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Should Dems "Get Religion"?--or at least set the record straight???

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DemocracyInaction Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:29 AM
Original message
Should Dems "Get Religion"?--or at least set the record straight???
We Dems have been the biggest wussies in standing mute while the right-wing Christian preachermen (like Robertson, Falwell, Graham, etc.) have re-defined Christianity and sold it wholesale to the American people. The result, of course, is the sweeping of Republicans into control of our government. We never stood up once and said "bullshit--their message is the total anthesis of Christianity". So it got me thinking.

I believe this is an essential issue to start hitting head on by the DNC. Why not challenge their "definition" of what Jesus preached and required of those who believed in him (i.e., taking care of the poor/sick/elderly; turning away from strutting around claiming to be holy; the rath against the money changers in the temple; the anti-materialistic focus; living in peace with others, etc.) Why not call out the Falwells/Robertsons and the like and brand them mere tools of corporate America who are living a wealthy, rich life because they have twisted the Gospels to support the greed and lies of corporate control?? Why not point out how they have destroyed all sense of "community" in this country--something Jesus tried to build in the hearts of men??

If the seeds of questioning and doubt are spread out there and some people begin to turn against these con men and return to the fundamentals of the Christian religion, the Republicans will be well on their way to losing control of the mob they need to be elected to anything. We need to very directly take on these manipulators and start realizing how they are the only thing between us and taking back control of this country.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
1. We need a Defense of Faith Act...
...which re-affirms and celebrates the right of Americans to practice any faith they wish. I mean, which Radical RWer will actually go on record OPPOSING the defense of faith??

NGU.


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Nimrod Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. It's a paradox
It's stated outright that in order to properly practice many faiths you must remove the right of freedom of religion from those of other faiths. It's called "conversion" and/or defense of "traditional (barf) Christian (barf) family (barf) values (hack hack cough).

Sorry that last one's a little hard for me to get out sometimes (wipes off keyboard).

The Christian Mafia would definitely oppose such a legislation. They'd say it encourages satanism or some such crapola and suggest just leeeeettle tweaks here and there, ultimately swaying it until it protects only their right to persecute others.

See, that's the problem with anything relating to religion in government. As much as people like to think they're following the One True Faith, there is no such thing except in the eyes of the individual.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
2. Religion as a political tool is a fascist technique. Yes to pointing this
out. No to using religion as a political tool ourselves.

Our best offense is to champion Separation of Church and State which is as American and apple pie and most Americans except for the lunatice fringe right still believe in it.

:dem:
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sarahlee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. Completely agree
Thanks for beating me to it.
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La Femme Donating Member (83 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #2
15. No on Religion
"There are a tremendous number of Christians and "spiritual" people who would vote Democratic if we could show them that our policies truly are closer to what Christianity stands for than the policies of the GOP."

And there are many Democrats that would turn away from a party that started pushing religion. If we need to push anything, it should be our right to choose whether we partake in religious activity. I agree with McCamy Taylor: "No to using religion as a political tool ourselves.Our best offense is to champion Separation of Church and State...."
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
3. Set the Record Straight.
Many Dem's have religion already, the repukes and the radical clerics (Falwell and Robertson) have sold the sheep that you can't be a Christian and Democrat.
It is time we prove to the fundies that we pray too.
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
4. Bingo. (nt)
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:38 AM
Response to Original message
5. Hell no
let God take care of it. Vengence is mine... doesn't the Bible say that? They'll get theirs. Just give it time. It'll be OBVIOUS too. Rememer the first thing Reagan signed into law was to stop the use of aborted fetuses in research to cure diseases like Alzheimer's. Not trying to start a debate about abortion, but the truth is, he did end up with the very disease he didn't care about finding a cure for...It IS something to think about. The irony.

