Why do we eat our own ??

[drdon326]

in the past 24 hours i've seen threads bashing...

hillary clinton
chuck schumer
diane feinstein
barak obama
patrick leahy

you may not like a certain vote or even votes but you'll probably like the alternative alot less if we tear them down.

And btw, I loved what Boxer did to rip condi a new one but she voted for the last iraqi war supplemental. (Was it $80 million or billion...i dont even remeber)

[DrGonzoLives]

1. They taste good with Worcestshire Sauce

:9

[Jacobin]

39. They are irresistable with "Vichy" sauce

And they are fucking slathered in it.

[Walt Starr]

2. All three of them make me sick

Sorry, politics as usual must go. It's the only way we proceed.

[lancdem]

7. What three?

There's five on the list, Walt. :)

Oops, there were 3 when you replied. Sorry!

[drdon326]

12. I added 2 on edit...my bbad. n/t

[Marlie]

24. It's so depressing

Are we at DU becoming like the rest of the country. God forbid we
say something that is not in lockstep with our party. Just what
has the Democratic party done for our country these past years?
Bush has gotten away with murder, yet he gets everything and everyone
he wants.. I'm tired of making excuses for my party. Simply
speaking, presently the majority of them stink and it's been that way for some time now. For all of you who accuse us of eating our own,
would you just list the good things the Dem's have accomplished, say
over the past six years? I would really love to have my memory
refreshed, as I can't seem to remember many. Sure, we have long
lists of Bush's failures but the point is, what have the Democrats
done to stop any of them? They continue to enable this Administration
one way or another and I'm so tired of it. I will not stop writing
and fighting for our cause but sometimes you just feel it's
useless.

[Just Me]

62. Relatively speaking, we spend less energy bolstering the "heroes",...

,...than we do bashing the "weak",...and a LOT less energy frying the real bastards.

The Republican party stays together no matter how freakin' AWFUL its leadership or representatives.

Hence,...they are kicking our asses all over the place.

Their priorities in terms of spending their energy is:

*BASH the CRAP out of all credible, honest people
*PRAISE, PRAISE, PRAISE "mouthpieces"
*CHIDE (in private) those who fail to toe the line

We could LEARN something from those mo-fo's "winning strategy"!!!

Doncha' THINK? :bounce:

If I could set our priorities, they would be as follows:

*BASH the CRAP out of the greedy corporatists in power
*PRAISE, PRAISE, PRAISE the ACTIONS of those who are taking a
stand for honesty, integrity, the Constitution and/or "the
people"
*CHIDE (in private or lightly in public) those who
are "weak", "distracted" or SKEERED of losing their
political career.

Moreover,...instead of demanding the unattainable goal of perfection,...why not make our demands clear and simple: we want an OPEN, HONEST, ACCOUNTABLE governance because we DESERVE to be an INFORMED people since we are "the people" who are supposed to quantify and qualify a "democracy"!!!!

AND, I WILL RANT ON,...

BOXER, KENNEDY, BAYH,
BIRD, LEVIN, DURBIN, KERRY,
JEFFORDS, REED, DAYTON,
AKAKA, LAUTENBERG, HARDIN:

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR COURAGE AND INTEGRITY,
AND FOR TAKING A STAND AGAINST THE MANIPULATION
AND BETRAYAL OF AMERICAN'S TRUST AND LOYALTY!!!

I APPLAUD AND EMBRACE YOU WITH EVERY OUNCE OF MY BEING!!! :HUG:

BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY, "THE PEOPLE NEED YOU"!!!

FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT FOR US.

YOUR STAND WILL EVOLVE INTO SOMETHING BIGGER THAN A STREAM IF YOU CONTINUE TO STAND IN YOUR CONVICTIONS FOR US.

I AM SO GRATEFUL FOR YOUR COURAGE AND INTEGRITY BECAUSE YOU ARE A REFLECTION OF ALL THOSE, LIKE ME, WHO HAVE INVESTED THEIR LIVES IN MAKING "DEMOCRACY" A REALITY.


MORE RANTING,...

