The politics of false cause.

[Pepperbelly]

I have been alarmed and disappointed in our post election circular firing squad regarding why we lost the Presidency and became even more of a minority in Congress. I have seen many posts here blaming liberals, blaming the DLC, blaming the media, blaming election fraud, blaming Kerry, blaming everything. None of the cases I have seen come close to meeting the test of causality.

Yet all have some bits of truth in them. All of these seem to be tiles in the mosaic of what actually occurred. All have their advocates. All are arguing vigorously for their point of view to the point of these notions developing into stand-alone ideologies.

Every one of these elements, when you pull back a little, are indicative of a greater problem for the party. It is not a matter of culture or policy or even slanted media although the media truly is slanted toward their corporate masters. Instead, there is a common theme in all of this that does, IMHO, explain why these factors lead to our defeat.

Our professional party structure is incompetent.

Look at how the party was represented to the public in the last election. We know that the gop will try certain things on us. They do EVERY time because they are gutter crud that cannot win without dishonesty, sanctimony, distraction, distortion, character assasination, fraud, and rigged officials. They ALWAYS do this.

Yet, our party apparatus seemed helpless against these tactics even though experience told us it that was what they were going to do. The evidence permeates every element of our campaigns. Look at how our 'faces' operated during the campaign. Personlly, I can recall very few, if any instances, where the person represented the Democrats did a good job. They were shamefully unprepared to refute the gop stuff, not knowing even enough to recognize when the gop started lying, much less having sufficient knowledge to consisely explain the facts to the viewers. Instead, they would blather on and on with talking points that sounded weak and insincere and did not refute the lies the gops used.

The Swift Boat Liars ... we fumbled it. Iraq ... we fumbled it. The economy ... we fumbled it. Terrorism ... we fumbled it. LIBERAL! ... we fumbled it. The list goes on and on. It wasn't a matter of talking points, it was a matter of organization.

The Party should have ALL the facts necessary to defeat the gops' lies (which they did if you wanted to dig through a web site) and that should be communicated to the people doing shows for us on tv. Those people representing us SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO DO SO UNTIL THEY ACTUALLY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT! I do not mean something as shallow as 'talking points'. I am talking about being f*cking experts when they represent us.

I know they are busy people. But they are busy for the party, they are paid for their work and paid well and if they cannot master the facts and perform their duties, then they should be shown the door.

Every single thing they trew at us was expected. There were absolutely no surprises yet we stumbled around like Dawn of the Dead zombies, seemingly helpless to stop what we knew was coming.

That is unsatisfactory. If I did my job that poorly, I would be gone. And I don't make near the money these guys do. So whether they are lazy, stupid, shallow, or whatever, we will begin winning again when we get a little competence into the organization.

[salin]

1. agreed - and sadly

a small incestuous group of campaign strategists and their affiliated spokespersons dominate too much of the national (and state) level campaigns. In the eighties did a stint at a new, but well connected dem consulting firm in dc. It is a small group... our own echo chamber. And they are ineffective.

That is why I really appreciated the run for the money (and fear) inspired early on by Dean. Suddenly there was an insurgency in terms of how that campaign was run - and particularly how money was raised. It gave me hope that it would break some of the influence of that very small circle of dem consultants/strategists that in DC and pave way for a "next" generation of folks. Of course Dean imploded - but some of the lessons didn't. Yet, that same cadre remains powerful in directing the political strategy of many elected who sit in the beltway.

Personally I think that is what led to the ugly name calling by a prominant DLCer. Fear of losing power. Somehow there is little reflection about the flaws in their advising it is always "those guys" (in this case progressives, moveon, etc.) fault. Not unlike folks on the left pointing to the dlc and related cadres of consultants - but those pointing fingers here have no power and do not perpetually work on campaigns. Hopefully it is last breath squawks attempting to retain prestige (and access to the good campaign/policy jobs) before the new generation and age in dem strategists are ushered in.

[Pepperbelly]

2. You hit the nail pretty squarely with that ...

They are indeed a small incestuous group, ineffective in what they do yet still holding great sway with the powerful.

