I will be very cold-hearted towards the American people if they pick Bush

[bluestateguy]

Say we get a turnout of 55% this year, and Bush wins with 50% or 51% of the vote. That will mean that about 72% of the American people will have either chosen Bush or chosen to stay home (which I regard as being the same as voting for Bush, just like a vote for Nader is a vote for Bush).

So that being the case, after everything that has happened over the last four years, why should I continue to feel any pity for the American people? If they vote Bush back in, or don't bother to vote, why should I pity some family who loses a relative in Iraq? Why should I feel pity for some kid who gets drafted, but never took the time to vote on Nov. 2, or voted for Bush? Why should I feel bad for some factory worker in Ohio who gets laid off, but nonetheless voted for Bush because of gays, guns and God?

Sorry folks, but it will be a case of compassion fatigue for me if the American people send that joker back to the White House. The American people will get exactly what they deserve if they do, and I won't have time to get into a tizzy about it. I have my own life, my own career to worry about, bills to pay and at some point you just have to let the American people learn their lesson.

If Bush steals it that's another matter entirely.

[JuniorPlankton]

1. Yep

n/t

[MallRat]

2. WE WILL WIN. Bush will have to steal it if he wants it.

n/t

[Burma Jones]

3. Yep, I feel the same way

There's rarely been such a clear choice, and the people have to make that choice.

[XanaDUer]

4. I feel the same way

and if any Bush lover complains to me about abilities to find good-paying jobs, etc., I will ream them.

[seventhson]

5. Oh, If Bush "wins" it will be Thievery, but I agree that Americans will

also bear responsibility to a large degree.

Remember, however, that Americans have been dumbed down and lied to for decades by the wall street anglogerman elites and fascists.

Many Americans are ignorant and propagandized and brainwashed at the direction of the BFEE and their Nazi collaborators.

So hold a positive thought for our fellow citizens and forgive them if this election is stolen (again) - they know not what they do.

[JI7]

6. because even they don't deserve the crap Bush does

it's a fact that america leans much more conservative than other "developed" nations.

but even though i might be angry at them or whatever else negative feelings. in the end they still don't deserve the crap bush does to them.

[magnolia]

14. I disagree.

If they elect Bush they deserve everything they get!!! All the information is out there. You'd have to be living under a rock not to see what Bush has done. I'm not saying this in a mean way. The fact is that many people, don't really know how to live until their lives have touched death. With republicans they aren't going to see the truth until it hits them square in the face! Don't worry...they'll learn and be better for it in the end.

Meanwhile...sadly...WE don't deserve it. I haven't figured that one out yet so Kerry will just have to win!

[HFishbine]

15. Agreed

No excuses in a democracy.

[JI7]

16. yeah, it's hard not to feel angry, but America is just more conservative

than many other similar nations. just look at the vietnam war and how many refuse to admit we were wrong. and how kerry still has to deal with that shit. in other foreign nations they understand their wrongs and are very suspicious of their governments when it comes to using military force. look at spain and how they refused to put up with lies from their government concerning the terrorist attacks.

in america for some reason there is a tendency for people to just get behind the "leader" and not ask questions. it's a cultural thing.

[Cats Against Frist]

26. I am in agreement with you, as well

They do deserve it.

[realFedUp]

7. If they do steal it again, there will be people in the streets.

[Rose Siding]

8. If that happens, the 28% would need even more compassion

And unless they make us wear armbands, how would you tell us apart?! But giving up is always an option and I would be tempted.

[JI7]

9. never give up

[klook]

12. NEVER give up!!

Think of what African-Americans have gone through to earn a place in American society. Think of what the French did to overcome the monarchy. Think of what Nelson Mandela and his followers endured on their road to freedom and equality. Our struggle is "Pussycat Dues" (to quote a Charles Mingus song title) by comparison.

[JI7]

17. that's what i often think about , just look at the past

and what people went through and how they kept fighting for what is right.

