What's going to happen when the 60% of bush supporters learn the truth?

[LynnTheDem]

According to polls of bush supporters:

-72% of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq had actual WMD (47%) or a major program for developing them (25%).

-Fifty-six percent assume that most experts believe Iraq had actual WMD and 57% also assume, incorrectly, that Duelfer concluded Iraq had at least a major WMD program.

-75% of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq was providing substantial support to al Qaeda, and 63% believe that clear evidence of this support has been found.

-60% of Bush supporters assume that this is also the conclusion of most experts, and 55% assume, incorrectly, that this was the conclusion of the 9/11 Commission.

-68% of Bush supporters believe the world majority supported the invasion of Iraq

-57% of Bush supporters assume that the majority of people in the world would favor Bush's reelection

http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/html/new_10_21_04.html

So what do you think these people will do when they do find out they've been total rubes?

Americans as a rule don't like being conned/duped/tricked, especially when it's resulted in the deaths of American citizens. But will their guilt in being complicit in all the deaths make them do the right thing, or will they be so unable to face the reality that they'll just go deeper into denial?

[robbedvoter]

1. Sorry to say, Sagan's lesson will apply:

"One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We're no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It's simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we've been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back. So the old bamboozles tend to persist as the new ones rise."
Carl Sagan, "The Demon Haunted World", 1995

[LynnTheDem]

3. We're certainly seeing that in the "justifications" shit.

No where in bush's IWR does it say "spreading democracy".

If bush had told America "We must invade and occupy Iraq to spread democracy" in April 2003, even the bushbots would have demanded his impeachment.

And yet now they chant along with bush; we must "spread democracy!"

And the MSM reports on "bush's STATED OBJECTIVE OF SPREADING DEMOCRACY..."

Ummm NO. bush's "stated objective" was WMD MUSHROOM CLOUDS WE KNOW WHERE THEY ARE THERE IS NO DOUBT CAN'T WAIT FOR THE SMOKING GUN THERE IS NO DOUBT THERE IS NO DOUBT THERE IS NO DOUBT".

Seriously, has there EVER been a war where the aggressor changed the rationale for the war so many times...AFTER launching the war???

[AlbizuX]

6. agreed....they won't care

The issues they believe they are fighting against (terrorism, cultural war) are more fundamental to them than issues of electoral fraud...

They would probably think it was God's will that our laws were subverted...if it was done to inaugurate a president who would fight for their issues.

Stop thinking Republicans are just like you...they represent the most ruthless, reactionary people in this country.

[neweurope]

19. I agree. Like my German countrymen after WWII most will just get

into denying. In some cases this denying has gotten on to the next generation.


----------------


Remember fallujah!

Bush to The Hague

[slor]

24. Good quote. Thanks n/t

[seaj11]

25. Been meaning to read that. n/t

[atre]

27. He's right. It's called cognitive dissonance.

When confronted with evidence that Bush has lied to them, they will merely reject or ignore the evidence.

[PATRICK]

28. That simplifies

cognitive dissonance nicely, which itself really does not thoroughly make the concept understandable. I think it is a bit more than that. The Germans certainly had their faces rubbed into the Holocaust. Two results. First you have a very very strong institutional guard against any aspect of fascism. Second, the old prejudices and hates remain but underground, I would guess in about the same numbers as during the war. The war excited other political vices and lusts to brutalize the nation and more numbers. Afterward, denial even when the democratic state warred against it constantly.

The Dems astutely presume that that 60% will simply sulk or revolt by voting for the Dems, but never really want the truth or radical reform the other way. Everything they do seems crafted NOT to behave like postwar German democracy but to make life comfortable with myths for the "bamboozled".

Now are these the only two ways? Constant but unwinnable war(so far) against common mental social vices or appeasement of the electorate until they become less brutalized and self-destructive? The vaunted specter of education keeps getting raised, but that never has ensured victory, nor has even a kinder more truthful propaganda.

My point is that a sizable number of people in a poisoned generation have fallen for the evil and won't get up. There is a malevolent tone to the stubbornness that you won't find among truly sincerely duped decent people. The corrupted need to actually convert or repent if you will. That cannot be forced or guaranteed. A deep spiritual choice has insidiously been made even by accepting wrongly the leadership of lying authorities. You are asking a lot of people in this state and that should be appreciated, especially when they do start back to the truth. A swift interior check should show that all of us have experienced this to some degree or other.

