757-type debris at Pentagon

[Duer 157099]

Has it been considered that if this was MIHOP, that an unmanned drone plane, the one the witnesses saw, was filled up with already-damanged 757 parts to deposit at the crash site? Which would render the argument using the few photos showing bona fide 757 wreckage as moot.

Seems plausible to me to do this, if one were willing to go so far as to stage 9/11

[killtown]

1. No 'plane debris' at Pentagon could NOT have been planted

All the 'plane debris' seen at the Pentagon could have EASILY been planted there.

I doubt the drone (if there was one) was filled with plane debris. Most of the plane debris seen outside the Pentagon has no burn marks on them, clear indications that they were planted by hand (either before or after). You can also see Pentagon workers carrying them away by hand, so they obviously could have been carried to by hand.

[file83]

2. Those drones don't have "cargo" space in which to "fill" with debris.

They have small compartments for electronics and missles can be strapped to the wings, but filling a Global Hawk with "planted debris" isn't really possible because they don't have the space. Any tiny amount that they could stash on board would probably get destroyed during the explosion/impact.

[Kesha]

3. ...but A-3 Sky Warriors have a bomb bay to store some debris

...and there is a whole fleet of them, owned by the same Raytheon company
which sucessfully developed & tested JPALS on 25th August 2001.


Kesha

[mirandapriestly]

12. Raytheon - didn't they have a floor on the WTC?

and there was something weird, like one of their executives was allegedly found in the debris , but he had been aboard the "plane" that hit it, not in the building?

why the Sky Warrior?

[DoYouEverWonder]

19. A number of Raytheon employees

were on Flight 77.

[Kesha]

33. That`s right... on every flight except UA93

See this Team8plus thread for details:

http://www.team8plus.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?1370.0


Kesha

[mirandapriestly]

46. ooh, yes, they had the 91st floor on wtc2

that would have been a convenient floor for crews to be working on the building prior to 9-11.

[DoYouEverWonder]

47. Any idea how many floors

and which ones were never occupied?

I ask this because in most skyscrapers, including the Empire State Building, whole floors are still left empty because no one has ever rented or occupied them. These areas are never 'finished' because there hasn't been any need to. It would be interesting to find out which areas of the WTC were still 'unfinished'.

For example -



You can see in this picture that one floor is on fire all the way across the whole side of the building. Why do I get the feeling this was an empty floor? Why is the fire so intense on just that one floor but not directly above and below it?

[mirandapriestly]

54. Yes, I wish there was a way to know which floor was which

it looks like there are lines on the side that also go across . I wonder if those denote floors. Maybe I'll try to figure it out. There are lists of who occupied which floors. There is also that bizarre story about the artists who built a balcony on one of the floors a few months before 911.

[DoYouEverWonder]

48. Looks like at least one floor, the 34th floor was empty

Nevertheless, we tried to lure him into theorizing about his description of loud sounds he heard from the floor above while on the thirty-third floor. They sounded to him "like a dumpster with steel wheels scratching a bare cement floor."

"I was like," Rodriguez says, "'Oh my God, that's an empty floor, what's going on?'" No construction had been underway and, in fact, a special access key was needed to make an elevator stop at that floor. Fearing "somebody was there with a gun or something," he bypassed the floor.

But he stands by his vow: "I won't speculate because I'm not a theorist." However, it's surprising that the more, uh, creative minds of the 9/11 Truth Movement haven't latched onto the thirty-fourth floor. It could be positioned as both controlled-demolition-central and a munitions dump, where the largest bombs awaited detonation by a suicide crew manning the floor.

http://www.buffalobeast.com/89/wellen89.htm

[mirandapriestly]

55. Looks like 34th Floor was being refurbished and had a crew

working. Weird, it sounds like they all died except this one guy.

" Craig Trykowski, a laborer for Henegan Construction Co. in New York City for the past two years, was working with 75 tradespersons and colleagues on interior construction for Lehman Brothers on the 34th floor of the north tower of the World Trade Center. He had been working at the WTC for a little over three months. "The job was going well," he says.
...
They're all gone now," says Trykowski. "


The floor with the straight across fire was most likely one of the Marsh McLennon floors.