[depakid]

19. This is completely different

The oppressed people you all are talking about didn't CHOOSE to be oppressed. It seems to me that's what the original poster was getting at- and I have to agree. This time- unlike with Reagan & the previous Bush's- this one's obvious, and I'm all out of sympathy.

[JI7]

23. well, yes, i already have a low opinion of the American people overall

but i'm not sure i would go as far as saying they deserve what happens to them.

[depakid]

27. Not sure I'd go quite that far, either, but

I bet a large majority in the rest of the world would.

[Clinton Crusader]

10. I have to agree

There is overwhelming evidence of his lying and incompetance, how he turned the world's sympathy into the world's hatred, invaded a country that wasnt a threat to us, ignored bin Laden, rose the deficit through the stratosphere, on and on and on and on and on and on. It literally staggers me that there ARE 40% whatever that WOULD vote this asshat back in.

And if the numbskulls in this country think that's all dandy, Im not sure I want to live here and they absolutely deserve what they get.

Be careful what you wish for, you just may get it.

On the other hand, I do believe the only way they will win, is thievery and an election a la 2000. Why else are all these stories coming out of voter fraud, throwing Dem registrations in the trash, Sec. of States' trying to skew the electorate who are qualified to vote. They KNOW they cant win an honest election. God HELP US but we havent even really seen what ol' Jeb will do this time around.

What WILL we do, if another 2000 happens??
:kick:

[tom_paine]

11. Cold-hearted doesn't even begin to describe it

I will look upon them as a Russian Capitalist selling blue-jeans on the corner looked at the Communists and the Sheep.

Period.

I will expect nothing from the Amerikan Communists and the Sheep except to follow their Masters and to be able to commit atrocities (the Busheviks will commit them, the sheep will snooze or say "but the Free Russians do it, too!").

I will prepare myself mentally and physically for life in a Totalitarian Nation where any day could be the last and the monsters could rise at any moment.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

13. It is so strange

I have had two conversations recently with women who have had their eyes opened and are now seeing through the propaganda filter, when I thought they would not. In each case, their husbands will not open their eyes.

One man has experienced a big loss in sales during the Bush adminsitration and the other man is marginally employed. I believe they both buy into the "macho" Republican "empire" war thing and want to be brainwashed because to them it feels good. They are sacrificing so much for a phony image, but they just won't look at the truth, that the Republcans are chickenhawks.

[DemocracyInaction]

18. it's exactly the way I have been feeling.....if you are either too stupid,

too brainwashed, or too lazy, I'm done with you. I've fought decades for these people and I'm sick of them spitting in my face. I'll take care of myself and they can rot for all I care. And, sadly, I'm getting a horrible feeling deep in my gut that this is going to be just like mid-term election 2002. We were so pumped. We saw polls that looked so promising. And then that fateful, godawful night. I'm afraid too many Dems get too lazy to vote. I'm afraid the minions of Satan pour out of the churches and other such gathering places and flood the voting booths. (sorry, seen too much of it over the years).

[rumguy]

20. It's like how Bob Dylan put it

Those who let themselves be manipulated by those who manipulate deserve what they get.

I feel the same way.

[KayLaw]

21. Not quite

I almost feel that way but worry so about our children who are too young too vote and people like one of my sons who has autism. They have so much to lose but no vote and no voice.

I wish there were some way Bush voters, and Bush voters only, could " feel the effects " of his policies, but I don't see how that can happen.

[agincourt]

22. I think the thing that infuriates me,

is that the american people will look like they're waking up for a bit and then they'll take it all back. I swear corporate fascism gives these people warm fuzzies. Americans will be conservative until the whole thing falls apart. They keep going back to a comfort food that kills them.

[AlCzervik]

24. If * were to win without fraud

All the anti-Bush feeling in the world will be transferred to the Anti-American feeling, and i would understand that. This is the most important reason to elect John Kerry imo. there are many other reasons as well but this one will have a direct effect on everybodies security.

[Cats Against Frist]

25. Actually, you know what?

That's a good attitude. I know people like to be fighters and continue to make this country right -- but I've said it here a million times -- the caring people of the left are not attempting to save some poor, exploited class -- all of our energy actually goes into saving the big fat middle class from itself -- and that doesn't even necessarily exclude us.

