PREDICT THE 2008 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES!

[Comicstripper]

Who will run!? Who will get the nomination!? Who will be their running mate? Who's gonna WIN!? (Who cares!?) SPECULATE!

GOP Primary Candidates
Sen. Bill Frist
Sen. Chuck Hagel
Gov. Bill Owens

.....................Ticket: Frist/Owens

Democratic Primary Candidates
Sen. Hillary Clinton
Gov. Tom Vilsack
Sen. Evan Bayh
Gov. Mark Warner
Sen. Russell Feingold
Gov. Bill Richardson
(?*Gen. Wes Clark*?)

....................Ticket: 1)Clark/Clinton
____________________OR (If Clark Doesn't Run)
............................2)Clinton/Bayh

Winner:
1)Clark/Clinton.....2:1

2)Clinton/Clark.....1:1

3)Frist/Owens.......1:2


*Analysis*--A Clark/Clinton ticket would most likely beat any GOP ticket that did not feature John McCain as the presidential candidate. Given McCain's age, I don't predict a run for him. I excluded Giuliani as well, because although he is seriously flirting (dare I say...cheating with?) the idea, I think he'll run for Hillary's seat, as the GOP will be trying to derail her presidential ambitions. Giuliani might fly with the New York Republican Party, but the more conservative base will let him know he is NOT wanted in 2008.
Depending on Hillary's status in 2007, I think it's pretty clear she wants the nomination. However, the sensible part of her may tell her to negotiate a VP slot (As in, "Hey, Wes, I'll endorse and campaign for you if you, uh...put me on your ticket...Bill, too.") She's a smart lady, she knows she may not be able to win a nationwide election.
Clark is our best hope and a shoo-in should he get the nod. His Southern background and military credentials will help him turn several pink states blue, and he'll have no trouble keeping every one of Kerry's states, as well.
As for Frist/Owens--not enough charisma. The GOP is getting cocky, they're going to play it bland come 2008.

Any thoughts? Comments? Questions? Suggestions? I put a lot of work into this, please everybody toss in your two cents ( a few kicks would be nice as well...)

-Comicstripper

[Comicstripper]

1. Kick

For myself...

[Catch22Dem]

2. I like your analysis

It's really not bad at all. Quite good actually. What about Condi? You left her out, and I wouldn't.

I'm hoping Clark gives it another try.

[chemteacher]

3. Owens may be out of it for GOP...

Some of the dirt in Colorado is that a local alternative paper is sitting on the photos of Gov. BO fooling around...That is what caused him to split with his wife.

[serryjw]

69. I agree

I live in Cap Hill. I don't think Owens is in politics at all. The word from a reliable source is he will not live out his term. He doesn't want to work with a dems legislature...There maybe a 'love child', he has too many skeltons and his wife hates politics.

[saltpoint]

4. Edwards or Clark win in the Iowa Caucuses. Next --

-- Evan Bayh wins in New Hampshire (he skips Iowa).

Clinton drops out, unable to raise money. General Clark, and Senators Edwards and Bayh duke it out in South Carolina. Edwards noses ahead of Clark in the last two days and becomes the nominal front-runner.

In the end, we nominate an Edwards - Clark ticket.

The lying deceitful ethically monstrous corpse-fucking Republicans nominate THE CAT BUTCHER, who fiendishly picks Tim Pawlenty for veep to try to steal blue Minnesota.

It doesn't work. Edwards & Clark are both southerners and Frist is discovered by voters to be a mealy-mouthed cat-butchering asshole.

Democrats win.

[Yupster]

27. "Cinton unable to raise money"

Oh that's rich. A good hearty laugh.

[saltpoint]

32. Hearty now, less hearty after she loses in Iowa and in --

-- New Hampshire.

No one in South Carolina is going to give money or support to Hillary Clinton if she can't win in either of the first two primaries.

They might not be willing to give money or support to her even if she does.

[WI_DEM]

43. Bayh being from the midwest would compete in Iowa

and he would probably do quite well there.

[saltpoint]

55. Hi, Wi_Dem. Bayh is showing some spunk this year --

-- with his votes on the Senate floor. (I wasn't too hogwild about him right after 9/11, but he seems to be re-focusing or something). Anyway, I think some people are counting him out and that might be a mistake.