Feeding the poor and loving even the least among us would be a grand glorious thing to see happen, but as long as that bunch of plunderers runs the show, piss on the poor policies will go full steam ahead.
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auburngrad82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
7. Absolutely
The religious right and the GOP has corrupted the christianity in the name of power and politics. True Christianity isn't just about abortion and gay marriage. It's about taking care of the poor, it's about personal morality, ie honesty, and it's about respect for life in all levels. Waging war against a country on false pretenses is not Christian, it is barbaric. Having the highest infant mortality rate of any industrial nation isn't Christian, it's immoral.

The Dems need to start talking about their beliefs and their values. There are a tremendous number of Christians and "spiritual" people who would vote Democratic if we could show them that our policies truly are closer to what Christianity stands for than the policies of the GOP.

If it were not for religious leaders and churches there probably wouldn't have been a Civil Rights Act. Remember, Martin Luther King, Jr was a preacher and the power behind the movement was churches, both black and white.
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BOSSHOG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
8. Do they stone to death people who work on the sabbath
which is in Leviticus, the same place they get their hate of homosexuals? No! Do they clean up their own houses divorce, incest and spousal abuse rates? No! Do they pick and choose in the Bible the passages which justify their own insane actions? Yes! Do they want to replace the constitution with the Bible? Yes! Do they whine about being persecuted when they are obstructed from making such a switcheroo? Yes! Could Falwell, Robertson, Limbaugh, Dobson, Gannon, Hannity etc make a living any other way than hating? No!

I didn't spend 24 years in uniform supporting and defending the bible. And my oath to support the constitution is still in effect. Nothing pisses me off worse than a group of religious zealots wanting to amend that liberal document and use it as a weapon against a bunch of citizens because they read somewhere that homosexuality is an abomination.
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texanshatingbush Donating Member (435 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
9. You've hit the nail on the head !
If we took a poll, would it show that the Dem's tent is more inclusionary than the Repuke's tent?

My gut instinct says it would--that we have more Christians, Buddhists, atheists, Muslims, agnostics, Jews, Hindus, etc. who self-identify as Dems.

This would be important to the new, re-energized Democratic Party, because it would show that the Democratic Party espouses principles which unify, rather than exclude, a broad range of people. And doesn't that offer greater hope for peace and understanding and greater benefit to mankind? As the world becomes more and more a "global village", this would seem important in our relationships with other countries.

The rector of my church has a great bumpersticker on his car:

"God bless everyone.
No exceptions"
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
11. It should be a 'morality' platform
But expanded way beyong abortion and gay marriage.

What about the morality of providing good healthcare, good education and the chance to earn a decent living?

What about the morality of providing for "the lesser among us" which is actually mentioned in the Bible about a hundred times?

What about the morality of telling the truth and staying true to your word? Isn't there a commandment about 'not bearing false witness'?

What about the morality of starting unnecessary wars and killing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians?

It's time to present the true meaning of the word "morality" back to the people.

There. I've said it.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 10:48 AM
Response to Original message
12. The biggest problem is language barriers...
Too many times, even on this board, people equate Religion with Christianity, or People of Faith with Fundlementalist Christians. Both of these types of comparisons are not true. Many people are members of the Democratic Party because of their religious beliefs, not in spite of them. Many people cannot and will not separate their core values, whether anchored by a belief in the Supernatural or the Natural, with their political beliefs, this is not wrong as long as it is not taken past the personal or religious community level.

To give an example in my religion, Wicca, we believe in many things, but parts of the core as far as human relations go, we are not exclusive, i.e. we do not believe that other religions are wrong for the people that follow them, we believe that religion is personal, and true for the person in question. Whether Christian or Buddhist, Muslim or Hindu, Atheist or Deist, it doesn't matter what my neighbors believe, as long as we are polite to each other. So what motive would we have to legislate our religion into the public square, what motive do I have for destroying Church and State separation? Our religion has no inhibitions when it comes to Homosexuality, in fact, entire covens may be of homosexual members only. Not to mention their are no rules against handfastings of homosexual members, I'm sure quite a few Wiccan Clergy have done so. So What is the motive for supporting the Federal Marriage Amendment? The same goes for both race and sex, we have Priestesses as well as Priests, equality is a core tenant as well. So with these core beliefs laid out, which political party do you really think someone like me feels more welcomed in?