,...Lieberman, you rejected me, altogether, today. You extinguished my voice by chiding those who were the agents of my voice. Shame on you. With respect to the other 32 or so Democrats and ALL the Republicans who chided or silently proved their "disapproval" of those who took a stand and voiced the concern of millions of Americans,...you ALL FAILED to meet our demand, our right and due expectation of an OPEN, HONEST, ACCOUNTABLE governance. You ALL failed to meet your commitment and responsibility to me and the rest of "the people" by ignoring your oathes of office to protect our rights and liberties (especially in denying us the RIGHT TO BE INFORMED) and to protect us from ANY harm by predators either foreign or domestic!!! I hold you COMPLETELY RESPONSIBLE for your failures. "The people" will ultimately hold you accountable. GOD will judge you ALL (yes?)!!!



*sigh* I'm finished ranting now.

[KissMeKate]

92. its called holding them accountable for every vote.

we can insist our representatives actually represent us, without having to settle for the false choice of "rollover democrat or republican"

[Just Me]

93. Yes. But,...do we protect ourselves from those with knives at our throats

or kill those who are simply,...bystanders?

Screaming "why aren't you helping me" at those standing on the sideline fails to help us defeat our enemy on the battlefield. PLUS, we are giving the predators even more ammunition by pointing out our own "weak" comrades in front of their faces.

That's just my take which I express to those who are supposedley on the side of "the people".

[KissMeKate]

94. ok,

all those analogies confused me- what are you saying :)

[Old and In the Way]

3. They taste good.

If we don't like our elected officials, why not work to oust them in the primaries?

[drdon326]

6. Just great.....

tear them down,throw them out and youre really not going to like the results.

sheeesh

[Old and In the Way]

32. huh?

I thought that's why we have primaries? If Democrats don't like the way their elected person votes in Congress, you have a choice in replacing them. Isn't that a good thing? If throwing out apologists and enablers of Republicans is the end result, I happen to think that's a very good thing.

[Scatamooch]

97. Less Filling!

Ya think that maybe, just maybe, we can find someone that doesn't have a past? These elections have turned into "who can dig up the most dirt on their opponent" instead of being about the issues facing our country today...Before we choose who our candidate will be, we must be absolutely sure there are NO SKELETONS in their closet. :bounce:


Scatamooch

[Connie_Corleone]

4. Don't forget Obama (oh, you added him, okay.)

He just got in the senate. I may not like his one vote on Condi, but I'm not going to throw him overboard for it.

[Melodybe]

5. Because they are no better than republicans

because we are suppose to be the party of the working man and for the last 5 years I have seen democrats do nothing but chummy up to the most evil, greedy and corrupt people that have ever been in power.

I am sick of it.

Tell that shit to my friends in Iraq and my best friend's husband who is about to be shipped out to fight in a war of lies.

Fuck them, I want someone to stand up and be decent for a change.

If dems in congress can't do that, they are no better.

[drdon326]

17. Think so, huh?

what you want cant happen given the dems are now the minority party.

Any more loses and the pukes will have a veto proof majority.

[DrGonzoLives]

20. Sometimes

I think the screaming contingent wants that, so things actually get worse, at which point the people will "wake up" and see things their way.

Of course, they don't really care how bad it gets up to that point - as long as they're proven right in the end.

[Melodybe]

27. Enjoy the fascism

our dems seem to have no problems with it.

[DrGonzoLives]

29. People like you

would enjoy it more - it lets you become martyrs.

[Melodybe]

34. Bull shit! I have two little babies that I want to grow up in a

safe country, I don't want to be a martyr. I worked my ass off to get Kerry elected.

I registered 200 people to vote, I dedicated thousands of dollars, and volunteered thousands of hours for this party.

I sat out side of one of the most historically racist colleges, Ole Miss, at a John Kerry table.

I am in the middle of the biblebelt and my gay friends are treated like shit.

I am watching way too many of my friends from high school and college come back fucked up from Condi's and the administration's lies.

I want the democrats to be a party of opposition, to the most radical and dangerous people that this country has ever known.

It that is too fucking much to ask then I'm sorry.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

50. Well said! I have two teenaged sons that over my dead body

will become fodder for this Sociopath's endless wars. The Dems that voted yes are in collusion with this madman's policies and I refuse to be silenced myself.

[googly]

66. I thought we still have a all volunteer army...so your kids are in no

jeopardy of becoming cannon fodder. However if Bush takes us
into Iran and then Syria then we may get the dreaded draft come back.
In that case, Canada is always an option?

