This Time It's 100% On Dems Shoulders---No Excuses Accepted

[DemocracyInaction]

I agree with something just said on Lou Dobbs. On the one hand, there are very, very nervous Republicans right now who are scared shitless to be out there as a party all by itself backing Social Security reform and putting the US in terrible hock to swing it. On the other hand, Reid has told the press that he has assurances that 100% of the Senate Dems will oppose it.

IF any of these "sometimes-wanting-for-a-backbone" Dems cave and Bush gets some kind of victory out of this, the Republicans have perfect cover to a) claim it was "bipartisan" b) if in a panic, claim that it was the work of the filthy Dems (that's what happens when you dance with the devil; and we've been bitten by it time and time again)! But there is something far deeper at work here.

It makes absolutely no difference whether SS needs overhauling or not. The issue in of of itself is small beans compared to what all is at stake for this country. The only remaining rock bed of what Dems were all about is their defense of SS and Medicare. If they so much as give an inch, any remaining semblance of a "for the people party" dissolves. They can kiss midterms and '08 goodbye...for starters. They desperately need to come off as the "People's Warriors" in this first challenge of Bush's second reign or they become hopeless, useless clowns. I hope they know that...I really do. They cannot start out this second term by becoming complacent or invisible, or cooperative with the Republicans; or they are going to be even more diminished come the next election. Count on it.

[LostInAnomie]

1. I agree.

If we compromise on this it is over for our party. Those that vote for this sham should be treated as if they are Republicans.

[MidwestTransplant]

2. Not to mention no Republicans are blamed for not voting for

Clintons 1993 budget which started the boom. So we can't go wrong politically speaking even if it doesn't screw old people and result in tremendous debt...which it will.

[JoshK]

Well, if Reid publicly guarantees 100%, it's probably true.

He wouldn't have said it if he weren't sure.

I do agree with you that if they caved in on Social Security, it would be their death knell. In a way, this is too bad, because they are not really "the People's Warriors" at all, and standing up on this one issue is not enough to change that unfortunate fact. So what will likely happen is they will hold the line here, then go back to their usual capitulating on every other issue, as we move forward.

[Just Me]

3. I suppose the neoCONspirators and the Republicans get a free pass.

They need not fear being bashed or attacked or admonished or condemned. The neoCONspirators and Republicans responsible for pushing America right over the cliff get a free pass.

:eyes:

[Telly Savalas]

4. If an isolated jackass like Lieberman crosses party lines...

then there's not a lot you can do about that. But if any less than say 40 members of the Senate caucus vote against Bush's trainwreck, then we've got serious problems. I, however, am pretty optimistic this won't happen. In fact, I think enough Republicans will break ranks so that Bush's SS demolition won't pass.

[ultraist]

6. I agree, even Repukes are going to break ranks with this one

Several have already come out and said so. I feel pretty confident that Dems will stand strong on this and OPPOSE it will full support from all Dems in Congress.

[jdots]

5. Please explain " The Dems " as in they

[ultraist]

7. Dems in Congress, those who will be voting on this

[Vadem]

8. You are absolutely right! The Senate Dems should vote NO on

every bill the Pubs put forth in these four years--we know it would not be to the benefit of any of us!

[DemocracyInaction]

9. Vadem---you can bet if the tables were turned that the

Republicans would oppose everything we brought forth. Perhaps it's time that the rank and file get tough and mean and take these people out to the woodshed and tell them that if we are going down then, hell, we will take them down with us. We need to start enforcing like the Christian right 'enforced' with the republican politicians. They need to fear us MORE than they fear Bush.

[Just Me]

10. Do you hold the neoCONspirators and/or Republicans responsible,...

,...for anything? Are you prepared to take your big club and thump on them? Or, are you just out to beat up on all Democrats?

Hmmmmmmm. :shrug:

[DemocracyInaction]

11. Is it Just Me, or do you demand nothing of your party--or care???

No Republican is going to put one of our Dems into elective office. They are going to have to do that all by themselves. It makes no difference if some, none or a lot of republicans end up disserting Bush on this issue. BUT it is imperative to this party that ALL the Democrats oppose him. Or are you suggesting that there would be mitigating circumstances that would make it okay for a few Dems here and there to cozy up to Bush on this one??? I don't give a rat's ass what the Republicans do BUT what the Dems do is more than whatever the issue is at stake. This is an issue that will draw a great deal of attention. Dems will really be watching and a bunch of nervous republican supporters will also. This is put up or get ready to be run over time. That's the way the cookie crumbles. That's politics and it's SHOW TIME. I hold repubulicans accountable by VOTING Democrat. Now, I expect them to perform and not act like republicans.

[Vadem]

15. What the hell are you talking about????? My post was entirely

based on our Dems blocking every bill that the Pubs put out that do not help our people, i.e., the general public, not the damn corporations. I don't know how you could have misread my post as bashing the Dems and not the Pubs!

:wtf:

[reprehensor]

12. bump

[NewYorkerfromMass]

13. It's just more welfare for Wall Street in the end

I agee it is a bedrock Democratic issue on which they are staking their entire raison d'etre, and even the saner Repubs know it is folly.
Good post.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

14. I think people despairing of the Gonzales vote

and lack of filibuster might take heart in this.

[harpo]

16. its a distraction...they are up to something, they know they can't pass it

but they keep talking about it...so they are hiding something or distracting us so we look the other way

[autorank]

17. It will be 100%. Ben Nelson is with Reid. Traitor Feinstein too.

I suppose Salazar can pull a Ben Nighthorse Campbell but I doubt it.

We're at 100% with 44 + Jeffords.

Repukes:

Snow's up for reelection. Add one for our side.
Collins would be recalled if she is with *. Add one for our side.
McCain will do a flip-flop on * now that he's done the dirty deed. Add one for our side.

That takes us to 48 sure votes. With parlaimentary procedure strategies and other shcenanigans (which Byrd and Reid know to the tee), this thing isn't looking too good.
Hagel wants to run for prexy in 2008. Add one for our side.

Who can come up with two more Repukes?

[NewYorkerfromMass]

18. we don't need 2 more Repukes

it is guaranteed they will block this thing anyhow they can.

[autorank]

19. Good point. I feel better just being reminded of that.

I'm fascinated with the politics of the fillibuster. I think our folks would have rolled it out for Gonzales but wanted to make sure it was still around for Social Security.

[Pam-Moby]

20. I have been so saddened by

the actions of some of our so called Democratic leaders in not standing with Conyers and Boxer on the Ohio electoral vote. Also Condi sailed through without much opposition which was a big let down. Now today Gonzo was allowed to be confirmed!! Why did they not filibuster this evil person??? But I agree that they better stand straight when the SS and Medicare programs come to the floor!!! Any dissenters should be held accountable by not being allowed to seek office again!!! We all need to stand our ground on this!!!