Is Obama "Well-Spoken?"

[JHBowden]

I often hear Obama referred to as "well spoken." Isn't this just a nice way of saying he is a black man that doesn't speak ebonics in public? Kerry is also articulate and well-spoken, but I rarely hear people refer to him like that.

Am I off base? Tell me what you think.

[RPM]

1. i read it that way

rarely do i see a white person who is called "well spoken"
:eyes:

[AlCzervik]

2. some are better speakers then others for sure

i don't think it's an insult to Obama because he's black. For example, i like the style of Kennedy when he speaks over the style of Reid.

[CWebster]

3. No, it is more than that

He is a very elegant, eloquent speaker. He is talented.

[grace0418]

31. It's inspiring to hear him speak

few people possess that gift.

[LoZoccolo]

4. OK, he's /not/ well-spoken.

:eyes:

[Maddy McCall]

5. I think he's very eloquent and articulate, and I love his voice.

I would say the same thing about any talented orator of any race. But I do agree that "well-spoken" is a racist code word for "that black man talks like a white man."

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

6. Is Bob Kerrey black?

Because it took me all of about 5 seconds to find a white example of your bullshit statement.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4438903/

on edit: in fact, i'll give you 5 total articles where i've googled "kerry well spoken"

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/01/28/1623208
http://journalism.nyu.edu/_ee/index.php/recount/article/going_upriver_kerry_does_nam/
http://www.drivingvotes.org/blogs/aaron/archives/000270.shtml
http://www.haro-online.com/movies/going_upriver.html

[onehandle]

7. It depends on who said it.

O'Reilly-Racist slur.

Franken-Sincere observation.

Obama is a much better speaker than me. So is Kerry.

O'Reilly would say that Kerry is very French.

O'Reilly is a tool. I never miss a chance to say that.

[Walt Starr]

8. Actually, "well spoken" is pretty much an understatement

He speaks eloquently and oozes charisma while doing so.

[babylonsister]

9. How else would you describe someone

who speaks so eloquently and why does race have to enter into it?

[DefenseLawyer]

30. Why does race have to enter into most things?

Unfortunately it does. Clearly not everyone who compliments Senator Obama as "well spoken" is a racist. But I think there is significant segment of white Americans that don't think of themselves as racists, but who categorize African American men as either "scary black man" or "one of the good ones". "Well spoken" is often used in context to mean "seems white" which some can interpreted as "knows his place".

[truebrit71]

10. It means he doesn't sound black.

At least that's the inference I get...

[ultraist]

14. It depends on who says it,

As someone else mentioned, I think it depends on who says it. I use that term frequently but not to describe speech delivery skills (oratorical) buy everyday language skills. I often say, my neices are well spoken because both the syntax and vocabulary they use is sophisticated. (I'm a proud Aunt).

Obama is eloguent (well spoken) and he is an amazing orator (formal speaker). I would not consider Kerry a great orator but he is well spoken.

[goodhue]

11. way off base

Obama speaks better than Kerry. Kerry's speech can be awkward and convoluted. Obama's speech is generally eloquent yet straightforward.
It could appear that you raise this issue only because Obama happens to be black, which is indeed way off base.

[indigonation]

12. No, he is engaging, charismatic and intelligent -

has nothing to do with ebonics. I think Martin Luther King Jr. and Malcolm X had the same effect on people. Obamas challenge with many will be his unusual name. I would say with your typical ignoramus bushbot, but Ted Kennedy butchered the name pretty badly.

[notadmblnd]

13. Whether people are black or white

it has always been my experience that some people are able to articulate their opinions and ideas better than others. Yes, Obama is very articulate, and he expresses his views and ideas that is easibly understandable and pleasant to the mind. The first time I heard Obama speak I thought, "That man is going to be the United States first black President". bush is not articulate, he mispronounces words, speaks in incoherent sentences and makes my head hurt to listen to.

Will Pitt here at DU is very articulate and very often expresses my opinion here better than I ever could. His writing flows with a smoothness that my mind can easily absorb.

When I was working, I had an associate that I absolutely hated working with. He was white, and very intelligent but he just couldn't get what he was thinking in his brain out via his mouth. He would typicaly start out talking about a subject, but he would have these random thoughts that would interrupt and he would go onto a different subjects or throw in needless details, stammer and such. I was always thinking JUST SPIT IT OUT!

So, no, at least for me it has nothing to do with color. I think Obamas gift of being able to articulate, is something that is above the norm for most all of us.

does that make any sense?

[ultraist]

17. Was your associate ADD?

If he could not hold a train of thought, he may be ADD.

"Well spoken" CAN be racist or deragotory if the speaker's intent is such and they say it in a condescending manner. Voice inflection or intent as well as surrounding content can make nearly any comment racist.

But in an of itself, it is not racist.

[notadmblnd]

19. Not as far as I know.

it was just painful to have to listen to him speak.

[ThorsHammer]

15. Could go either way

I think a lot of people do mean that he's a black man who doesn't speak ebonics. A lot of people also refer to any black man like this as 'articulate'.

Others, myself included, find him well-spoken as he just has "it" and appeals to everyone. Bill Clinton was very similar in this regard.