[Kesha]

32. Homer died twice

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:iwts8D3XdbYJ:www.pownetwork.org/bios/mia_usa2.htm+Herbert+Homer+killed+pentagon&hl=en

IMMEDIATE RELEASE
September 14, 2001

"...The Department of Defense announced today ten additional names of the approximately 126 persons who remain unaccounted for in the wake of Tuesday's attack on the Pentagon...

...Herbert Homer, Milford, Mass...


September 15, 2001
"...The Department of Defense announced today that Herbert W. Homer, a civilian employee of the Defense Contract Management Agency, was among the passengers aboard United Airlines Flight # 175, which crashed into the World Trade Center. He was previously listed in error as unaccounted at the Pentagon..."


...and why an A-3?
Raytheon has not only developed & tested JPALS, a precision approach & landings system shortly before 9/11... it also has it`s
own fleet of former Air Force "A-3 Sky Warrior".
We all know the first stories about what hit the Pentagon (and WTC 1!):
A small plane/commuter/737... and this is a A-3:



Kesha

[mirandapriestly]

44. ahhhhh...nt

[Kesha]

50. you don`t sound very...

...convinced. ;-)

Why?


Kesha

[mirandapriestly]

56. I guess I have the "pre 911 mindset"

where people only die once.;)

[killtown]

4. A CHALLENGE TO ANYONE - show me '757 debris'

at the Pentagon that COULD NOT have been planted.

[killtown]

5. Well, I guess all the Pentagon 'plane debris' was planted

since no one can show me plane debris there that couldn't have been planted!

[hack89]

6. Glad we solved that mystery - what's next? nt

[killtown]

7. You don't think any of the small amounts of plane debris was planted?

Show me one that couldn't have been planted.

[hack89]

8. Any piece that was man portable

could have been planted - you simply have to prove that it was planted. Something you have failed to do.

[killtown]

9. And you simply have to prove they WERE NOT planted

Something you have failed to do.

[hack89]

10. You are making the claim that they were planted ...

don't you feel any obligation to back up your assertion with some facts?

[killtown]

11. No, I'm asking show me pieces that could not have been planted

and NO ONE has been able to show me any which lends evidence that they were all planted.

I can't prove they were, you can't prove they weren't.


btw, you still believe (being paid) that a big ol' 757 disappeared into the Pentagon on the first floor flown by a 5'0 man who was declined being rented a Cessna a month before?

[MercutioATC]

13. I've asked the question before...maybe you'd like to try an answer?

There's photographic evidence of debris on the Pentagon lawn shortly after the incident. With scores of people watching, exactly how were they "planted" without anybody noticing (I'm speaking, in particular, of the large piece of fuselage that we're all familiar with).

You demand proof that it wasn't planted? I'm citing scored of witnesses (not "proof", but a reasonable explanation). Wanna explain how they all missed that piece being hauled out onto the lawn?

[killtown]

14. Who's says they planted them after the crash?

and where exactly at the Pentagon was that "wing/tail" thing found?

[MercutioATC]

43. So they were lying on the lawn BEFORE the crash???

The piece of fuselage was found on the lawn between the highway and the crash site.

[killtown]

51. Yes, why would that be so hard to believe?

And please pin-point where that "wing/tail" piece was. I think the photo may be from somewhere else.

[MercutioATC]

52. As I said, between the crash site and the highway...

...and I find it hard to believe that nobody would have noticed it just laying there on a sunny September day...

[Generarth]

26. Let me get this straight

You think the Iran earthquake was triggered by Nukes but that it's unlikely the pieces of 757 were planted on the Pentagon lawn.

Is that right?

[hack89]

38. I think you have mistaken me for someone else ,,,

I have never claimed that the Iran earthquake was triggered by nukes.

[kerry_s]

15. A NEW CHALLENGE TO ANYONE - just show me '757 debris'

I'm not interested if it was planted or wasn't... just saw me ANY part of debris from the pentagon crime scene which can be originated from Boeing.

I'm waiting for photos especially.

[killtown]

17. Yes, I should have made that challenge too!

Thanks for staying one step ahead of me kerry_s!