And the real pity of it is that when the 'pros' get their hooks into a pol, they suck all the life, spark, personality, and spirit from the pol's public face. When these 'pros' appear as talking heads on the tube, they are so bland yet smarmy that they would convince no one of anything.

I really think that laziness is a big part of it. Bob Somerby spends his spare time showing how easy it is to factually refute the lies and nonsense but it does require that they spend at least SOME real time in preparation and contemplation. Maybe they should eat a sandwich and do that rather than doing lunch.

:D

[salin]

5. too busy doing "Power Lunches"

back in 1987 on an evening out you knew who the consultants were... still in suits and with mobile phones (very rare at the time.) Funny thing is after several years working on and around the hill... I found myself walking very fast... realized that is the only way one walks in the senate office buildings... and found myself looking for the "passing lane" on escalators (to my knowledge, dc is the only place that consistently has passing lanes in escalaters - esp to the metro)... just something of the "we are so important" mentality. I hear that it is much worse these days ... that the lobbyists are even more ever present and the powerbroker/strategists even more self-important. Didn't think that was possible.

Once had a date with an up and comer... he is probaby today somewhere in Warner's administration... came to pick me up in a suit. I was casual.... Oops, should I go and change, I asked (eg were we going somewhere not casual)... No says he... though he acknowledged that he had gone home and changed (so this was his not power suit, suit...) Asked me where (general area) I would like to go for dinner... options: Old Town (Alexandria), K Street, Hill or Georgetown. I say Old Town. Cant remember why this was nixed. Second option - Hill... naw... then I suggest KStreet and we drove to the area til he says... I work here every day, would rather go somewhere else (on the way to... my last pick due to my finding it so pretentious) Georgetown. Where we go to the then yuppie, overpriced and quasi pretentious American Cafe... followed by drinks somewhere at the Georgetown Mall. bah. One date, I tell ya, one date and that was all. And such a long night it was. But he epitomizes the folks who did much of the consulting campaign work... who seemed generally to be of a slightly different nature (more power hungry and selfimportant) than the hill staffers. Just attracted different types of folks. *sigh*

[ClintonTyree]

3. While I agree with your assessment................

the blame for this fiasco lies squarely on the shoulders of an American Public that is too intellectually lazy and uninformed to make decisions about the future of our Country.
All they know about the events that are shaping our Country are 30 second sound bites spewed by an ever increasing Right leaning Media.
They're too damn lazy to find out the truth. They're ill informed and like it that way. Studies have shown that those with less than a high school education overwhelmingly support the illegal usurper. They're stupid. Not ignorant, for that would imply that they CAN be taught. They are stupid, and the Right depends on that stupidity to further their agenda.
Until we have an informed electorate, which will probably be never, the Right will continue to flourish.

[Kahuna]

24. What you say is true about the American public. But at least the repukes..

understand them, and know how to play them. When the hell are Democrats going to takes their heads out of their asses and find out how to relate to real people? They don't know how. That's their problem. Clinton knew how. That's why he was a winner.

[Turn CO Blue]

4. Hear, hear!

These are the aspects of a failing corporation:

- Incompetent old-school leadership - check

- Ineffective use of advertising - check

- Tired, poorly saturated brand identity or brand identity poorly understood by public - check

- Not having a certain "it" factor that draws people to the brand - check

- Not meeting the competition head-on - check

- Not pursuing exposure and penalty for the competition in court for dishonest business practices - check

- Not protecting the stakeholders' interests agressively - check

- Not introducing new target markets or having total penetration of existing markets - check

- Not reexamining the business tenants and mission statement every few years for clarity and direction - check

- Not hiring the very best corporate communications experts and public relations experts available - check


Okay, so I have to agree with you about the piss-poor management of the Democratic party!

I think the everyday Joe or SuzyQ on this forum feels that just about ANYBODY on DU could have done a better job debating our issues (talking points, memes, values, etc.) than any of the "regular" Democratic talking heads. The Dems on news programs were often weak or hysterical, were all too often conceding some point or other, and sometimes looked like deer caught in the headlights!