Is Senator Kohl running for re-election? I hope he does, and I hope Tommie doesn't challenge him. Would love to keep that seat blue.

Do what you can!

[independentchristian]

52. Edwards wins Iowa

Clark and Clinton won't even factor in there.

The issue of 2008 will be "recovery" after the Bush disaster, and they are going to be looking for an empathetic candidate who is focused on jobs and poverty, not a general or a seemingly, inconsiderate, opportunist like Hillary. Hey, that's what a lot of people see when they see Hillary. They recognize her because of Bill, but they don't see anything particularly special about "her" qualities.

[saltpoint]

56. There's a group of good folks adding the name of --

-- Senator Lincoln (http://www.lincoln2008.com) to the mix.

I realize it's very early, but I think Senator Lincoln might outpoll Senator Clinton. In Iowa especially.

But I agree with you -- I think Edwards has strong appeal in Iowa and if he runs, he'll not be easy to shove aside.

[genius]

5. Dennis Kucinich, who was almost completely unknowns through most

of the 2004 primaries found his popularity souring towards the end of the primary season. He received the second most votes for President on the floor of the convention. While some people say a good man like Dennis doesn't stand a chance in a war of cutthroats, Dennis has become a national hero to those looking for an alternative to business as usual. Unlike 2004, Democrats are keeping track of voting records. In the voting ratings chart, Senators are doing very badly but Dennis is up at the top of the House chart. Dennis will emerge as the nominee but the question is whether there will be an election. Bush has been so obvious with his Nazi cabinet that he could think he could get away with calling off the election. If it is held, it will be a hoax. Bush will not be ready to step down and will either overturn the 22nd Amendment or call off the election.

[genius]

6. No Senator can win unless his/her voting record improves.

http://patrickhenrythinktank.org/sen-scores.html

However, a number of House members have a good shot.

http://patrickhenrythinktank.org/house-scores.html

[Laura PourMeADrink]

7. Female Perspective: Frist has not one iota of sex appeal. He

is pale, whimpy, and creepy looking. His politics stink too. No way he could win. Hooray !

[Comicstripper]

25. Male Bisexual Perspective:

You're right!

[elsiesummers]

37. Frist looks like a corpse - that's why he won't be their nominee.

I don't think we can get that lucky. Pubs may suck but they aren't fools - they'll put up someone more appealing (My bets are on Jeb Bush or George Allen).

[Laura PourMeADrink]

40. George Allen is almost like a B** look-alike. Dopey

[Donna Zen]

8. Add Mitt Romney to the GOP list.

Romney just started his fourth PAC, this one is dedicated to his presidential bid.

Clark can beat McCain.

[Comicstripper]

22. Thanks for reminding me

I knew I was missing a candidate...

[ClarkUSA]

9. If Scott Ritter is right about Bush planning a three-front war w/Iran,

Iraq and Afghanistan, and possibly another one with Syria before 2008, then I think we'd do well to nominate the most bulletproof wartime leader we have against their wartime leader choice.

I hope Wes Clark decides to give it a shot. I know if the world is going to hell in a handbasket, he will.

[LeftyLizzie]

10. Kerry

I think he'll run again, or at least he's acting like it now . . . But I'm wide open as to the nominee. So many things could happen between now and then, it's like I don't even want to think that far ahead, only to concentrate on what's right in front of us. Though it is always good to keep the future in the back of one's mind . . .

[ArtVandaley]

11. Feingold/Richardson

nt

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[O.M.B.inOhio]

13. A GOP candidate who's more distant from Bush

By 2008, the disaster that is the Shrub (p)Residency may be beyond the ability of even the Red state Rednecks to deny. So when we're ready to bash Bush, they may have somebody who can say, "That was Georgie. I'm a Reagan conservative."

For the Dems, how about Edwards / Oprah? (joke)

[googly]

14. Hillary Vs Liz Dole in 2008....you heard it here n/t

[Comicstripper]

24. Wouldn't that be something?

Lizzie's too old, I'm afraid.

[googly]

26. Yeah she is kinda old but younger than when Reagan got elected

but anyways how old is Liz Dole?