I know some people are not as far left as I am -- I'm the far left where it meets the right, almost, philosophically -- I'm a small-L libertarian. I know that people do not necessarily feel that they can live their life like I can -- I've worked almost 30 years to get up out of the fundie, SUV, Wal-Mart suckhole of my lineage to become a fairly responsible citizen, and, in some ways, I think, a good model for a lot of people.

I am not what the left just "talks" about. I live it. I don't wear make-up, I don't care about fashion, I'm not into star worship, I'm no consumer -- I buy as much as I can second-hand, independents, co-ops. I have some things that I'm working on, to be even better -- getting my health in line, working on eating always nonprocessed, whole foods, quitting smoking. It's all part of a larger plan to actually live what I think we should all be like.

I know it's sad to give up hope, but if you're a confident person, with interests outside of popular culture -- scholarship, the arts, crafting, etc., and you've reconciled your existence with some kind of transformational/zen-type message, and you're fairly intelligent, you can make it in this country, no matter who is president. Part of being intelligent is learning how to beat the system. Learning how to figure out a good way to live, despite the odds.

So, my advice is, if we lose this election -- get behind your worldview. Throw the goddamn television out, quit trying to be boy beauty and girl beauty, get involved in local politics, move to a blue state, form cooperative living situations with like-minded individuals, hell -- move out into the middle of nowhere. Watch what you consume, watch what you buy. Don't fuck around -- I used to live in Seattle, where the only difference between a liberal and a conservative were who they voted for. Volvos, IKEA tables, shopping at "boutiques," primping up "left style," North Face and Columbia sportswear, Alibi Room.

Part of the reason that we have a little problem getting people to "come around," is that we live plenty of the "mainstream," ourselves -- just because it's different brands, doesn't mean you're any less of a consumer wasteoid.

Again, I do believe that the GOP, and their whole disturbing and sick amalgam of bastardized Christianity, Mammon Worship and Social Darwinism is definitely the dark side of humanity, but we don't all have to live in anger and frustration, forever. You can make your way to a good life. We may have to start looking for alternatives, you know. I'd like to think we'll win this election -- but history shows that this is a sick world, where fascism and despotism happens -- especially where "no one ever thought it would happen." There are a lot of stupid people out there. If you underestimate them for a minute -- just take a look around you. Watch an hour of television. Go to a mall. Behind every dictator, there is a support system. In this case, it would be the Bush electorate.

The ebb and flow of existence is thus: be prepared. It may get worse, before it gets better, and I would suggest that there be a plan in place for liberals to close ranks -- though deciding whether it should be the East coast or West Coast could be a civil war, in itself. :) I'm voting for West Coast, where I will be moving anyway, to start a little farm for myself, in 1-2 years.

So, in answer to this post, directly: the coldness is well-earned by them. Don't just be cold -- shut them completely off.

[lastliberalintexas]

32. Good ideas

But you'll find there are even too many on the left who still feel that they "need" these things. Consumerism run rampant.

[Neecy]

28. Election Night 1984

That was the night I figured the American people collectively lost their minds, and re-elected a puppet of a leader who further enriched the rich and put the tab on our credit cards, looked the other way at the most brazen of corporate criminal activity (remember the S&L scandals?) and who gave not a shit about anyone outside of his own party or his own tax bracket.

Sound familiar? We've been this routine before, so we don't need further proof of American ignorance. People have voted - overwhelmingly - in the past against their own self-interests. I lost ALL respect for the great unwashed masses exactly 20 years ago next month.

[lastliberalintexas]

33. And if 1984 didn't do it for you

1994 should have.

[Fed Up]

29. If the Chimperor pulls out a win, that's it for me.

I'm getting out of politics, getting out of reading and watching news, getting out of the online community.

I won't know a fucken thing that the Chimperor does until I "come back," so to speak, around January 2008.