BTW: Just a little disclaimer, we have our nutballs too, just so you know, and these are beliefs I got out of the religion, what I believe are part of its core values in human relations, other trads, like the Dianics, and some others, well...the mileage may vary, so to speak. :)
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DemocracyInaction Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Solon---I realize that in my original post I'm speaking strictly of
Christianity and for a reason. The massive movement in this country that has put these Republican scum into office was done by the CHRISTIAN right. Thus I feel that the tenants of Christianity are the ones that need to be callled out and addressed. The other religious beliefs (or lack of them) have not created this massive movement that has demonized the Democrats and foisted a totally, totally corrupt view of what the man, Jesus, preached. It's time to make inroads into that brainwashing that has been foisted on the American people by these right-wing preacher con-men. It's time to expose them and make their minions perhaps think about how they are 'interpreting' the Gospels and whether it even remotely resembles what the little guy from Galilee was trying to get across. This is the religion that needs to be addressed and challenged in this country because it has been turned into a dangerous and perverted thing from it's original message. I hope that addresses why I chose to stress "Christianity".
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Festivito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
14. Separation's wrong emphasis exacerbates Religious Right's fear.
Many Democrats are religious, and do not allow the right-wing religious operatives speak for them. But, how does one speak louder than a radio or TV station. One cannot.

One problem I see is putting Separation of C&S as the law instead of the test of success or our laws. This placement leads to a line -- not a wall -- of separation that becomes rediculous, making fodder for Republican zealots who convince followers they are being attacked. And when they are not happy, because they are being attacked, that wall Jefferson wanted starts to crumble, not strengthen, not widen.

Atheists also feel attacked, and they ARE BEING ATTACKED. But, if we want a country where religious practice is free, we have to put up the the inconvenience, re-legislate, or move.
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
16. Old Testament Christian quoting fundies need to read 2 Corinthians 3:3-18
settingthe record straight here on this issue....


The old covenant engraved on stone kills.... while the new covenant engraved by the Spirit on hearts brings life.

...these fundie bible thumpers and misinformed old testament qouting death culters need to have the veils lifted from their eyes.


2 Corinthians 3:3-18

3 Clearly you are a letter of Christ which I have delivered, a letter written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh in the heart.
4 This great confidence in God is ours, through Christ. 5 it is not that we are entitled of ourselves to take credit for anything. Our sole credit is from God, 6 who has made us qualified ministers of a New Covenant not of written law engraved in stone but of the Spirit. The written law kills, but the Spirit gives life.

7 If the ministry of death, carved on stone, was inaugurated with such glory that the Israelites could not look on Moses' face because of the glory that shone on it (even though it was a fading glory), 8 how much more greater will be the glory of the ministry of the Spirit? 9 If the ministry of the convenant that condemned had glory, greater by far is the glory that justifies and brings life. 10 Indeed, when you compare that limited glory with this surpassing glory, the former should be declared no glory at all. 11 If what was destined to pass away was given glory, greater by far is the glory that endures.

12 Our hope being such, we act with full confidence. 13 We are not like Moses, who used to hide his face with a veil so that the Israelites could not see the final fading of that glory. 14 Their minds, of course were dulled. To this very day, when the old covenant is read the veil remains unlifted; it is only in Christ that it is taken away. 15 Even now, when Moses is read a veil covers their understanding. 16 But whenever he turns to the Lord, the veil will be removed. 17 The Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 18 All of us, gazing on the Lord's glory with unveiled faces, are being transformed from glory to glory into his very image by the Lord who is the Spirit.