What the hell are the Dems afraid of when debating our issues? Winning? Why won't they harshly contradict a Repub for lying? (ha! that would be the day!) There is NOTHING to be ashamed of in defending or promoting liberal/progressive issues and values - and if they don't agree - THEN PEPPERBELLY IS CORRECT - THEY SHOULD BE SHOWN THE F'ING DOOR!

I also assert that it is possible to be "statesmanlike" while effectively shredding these corporate-owned hatemongers to pieces.

[Pepperbelly]

16. Fire the bastards. No kidding.

No shit. This isn't about philosophy. It isn't about money. It is about minimum competence levels in the people who are supposed to be doing a job.

[Nay]

6. Couldn't agree more. I've been screaming about this for a while, too.

There is no reason why, with all the money and people we have, we can't muster up a few attack dogs who know the facts, fer god's sake. The fact that the dems have not done this is worrisome for a couple of reasons -- we don't get decent leadership, and even more troubling, a lot of us are getting the feeling that the dem leaders have gone over to the dark side, and only put up a sham fight in order to get our donations,keep us in line, and feed at the same trough the Reepubs do.

[Pepperbelly]

15. I would be satisfied with well-prepared, concise & forceful refutation.

We NEVER have that.

When I think of our 'faces', I see hairspray, teeth, and nice clothes ... just like the other guys. No warriors. Just slick sophists.

[Kahuna]

23. I was screaming about bushco's, "the devil you know strategy.."

and that's exactly what they used. They demonized Kerry until voters decided to vote for, "the devil they know." As political "experts" why didn't our guys have a plan to counter this plan? Sad bunch of jackasses if you ask me.

[leftofthedial]

7. I agree they are incompetent buffoons

constantly outmanouevered by the opposition.

they are always playing catch up, even when the limited reality Murkans are exposed to overtakes the repukes and shows them for the assholes they are. These issues, from Abu Ghraib, to the glaring failures of leadership in Iraq, to the lies that got us into the war, to the devastated Murkan economy . . . have all just drifted into the ether without any aggressive expoloitation by the allegedly "opposition" party.

No leadership. No good ideas. All kinds of internal turf warfare. The tide of history and virtually every issue plays to our advantage and yet we let three elections in a row slip away.

If this was a sports team, the manager and coaches would have been jettisoned long ago.

[Pepperbelly]

17. at every turn! And the gops TELEGRAPHED every move.

Were these guys asleep at the switch or what? It was like the cliche ... the slow motion train wreck. We all saw it and there was nothing we could do to stop it.

Frustrating, eh?

[leftofthedial]

20. we're trying to engage in a gentleman's duel

while the opposition is busily engaged in an alley brawl with knives and chains and guns

now, with Diebold, they have the cops on their side too

[Kahuna]

25. I'm still waiting for Kerry to denounce the Swift Boat Liars. Because..

if he ever did, I missed it. :shrug:

[PATRICK]

8. And deeper

into the grass roots structure, the party seems naive and prone to the insertion of LaPore's and other blatant operatives, to putting naive people, self-appointed hotshots or other disasters waiting to happen. It is not just the rotting fish head. The grass roots of the fanatic RW has
seen our own chinks in the lower levels, in the positions of settled in advocacy groups like the NAARP and how to use the tools we misuse or weakly use to their own advantage. THEY have the pervasive competence invading every nook and cranny of a decadent party structure.

Someone take those picture of great American presidents off the wall and put up the Declaration and the Constitution instead, because this is a new ballgame and what FDR built has been turning into melting swiss cheese.

I really agree with this post. Even as From spitefully launches anti-Dean campaigns instead of taking accountability the absence and even abuse of party leadership has turned us into circles as well. Instead of circling around the wagons we circle and snipe around ourselves(another sign of a dysfunctional party) with the occasional brave breaking through to count coup with his lance, tapping from on the head, before being gunned down.

