Don't drink the koolaid - think !

[NotNInch]

Why would anyone knowingly take a timer-activated bomb into a public place and stay with it 'til it explodes?

[LARED]

1. No timing devices have been recovered (n/t)

[NotNInch]

2. So where did you find my post ?????

Please answer while I look for the info on the timing devices that were found.

No joke, I cannot locate my post.

[LARED]

3. september 11 forum (n/t)

[libertypirate]

17. I saw that as well I thought the same thing...

[John Doe II]

4. Sometimes I wonder if you're serious ...

" According to the latest report by ABC News, U.K. authorities say they have found remnants of timing devices, suggesting the bombs were planted in packages or bags and left behind."
http://news.nasdaq.com/aspxcontent/newsstory.aspx?&cpath=20050707%5CACQDJON200507071911DOWJONESDJONLINE001669.htm

Or just search for "timing devices" and "London" and choose your source...
LARED, I really don't know how you can make such a statement especially without giving a source.

[LARED]

6. You might want to check more current news

No timing devices have been found.

[John Doe II]

7. Bother to present sources and

bother thinking about why one day something is found and the next day it is claimed that is wasn't found?

[LARED]

8. Some sources

BTW your source is from 07/07/05. Perhaps its comments were a bit early

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=2&ObjectID=10335891

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1050714/asp/frontpage/story_4988275.asp

No timing devices were found when the bombs exploded, suggesting that the men were suicide bombers who detonated the explosives manually.

http://www.capetimes.co.za/index.php?fSectionId=272&fArticleId=2620192

Paddick said no timing devices or other detonators had yet been discovered in the wreckage. When they are found, they are "probably going to be in millions of pieces", he said.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/terrorism/s_351871.html

Paddick said no timing devices or other detonators had yet been discovered in the wreckage and are "going to be in probably millions of pieces," he said. Early analysis suggested that each bomb consisted of a "device in a bag, rather than something that was strapped to the individual."

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/uk/article_1033748.php/British_police_hunt_masterminds_of_London_attack

Following Tuesday's discovery of "large amounts of explosives" and bomb-making equipment during police searches in Leeds, and in an abandoned car at Luton station, north of London, investigations were concentrating on the type of explosives used in the attacks.

Traces of military plastic explosives were found at the scene of the blasts, it was reported Wednesday.

Police said no timing devices had been found, suggesting that the bombs were triggered by hand, which would support the assumption of a suicide mission.

[John Doe II]

13. Thanks for the sources:

Interesting that apparently every detail of the story is changing.
Have a look at this from July 9:

LONDON, July 9 -- The bombs that ripped through three London subway trains during Thursday's morning rush hour were high explosives triggered almost simultaneously, most likely by synchronized timing devices rather than by suicide bombers, according to a revised account released on Saturday by police.

After examining computer data, electrical equipment and eyewitness statements, investigators have concluded that the three bombs were set off within 50 seconds of one another, officials said during a news conference. "It was bang, bang, bang -- very close together," said Tim O'Toole, managing director of the London Underground.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/09/AR2005070901248.html

Or this from Jul 8 (afternoon) being very precise:
British investigative authorities have reportedly found two timing devices used by terrorists in yesterday's bombing attacks in London.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200507/s1410263.htm

And it makes sense that they used a timing device if the attack was simultaneous. I say "if" cause even the timeline changed a lot.

Technical data and witness accounts suggest the bombs contained synchronized timing devices and were probably not triggered by suicide bombers, Deputy Assistant Commissioner Brian Paddick told reporters Saturday.
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/07/09/london.attacks/?section=cnn_topstories


So, what we have is:
A very precise information that they found timing devices.
Then that it is very likely they used timing devices and that it wasn't a suicide mission.
Then that they didn't use a timing device but that they were suicide terrorists.

[janedoe]

20. Well, for the first 1.5 hour, it was a power surge.

I happened to be away at the time, with CNN on as background noise. I don't know how much time passed -- perhaps 30 minutes, before I wondered why they were playing the same story of an "innocent" power surge, continuously. That made me suspicious. It continued on for another hour before they announced any malace was involved.

The first story was "suicide bombers," and "no timers." That lasted for about an hour(?) and then turned to "no comment." I think it turned into "timers" in the afternoon (July 7). I don't remember exactly when that story switch occurred, but I do remember wondering how the story could change so quickly, once they committed to a story.