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

104. As I said, endless wars. Canada is no longer an option. They have

an agreement now with the US and will not provide a haven for those who go there to escape the draft, if there is one.

[googly]

105. Sorry, I did not hear that, but from everything I do know,

there is no chance there will be a draft any time in the near
future. The army likes the volunteer army. The draftees rarely
stayed beyond the 2 years.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

111. Thank you for being sorry, but they are going to need warm bodies.

Recruitment is way down, and to fulfill the Sociopath's desire to "bring freedom" throughout the world (and he will try to do exactly what he did with Iraq), they are going to need a draft. One doesn't have to be a rocket scientist to figure that at.

[Q]

51. Well said...er...written...

...but none of this seems to concern the 'moderate' Dems who always react in a kneejerk manner to ANY criticism of any Democrat.

[DrGonzoLives]

54. As opposed

to people like you and others in this thread who react in a kneejerk manner anytime a Democrat DOESN'T do exactly what you want?

[Q]

109. No...as opposed to doing what they take an oath to do...

...protect and defend the Constitution. What part of THAT don't you understand?

It has nothing to do with what I want. It has everything to do with what is right and wrong.

It's amazing how many Democrats are willing to overlook the failings and misdeeds in their own party simply because the other side is worse.

Are they pleading ignorance? Do they not know that it's wrong to coddle criminals? Do they not understand that enabling crimes or voting for lies makes them complicit?

Our nation can't take this kind of crap any longer...with both the Republicans and Democrats considering winning more important than good government.

[DrGonzoLives]

56. If Rice, miraculously, had been defeated

then what? Wolfowitz? Perle? What do you think Bush does next? Nominate Kucinich or something?

I'm happy that we had 13 Senators vote Nay (second-most only to Henry Clay's confirmation back in the 19th century) but it is absolutely ridiculous to claim that they're "no better than Republicans" or whatever the going motto is because of ONE FUCKING VOTE.

Go ahead, beat them in the primaries, and watch more Republicans get into office. God knows that will make things better. The rest of us will work from the inside, where things can actually get done.

[googly]

68. What's wrong with you? You sound logical!

[Just Me]

78. The BENEFACTORS are inciting us to beat beat eachother with,....

,...our own bats.

They are lapping that shit up, big time.

*sigh*

We really must FOCUS.

While they pull own the "magical unknowns",...we have the real KNOWNS on our side.

We have got to stop being distracted by these power-mongering, divide-N-conquer, buttholes!!!

Boxer is leading a "cause" that touches EVERY LIVING HUMAN BEING: "reality", the "here and now" facts, a demand for accountability and integrity.

[Warren Stupidity]

88. the MSM talking heads would have exploded

in unison. It would have been a massively embarrassing defeat for the theo-fascists in washington. Would the next clown have been worse? Most likely. The point is that an opposition party opposes. That if we never say no, we never defeat the media propaganda that the regime acts wisely on consensus, WITH THE SUPPORT OF RESPONSIBLE DEMOCRATS, that it is business as usual in washington dc, that we are not living in a fascist theocracy run by messianic megalomaniacs masquerading as a constitutional republic.

Voting yes facilitates the charade. The fact that so many here don't get it is appalling.

[martymar64]

89. We appease, so we lose

The reason we've been losing is because we vote with the Repubs so they won't get mad at us. We appease them at every step with a big "Me Too" chorus. Ask Neville Chamberlain how well appeasement works.

[truebrit71]

30. Hear, hear!!!

n/t

[mike_c]

8. I can only speak for Diane Feinstein...

...since she's one of my senators. I've been critical of her for several years, and since I'm Green, she's certainly not one of "my" own! As a democrat who has supported many of Bush's worst policies, DiFi has done little to help advance progressive causes. As she's one of my senators, I have a vested interest in replacing her with someone who will do a better job.

[FrenchieCat]

9. Because the Republicans

leave a nasty aftertaste after one bite.

So instead, we eat our own!

....plus, it's easier, faster, and gives us strength to digest the rest of the shit that we are made to swallow!

[Padraig18]

10. Because it's easier to be self-righteous than it is to think critically.

Welcome to St. Agnes' Home for Terminally Outrgaed Leftists.

