I'm a non-collectivist leftist

[bobwhite]

I believe in individual rights. I believe in the maximum amount of freedom for the individual. Your rights end at the tip of my nose, and vice-versa.

I instinctively get uneasy when people start talking about 'community values' and 'mutual responsibility'. I practice those values in my life, but when I hear it get mixed up in policy it makes me feel kinda strange. I don't like participating in protests or mass movements or any of that kind of stuff. I don't trust mobs of people chanting anything.

This is how it works in practice: I believe in limiting the ability of corporations to pollute. I believe they should be punished for it. But I see it as an individual rights issue - in other words, that corporation infringed on the rights of others by putting toxins into the environment. Not much difference between that and just standing on your property and shooting at people, is there? Both result in death and injury.

I think Dems need to take back the language of individual rights. You can frame issues in this way. It instintively appeals to people and is very American.

[tkmorris]

1. True enough, but

You can really get caught up in the details. For example, some people would use your "individual rights" concept to argue against income and other taxes. I don't think it applies there, but the argument can be made that just about any collective endeavor (including taxes and the things they pay for) goes against the grain of the individual rights.

Mind you, I don't think YOU are saying that, at least you didn't in your post, but the idea can be taken to an extreme that I am uncomfortable with. Extremist Libertarians do not appeal to me.

[bobwhite]

2. I see that as an issue, but

any political idea can be taken to an extreme. I just wish that our leaders would use the language of individual rights more.

Money is issued by the government, by the people, inherently an action that can only be taken on a collective level. Therefore, if you agree to print money, and use it, the government has the right to tax.

But when you get right down to it: civil rights, the environment, the separation of church and state, all these issues are important because here you have other people, or the government, potentially intruding on individual rights. I'm talking just the basic natural rights we enjoy as humans. I have the right to walk down my street and not be poisoned by dirty air the same way I have the right to walk down my street and not be punched in the face.