[ZootSuitGringo]

15. I'll go for Clark/Clinton

or Clark/Warner

or Clark/Feingold

Clinton as a VP makes more sense than as Presidential candidate.

Warner as VP would bring his resume in National Security up to par for a 2016 run.

Feingold as VP makes sense, as he would not win at top of the ticket. Can be painted easily too as weak on National Defense.

[Tony_FLADEM]

16. It will be George Allen vs. Evan Bayh

Evan Bayh will win in a close election.

[Stevepol]

17. It will make no difference who runs, just as I predicted for 04.

The Dem will get the most votes but the machines will give the election to whoever the Repub candidate happens to be. I suspect Chuck Hagel. He'll have all kds of confidence since there's no way his own former company is going let him get un-elected in NE. But Judas Iscariot could win if he ran as a Repub or a green turtle. It wdn't matter. The machines are rigged for the Repubs and a Dem stands no chance now or ever until the machines are audited w/ hand-counted paper ballots, required audits.

[politicasista]

18. Sorry, too early for me

:shrug:

[Comicstripper]

21. I like this...

I'm with you. Really I am. 2006 comes first.
I just get such a kick out of the GAME of politics, I like to test my instincts sometimes!

[many a good man]

19. HRC, Clark, Feinstein, and Edwards

What an interesting field! I can't wait to see who the Iowans and Granite Staters pick to be our nominee. I think it all depends on what kind of state we find ourselves in the winter of '07:

* national security meltdown
--> Clark

* economic meltdown, Iraq out of mainstream consciousness
--> Feinstein or Edwards

* total societal breakdown
--> HRC

So I guess I have to go with Clinton, especially after she denounces gay marriage and pledges to stay the course in Iraq.

My two cents: don't even think about VP; it has no significant effect on elections any more. People only vote for the top of the ticket.

You're right, McCain's too old. But Hagel scares me. If the failures get pinned on ** instead of whole GOP, Hagel would emerge as the "sane" anti-Bush Republican alternative. He could run against the **-Cheney legacy and still represent "solid" conservative values.

Do you really think HRC would consent to playing second fiddle again?

[Comicstripper]

23. I think she might

if she doesn't think she can win as...first fiddle.
She's a smart lady, and not so old that she couldn't run after a term or two as VP.

[zulchzulu]

20. No mention of Kerry means this thread is bullshit

Wes ain't gettin' it, Edwards ain't either...

[Yupster]

28. My tries

Hillary/ Richardson

vs

McCain/ Kay Bailey Hutchison

[saltpoint]

33. Your GOP ticket would be tough to beat.

[JHBowden]

29. Warner-Bayh or Clinton-Bayh

I think Owens will get the nomination for the Republicans, and will probably pick a national security person for VP.

[B0S0X87]

30. you give Frist too much credit

That guy makes Gore look like Tom Jones when it comes to charisma.

[saltpoint]

34. LOL. It's true. Frist is unforgivably dull.

But then I think back on Dole and Bush, Sr., and realize the GOP has nominated a lot of dull-assed people in its time.

[Awsi Dooger]

31. If those are odds at the end, you've got Frist/Owens as a heavy favorite

1:2 is an odds-on favorite, 2 chances in 3 of victory. It's like Smarty Jones in the Belmont last year; he was roughly 2/5, not 5/2.

When the first number is lower than the second, theoretically the result is more likely than not to happen.

[Comicstripper]

47. My odds work differently

shut up, that's why.... ;-)

[elsiesummers]

35. I think the Pub ticket will be Jeb Bush/Allen.

I think Hagel will play the Republican role of McCain/2000 in 2008.

Dems:

Running: Hillary, Kerry, Edwards, Clark, maybe Richardson, maybe Bayh, maybe Biden, maybe Vilsack, maybe Finegold, maybe maybe Warner, maybe Boxer.

Ticket: Hillary/_____

I don't see anyone with the star power to trump Hillary (guessing) though I certainly hope the race has some surprises. Edwards has more star power than most, Biden more experience; Bayh is articulate but dull.

So for veep: Richardson, Bayh, Edwards, Warner - in that order. I'm choosing veep picks Richardson and Bayh on the basis of possible voting blocks and fundraising ability, Edwards on star power/stumping ability/overall appeal and Warner on trying to turn VA Dem (a longshot with Hillary at ticket top - a lot of motivated Hillary haters in VA).