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Hidden Stillness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
17. Our American Heritage
Democrats need to re-introduce people to something they used to know just from living in this society before the vast corporate takeover silenced us all, and that is the great, middle-of-the-road, (actually liberal), gentle and tolerant but principled Protestant Christianity, that is today considered not only a threat, but a haven for totally stupid assholes. I blame Republicans for this lie, and I believe they will pay a price for all this. I am of a type that loves Walt Whitman, the Transcendentalists of the mid-1800s and etc. (Emerson, Thoreau, Margaret Fuller, Theodore Parker, etc.), the great William James and the classic book "The Varieties of Religious Experience" and many others. I love that era because it is somewhat similar to our own--same kind of disillusioned searching, corporate criminality, etc. There also used to be a kind of liberal religious thought that was popular during the '30s and '40s--their books actually sold well--like Harry Emerson Fosdick, Lin Yutang (who I was thrilled to learn years ago my Mom read during the '40s), and others; unmistakeably liberals, Christians. It used to be common.
Just to further this thought a little, the following are two posts of mine that tell this attitude pretty well--what I think this certain Christian attitude is, what I think God might really think of the prick Bush, etc. The first was a poem that was actually my first post here, where it sank without a trace--BAM!--I don't know if anybody even read it; the second was a message I posted at another website under another name. I apologize if anyone has already read either one.



"Bushie's Little Christmas New Year"


So we welcome the new, with the same old fear,
Because of course, Bush is still here.
We live in a dream world, led by a fake,
Are we all hypnotized; not awake?

-----------------------

Santa brought Bush a gift, as you know;
Stole another one--two in a row!
Republicans brimming with gifts, like elves,
Ohio vote numbers they made up themselves.

So now, regardless, the deed was done,
The media handled, the election "won";
But for every promise Bush fails to keep
The people now just fall asleep.

A while ago, at any rate,
A crisis was coming, and it would be great;
"Where is Bush?" they were heard to say,
"On vacation--we like it that way."

An army of the poor had come to call
Up to the White House and straight down the hall;
They asked what became of that campaign vow:
"Where are your Christian morals now?"

Bush's staff thought they were servants or peons,
They hadn't talked to their like in eons:
"What do I say?" one of them fretted,
"These aren't contributors; who had them vetted?"

The people told of their terrible plight,
Family farms destitute, urban blight;
The old now threatened, the young who never had,
"For us, your economy is always bad."

"We are not helped by stocks, up or down,
"The words 'tort reform' are the words of a clown;
"Tax cuts won't help us, subsidies too,
"Because we have nothing, and they all go to you."

Their accusations, their cries for relief,
Began to annoy the Repub Corporate Chief.
"These people were fun when they cheered me on cue,
"But now the servants tell ME what to do??"

Finally, Rich Boy had had quite enough,
"You welfare queens think you have it tough?"
"You try to embarrass me with all these displays,
"Why don't you turn in your 401Ks?"

"If you have these problems, sell off your yachts,
"You think you have problems--I have lots."
Then Repubs started pushing them all out the door;
These little peons were not fun anymore.

"What do the poor know about God's will?
"Whatever they want, I want to kill."
None understood what was the fuss,
"You claim you want Jesus--you voted for us."

Then the whole group came back to their senses,
Remember our pose, our attacks, our defenses.
"How can we use this against them," Bush thinks;
Call them "liberals," "whiners," "they drives when they drinks"?

"Let's skip that last one," one of them said,
"Especially when driving makes some end up dead."
"We'll search all their records, we'll dig up some dirt,
"As the Lord God permits us to fight when we're hurt."

As the privileged demons prepared their attack,
Something new had called them back.
The media learned of the incident here;
Those brown-nose corporate crawlers--they're nothing to fear.

The media grilled Bush as they have all along:
"You were right, weren't you Georgie, and they were all wrong?"
Then Bush asked an aide advice on how to seem sincere,
"Give a pinch to your cheek--it'll force out a tear."

Oh what a laugh, the oppressor on top;
Hauls out the Bible, to use as a prop.
The same winners win, the same losers lose,
But who do you fool, when thus you abuse?

------------------

I dreamt I had a dream that night,
Little Bushie's toughest fight.
A real punishment for a real crime;
No Daddy to bail you out this time.

