Is The Use Of The Term "Personal Account" (SS) A Clear Sign That Someone

[Beetwasher]

is a WH apologist? Or on the WH payroll? Or essentially just full of shit?

Just asking. If some people on this board use that term, and are essentially pushing WH propoganda, what does it say about them?

[smoogatz]

1. Either you're a seller

or a buyer. That's what it says. Bush's plan is privatization pure and simple, and that's what we should call it.

[CitySky]

18. I actually use "corporatization"

instead of "privatization."

Do we want to put our societal safety net into the hands of the government, or into the hands of corporations? That's the choice.

[glitch]

2. Yes, and that goes for all the other far right reframes as well. We should

create a dictionary of them all, with a permanent link.

[BuyingThyme]

3. If those are choices, I go with "full of shit."

It's all propaganda aimed at eliminating the middle man.

Instead of paying money to the government, they want us to hand it directly to the corporations.

It's known as fascism...or personal accountism.

[displacedtexan]

5. Absolutely! BushCo knows that people like to gamble...

and that most poor schmucks would love to be able to say that they are heavy invested in somesuch stock or that they're closely watching their portfolio.

Stupid.

Just plain stupid.

And there's one born every minute.

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

4. I wouldn't blame them completely

They are probably just caught up in the mystique of suddenly getting something tangible out of the government. I can see how that appeals to a lot of people.

Or, they are dying for a job managing some of the 15-20,000 customer service representatives that will be required to service the "accounts".

I wouldn't say the WH is actually paying them but... you never know with this administration.

[Nederland]

6. Tell you what Beetwasher

Since you seem to be so incredibly bothered by my use of the term personal account I'll stop using it. That way I can get back to kicking you ass on issues that matter.

[KittyWampus]

10. LOL! Social Security Doesn't Matter... Neither Does Medicaid

especially as compared to stuff like sending man to mars.

[Nederland]

13. You misunderstand

I never said Social Security and Medicaid didn't matter. What I said was that arguing about whether or not to use the term "personal account" is of little significance compared to the issue of SS reform itself. I was arguing with Beetwasher on another thread and when I kept refuting all of his assertions he resorted to nit-picking about my use of the term personal accounts. Fine. I'll stop using the term and he'll still be wrong about everything else.

[Beetwasher]

23. Uh, You Refuted Nothing, I Refuted Your Bullshit

Or don't you remember it was YOUR thread and therefor YOUR assertions...Duh....:eyes:

Remember: This isn't a repub plan it's MY plan? Duh....

[Nederland]

34. Ahhhh Beetwasher

As easily excitable as always.

[Beetwasher]

35. LOL!

And you, as transparent as ever...Do you really think you're fooling anyone with your bootlicking propoganda? Baaaaa Baaaaa!

[Beetwasher]

22. LOL!

Uh huh...You have to start before you can get back...:eyes:

Pathetic.

[yurbud]

7. bright side of "personal accounts"

They know they can't call it by it's right name and sell it.

Democrats have to start taking language as seriously as fascists do.

[Nederland]

11. What would you call them? (nt)

[cestpaspossible]

12. Where will the money go? They're Wall Street accounts. nt

[Nederland]

14. Fair enough

I'll take a Wall Street account with my name on it over my future SS benefits any day of the week.

[cestpaspossible]

16. Why the false choice? Just open an IRA.

When you retire and your Social Security checks show up, just don't cash them. As my parents used to say when I wouldn't eat my dinner: "More for us!"

[Nederland]

24. SS isn't a choice

Its compulsory.

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

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[cestpaspossible]

28. No I mean the false choice you posed

You said:

I'll take a Wall Street account with my name on it over my future SS benefits any day of the week.


As if there was something keeping you from opening an IRA right now. We already have private retirement accounts that recieve government tax breaks. They are real personal accounts, not a scam designed so that your potential for loss is unlimited, but your potential for gains is capped at 3% more than inflation. We also have a Social Security insurance program designed to keep the less fortunate out of poverty. It is false to imply that you have to choose one or the other. Again, if you don't your Social Security benefits, all you have to do is not cash the checks.