[AP]

16. This is a surprisingly persistent form of subtle racial bias

You'd think that by 2005, white America would have seen and heard enough "articulate" black speakers that it's no longer so shocking to hear someone like Obama talk.

[ultraist]

18. I do agree with that

There is a lot of insideous racism but there is still much overt racism as well.

I still stand with my comment that it depends on who said it, how it was said, and in what context.

I do not think that phrase has become code.

[EFerrari]

20. This is more about expectation than race, although racism plays.

"Well spoken" is also used to describe women and poor people. So, there is a bias and it encompasses race among other situations.

On not sounding "like a black man": a friend of mine has based his whole stand up routine on having a "white" voice. "My friends would ask me to call 911 because then the police would actually show up."

[ultraist]

22. You think so?

I wasn't aware that it is used primarily to describe women and poor people. You may be right, I've never noticed that though. I'll be watching out for it now! LOL!

[EFerrari]

23. : ) I think people of color, poor people and women get it all the time.

[stray cat]

21. He cuts through the crap, speaks rational truth and is diplomatic.

I call that well spoken

[JI7]

24. i said this before, what if a black guy had run for President like Bush

did and brag about their not doing well in school and being a horrible speaker. i doubt anyone would see it as a sign of him being a "regular guy" or some other shit.

they would say he got by on special treatment and call him lazy and unqualified etc.

and when a white guy like Kerry speaks well he is elitist or some other shit.

it's kind of like the limousine liberal and lazy welfare queen versus hardworking and victim of special treatment.

democrats who do well are called limousine liberals and those who have a tough time getting by are called lazy welfare queens.

but republicans who do well are called hard working and the republicans who have a hard time getting by are victims of some minority taking away their job because of special treatment for minorities.

[dogman]

25. Look in the dictionary.

It says nothing about race or gender and fits his style. As Walt said, it's an understatement.
well-spo·ken (wlspkn)
adj.

1. Chosen or expressed with aptness or propriety.
2. Courteous in speech.

well-spoken

adj : speaking or spoken fittingly or pleasingly; "a well-spoken gentleman"; "a few well-spoken words on civic pride"

[Obviousman]

26. He's eloquent

I never read anything racial into it, but maybe i'll have to look again

[Up2Late]

27. That's one of the Key phrases for today's Racist

That's one, "You People" is another, :grr:You should hear this VERY Angry rebuttal by Betty Baye (NPR Commentator and Newspaper Columnist (Louisville,KY I think)

<http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4475232>

and you can comment at my DU Thread :hi:

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3045333&mesg_id=3045333>

[Withywindle]

28. Chris Rock did a devastating monologue on this very subject...

With regard to things people said about Colin Powell; it was in the 90s sometime. "He's so articulate! That's not a compliment!"

I've spent the last 10 minutes Googling for funny lines from it with no luck - maybe someone else has it somewhere? Anyway, since I heard it I've never been able to hear a black person described as "articulate" or any varient thereof without wincing.

When you think about it, why would it be remarkable that a U.S. Senator with a Harvard law degree would be able to speak well? (I know, I know, he really is more eloquent than the average Senator, at least some of the time. Not a surprise if you've read his book: he's a good writer too.) There IS a history of that being said as a backhanded compliment, sometimes unconsciously racist. That's NOT the same as saying it's automatically racist to pay a compliment to anyone's oratory talents, it's just something to be aware of.

[sonicx]

34. "He speaks so well!!!"

It was from his 1996 stand up special. lots of funny lines in that one.

I agree with you about when blacks are called "articulate." I *immediately* think of Rock's bit.

[JI7]

35. what should be surprising is that thing in the White House is Yale

and Harvard educated after hearing him speak.

[BlueInRed]

29. I thought his convention speech was phenomenal

in both content and delivery. I haven't seen him much since, but when I have, he has not equaled that initial speech. But he can clearly do a great speech if well prepared; the convention proved that.

[KittyWampus]

32. I Have NEVER Heard Obama Called Well Spoken. INSPIRING,

Eloquent and Moving.

But 'well spoken'? That's a bit of an understatement.

Personally, I would LOVE to see you provide some links to where writers call him well spoken.

Or is this ancedotal accounts... cause if it is... I seems more likely your making this up to make some vague point.

[mtnsnake]

33. I agree. Whenever anyone hears Obama speak the first things that

come to mind are how inspiring he is, how smart he is, and how uplifting he is for any hopeful Democrat. The LAST thing that comes to mind is his color.

There are no other Democrats right now that can move me the way he can.

[Skittles]

36. no, I think he is an EXCEPTIONAL speaker

he reminds me of when I used to hear MLK speak when I was a kid.

[procinderella]

37. Read Obama's statement about why he did not vote for Gonzalez

www.obama.senate.gov

Read it and judge for yourself. (The frosh senator is also a constitutional law professor.)

[Dr Fate]

39. Obama rocks!

n/t

[angee_is_mad]

38. Hit the nail

on its head, if that is the case. I have never heard Obama referred to as articulate. Now I have heard him referred to as a good orator, based on his convention speech.

The mainstream(white) sometimes use that phase when referring to someone(black) who does not speak broken English. You tend to hear it a lot in reference to black athletes.