Sorry I have to ask this stupid question

[Democrats unite]

What the hell is the difference between a Democrat & a proud Howard Dean Democrat?

Is that saying Democrats are not proud? A Democrat is a Democrat. If you are not happy with the Democratic party you are free to leave at any time you like, noone is stopping you, noone is holding a gun to your head, just go. Quite frankly I am tired of this and what some people are going to do if Dean doesn't doesn't get the nomination or the NBD group. Go find your own Damn Party & take your tripe out of ours. The True Democrats I know have one mission & one mission only this year, ANYBODY BUT BUSH!!!

And if you can't live with that don't let the door hit ya where the good lord Split ya!

[AntiCoup2K4]

1. Well, since you have already identified yourself as a DLC operative....

...then you already know the difference. Dean wants to return the Democratic party to its true values, the party of FDR, Truman, and Jack & Bobby Kennedy. Your gang wants to maintain the status quo which involves a lot of corporate ass kissing. Your guy Clark, for example went from being a Republican fundraiser to a defense industry lobbyist to a corporate media commentator to a Democratic candidate for President all within 2 years, and you don't find anything at all wrong with that.

I'd say that's a pretty clear difference between Dean Democrats and status quo DLC corporatist "Democrats".

[nancyharris]

4. Read some history

“FDR, Truman, and Jack & Bobby Kennedy”

Those 3 presidents have little in common with Governor Dean. One fire-bombed Dresden, one nuked Hiroshima and the last invaded Cuba.

[boxster]

5. Return the party to its true values?

Isn't Dean a fiscal conservative? How does that make him the only "true" Democrat? On the contrary, I'd say that it helps identify him as less liberal than Edwards or Clark or Kerry.

Edit: typo

[Democrats unite]

6. I have identified myself as a card carrying DLC member

I will not argue that point, I will just say I am proud of it.

Republican fundraiser? Do you have proof? talk is cheap. defense industry lobbyist? This is America land Of opprotunity, why shouldn't it be for him also?

You can put any label on me that you want, it is safe to say I am one of the very few if not only DLC memeber here. That blows your theory right out of the water on that.

[AntiCoup2K4]

13. First of all, you put the label on yourself.

...and as you say, you're "proud of it". Hey, to each his or her own, but I don't think I could sleep at night.

The Republican fundraising is well known. Such as the event where Clark gave his famous praise to Team PNAC as the "great team that we need" in Washington DC.

The Defense Industry (which the Bush Criminal Empire is and always has been deeply involved in) is one of the most corrupt industries on the planet. The last General who became President warned us about them, and Ike would be doing cartwheels in his grave if he could see the likes of Halliburton, Bechtel, and Lockheed Martin.

And no, you aren't the only DLC'er here. Not by a long shot. That was proven in a certain thread yesterday :)

[Democrats unite]

18. Well known? I don't know about it.

Please enlighten me.

I must have missed that thread, I always ssem the only one here getting hit over the head for Being DLC. But I'm tough I can take, I won't be taken my ball & going home mad.

[GalleryGod]

2. I Agree 1000% (homage' to G. McGovern)

Wait until the New Hampshire "Flame-out"...
then Next Summer: They'll THREATEN a 3rd Party Candidacy.
You watch..just watch.:nopity:

[Padraig18]

3. Flame bait. n/t

[AntiCoup2K4]

7. Yeah it was, but I answered the question anyway

Because if we don't take back our country now, we may not get another chance.

[INTELBYTES]

17. Dean wasn't electable anyway.

[JohnLocke]

8. Hmmm......

:nopity: :nopity:

[Democrats unite]

9. Flame bait?

Just look at sig lines. Thats flame bait!

[Padraig18]

11. Yes, flame bait.

An examination of the Rules will reveal why it is.