:toast:

[silvermachine]

49. Try contacting the Arlington, VA. Fire Dept

There are tons of photos. This is just absurd.

[DoYouEverWonder]

20. Of course you don't expect a response?

because so far no one has shown us much of anything that resembles a plane, no less a 757.

[kerry_s]

25. No, I do expect response

because I'm interested in gathering as much photo evidence as I can.

And so we have? One apu and one rim of wheel?

[hack89]

22. How about a picture of a 757 wheel, landing strut and

apu, among others?

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/pages/911_pentagon_757_plane_evidence.html

[kerry_s]

27. Hmm APU??

I am still astonished why there aren't any photos of titanium ENGINES but only one small part of apu-or-sth?

It is said that it is a part of engine despite a much smaller diameter


...or a part APU - Auxiliary Power Unit, but I don't find any resemblance neither with boeing apus:





(http://www.hs-powersystems.com/products/aps2000pds.htm)



nor with any engine part:



So where are these two engines? Did they weight too much to be planted?:)

[hack89]

31. It would help if you looked at the right part of the engine ...

that is the high pressure compressor and not the large fan on the front of the engine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbofan

Do you have xray vision such that you can look inside a picture of an APU and tell what the compressor look like?

[kerry_s]

34. 1. It's still too small:)

2. Even if it is a rear high pressure turbine so where is the rest of this engine?...

[hack89]

39. Want to bet?

http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/conspiracy/q0265.shtml

this site also explains why it can't be a Global Hawk, A3 or Tomahawk.

[mirandapriestly]

29. Plane that hit a lamp pole

The site you link mentions the lamp poles reminded me of this ,
smaller, but still:
http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=20041122-0

[hack89]

30. Smaller, lighter, slower, but still? nt

[mirandapriestly]

45. Their size proportional to the lamp pole is still

comparable. The degree of damage done to the smaller plane is enough to compensate for their difference in size. Also whe you look at plane damage cause by birds, it is more or less the same on large and small.

[kerry_s]

35. I've found others

It was OUTSIDE Pentagon!!! I was thinking all the time that this famous picture has been made in one of the internal corridors...

[DemInDistress]

16. this reply is from an aircraft mechanic at Boeing..

I am a retired lead journeyman aircraft mechanic, Boeing Aircraft.

11 years on the 757 line, 5 years on the 747 line, a few months on the 767 line and the remainder as a modification mechanic on what ever airplane was being modified. KC 135 tanker, 707, 727 and 747 Civilian Reserve Air Force (CRAF) jets.

There is NO 757 wreckage at the Pentagon in the photos. None, zip, zero, zilch, nada. NO 757 vertical fin (tail) stabilizers (back wings) no wings or engines. NONE. NO WRECKAGE AT ALL.

The jet engine compressor recovered from Tower One is NOT a 767 engine compressor. It is too small.

Tower Two was hit by a 767-200 Jet Airliner. These airplanes can be controlled by radio from the ground with NO difficulty. ANY AIRPLANE CAN BE CONTROLLED FROM THE GROUND BY RADIO SIGNALS.

The listed email is valid:

[e-mail]
Oil Slick Dick | Homepage | 03.30.06 - 11:38 pm | #

[mirandapriestly]

21. Good for you! Is that someone you met or know?

As for the compressor I found this site, "ask an aerospace engineer" which says that the compressor is the right size for the 757, because the housing was a lot larger and he has the dimensions. I am not a debunker, but I am curious about this.

http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/conspiracy/q0265.shtml

It would be just as easy to plant a real than a fake, since either way it's planted, probably..

[DemInDistress]

23. I met this guy online yesterday while reading

his comment. When i hear a journeyman mechanic speak I listen. Who's to say this guy who worked for Boeing is
lying? Certainly not me. I emailed him and he replied with this...

Thanks for the email Jimmy. This is my regular mailbox
and my real name. I am retired from Boeing, Renton and
Everett Washington and Wichita, Kansas (what a
shithole).
You will find my name at www.snipercentral.com
Vietnam Snipers, 3rd name from the bottom of the
list.

