wait...I just realized...most DU members would be afraid of retribution or for their lives for pointing out the crimes of TPTB.

[OnTheOtherHand]

1. that more agree, but don't care enough to make it a sticky?

That's probably true, in fact, although I'm not suggesting that the "vast majority" of DUers believe in MIHOP or LIHOP.

(I'm not a "truther.")

[SDuderstadt]

2. Good observation, although...

the question would be what percentage does believe in one of the "HOPs" and why don't they express it more openly?

[Chris P. Bacon]

3. I think you should conduct your own poll

Asking DU'ers about their choice, regarding the 9-11 attacks. The "Muslims did it and Muslims did it alone" choice vs. the several kinds of inside-job choices.

[SDuderstadt]

4. The "Muslims did it and Muslims did it alone"

I'm not sure that should be a choice, plus it will have to stay in the 9/11 forum, so it would hardly be representative.

[Chris P. Bacon]

5. If a person has "I am pro-choice and proud" in a sticky, how does that explain his/her 9-11 views?

I think the only way to know would be asking that person, "what do you think about 9-11"?

The problem with the sticky argument and your "2% endorsement" claim is that the number of people whose 9-11 views are unknown to us is approximately 98%.

[SDuderstadt]

6. Jesus fucking christ...

did you totally miss the point? "Truthers" routinely claim that the vast majority of DU believes in either MIHOP or LIHOP. The point is, given the chance to express those views, only 1-2% do so. I never claimed that to be the number of people who believe it. Read what I actually wrote, dude.

[Chris P. Bacon]

7. The chance given in a poll vs. the chance given by these stickies are apples vs. oranges

In a poll, One is presented with a handful of choices. In a situation where you can write whatever you want on a sticky, the choices are infinite. I don't think the situations can be compared.

[SDuderstadt]

8. Dude...

I am not comparing a sticky to a poll. Have you ever heard of satire? I am asking what "9/11 was an inside job" types make of the lack of stickies portraying that sentiment. Why aren't more people using the opportunity to highlight their belief?

It's a simple question.

[whatchamacallit]

9. It doesn't mean shit

Logical fallacy much? Let me help you Mr. Critical Thinking... I have many interests, beliefs, and causes. 9/11 is but one of many. To assume that anyone who doubts the official story, would undoubtedly make that their first and only message on their sticky(s) is pretty fuckin stupid. This OP proves nothing but your lack of reasoning skills.

[SDuderstadt]

10. Read my post again...

I didn't draw a conclusion. I asked to provoke discussion. Duh.

It's also parodying "truthers" who make stupid claims like "the vast majority of DU believes in MIHOP or LIHOP". Your shoot-first, ask-questions-later" style has made you look silly yet once more, dude.

[whatchamacallit]

11. right...

I can tell you this, the DU polls I've seen - where questions directly related to 9/11 are asked - favor "truther"sentiments by a wide margin (which is probably why they get chucked down here so fast). I'd say that's better evidence than trying to infer people's beliefs by counting the messages on stickies.

BTW, how does successfully calling you on your bullshit make *me* look silly?

[SDuderstadt]

12. Because you're making a false claim...

dude. As well, you're drawing an unwarranted conclusion based upon your "observation" about DU polls, which you'd know if you had the foggiest notion what a valid sample was. Again, read what I wrote and show me where I claimed anything. Can you?

[whatchamacallit]

13. Ah the weasel dance...

Your post insinuates. Deny (lie) if you like, but people can make up their own minds what you intended. Also, even if what I've observed is not necessarily statistically valid, it's sure a whole lot better than the strawman you're pimping. D U De.

[SDuderstadt]

14. Dude...

do you understand what the elements of a claim even are? If you do, can you point to them in the OP?

For the last fucking time, I posted it to provoke discussion of something I find meaningful but draw no conclusion from. I also stated that part of my aim was to parody those "truthers" that are so critical thinking-challenged that they stupidly claim one can draw valid conclusions from a self-selected set of poll respondents. If you understood anything about polling, you'd realize how stupid that is.