Then, I think it was Tuesday or Wednesday when the story switched again to the "suicide bombers" story.

http://xymphora.blogspot.com/2005/07/birth-of-london-bomb-official-story.html

So, with suicide or timers setting off bombs in the subway, one thing is consistent; there were bombs going off in three places. So, why couln't those terror-drill folks at those places recognize there were bombs going off for about 1.5 hours?

[LARED]

21. Interesting?

Interesting that apparently every detail of the story is changing.

I don't think every detail is changing? Do you?

I think if some details did not change as the investigation moved forward, I would be very suspicious.

The story changing as more information is collected is normal.

[John Doe II]

22. Not interesting. Very interesting!

Except the locations where it happened on 7/7 can you name details that didn't change in the course of one week? How many?

[StrafingMoose]

14. Well then...

Let the autority make their official word on it. There seems to be conflicting reports, I agree. By authority I mean what the representative says at the daily press breifing (if there's any in UK or it's equivalent appelation).

It would be good also to have the word from the MI5 people too.

[Sweet Pea]

9. Yeah....

Called the "fog of war".

[Woody Box]

11. The fog comes always afterwards

The birth of the London bomb Official Story (7/13)

http://www.xymphora.blogspot.com

You can practically hear the click at that moment in the life of every conspiracy when the police investigation turns into the Official Story. At that point, the investigation is intended to 'fix the facts' to the Official Story, and the cover-up begins. The story of the London bombs has made this transformation within the last twenty-four hours.

Yeah - this is the way it works. xymphora has it right.

[Kevin Fenton]

12. Finding timers

It's actually quite difficult to find the pieces of a timing device after an explosion. In The New Jackals Simon Reeve describes the attack on PAL 434 by Ramzi Yousef and the investigation afterwards, where they had great trouble finding the timer and proving it in court. When you think that the bomb exploded, destroying the timer and that three of the sets of timer pieces were in dark tunnels buried under a whole load of debris, it's hard to imagine that a piece of a timer would have been recovered on the first day.

The press speculates about stuff every day. The idea that what comes out first is true and what comes out later is a cover up is usually a good one, but here there are good reasons to doubt what came out initially. Besides, the suicide bombers really existed. I don't see how the presence of timers indicate it was a false flag operation.

[NotNInch]

16. What about the drill?

Who was placing or carrying the bombs for the drill?

[Kevin Fenton]

18. Not much information

There's isn't much information about the drill. The only thing I've heard is an interview with Peter Power which discusses it for a few seconds. Based on that, I couldn't say whether it was an exercise with actual people doing actual things on the ground, or just a table-top exercise. I agree that the drill is odd, but I don't think it's enough to claim it was a false flag exercise.

[muriel_volestrangler]

19. Power says the drill was on paper only

From another thread in this forum:

In short, our exercise (which involved just a few people as crisis managers actually responding to a simulated series of activities involving, on paper, 1000 staff) quickly became the real thing and the players that morning responded very well indeed to the sudden reality of events.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=46961&mesg_id=47397

[StrafingMoose]

23. Yup, but...

That drill was ordered by a 'private company' and Visor was hired to do the paper & communication thing in a bigger exercise 'that will remain confidential'.

The parts I quoted were from a reply email someone here received from Power stating also that he won't make any further comments unless you have journalist credentials. I can't remember who exactly, if he/she sees this message could he/she step up? I'd like to read this email again :P

[Kevin Fenton]

5. Simultaneous

Because there were a series of bombs and they wanted them to go off together.

[Woody Box]

10. "Absolutely nothing to suggest a suicide bomb"

These sources are from 7/8

Andy Hayman, head of the anti-terrorist branch of London's largest police force — the Met, said there was "absolutely nothing to suggest this (the bus attack) was a suicide bomb".

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1165735.cms

Assistant Police Commissioner Andy Hayman said officials believe the bombs were placed on the floors of the three subway cars that were hit. He said the initial investigation suggests that each bomb had less than 10 pounds of explosives.

Based on evidence recovered from the rubble, investigators believe some of the bombs were on timers, a U.S. law enforcement official said. The official would not further describe the evidence.

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/news/070805_nw_bombings_london.html


Law enforcement officials declined to respond to questions about a U.S. official's statement that evidence indicating timers were used was found in the debris. London police also played down the possibility the devices were detonated by remote control using cell phones.

http://www.bradenton.com/mld/bradenton/news/breaking_news/12085481.htm

[screembloodymurder]

15. It's all official "speculation".

Something we're only allowed to do here in the wing-nut corner.