[Nederland]

33. Lack of money perhaps?

Does that even occur to you?

[cestpaspossible]

37. I'd advise you to save your pennies then.

You can open an IRA for as little as $50. If you are actually telling the truth, and you don't have $50, now, while you are (I assume) of working age, then maybe you are gonna have to cash those Social Security checks after all.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yurbud]

17. privatization is accurate and previously used even by the right

the probably changed because of polling and focus groups.

[Dinger]

32. I Don't Even Like "* * " In Quotes

personal accounts - yuk,


I have to sanitize my keyboard now

[cestpaspossible]

8. No, they may just be someone who's been duped.

They could be a well meaning Dem or progressive, who either doesn't understand the importance of using the correct term (I call them "Wall Street accounts"), or, maybe they just slipped. I even heard Katrina vanden Heuvel say 'personal accounts' on the Chris Matthews show, but she corrected herself. She certainly is not a WH apologist, on the WH payroll, or even full of shit, imho.

[BuyingThyme]

9. Enron never would have fallen...

if Bush's Social Security plan had been in place.

Kennyboy would have had enough cash flow to keep the scheme going forever.

[sandnsea]

15. WH apologist

David Gregory used it this AM on MSNBC. Whore for shore.

[yurbud]

19. when they have to make up a new word for "deregulate"...

it will be close to game over for the fascists.

[BlueInRed]

20. I think it would be one of many signals

but a person trying to sincerely learn information might use it, not knowing the history.

If they are saying the trust fund is an illusion, the cap shouldn't be raised and several things like that, then probably they are peddling Bush's wares. It's a judgment call.

But, there are several people here who argue similar theories, but you won't see them all in conjunction. I know a couple of sincere conservative Democrats here who echo a lot of the Republican stuff, but they don't call them personal accounts and don't try to say you actually own them and have complete control over them.

If confused, do a search on the poster and read a few other threads. Usually there's something that'll give it away, like being quick to provide the links to articles dissing Democrats, like JFK, Kerry, etc.

[rocktivity]

21. Tweety (kind of) discussed it with Bill Maher a couple of days ago

But once again, he answered his own question before he was done asking it. Why DOES this man bother to have guests?

(2/3 Hardball transcript)

MATTHEWS:  ...(Bush) says we‘re heading for (Social Security) bankruptcy...Would you explain to me why Democrats like to call it private accounts, because it sounds bad, and Republicans like to call it personal accounts, because it sounds good?  I miss the difference. 

MAHER:  The difference is a focus group that Frank Luntz...did...Why is it called the Clear Skies Initiative?  Why is it called No Child Left Behind?  Why is it called the Patriot Act?  That‘s what these people do so brilliantly.  They name things.  They don‘t do anything right, but they name it correctly. 

Miss the difference, my :kick: Nonetheless, Chris and Bill are on the money. It was the Repubs who directed the media to started calling them private accounts, but had to regroup when they found it wasn't playing in Peoria. So they came up with an alternative, and those mean old obstructionist Democrats are dissing President Mightymouse by not playing along!

:headbang:
rocknation

[cestpaspossible]

29. Last night an economist and former county chair

gave a talk on Social Security to our county dem meeting. Good discussion, but he kept saying 'personal accounts' and I kept wincing. Afterwards, I went up and talked to him about it. He just shrugged. I talked about the Repubs scientific use of language and why they wanted the phrase 'personal accounts' instead of 'private accounts' used, and his eyes just glazed over.

Frustrating.

[auburngrad82]

31. "Privatization" was not selling so the WH asked the MSM to use "personal"

accounts. Sounds better and they can try to sell it to the sheep.

[earth mom]

36. Yes, I think if someone is informed and certainly posts here on DU

then they know what * & Co are all about. They know that they are masters of word manipulation. It's what they do best, if you want to call it that, since every thing * & Co touch is slimy and hateful. Not to mention manipulative, blatantly misleading and chock full of lies. Basically all one and the same.