The lie is powerful because it erases all the personal pain of dealing with reality. The truth is more powerful because it kills and damns you no matter how glamorous the fantasies you empower temporarily. People usually idolize themselves as their own false god and the props are very sad and contradictory to this internal pride.

[Skittles]

2. Lynn, I think there must be some kind of mass psychosis going on

lots of people really think Bush is a good leader - that he is INTELLIGENT, that he is a war hero! Maybe they are beyond help.

[LynnTheDem]

5. Something VERY WRONG is going on in this country, for sure!

Yesterday a woman who'd lost her 19 yr old son in Iraq said he'd been fighting for their HOME TOWN in California, that we "invaded just in time" or they'd have been "over-running us" and if bush hadn't invaded, "I'd be wearing a burka now".

:wow: :wow: :wow:

Honey, sorry you lost your child. But Hussein was SECULAR; the women of Iraq WERE NOT forced to wear burkas, and very few of them did. So WHY THE FUCK would the Iraqi people want to force American women to wear what THEY DIDN'T WEAR???

DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

And of course the rightwingnut response is all Arabs are the same.

Ok. Then all white fundamentalist christian republican males are the same...as Timothy McVeigh.

American society is one of the most fundamentalist nations in the world; I suspect we're also one of the most racist, biggoted bunch, as well.

As for the most stupid, that is already well-acknowledged by the entire world. School kids in India talk about how silly Americans are for believing Iraq was involved in the 911 attacks. It's so damned EMBARRASSING!

[Kahuna]

10. I saw that woman. How pathetic she was. Spewing right wing lies..

to justify the death of her son.

[LynnTheDem]

14. She's a racist & a biggot.

The death of her son just, to her mind, justifies her biggotry and racism.

[Guns Aximbo]

20. you're right

... something IS going on here. I'm purplexed at the rapid change in this country. In 20 years we've gone from a Carter to Bush. I'll be honest, I'm a bit nervous.

What is going to happen to my kids? Will they become slaves, stepford children, Bible Humpers? I'm scared as hell and am fighting tooth and nail against these changes.

[rniel]

21. Most people

don't follow politics. They follow American Idol. These same people have some vague notion that there's no difference between the two political parties.

[4MoreYearsOfHell]

4. They will never learn the truth

unless they hear it from the media toadies Hannity/Limbaugh et. al. And I don't think THAT'S gonna happen...

Really, all the facts are out there - they are just too lazy/afraid/incapable of thinking for themselves.

[zanana]

22. They're like alcoholics in denial.

And you can't solve a problem unless you admit that you HAVE a problem.

[Guns Aximbo]

7. nothing... They're cattle

[robbedvoter]

8. Just think of the hallo they put on Raygun - when is THAT truth

supposed to come out?


When Ronald Reagan died earlier this year, someone from Fox News called Gordon, looking for a sound bite for a story on Reagan’s religious faith because Gordon had known Reagan’s pastor.
“I said, ‘He didn’t take care of poor people,’ ” Gordon said.
The guy from Fox said, “I don’t want to hear about poor people, I want to hear about Reagan’s Christianity.”
Gordon replied, “That IS Reagan’s Christianity,” and the Fox guy hung up on him."
http://www.arktimes.com/Articles/ArticleViewer.aspx?Art...

[FormerDittoHead]

9. Look at the history books of the past...

The number of myths perpetuated in American history books can fill a book.

In fact there are many such books...

[grumpy old fart]

11. We are at war with Eastasia, we have always been at war

with Eastasia......Everything else just goes down the memory hole....

[Kitsune]

23. Ignorance is Strength *nt*

[grumpy old fart]

26. Eastasia is our ally, they have always been our ally.......

[RebelOne]

12. Even if the truth slapped them in the face,

they would still be in denial. Reminds me of my Republican sister. You can prove something with cold, hard facts, and she still insists you are lying.

[DemNoir]

13. If one doesn't believe those things then it's impossible to support Bush

It really is all over. No matter how bad things will become, Republican power will grow.

Is there a greater certainty than Pres Jeb in 08? I don't think so.

[chapel hill dem]

15. And if the Democratic Party fractures, there will be no resistance...n/t

[ernstbass]

16. They will bury their heads deeper in the sand

[demo dutch]

17. They'll never learn the truth, they're brainwashed by Limbaugh and Co.

A great number voted for Bush because, they still think that Irag was involved with 911.

[leesa]

18. They will not find out the truth because they don't want to hear it

Face it. Bush has stated that their were no WMDs and yet they still believe there were WMDs. They will just shift to another rationalization. It's what Republicans do. Anything to avoid reality.