I already have a book list a mile long if Chimpie wins. And these are good books, great works of literature, science fiction, plays, and so on. Probably it would take a man 10 years to read them anyway.

the last thing I'll do, and I mean this sincerely, is sit in front of a computer monitor or television set watching this ape destroy the country and world.

And if 72% of Americans give Chimpie their green light, what's that to me if they suddenly have a change of heart by 2006? Fuggem, they voted for him.

bluestateguy I agree with your poignant observation.

[FlaGranny]

30. I just came from our local

Kerry/Edwards campaign office. I have talked to them on the phone, but it was the first I had been to the office. I was surprised at the size of the office, for one thing, but when I went inside, there were, at a minimum, 50 to 75 volunteers at work. When I told the volunteer at the front desk how surprised I was at the size and activity of the office, she said "you ain't seen nothing yet". She said this was "slow." The office was full of old folks, young folks, and those in between. I came out of there feeling better than I did going in. There are a lot of good people working very hard to get Kerry and Edwards elected. There are many, many older people giving $25 or $50 at a time out of their Social Security checks - a lot of money to them.

I find it hard to believe, from personal experience, that * can get enough votes to avoid embarrassment, let alone be elected. I truly and firmly believe that if * "wins" it will be by fraud, deception, and criminal activity - standard operating procedure for him. I also cannot really fault the American people too much for not knowing what we know. A majority of them rely on network "news" for their information and believe they are informed. I was once in that category myself. Not until I started my own internet research did I find out what was really going on.

I'm sure many people are still where I, myself, was only 4-1/2 years ago - obliviously going about my daily life, and relying on TV for political information, and voting for "the best man," who was 99 times out of 100, a Democrat. From now on, I will vote 100% for Democrats. I don't even care if a Democrat is a proven crook, because I have yet to find a Democratic crook as bad as a Republican fundy.

You can't tell me from a fundy Republican by just looking at me, or even by having an informal chat. I am confident that the majority of Americans, though misinformed, are people worth caring about.

[gulliver]

31. That says it for me too.

I think Kerry is going to win, but if he doesn't, I'll know I did my part. I've donated, canvassed, bumper-stickered, and will be GOTV'ing.

If Bush wins without stealing the election, it will be apparent that there is nothing I can do. Anyone who could vote for Bush after the last four years and the last three debates is seriously misguided. They will have to learn the hard way. (Like it hasn't been hard enough!)

[petronius]

34. I really disagree with this attitude

If you consider Americans as a monolithic entity, we've never been particularly deserving of compassion - we've always been rich and powerful enough that our fortunes or misfortunes are due to our own decisions. We are not a country subject to the whims of fate. So there has never been any point in feeling pity or compassion toward the American people (or nation or society) as a whole.

But, within our society, there will always be individuals who are deserving of compassion - there are those who are powerless, victimized, or just plain unlucky. I think it is a huge mistake (I would even say an immoral attitude) to transform a displeasure with the the national entity into a callousness toward individuals.

[bluestateguy]

35. The things I will say if he wins will rub a lot of peope the wrong way

There will have to be somebody there to say "i told you so" when the draft notices start going out to the kids.

[petronius]

36. Perhaps I misunderstood your post

There's nothing wrong with saying "I told you so" as long as you say it to the people who deserve it. It sounded, though, as if you were writing off everyone in the country regardless of their circumstances, and that is what I disagree with...

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

37. I don't like it

but I feel myself going the same direction.

Honest to God, my litmus test will be: "Who did you vote for in 2004?"

If they say bush, I say, "well, you asked for this, didn't you? In fact, you helped to bring it upon ALL of us, didn't you?"

If their answer is Kerry, I feel empathy for them and I help however I can.

God, that's sad, but you know what's sadder? THAT THEY HAVE CAUSED ALL THIS!!!

I am sick of neocons (the ones I know on the net and in real life) pretending to be oh-so-concerned about all our division and wringing their hands and saying oh we need to come together.

Well if you are voting for bush, I ain't coming together with you. In fact, I've got a nice fuckyouverymuch for ya.