Either provide some evidence of any claim I made or I'll regard this as a closed matter.

[whatchamacallit]

15. Fine

How is it "meaningful"? Is there a conclusion that can be drawn from it's meaning? If not, like I said, it doesn't mean shit. Thanks for playing.

[SDuderstadt]

16. I don't care if it's meaningful to you or not...

dude. Duh.

Simple question: Do you think the "truth movement" is losing ground or gaining traction? How many Democratic state party organizations have featured "9/11 truth" at a state convention? Why is that, dude? Nine years later, where should the "9/11 truth movement" be?

[Coldpal]

17. I don't think stickies as a measuring method is gaining traction either

Among statisticians.

[SDuderstadt]

18. Read what I actually wrote...

dude.

[johnnie]

19. Most people have other things on their mind

Just because only "1-2%" post a sticky doesn't mean the others that think it's either MIHOP or LIHOP are obsessed about 9/11 as you are. They come to DU for many other issues. You've been down here too long, I think you need to get out more.

[SDuderstadt]

20. Hmmmm....

wouldn't LIHOP or MIHOP have been the crime of the century? Why aren't more people thinking about it?

Hint: I think the "9/11 was an inside job" movement is dying out.

[whatchamacallit]

21. Well truthers the jig is up

the brilliant SDuderstadt has deduced from the percentage of "inside job" messages on donation stickies, that very few people think about 9/11 and that the "movement" is over. Pack up the tents. guess we can all go home now. That includes you SDude. Bye bye.

[zappaman]

22. not really

if you had any reading comprehension whatsoever, you would see the point was addressing the people who say "the majority of DU knows 9/11 was an inside job".
obviously, that's not true or the dungeon wouldn't ever exist.
but keep digging whatchamacallit, you're almost there....
nothing more entertaining than watching the "truth movement" run around in circles.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SDuderstadt]

23. Another stupid strawman from you...

please show me where I said that.

[whatchamacallit]

25. What's all this then?

"wouldn't LIHOP or MIHOP have been the crime of the century? Why aren't more people thinking about it?

Hint: I think the "9/11 was an inside job" movement is dying out."

Where do you get this "logic"? Missing stickies?

You don't really think you're fooling anyone with the "show me exactly where I said X" schtick do you?

[SDuderstadt]

26. Dude...

I asked some rather simple questions. It's pretty clear your interest here is picking a fight.

Simple question: why aren't state Democratic parties giving your "movement" more airtime?

Hint: because the "9/11 was an inside job" contingent is as embarrassing to the Democratic party as the "brothers" SHOULD be to the GOP, dude.

[whatchamacallit]

27. Thread morphing will not save you

nice try though. Adieu.

[SDuderstadt]

28. Buh-bye...

dude.

[davidkc]

29. You claim that "9/11 was an inside job" movement is "dying out"

Do you imply that at one point in the past, most stickies endorsed MIHOP or LIHOP, since stickies are the barometer that you use to measure whether a movement is dying out or not?

[SDuderstadt]

30. Why are only "truthers" with reading comprehension deficits...

weighing in on this?

Did you note my rather clever use of the word "think"? Here's some unsolicited help, dude. When you see someone lead off a statement with the words, "I think", they are rendering their OPINION, not making a statement of fact. Duh.

[davidkc]

31. When opinions are based on things such as the Sticky theory

Reactions are likely to be negative.

[SDuderstadt]

32. Dude...

can you read what I actually wrote? I am parodying those "truthers" who have rather stupidly claimed that the "vast majority of DU believes in MIHOP or LIHOP" based upon unscientific "polls". I should have known this would go over your head.

In my opinion, half the fights get started here when a "truther" starts with some variation of, "well, when you said that, what you REALLY meant was...", which is why I have such disdain for conspiracy theorists.

Maybe you should drop the strawman arguments.