I'm me, I'm real.

I'm a political activist.

Bush's family fortune is soaked in the blood of the
Holocaust, Korea and Vietnam. Prescott Bush helped
finance Hitler. We were in Vietnam for Michelin Rubber
until Shell reported to Nixon that there was no
recoverable oil in 1969 and Nixon began the
abandonment in late 1970 to coincide with the reelect
Tricky Dick season.

The whole deal is control of oil and oil profits. 200
billion barrels of Caspian Basin crude oil need a
route to Port Muhammad bun Qa sim in Pakistan. 112
billion barrels of Iraqi crude oil are now controlled
by Bush. That totals $20 Trillion worth of oil we
taxpayers will pay $1 Trillion and our dead for US
control of.

Rich
He sounds genuine to me.. One more thing that aerospace site is very informative but to technical for me.

Thanks for the feedback though !!

[mirandapriestly]

28. Oh, he definitely sounds genuine

great letter!

[DemInDistress]

37. miranda,,here is another email the aircraft mechanic sent me.

Hi Jimmy, I'm 57 and in Washington State. I was in
advertising part time all those years and wrote the
ads which tipped Washington to the Dem's in 1992 to get
even with King County Prosecutor Norm Maleng. He tried
to railroad me over child support I had paid on time.
He ran for Governor twice and State Attorney General
once and lost all three times. So far my ads have
wasted $600,000,000 rethugnican campaign money. All I
have to do is write the copy and develop the strategy
and give it to the State Dem Party and they do the
rest.
I was raised in Utah and my dad had a small gun and
ammo shop. I've been a 1000 yard rifle shooter since I
was 14. I was drafted for Vietnam and bought into the
mom's apple pie bullshit until I found out that if a
rubber tree were damaged by combat, us or them,
Michelin got $900 from Uncle Sugar. $900 is the life
profit from a tree. If the tree were 40 years old and
had produced it's majority of profit Michelin still
got $900. If the same tree got damaged again next week
Michelin got another $900.

For political activism, sometimes our personal issue
has to take a back seat to what ever pisses off the
voters enough to make the asshole lose. And that is my
strategy. Just make sure the asshole losses the
election.

Stay in touch

Rich

If we keep searching hunting down strong opinions about the mysteries of 911 I bet we can win over the disbelievers who accept that "Ludicrous" Official 911 Report.

Last month Mayor Mike Bloomberg and the Corporation Council have stated they will sue the man hired to take photo's and video's of the cleanup on the WTC. This man was paid to shoot and film and when he was through decided to forgo his check/or return it and keep the 30,000 pictures and many hours of video's I bet he has some revealing items in his possession. I'll keep you informed of the status of that case. Many 911 families felt this guy was despicable for doing that. My guess is if Mayor Mike got his hands on all that material we'd never see it.

[savemefromdumbya]

18. no becasue the wall was blown by a succession of smallish bombs

[Generarth]

24. Is there any possibility that the plane was Flight 11 a 767?

I havn't got much to back this idea up with, just a suspicion at the moment.

[DoYouEverWonder]

36. Here's a pic from one of the WTC planes

I don't recall seeing this pic before? But the engine seems on the small side for a 757?

http://www.photolibrary.fema.gov/photolibrary/photo_details.do;jsessionid=61D8D6EBCFE7509C82D396C95797BE6A?id=5474

[DoYouEverWonder]

40. Here's the engine attached to a 757

Even without skin, there's a major difference in size it seems?

[gbwarming]

53. High bypass turbofan engines have a large diameter fan and smaller core

The core where the compressor, combustor and turbine stages are located works at much higher pressure and temperature so it's construction is heavier and perhaps more likely to survive a crash in a recognizable shape. The engine shown below may not be the exact type used in any of the 9/11 planes, but it is the same general layout.

[flyarm]

41. something is wrong here..your post says one of plane engines from wtc

then your comment under picture says :

I don't recall seeing this pic before? But the engine seems on the small side for a 757?

well both planes that hit wtc were 767...not 757...is that a typo?????????

fly

[DoYouEverWonder]

42. Oops, yes it should read 767

Thanks.