That said - I'll probably support Edwards or Biden for the primary cause I have to go with superior rhetoric, charm and charisma.

Wildcard: I'd like to see Ed Rendell get in - I think he'd be an interesting/unusual and surprisingly strong candidate - sort of a macho take no prisoners guy (like Dean) but with a relentlessly positive campaign style, New Dem creds (swingvoters) but solid core Dem values (party base).

[ZootSuitGringo]

36. Wow, Biden? Now that's a jerk if I ever smelled one, and

you'll go with Edwards on star power/stumping ability/overall appeal???

His convention speech sucked. His overall appeal didn't help the Dem ticket during the most important election in our lifetime, against the worst president and worst still vice president in all of history. His star power was severely and agressively heralded and propagandized and still he didn't quite sell. The man won no primaries other than his birth state. The media kept showing him smiling, and kissing babies, and his fingers in the air, to no avail.

So I realized what the Corporate media kept telling us that we should like Edwards. I just never saw "it".

[elsiesummers]

38. I liked Edwards enough that I slept on a gym floor to work for him in Iowa

Yeah I think he has a lot to offer.

As for star power/appeal - this is why I think he may be a possible (3rd place on my list) veep pick - not why I supported him.

I really like that Edwards talks about economics but in human terms. In the last campaign I was so sick of hearing anything about the war that I could not stand either the pro or anti war candidates. Edwards focussed less on the war and more on domestic issues than the other candidates, so he reached me when the other candidates turned me off.

Edit - I give you that Biden does seem like sort of a jerk - but he also can argue circles around an opponent - not a bad trait in a pres candidate. I don't think Delaware helps us anymore than Massachuetts did last time - so that is the big problem with Biden.

[Hippo_Tron]

39. Everybody seems to be hyping up Frist as the choice of Bush and Rove

But perhaps Frist is only their fall guy so that they can make the "washington outsider" emerge to victory over Frist. I'm sure that they've promised that Frist will at least get the VP nod, though, otherwise he wouldn't retire from the Senate.

[ABaker]

41. I think that

Republicans:

Rice/Frist

Reason: Cheney is going to resign next year and Rice will take his place as VP.

Frist is a darling of the Republican base.

Democrats:
Clinton/Richardson

Reason: The Clintons have a lot of power and a lot of money. Many Democrats would not have been elected without their help. Thus, they "owe" the Clintons. If Hillary runs, everyone else will step aside to "pay their debt" to the Clintons.

Richardson is very qualified and very popular in the south.

[WI_DEM]

42. likely democrats running: Clinton, Clark, Bayh, Edwards, Kerry

Richardson and maybe Biden.

likely nominees: either Hillary Clinton or Evan Bayh.

likely Republicans running:
McCain
Frist
Romney
Hagel


the toughest GOP ticket would be McCain/Hagel or Hagel/McCain.

[elsiesummers]

45. Don't agree that McCain/Hagel (or vvs) would be tough...

I don't think it's a likely ticket for the Republicans and not a way for them to turn out their base. The current Republican party will have at least one member of the ticket from the South. (Jeb, Frist, Allen, for example). Second, they will have at least one member on the ticket who speaks the Christian Right lingo - which McCain/Hagel cannot fulfill.

I don't think either McCain or Hagel will be allowed withing sneezing distance of the Pub ticket, but maybe the ticket top will be so Christian Right that they will seek some sort of so called centrist/moderating influence of McCain or Hagel (highly unlikely).

[itcfish1]

44. Chuck Hagel?

Isnt he Part owner of a voting machine company?

[quiet_please]

46. A question...

I don't disagree with your analysis, but I am not sure that Vilsack is that well known outside of Iowa, is he?

[Comicstripper]

48. No, he isn't

but Bill Clinton wasn't that well-known either. Neither was Carter.
More than anything, I just think he wants to run. No one surrenders their governorship unless they're planning something bigger (which Vilsack is)...
Plus, he was supposedly one of Kerry's "Top Three" VP candidates...

[quiet_please]

50. Well

that is true, and I hadn't thought about it. It would seem that when we win back the WH, it is going to be with a moderate midwest gov.