To the dark Other side, get there with a push,
And meet at last the Lord; surprise--it wasn't Bush!
"The punishment you give will be given to you,
"Because you are a sinner, too."

A long line precedes you, so wait at the end,
What have you made of yourself, "Friend"?
Your Party is now the rich, who acquire,
And I know your faith to be that of a liar.

Laughing, partying, your spirit left to rot,
"But I was hungry, and ye fed me not."
You put on an act, have a photo-op here
But there the picture is totally clear.

The powerful arrayed against those who can't fight,
Total oppression this long dark night.
Halliburton, Cheney, GE and more,
Kenneth Starr, WalMart, every kind of whore.

Plotting, planning, stabbing, slashing,
Here is where you belong.
And listen now to the pain of your victims,
Where once, laughing, you sang along.

I ordered you to "Feed my sheep,"
"Give away your riches."
You mouthed the words and took the credit,
Then like a light, it switches.

A slogan, a mask, a campaign tactic,
Pretending to know God's holy pain.
The only visions you ever had
Were from your mounds of cocaine.

You were winning now, on the attack,
Mouthing words straight from that device on your back,
But wait, don't worry, it will come true,
Someday the world will all judge you.

You trick and you fool and do all your research,
No judge can stop you, on corrupt Earth.
And like a rich boy you always get by,
But wait, bastard sinner; when you die....



"Real Christians, Fake Christians"


Every now and then, Republicans become so power-mad, criminal and
corrupt, that they go insane, start ripping up and destroying
everything, and have to be stopped. They did it with Teapot Dome,
causing and then not addressing the Depression, starting the Viet Nam
war (Eisenhower sent the first "advisors"), Watergate, Iranscam, the
Iranian election/coup of 1954, El Salvadoran death squads of the
1980s, building up both Saddam Hussein and bin Laden, on and on and
on, until the present day of nothing but corruption. Nothing,
though, equals the sin they have commited by twisting and then
killing the actual meaning of Christianity, remaking it as their own
corporate brand-name product, just so they can win elections and the
battle of propaganda. It was as if they had the self-delusional gall
to think that they could stand at the Gates of Heaven and block us
all from going in. Since they can't, they sell "Christianity"® as an
aggressive ad campaign to smear us with. They are poisoning the real
Christianity and making it so ugly and repugnant to people, that it
may never recover its true message that "there is room for everyone
at the table."

When I was a teenager, like a lot of people I drifted away from
religion, eventually becoming an atheist. I was disgusted at the
hypocrites who pretended to be religious, sanctimonious yet cold to
real suffering, I was sick of hearing their archcon bigotry masking
as "tradition," and I was repulsed by the sickening, stale, "dead to
the living world" atmosphere of mainstream Christianity. It seemed
like a social club where I did not fit. For years, I went on,
considering it a relic of male oppression, and ignored it. I got
their bigoted presumptions out of my mind and went on. At some
point, though, I re-read the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 5, 6, and
7); I had remembered it as really brilliant, and wondered if it still
was. It was like a whole new world, and a new religion. Every line
was beautiful and deep poetry, and I kept reading it over and over,
and thinking. I was still an atheist, but this was completely moving
me. Gradually I became a Christian again, but with all the learned-
crap removed, from my earlier rebellion, I approached it wanting to
learn what it really was. It was now as if I were alone with the
real teaching, trying to understand it, and did not have to resent
anybody else's characterization of it. I later learned, by studying
a more mystical Christianity, that this "going away from crowds" and
forgetting the worldly way, to approach God with your own sincere,
cleared mind, is a time-honored way of seekers. I read things about
how Jesus can easily be considered a feminist, a socialist friend of
the poor, a troublemaker, an anti-capitalist, all by referring to
ordinary Bible quotes, and I realized for the first time that this
religion was a friend to me, too. If I had only considered it a
bastion of conservative thought and rhetoric, I never would've
approached it as it really is.