While demanding real world accountability(argue the damned philosophy later) from the top we should be moving to permeate the grass roots, the hard commitments to do the election official work and party building. The RW is there already, even encouraged by the mopes in the DLC, laying bare their breast(or rather ours) to the assassin's blade.

Their people have the time and money and fanaticism and the eventual payoffs to steal every precinct level party organization. It is not a suggestion, it is a necessity, that we fight the real battle there- as well as the doofus war on top. It might be noted in our temporally free exchange of ideas, that absent real work on the ground the RW minority can mange to fill all the voids in all key areas of power and still remain a minority and be well rewarded for all their sacrifices and crimes.

And yes, I would like to see where some of our key DLC management types are getting their personal money and who they cozy up to more than their "liberal" base. When you can't possibly tell from the external evidence if someone is secretly working for the other side or just plain incompetent, the message is crystal clear. They gotta go. First order of business.

[Turn CO Blue]

11. Good points about the precinct level

I tell you all this - if rational people with liberal/progressive values do not OWN the public school boards - then we will be doomed to generations of ignorant theocrats to come (not to mention that the well-rounded teachings of arts, culture and science will be tossed aside in favor or more standardized testing, testing, testing)...

I wholeheartedly agree with you about the spiteful self-serving attacks on Dr. Dean coming out of From's debased fear and territoriality instinct!

[TacticalPeek]

9. Eminently reasonable.

Unfortunately, there are no money-back guarantees in that biz. Even more unfortunately, your critique probably implies a ten to fifteen year readjustment period, because institutional change comes slow.

[ClintonTyree]

12. Look how long it took the Reslugs...............

after Nixon to regroup and retake Congress. We'll have to bide our time. Hopefully there will be something left to save by the time we do regroup.

[Q]

10. Or do they only 'look' incompetent'?

...Because they were trying to push an agenda that ran counter to traditional Democratic principles and values? Perhaps they seemed like they didn't know what they were doing because they tried to run on both sides of the fence at the same time?

Interesting thread. Thanks.

[Turn CO Blue]

13. I wonder that myself...

if the Dem leadership is also in bed with corporations, then we really are just two sides of the same coin -- Republican and Republican-lite!

[PATRICK]

14. Looking and doing

IS incompetent. The flight to the "success" numbers they constantly bring up is the REAL circular reasoning problem. The race around the toilet bowl as it all goes down looks very dynamic. The people they get elected continue to morph into feckless DINO's. I'd rather the hand on the handle not be the GOP.

[Pepperbelly]

18. one thing I want to make clear ...

Even though I do not always seem to believe this, I do: we have every reason in the world to be outraged.

Maybe the only difference between our positions is what it is we should be outraged about.

[BeFree]

19. Outrage? Hell yeah

Kerry won. Kerry won the damn election and if you disagree then you believe B** and the media, and not several thousand DU'ers who have been educated and informed concerning the election.

But let's break down the reason Kerry did not get many more votes.

God, guns and gays, is the simplest catch all.

Some of us lefties are so shrill about keeping church and state separate, getting rid of dangerous handguns, and shoving gays down people's throats, we've all gotten a pretty bad name in the heartland of America.

Now, we all know these issues are important. But the way some of us have gone about it is not politically correct. There needs to be a more democratic way of getting these things instituted.

In a nutshell, these issues cost us a good ten points; a loss not easily overcome. Sure, the heads made mistakes, but the body has too.

It so much easier to attack the leaders than it is to examine the rest of the reasons, eh?

[Pepperbelly]

26. I disagree respectfully ...

God, guns and gays ... we knew that was coming and every BIT of it could have been not only turned defensively but made radioactice if these guys weren't such lazy shits. There were no surprises at all.

[Kahuna]

36. But..but..but....'We'll appeal to the intelligence and sense of fair..

play of the American voters....' :grr: There is no intelligence and sense of fair play with the American voters!!!! Haven't they been paying attention??? If the American voters had and decency at all they would have denounced bushco's illegal war, AND the election theft of 2000!