At least that is my opinion. I am open to alternatives!

[hughee99]

49. A good analysis, but...

I have a hard time believing that, even though it may be a good ticket either way, either Clinton or Clark would be willing to take the VP slot. I think for either one of them, if their name's not on the top of the ticket, their name won't be on it at all. I could see either one taking a political appointment afterwords (Sec. Defense (Clark), Sec. of State (Clark or Clinton)) but I don't think we'll see either one running for Veep. I could see Bayh, Vilsack or Richardson as a VP candidate, though.

[Donna Zen]

51. MSM pushing Hillary all day today

CrossFire just did a Hillary v Condi piece. Hillary will lose. Ya know that doncha? Nothing against Hillary, even though she usually votes on the big issues contrary to my beliefs, but America is burned out on the Clintons.

[MattG]

53. agree with Donna Zen

Nobody likes Hilary, nobody.

They could run satan himself (obviously BEING satan, name and all) and people would still be like hmmmmm... I dont know who to vote for.


No Hillary, I dont know how many times I've said it; but-NO-F'IN-HILLARY-EVER!!!

[unblock]

62. but would she really lose to rice??

sorry, but i have a very tough time believing that republicans are going to line up in droves to vote for a black woman.

i think running condi is a good way to lower republican turnout, no matter how much they hate hillary.

for this reason, i think republicans will never nominate rice. they just want the story out there to further remove themselves from the bigot image. but they'll never let it actually happen. don't worry, though, they'll throw their bigots some red meat at some point, even if it is coded.

[Sonora Nora]

54. why not shake it up?

Clinton/Obama


Jebus/Condi

[pdxmom]

57. I think Mitt Romney is going to be pushing hard

for the GOP nomination. No question about that. The campaign has already started and he's working to the right of Bush.

[John_H]

58. here's how the GOP primary will go:

McCain
Frost
Owens
Hegel
Some crackpot like Ash croft or Delay
Giuliani?
Powell?

Owens gets a lot of good press in the beginning, but leaves early after not being able to overcome the name recognition of the other candidates.

Hegel and McCain will get real interesting after NH" McCain will try to cut a deal w/ Hegel because Hegel will be siphoning McCain's maverick/I-love-the-war-hero vote. The white house will try to help Hegel stay in for the same reason since they want to help...

Frist who will have the party backing. Even the dumbest rethug in america can see he's as interesting as watching paint dry, but Chimp will be running an anybody but McCain campaign from day one.

I predict Frist will be the nominee no matter what. McCain just won't have the juice to thwart the chimp/RNC dirty tricks.

Frist will pick either Hegel (if that's what they promise him to keep him in the race long enough to kill off McCain), or some northern governor.

If Giuliani runs, he and Frist will wage an ugly battle until nearly the very end with Frist as the "safe" choice and Giuliani as the sentimental contender who has too much baggage(cancer, adultery, etc.) Frist will win.

If Powell runs he's the nominee and probably the next president.

[Shredr]

59. Hillary vs. Condi

If they can't Ammend the Constitution in time to allow the Governator to run, I'll bet they'll throw Condi up there. Repukes'll vote for her just because they're drones and then they'll accuse us of being racist and sexist for knocking her.

[quiet_please]

60. I don't think they

will get the Constitution amended to let ASs run. There are too many out there that do NOT support that. Even some of my right wing friends are opposed to it.

[Auntie Bush]

67. Please to welcome you quiet.

[sellitman]

61. Repuke Voting Machines 1 --- Dems ---0

Fix the machines first. This argument is just silly until then. When will you all get it? We will NEVER win another election unless the machines get fixed.

NEVER!!!!!!

[napi21]

63. You're missing Santorum on the Pub side!

With all his fighting for face time in the media, you can be sure he's after the nomination.

As to the Dem ticket, I really do think it's way too soon to tell. I think Joe Biden is going to give it another shot, but I'm still hoping there will be some Governor out there who none of us recognizes right now that will take the lead.

We can also always hope for some RW nut to get out there and run as an independant and split the Pug ticket!

[IronLionZion]

64. That piece of shit better be unemployed by then

it would look pathetic for him to run for president after losing his Senate seat to Bob Casey Jr.