This is why I hate Republicans so much, for what they knowingly do.
They claim abortion is condemned by God, yet it is never referred to
in the Bible, (and yes, they had herbally-induced abortions then). I
even learned that for the first few hundred years, early Christians
did not believe a baby had a soul until about the third month of
life, and that baptisms were done later for that reason, to protect
it only when it was there. If a baby died before then, it was
considered totally non-existent by God. Further, St. Augustine
always wondered whether the soul of each human being was taken from
the total All-Soul, or was individually created anew by God for each
one; and was never able to answer it. These are deep, searching
questions we might do well to approach with some humility, and along
come these obnoxious, blathering Repubs "telling us what the facts
are." They condemn homosexuality, yet Jesus never refers to it. For
all their Damning to Hell, though, they can never manage to find the
reams upon reams of quotes from Jesus condemning rich people for
keeping their wealth and not giving it to the poor. This only
confirms my opinion yet again: when I seek religious guidance, the
first place I go is to rich, corporate oil executives.

Their biggest sin, though, is not merely being hypocrites, which we
all are; it is to rip up the Christian message for all, so that it
makes archconservative corporate Republicans win elections. This
proves that these people are not really religious at all, since that
is not their focus; that they do not care about each one's
mystical/moral relationship with God, but are only concerned about
what your political opinions are, and that they will exploit anything
to win. There is a passage in the Bible, (Matthew 12: 31-32), about
how you can sin against and blaspheme God, Jesus, and all else, and
it will be forgiven, but to blaspheme against the Holy Ghost "shall
not be forgiven...neither in this world, neither in the world to
come." The Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit is generally taken to mean the
truth or meaning of things; the light, and the way to get there,
etc. These Republicans are destroying the understandable
instructions of Jesus and the Apostles, that we can learn by, all so
they can fuck around with the advertised perceptions of things. They
want religious terminology injected into the political discourse?
How's this, Repubs? Burn in Hell.




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CatholicEdHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
18. Here is a College Republican article
in the U of MN newspaper with Religion and Democrats. He bases his thesis that unless the Dems follow the religious right on abortion and gay marriage, they will be seen as all talk and no actions.

http://www.mndaily.com/articles/2005/02/14/63245

"The statement should sound familiar, as Kerry commonly conveyed the same sentiment. The stance coincides with now-Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean’s call for liberals to begin accepting pro-life Democrats into the party ranks. Similarly, few Democratic leaders have actually said they personally endorse gay marriage (likely confident the Supreme Court will do their bidding).

The problem with strategy is that it’s superficial. Religious voters are not stupid voters and can glean that no authentic change has been made. The shift appears to be disingenuous, pragmatic and a pure product of political calculus. For Christian voters who see many moral issues in black and white, the religious rhetoric sounds like nothing more than politicians talking out of both sides of their mouth. A senator’s 100 percent NARAL Pro-Choice America voting record will always be difficult to reconcile with her religious rhetoric, no matter how many times God is mentioned.

In sum, even the most powerful rhetoric cannot change voting records. Moreover, softening on issues that are moral imperatives for Christians is futile. Softening does not equal change. The abortion of innocent, defenseless and unborn life will never be an issue that Christians can balance away against other important moral issues. Likewise, gay marriage will always be directly contrary to God’s design and biblical order.

Pornography will never be a form of speech with redeeming value, and the stifling of public religious expression will always sound like a threat to religious liberty. No amount of smooth talking or softening on morally black and white issues will change where the Democratic Party stands on key social issues. In the end, only a real shift to the right will save the left.

Bryan Freeman welcomes comments at bfreeman@mndaily.com. "
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Lindacooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
19. Jesus was a bleeding-heart liberal.
And these fundie 'Christians', supposedly followers of Christ, totally ignore what he said. Yes, the left wing needs to take back Christianity. Jesus was all about helping the poor, feeding the hungry, NOT judging, NOT loudly proclaiming your 'faith' in public, loving each other, and turning the other cheek.

Doesn't exactly sound like the christo-facists who are always sounding off, does it?
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