[dreissig]

10. Memories of 1968

Democrats in 1968 thought they could get away with marginalizing the antiwar Left, so they pushed us out. Late in the campaign, Humphrey realized that he actually needed the votes that had earlier been spurned. He reached out to the antiwar Left but it was too little, too late.

Thirty-six years later the antiwar Left is similarly marginalized. Don't be too eager to push us out the door! When I say I won't vote for Kerry, it doesn't mean I intend to boycott other Democratic candidates. I'll stay a Democrat after 2004 just as I did in 1968.

The point here is that it's unwise to underestimate the antiwar Left. We're not locked in, and you can't question our loyalty either. It's simple. Don't nominate John Kerry. I don't know how many others will also refuse to vote for a warmonger like him, but the number might be enough to change the outcome of the election. That's what happened in 1968.

[MaineDem]

12. Will you vote for Kerry if he is the nominee?

I couldn't tell if you meant that or not.

[teevee99]

14. you know the real probelm

with dean's anger issue isn't just the candidate himself, but his supporters as well.

the first post almost belittles anyone who would disagree with dean.

Then you all go on all these threads and get angry. And right next to all that anger is Dr. Dean's face and/or name. You are making people despise the man with your own actions. And it's not just online.

I went to see Michael Moore speak in my city and the Dean supporters, instead of sitting and offering their e-mail lists/buttons/stickers/etc. (like the Clark and Kucinich people were doing) started shouting at teh top of their lungs and to be honest, drove a lot of people away.

Abrasive behavior wins you no fans.

I didn't see Gephardt's people getting so angry when his campaign was floundering, I didn't see anyone but Dean's camp getting all upset about their candidate loses. It only happens to eight to ten candidates every four years.


what makes you immune to the process?

[EXE619K]

15. In my opinion....

First, i think it's obvious that this is another "hit" piece on Dean, so I'm glad you support Wes Clark.

For me at least, Howard Dean spoke for me when all the other "party" leaders decided to stay quiet and chose the ways of "fence-sitting" or "political correctness".

Clark says he was against the war, but after numerous appearances on CNN during the war and when thousands of people protested across the country, he never said a damn thing when he had the "podium".

Now for me at least, the IWR: yes vs. no, doesn't matter too much for me.

However, With all these prominent "party leaders" during the conflict failing to call out Bush for what he is doing...I am grateful for the Good Governor and his vocal opposition. With all these "Proud Democrats", why did we need Howard Dean(a fairly unknown political figure) to speak out for us?

Several months ago, I listened to one of the segments on CSPAN "call-in" hour in the morning. The Senate was debating all the provisions and the wasteful spending that the GOP was trying to put in the Supplemental Support bill for Iraq (for exp. the Boeing/KC-135).
John McCain(R) was a vocal critic in many of the provisions for that bill.
a caller on the Democrats line said " I'm ashamed at the Democratic Party that's supposed to represent me. Yet, no other Dems in the Senate are calling this issue out and condemning it. Why do we need John Mccain to represent the Democratic party?"

I don't consider myself a "proud Howard Dean Democrat".

I consider myself a "proud Howard Dean supporter"

But, that's just my opinion.

[teevee99]

16. yes

<i>I consider myself a "proud Howard Dean supporter"</i>

that's a much better way to say it.

[redqueen]

19. Not fair

There were many Dems speaking out against that... the entire Black Caucus if I'm not mistaken.

That caller is uninformed.

Or, maybe they were expecting 'high profile' Dems to speak up. In that case they were pretty on-the-mark.

And people wonder why Dean has such support. Go figure.

[Democrats unite]

20. Thats my whole point!

They want you to think Howard Dean has done it all & he's the only one that cares. Thats Bullshit!

[Moderator]

21. Locking

1. If you start a thread in this forum, you must present your opinion in a manner that is not inflammatory, which respects differences in opinion, and which is likely to lead to respectful discussion rather than flaming. The moderators have the sole authority to decide whether a thread topic is inflammatory.


Thanks,
DU Moderator