[lancdem]

13. LOL

[el_gato]

16. anybody with a D beside thier name gets a free pass, eh?!?!?!

[Padraig18]

25. Point out where I said that, if you'll be so kind.

:wtf:

[el_gato]

47. the implications of your words are clear

as far as I am concerned we can't afford to let scumbags like Feinstein and Hillary Clinton sell us out anymore.

[Padraig18]

55. My words say exactly what they say, no more, no less.

The lack of critical, long-term thinking here on the votes regarding these two nominees is amazing. Knee-jerk outrage is no substitute for intellgent decisions regarding which battles are wroth fighting and which precedents are bad ones to set.

[Warren Stupidity]

81. ok so we are too stupid so splain to us

what the "long term thinking here on votes regarding these two nominees is".

Please explain how voting for the lying Dr. Rice is not agreeing to more wars on false pretenses to advance and unstated an unsupportable agenda.

Please explain how voting for Mr. Gonzales, documented advocate of state torture in defiance of our treaty obligations is not a vote for state torture.

Please explain how the Democratic Party going along with abomination after abomination is somehow a long term strategy for success.

I'm so confused. Maybe you can enlighten me.

[Walt Starr]

83. The "secret strategy" excuse is overused by the apologists for the

pink tutus.

[lancdem]

11. For that reason

I'm probably going to take a break from the politics part of DU for awhile. Plus, the deaths in Iraq today have me realy upset.

[el_gato]

14. feinstien is a war profiteer (but by your logic we should ignore that)

the difference between us and lock-step fascists is that we can question those around us.

[Justyce]

15. Their job is to

represent us, and when they do things like vote for Rice, they know damn well they aren't representing us. I don't have as much of a problem when they vote differently on questionable issues in which we are divided, but this was not one of those.

And on that subject, the whole purpose of senators/representatives was to vote the way their constituents told them to simply because we didn't have the technology to all vote on every issue, so we would select someone to make the trip & vote -- not a lifelong career originally. How did it turn into them telling us what they would & wouldn't vote for & us choosing them on the basis of that, rather than them having to vote the way the majority of their constituents wanted?? We have the technology now to all vote on every issue & don't need them "representing" us at all anymore, but it will be a cold day in hell before they ever let the system change/reform -- it's much too profitable for them this way.

[DrGonzoLives]

18. Do you live in Arkansas?

If not, then Blanche Lincoln doesn't represent you.

Do you live in Vermont? If not, then Patrick Leahy doesn't represent you.

Do you live in Wisconsin? If not, then Russ Feingold doesn't represent you.

Et cetera.

[0007]

59. John Cornyn and Kay Bailey Hutchins represents me

I haven't mind up my mind to "Just let Go" or to "Give Up"

You should read some of the letters they send me! :puke:

[DrGonzoLives]

60. My sympathies

My point to the poster I was responding to was that the only Senators who represent you are the two from your state.

In your case, though, yeah, no one really represents you, since Texas hasn't sent anyone worthwhile to the Senate since Bentsen.

[Padraig18]

19. Wrong.

If they owe us anything, it is to use their best judgment; I do not vote to send some automaton to Washington.

[Justyce]

26. This is not how the

system originally was set up or worked. That was my point. Now, we have no choice but to trust their judgment and hope for the best.

[Padraig18]

28. Wrong again.

It was set up in precisely that way, because communications between 'home' and the Washington were, at best, primitive.

[Justyce]

31. Yes, it was set up

w/ representatives because of the communication problem, which we don't have a problem with anymore. (Please see my original post.)

[Padraig18]

35. I did see your original post.

It made no sense, either.

[Name removed]

37. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Padraig18]

38. As a history major and political junkie, ...

... I'm merely pointing out the total absurdity of your statements.

[Justyce]

40. What exactly is absurd

about it? It's just the way it was. Not sure why you are taking issue with the fact that we originally needed representatives due to the communication/technology issue, but we don't have that problem anymore. I suspect you are just having a bad day? What's "absurd" is attacking fellow democrats who come to this board seeking to join other dems for a common purpose. Have a good evening.

