My take on the Zephyr/Kos/Armstrong thing

[cali]

Essentially it's about tainting Dean by association. Simplified, it comes down to this: Bad Dean campaign bribed prominent bloggers to say nice things about them. Nevermind that Kos clearly disclosed that he was doing technical consulting for Dean, or that Armstrong shut down his blog during the period he was consulting with the campaign. Nevermind that both Kos and Armstrong were Dean supporters prior to their consulting gigs. Nevermind that they were doing consulting re internet outreach. The result is that Dean's campaign and Dean by extension look dirty. And that was the intent. Who's behind it?
Who the hell knows, but it's all over the MSM, and being reported in a despicable and dishonest way. As the French are wont to say; the more things change, the more they stay the same.

[cornermouse]

1. The status quo will remain as long as we don't stop them.

I think we have three options. We can go along with "their" (whoever they are) choice, we can stop them, or we can split and start a new party. Clearly the preferred option is to stop them.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[cornermouse]

4. The thing that I always have liked about the democratic

party is their ability to allow diverse points of view.

Republicans, on the other hand, tend to be the ones who say things like STFU... Interesting.

[ashiebr]

5. If you're more interested...........

........in having constant and divsive internal battles than in attaining political power for your party, then go right ahead. But then don't shed crocodile tears if the opposition picks up on these arguments and divisions and usues them against you.

Once again, the we see the common sight of liberals snatching a propaganda defeat from the jaws of victory.

[cornermouse]

6. Do you really think the "opposition" is so stupid

that they can't figure these things out for themselves? Get real. You're sounding more and more like a republican.

[ashiebr]

10. You're sounding more and more like a republican.

And how does a Republican sound?

You sound like someone who can't see the wood for the trees. Or maybe you just think we have to destroy the Democratic Party in order to save it.

Strange how you have gone from eulogising liberals as encouraging discussion and then at the first sign of disagreement you shout 'Republican'.

[cornermouse]

11. Terminology is an interesting thing...

I'll let the thread stand as is.

[ashiebr]

12. Good idea. N/T

[IStriker]

18. Maybe she has a price...

Could be she can be bought. Democrats are always ruthless when it's internal stuff because if caught, they know that nobody will prosecute them and somebody might if it's done against the opposition and they get caught. If Dean is elected the $ will likely be spent on different people, perhaps a clean sweep on the pollsters, people who run campaigns, etc. If the status quo remains, the same old, same old will divvy up the pie.

Nobody can tell me that what she's exposing and what went on with Williams hasn't been going on with each side ignoring the others corrupt habits for a long, long time. It's the spoils that each side has to pay their supporters with. What if Dean is elected and he cuts them all off? We're already out of power and losing aide jobs in both houses, etc. Who is going to hire these people if the DNC dumps them?

[Capn Sunshine]

25. If you're talking about Zephyr, you're smoothing over truth

Your post makes the leap to dirty tactics and behavior within the Dean Campaign when nothing of the kind happened. The Wall Street Journal article is the worst sort of reporting, including a false quote and agenda driven memes.

I take the message of your post seems to be the grand leap to something was done wrong, and I can only assume this is based on false assumptions or no actual analysis of events as they happened, just a cursory listening to perhaps....Fox News?

[geek tragedy]

3. Stupid ass liberals are more dangerous to the cause than wingnuts.

As in, liberals who are stupid are dangerous.

[CWebster]

7. Obviously, Dean represents a threat

and they are out to trip him up, while they continue to pimp for their blood money. But, if the Chair doesn't have anything to do with the message, why is Rosenberg is out there letting his views be known? RAISING MONEY IS ABOUT SELLING THE MESSAGE! Who is targeted by Rosenberg's message? Sounds like he is reassuring certain concerns that the boat won't be rocked.

You can be assured they won't put as much effort into attacking Bush as they will in defending his opposition, if it means their organizational funding sources are threatened.

[Geek_Girl]

13. That's my thoughts too

But I find it odd that the Mainstream media is attacking bloggers over this. It seems they are Afraid of the liberal blogging community and are trying to discredit us.

[displacedtexan]

8. Bear & Squirrel Stew: The Republicans' favorite dish

Republicans want you to believe that 1 Bear and 1 squirrel are equal; hence, Bear & Squirrel Stew-- 1 bear & 1 squirrel.

I posted this metaphor (as it describes the WILLIAMS / 2 Dean Bloggers smear tactics) on my blog this morning:

http://ascrivenerslament.blogspot.com/

[Boredtodeath]

9. This is Trippi/Rosenberg

Trying to keep Dean out of the DNC chair.