[napi21]

66. Oh boy, I hope you're right! I don't live in PA anymore, but he is

really bad! The problem is that the followers he has are very loyal! I heard the party was trying to convince Bob Casey to run against him in 2006. Has he announced a decision? I think Casey has a very strong shot at winning!!!!

[IronLionZion]

70. Casey, Hafer, Hoeffel, and some other people are speculating

Casey would just destroy him in the most humiliating way since he's a very popular Catholic pro-lifer. There are others in the running but I can't remember them. This should make for an interesting primary.

All the Dems have to do is support their candidate. Seriously, we can beat Santorum if we just put our petty shit aside and work together.

[Chomp]

65. Double change in constitution...early 2007

...GW Bush stays on.

Dick retires.

Arnie comes in as VP.

Arnie coronated '12.

Jeb in as VP.

Arnie again in '16.

Jeb stays as VP.

Jeb inherits big one '20.

Genna as VP.

etc...

[Donna Zen]

68. Thinking thinking

Romney/Condi

Why? Because Romney is from a blue state...very clean... and comes off as moderate. Also, he has huge connections in the SW, an area where Dems have been making some strides. Condi makes the republicans look progressive even though she is a person with no core values.

Either way it cuts into the Dem base. Romney doesn't really need strong foreign policy credentials because the brand name republican assumes that he is strong, Condi covers that anyway.

The other alternative is Frist...their guy, but does not increase the geographic appeal.
^^^^^^^^^^^^

Last summer I was told by someone inside the Richardson camp that he would not be running as the vp because the plan called for a Hillary/Richardson ticket in 2008. So far, my sources info is holding true. We will lose of course...you do realize that? It is not the particular candidates fault, although I disagree with Hillary on policy, it is because there is a slim to no chance of picking up any new states. It only looks as is that ticket can win if no one is running against it.

Moreover, running a Clinton doesn't change the brand. If they cared about our country they would think this through, unfortunately for us, they only care about themselves.

[Auntie Bush]

71. Clark/Richardson

They will pick up Southern, Western & Hispanic votes plus all of Kerry's votes. A sure winner. Go Clark go!:loveya:

[wisteria]

72. Kerry 2008

Nuff said!

[O.M.B.inOhio]

73. CLINTON / Feingold v. SATAN / Frist n/t

[fresnobill314]

74. No winner in 2008.

Jesus will return to earth in 2007. Dubya will have him shot down before he lands. Jesus' daddy retaliates by turning us all into primordial ooze. Game Over.

[ncteechur]

75. Don't forget Joe Biden.

Talk has it that Biden is exploring a run of his own. I also predict that John Breaux of Louisiana may throw his hat in, too.

Biden I like.
Not sure about Breaux's environmental record. Hilary Clinton, although I think would be good, is very polarizing.

Bayh as a VP candidate--not sure about Prez.

I'm one of those that think you get one shot. So I'm not sure that Kerry could do well or Edwards.

My top pick is Bill Richardson.

A Richardson/Bayh or a Richardson/Feingold could do well.

The Campaign finance thing could really play well for Feingold.

[ncteechur]

76. I'm hoping for a Frist/Santorum GOP ticket.

[ncteechur]

77. Or Gingrich--he's an ass to the nth degree.

[DWolper]

78. The guy that scares me the most.....

Honestly, his name has been kicked around and those close to him say he might run: Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty.

I had a chance to listen to this guy speak - and then met him personally and we visited for a few minutes. His politics would leave most of us very cold. But, he rivals Bill Clinton in his ability to "just be one of the folks." When he turns it up a notch on the platform, he blows away every Republican mentioned in this thread. He comes across as very intelligent without being cocky. Remind you of anybody? Honestly, I would rather this guy stay out. He has a natural ability that I last saw - and early - from a Governor from Arkansas.
Here is Pawlenty's website:
http://www.governor.state.mn.us/
I'm not the only one:
http://powerlineblog.com/archives/009520.php
He really could catch on. Keep your eye on this guy. WE need someone (again) with the "touch" this man has. We SURE don't want him as our president, but I have warned you early - real early. Didn't we just have an election? Ahhh, it's great fun.