[Padraig18]

42. This is what's absurd.

"...the whole purpose of senators/representatives was to vote the way their constituents told them...." . That's a direct quote from your original post. It was wrong then, and it's still wrong now. If you're looking for a cheerleading section to butress such blatant historical ignorance, you're looking in the wrong place.

[Justyce]

48. A "cheerleading section"?? LOL. Whatever.

[jswordy]

21. Know what? It doesn't mean squat posted here.

Not one damned thing in the big picture. So don't worry over it much. Just folks blowing off reactionary, knee-jerk steam, is all.

[mtnsnake]

22. Because too many people only care about their own personal agenda

instead of looking at the overall picture of what it will take to win in 2008.

All it takes is one little difference to set some people off.

If someone doesn't push for vote fraud, they're automatically disqualified as being a good democrat in the eyes of so many around here.

If someone voted for the chimp's war, based upon the lies Bush and Cheney spouted, then that candidate is disqualified forever (See Hillary).

If someone doesn't say exactly what 'we' expect he or she to say each and every time they have something to say, then that candidate is automatically a loser and nothing will change their minds.

It's called being unrealistic.

[Walt Starr]

84. You just don't get it

We are so in the minority that lockstep on it all is required.

Period.

[stillcool]

23. It is so old....

peoples tolerance levels, including my own are becoming non-existent. Some things can be taken in stride, but DINO's like Mr. Lieberman are particulary grating. The politics of politics is the problem. While we ourselves are often guarded in our conversation with others and straddle various fences in life, we cannot abide by the appearance of such in elected officails. Its always the "Why can't they just say?..", or do, or be...I also think many people are seriously being played by the media, and their rants are superficial and reactionary.

[googly]

71. Lieberman is easy for me to understand, he is jewish and he

is sympathetic towards protecting the small jewish state of Israel
which is surrounded by a sea of Arabs. That is why he supports the
Iraq war because if you recall Saddam sent quite a few Scuds into
Israel in Gulf War I. Since Condi is pro-Iraq war, she becomes his
defacto friend. "An enemy of your enemy is your friend". If you put
yourself in Lieberman's shoes, you might make all the same decisions.

[stillcool]

96. He's American, and he's a democratic Senator from the northeast.....n/t

[KittyWampus]

33. Because A Few Emotionally Overwrought DU'ers Are Imitated By Many

disruptors.

[sendero]

36. You know....

... nobody is "eating our own". Sure - there are some angry knee-jerk reactions here, but such is life.

Folks are fed up. Do you get that at all? Do you wonder why some of us are tired of waiting for our "representatives" to represent us?

I'll tell you what - I agree it is wrong to villify someone for just one vote. But there are a boatload of senators who never seem to vote our interests. Does that bother you? Should we all just quietly send their opponents campaign cash?

The Dem party needs to change, in a hurry and in a big way. Venting here probably isn't going to do much, sending letters and faxes of dissapointment will help some.

I live is a state with Rep senators, so talking to them (believe me, I've tried - if you want to get back a form letter that tells you nothing, try sending a letter to Kay Bailey Hutchison) is pointless.

Folks who have some of these clowns representing them have a right and a duty to express their displeasure.

Really, "a president should get to pick his cabinet" - what kind of fucking idiot thinks that means jack shit - this I have to hear.

[Generator]

49. Great post

As for me-I carefully think out my anger.

My anger at Clinton-who knows better and is just appeasing evil (imo) to get along so she can have a shot at 2008 is disgusting and I hold her more responsible than the rest. She knows what she is accommodating and trades her giving in to the deceit today as a way to make it okay tomorrow. It's dumb at best, oportunistic in probablity.

Obama-he's brand new-so I will give him a pass, call him savvy or naive-but I won't castigate someone so new just yet.

Anyway-I don't eat my own.

I still adore Kerry and he has voted the way I would expect. I can give him the benefit of the doubt on what broke my heart-conceeding the election. Maybe he really thought he lost, maybe he really believed it but is anyone telling me that these Dems really believe Rice will do a decent, honest, competent job??-No it's about appeasing the beast. It's dishonest. They know better. They are not fighters. Do you fight fascism with appeasment?