Just find the Trippi + Zephyr Teachout connection and you'll see the purpose of this little stunt. Trippi publicly supports Rosenberg. Zephyr worked for Trippi on the Dean campaign. The connection is clear.

We experienced the beginning of this little campaign last week at DU with the pimping of Rosenberg here.

[moggie12]

14. Except that she takes a slap at Rosenberg, too

That's what I initially thought, too, but she takes a shot at Rosenberg in her piece as well. Somebody just pointed this out on another current DU post on the subject.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1496217

Maybe she just took a shot at Rosenberg to cover her true intentions???? (Kind of stupid, though...) Also, somebody on another thread said she endorsed Dean for DNC chair! None of this makes any sense at all to me.

If she just did it to get publicity, she's a piece of %$@*$. That would be even worse in my eyes than doing something that to advance one DNC candidate or the other.

[KittyWampus]

15. Sorry,This Is Paranoid. Not EVERYTHING REVOLVES AROUND DEAN.

Dean is not served well by his supporters who trace everything that happens back to a conspiracy to 'Stop Dean'.

Zephyr cares about her career. Her calculations and actions are about THAT. Making a name for herself.

Gee Whiz, look who is in the middle of all this- ZEPHYR.

She writes a controversial posting about Democrats/Blog owners who she's familiar with.

I suppose the only reason the Armstrong info came out was to take down Dean as well...

[cali]

16. No it's not remotely paranoid.

Nothing I wrote indicated that I thought Zephyr or Trippi or Rosenberg are out to "get Dean". I don't believe that, although some of the posters on my thread do. What I do believe, and perhaps should have made clearer, is that people in the MSM and others, are using this to impugn Dean. And if you don't think so, then you haven't been paying attention to what Novak, O'Reilly and others are saying.

[CWebster]

19. and their is always the possibility of

a juicy employment opportunity dangled.

Trippi's chances diminish with Dean, increase with Rosenberg's planned forays into networld.

[IStriker]

17. Who is behind it? The usual suspects in the party...

all the money people (Soros, Kerry, Heinz, DNC, Clintons, etc.) who made sure that their buddies in the MSM took him down in his bid for the nomination. They are NOT going to let go of their death grip on the Democrat party without a huge fight. They bought it, paid for it, and it is theirs. Ask them!

[PapaJoe]

20. Dean is no Liberal

but I support him anyway. He has a nice yell. Let us practice the Dean yell. Yeehaw!

[IStriker]

21. I never said he was too liberal for the hotshots who run the party...

He's too populist for them (i.e. on the side of the ordinary people, not the money people who "own" the party.) They are scared of him because they don't know what he'll do. They have to have someone as chairman who takes orders and passes out the $ we give them to the "right" people they want on the payroll. If the 527's would be shut down or regulated to where they could only accept contributions under $ 2,000 per individual, the DNC chairman would be back to being the power broker again. If they can't control that person, they would be out of business over night.

Most of all, they don't want anybody running the party who is not corrupt like they are. I supported Dean for the nomination and now for chairman because he's the first HONEST Democrat I've seen in a long time running for anything on the national level.

[John_H]

23. why do rethugs always make the same stupid mistake on DU

the "democrat" party. Idiots.

[John_H]

22. Technical consulting. Whatever. It's about consulting.

About how if any democrat wants to get anything done, she's got to hire 56 consultants who--lets face it--are sometimes hired for other reasons than what they are consulting about. This racket is your money being wasted, folks. It's about the same consultants (of whom kos is the very least of our worries) blackmailing candidates into hiring them even though they repeatedly get their asses kicked by the GOP. If defending this practice in order to keep dean's name pristine (dean did absolutely nothing wrong, anyway) then be my guest. I'm going to keep screaming to high heaven the fact that unless we stop the consultant game, or at least bring in people who can actually win races, we're fucked.

[sonicx]

24. That's another issue...

You're right, "consultants" are used too much, but this isn't about ethics like in the Williams case (the connection the media was desparate for).

[John_H]

26. Maybe we should hire some consultants to explain

to reporters that there is a huge difference between a federal agency using taxpayer money to pay a nationally syndicated columnist and tv host to tout an administrations political initiative and a democratic political campaign conducting business as usual. Or, better yet we can just hire the entire staff of the WSJ to consult with us on how to deal with the right wing media. Kill two birds w/ one stone.