[Kahuna]

32. Agree with you. Our side has been extremely shrill...

And that is a turn off. We represent the party. If we don't represent the party well with our acquaintances, why would voters respect our leaders?

[zulchzulu]

21. The Partisan Media Machine helped make real issues be snuffed out

The Partisan Media made sure that Kerry's stances were never given full coverage. It was all about trouncing the truth with lies and distraction.

Unless we have real media reform or opposition in our own media channels in 2008, it will be the same thing with the same results. Of course, election and voting reform are right up there too.

I suggest you watch the last NOW that Moyers just did. He nails it.
http://movies.ziaspace.com/NOW.wmv

[Pepperbelly]

28. they do for a fact ...

and Bob Somerby has it nailed pretty good ... these guys ... these celebrity journalists are multi-millionares and are both lazy and possess a sense of entitlement. I actually think that jon Stewart made a decent crack in the facade when he did Crossfire.

[Kahuna]

22. After a stolen election in 2000, the Dems had no plan to fight this..

ruthless bunch. There were many things that the Dems could have used against bushco, and didn't. I waited until election day to see the ad comparing what bush said to what he actually did. Does anyone believe that 4 million new voters would have disturbed their praying to vote for *, had they known what a disengenous liar he is???? Well! The point is, we'll never know. Because the Dem leaders were too incompetent to come up with a plan.

[Pepperbelly]

27. Take for example when they yelled, "LIBERAL!"

One of my heros ... Senator Dale Bumpers dealt with the very same crap in every single election he ran and he won every damned one of them. Dale WAS a liberal but got elected and re-elected and re-elected until he wanted to retire. These slovenly hacks didn't bother to find out how the very attack was turned and in fact, made radioactive by Dale Bumpers. Dale had a very simple method. All they had to do was ask and that would have ended it.

but no ... who knew that them calling him "LIBERAL!" was gonna happen?

:shrug:

[Kahuna]

29. And why aren't the Dems demonizing the GOP echo chamber attack..

machine? They've let Limbaugh, Hannity and Drudge become mainstream!!! :argh:

[Pepperbelly]

33. perhaps it is a question of competency.

For example, during the Swift Boat Liar crusade, they would start their lies and the Democrats would ordinarily respond with something like, "Senator Kerry and President Bush both served honorably."

Huh?

[Kahuna]

34. It's obviously a question of competency. BTW...

Good morning, Pepperbelly... :loveya:

[tngledwebb]

30. If true, the question is how did it happen?

Not concurring with your thesis, but if so, how is it that a political party of the seemingly more intelligent and informed of the electorate is unintentionally and consistently incompetent and impotent when it comes to running political campaigns?

[Pepperbelly]

31. use your eyes and ears and tell me that it DIDN'T happen.

They took what kinda-sorta worked with an incredibly charismatic and intelligent candidate (Clinton) and tried to make it fit all models. It doesn't.

So far as the apparatus of the party, I really think it boils down to laziness and featherbedding.

[WCGreen]

35. Just a little info from a local "talking head"

For a while in the 90's, I represented the dem's on TV and radio fairly often. I was the treasurer of the party.

One thing I have to tell you is that the party doesn't always control who is going to be on the air representing the democtratic position. The media makes the call. they really don't call some centralized HQ and say get me a talking head...

They have a rolodex and pick and choose who they want on their show.....

So, they call Donna Braziele, who always has a nasty thing to say about democrats, because she is controversial. The same reason they call on Ann Coulter. They want friction. And since DB has been associated with the dem party for a long time, she will do as a spokesperson...

The GOP has been developing their talking heads for the last 30 years, paying people to essentialy be PR employees that are bought and paid for by their corporate sponsors....

Just a little hands on info.....

[Kahuna]

37. I agree and think it's apparent that that is what they do. The point..

then becomes, why do our guys let this happen? When you see the repukes on air, they're all on the same page. Whereas our guys are all over the lot, until nobody knows what we stand for.