There are two Dem camps on DU-the ones that think the ship has sailed, and those that think they can cling to it and it won't go anywhere. It's sailed. Now-find a way to get it back.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

41. I will not lay claim to anyone who votes to confirm anyone that assisted

in leading us into an illegal, immoral war that was based on avarice. A war that led to the death of well over 100,000 fellow human beings. If you wish to call these people your own, that is your business.

[googly]

73. Do you have a link for that 100,000 number?

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

103. http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0%2C2763%2C1338749%2C00.html

You can also do the search. It's all over the place except in MSM.
We are not allowed to think about this, didn't you know?

BTW...this is as of October.

[mdmc]

43. our own are tasty, with their gop lite tactics

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. We should just pat them on the head and say "Thank you"?

For their cowardice?

[mdmc]

45. lol, I'm still hungry!

[robbedvoter]

46. I voted. I expect representation. Where is your problem?

Hillary very rarely represents me - Jan 6, today, IWR.
next time - no vote.

[LittleClarkie]

91. That's not "eating our own" that's participating in democracy

It's the talk of "punishment" that gets me.

Good. Don't vote for her. Find somebody now, and start working for that somebody. It's never too early I reckon. If the other side can start early, so can we.

Meanwhile, I fear for my Dem Governor. I think he's going to have a tough fight. I'm going to have to focus on the local fight first, I think. If the Repubs get in Wisconsin, say bye to fair voting in Wisconsin. We're too purple for my tastes, and so tight we squeak. So the Republican gunning for the Governor's job who makes property taxes his main issue is going to be tough to beat.

[JoshK]

52. Here is what happens when you use that logic --

you convince people to support Dems even when they vote like cowards and traitors. This encourages the development of a party increasingly willing to act like cowards and traitors.

Unless you believe that what has befallen us is not very serious, you should not fall into the trap of supporting someone who casts cowardly votes, simply because "the alternative would be worse."

A vote for Rice, for the IWR, for Gonzales, or for any reactionary Bush initiative whatsoever -- these votes are unforgiveable, regardless of the party the vote-caster comes from. Coddling Dem warmongers, for example, just because they are Dems, leads to a Dem Party lacking the integrity to oppose immoral wars.

[OneBlueSky]

53. because they are NOT our own . . .

they are BushCo enablers and corporate whores . . . every damned one of them . . . if they're not going to oppose the worst president in US history, we might just as well vote in more Republicans . . . because the outcome will be no different . . .

[DrGonzoLives]

57. Leahy is a Bush enabler?

That's news to me.

Feingold a Bush enabler? Another shock.

Et cetera.

[LittleClarkie]

58. Mettle not in the ways of DU, for thee art crunchy, and good with ketsup

Heinz anyone?

I agree. That's why I have declared the "Democratic Party Back Watch" to which a precious few peeps have agreed. Criticize, yes. Support one over the other. Fine. Threaten to punish? No, Bad Dem, bad, bad (fwap).

We need to support the minority party as much as possible, not make it weaker. Declaring war on 37 (38?) senators for not voting the way you wanted is just lunacy. If we eat them, there won't be anyone left to oppose the Bush Co., even just alittle.

[drdon326]

61. Exactly.....

the dems have to pick their fights ( supreme court comes to mind).

If the dems were in the majority, thats one thing...anymore losses and the pukes will have a veto proof majority.

[Sleepless In NY]

74. They are making themselves weaker, without any help from us

Especially the ones that criticized Rice, then turned around and voted for her. What sense does that make? Tell me, please. For everyone speaking against bush and his policies, they just turned around and told us to be quiet because they "approve". They look like fools.

I'm sorry, I can't and I don't see how any self respecting democrat could vote for Rice. She might be a great piano player but she was a disaster as a National Security Director. The woman ignored Richard Clarke, A PDB "Bin Laden Determined to attack in the U.S."
and lied like the rug on top of Trent Lott's head about our reason to go to war in Iraq.

She was failure in her position, yet instead of being fired, they helped promote her.

What kind of message does this send to voters? That you approve of bush & his polices? Yes. So why should they bother to vote for democrats? Bush's way is the right way...stick with bush. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

Turn on cable tv tonite and watch republicans gloat.
And this, on the day 36 soldiers lost their lives in this assine war.

No more unconditional support for any democrat who refuses to fight back, it's not doing anyone, any good.

[LittleClarkie]

82. I didn't say unconditional support. This is not binary

Not supporting is one thing, threatening to "punish" is another. And living and dying by every vote is ridiculous. Feingold's good, Feingold's bad, Feingold's good again. Fuck him, support him, fuck him again.

Two things I hate to hear coming out of our side, talk of purging and talk of punishing. Blech.

[drdon326]

85. Great post....

good and bad changes on a daily basis...

look at evan byah (sp)....vilified as a dino...but voted against condi,

clinton was loved by many...now vilified.

feingold..same.

does every vote change support for each dem??

[Warren Stupidity]

86. no every vote doesn't...

but the DP has shown itself to be spineless in general and I am not going to waste my time and money on a political party that cannot even get up the courage to act as an opposition party. Ten Years is a long time to figure out how an opposition party acts and I am losing patience.

[drdon326]

106. Well.....

like it or not the DP is now the minority party and it has to pick its fight.

Practicality may overide ideology.

[Warren Stupidity]

108. ok - the minority party has to pick its fights

I agree with that statement but here is how I see that working.

The only real power that the democratics have is the filibuster. That is the weapon that they have to be careful about using. The rethugs have the votes to re-write the rules and end the filibuster, it is not written into the constitution. They can use the 'obstructionist' argument to justify such actions if the DP unwisely filibusters everything.

On the other hand, votes by the minority party (not filibusters, which are vote boycotts) are symbolic. So other than the unsubstantiated platitudes I've seen in this thread, what is the reason that the DP ought not to oppose, by voting against, every piece and parcel of the odious policies of this administration?

As I've said elsewhere in this thread, by voting with the administration the DP allows the media and the rethuglicans to continue with their narrative that the administration is acting responsibly and with wisdom and with CONSENSUS as it is supported by both parties. It is aiding and abetting CRIMINAL BEHAVIOR. (Unless of course you think that starting a war over deliberately false premesis or engaging in state torture are not crimes.)

[Sleepless In NY]

99. LittleClarkie it's been alot more than a few votes

It's been almost 4 years of waiting for Hillary or Schumer to speak up. They want to kiss bush's butt? More power to them. They are not getting my vote, thats not "punishment", its my right to vote for who ever I choose to.

By the way, Clark was my 1st choice. He would definitely get my vote, those 2 will definitely not.

[98geoduck]

63. When I have to choose between a shit sandwich and douche bags

I'm looking for somewhere else to eat.

[donheld]

64. Why do "our own" not stand up for us like they are suppose to?

They talk a big talk to get elected, but then don't walk the walk.

[McCamy Taylor]

65. GOP Strategy is DIVIDE AND CONQUER and they are good at it-SOLIDARITY!

Very often, the left does not decide to cannabilize its own, it is nudged to do so by agitators who infiltrate message boards or the media sowing seeds of discord.

Next time you find yourself mad

:mad:

at someone you maybe shouldnt be mad at, stop and think


:think:


how you got that way. You may work out a chain that will point back to a great big rat.

:evilgrin:

[Sleepless In NY]

79. McCamy Taylor Too bad Dem Senators dont follow that example

You're quite right, Republican representatives are masters of solidarity, our Democratic representatives are not. That was proven once again today. If our leadership can't even unite for one day over what has to one of the worst nominees for a cabinet post ever, I don't feel the least bit guilty not giving them my full support either.

[McCamy Taylor]

80. Naw, set a good example for them.

[Sleepless In NY]

100. McCamy Taylor no thanks, they aren't listening anyway

[greenohio]

67. Because we are dysfunctional.

Standard dysfunctional procedure to to destroy your own in the name of progress. If we weren't, then we'd win more.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

69. Because Purity Is Much More Satisfying on an Anonymous Internet Board(eom)

DTH

[Individualist]

70. Why do some people get bent out of shape

when others don't share their opinions? For the record, I don't abandon my principles because of verbal brow beating by individuals on a message board.

[ScreamingMeemie]

72. Because they really deserve it this time. This was not representation.

This was cockroaches. God damned cockroaches. All of them now have bloody hands in my opinion. Sorry if you don't like it.

[drdon326]

75. Cockroaches??....wow !!

lovely....when you get 70+ repuke senators you may miss those "cockroaches". No middle ground? all or none?

:shrug:

[ScreamingMeemie]

76. They haven't voted for me...or reprensented me since this farce of a war

began. Sorry if you don't like it, but it's insider politics and it's well past time to clean house. Onward with DFA

[drdon326]

77. Hey, i respect your opinion.....

look,every 4 years the pukes gain seats in the senate.....my point is........at this rate in a few years you really wont like what will happen....even less than you do now.

[Warren Stupidity]

87. MrsGrumpy has it just right

Flash on F911 scenes of spineless toady Democrat 'leader' after 'leader' lining up to vote 'yes' on "Proposed: that we are mindless toadies who will vote for war on false pretenses out of fear of not looking patriotic". One after another. God Bless America Lets Kill Lots of Iraqis.

I went along and shutup about Kerry's preposterous position on Iraq, taking it on faith that he would be better than the evil crew in power, and he would have been. But he lost, and the Toady Branch of the Democratic Party lost again in congressional elections. Now is the time to clean house. We can be all in solidarity again next year. Now is the time to make sure that we stand for something.

[KissMeKate]

101. I agree.

Plus, we democrats are oh so tasty ;)

[KissMeKate]

90. false dichotomy

"accept a moderate voting record democrat, or you can only have a republican alternative".

I dont accept that. We deserve representatives who actually represent us.

[thebigidea]

95. ok, what do you think of Cynthia McKinney, then?

Or is she not on your list of politicians beyond reproach?

[philosophie_en_rose]

98. Because our party has NO LEADERSHIP.

The Democratic Party can be proud of so many of its leaders, but there is no single figure that members of our party can rally around during times of challenge. I'm not talking about a dictator or some Rove-lite, but someone that can negotiate between factions of our party and create a united front against freeptards.

[leesa]

102. Because we EXPECT them to behave rationally and morally

NONE of these people behaved appropriately when they voted to confirm someone who knowingly lied under oath. Do not make excuses for ethical failures. They have harmed us with their inexcusable lack of ethics and the whole world was watching.

Making good ethical decisions and acting on them are what makes us different from the lying scum of the Republican Party. THAT'S why!

[tngledwebb]

107. Time to separate the wheat from the chaff.

Truth will out. We must be able to call a liar a liar, a sell-out a sell-out, a DINO a DINO. At least here on DU. Why?

Because innocent people are being killed in our 'wars' every day.

Because democracy in America has been replaced with fascism.

Because the Constitution has been undone by the Patriot Act.

Because two presidential elections in a row have been stolen, and because MSM is complicit with this criminal regime.

Stay calm, and as polite as possible, but mince words at your peril.

[CWebster]

110. Why should we support them when they do not support us

but are more inclined to support the other side?

Why should we march behind them saluting, when they goose-step behind Bush?

What is the point of the outrage about what is happening in our country, if the one immediate recourse we have to oppose it, through the Democratic party- sides with it?

This is what triangulation brought us: strangulation.

Don't expect me to coddle those who practice it. If they can't speak out in defense of this country and against those who would destroy it, they deserve nothing less than our contempt- no matter what party they pledge allegiance to.

Give me Jeffords over Lieberman, anyday.

[drdon326]

112. Because.....

half a loaf of bread is a wholelot better than no bread at all.

[CWebster]

114. You mean the half of loaf that actually made a stand?

No problem.

[QC]

113. Because it gives the drama queens a chance to perform. n/t

[freestyle]

115. One person's bashing is another's accountability

Some of it has gotten really bad, but I certainly sent rather pointed notes to Sarbanes and Mikulski about Rice and also about Gonzales. To me, they clearly blew it on Rice, but this vote would not stop me from voting for either of them when they are up the next time. I don't expect perfection, and I at least know they listen to their constituents even if they don't always do everything I would prefer. The overwhelming majority of the time they do.

Having said all that, if you are "represented" by a conservative Democrat, some bashing may be in order as well as primary opposition. But, whoever wins the republican nomination in your state will be much worse. There are usually very real differences between the candidates, especially on economic issues.

[drdon326]

117. Politics is the art of compromise....

no one gets everything they want....hopefully you get most of what you want.

[TeacherCreature]

116. Because we are sick of sell-outs,losers, and losing?

Maybe stuff like that?