We had better circle the wagons and stop attacking each other....

[kentuck]

We have all seen had quickly Governor Dean was brought down. And on a very questionable reason? Then last night, we saw FOX-TV and ABC combine to go after General Clark. They will pick off those they consider the most threatening first, in my opinion. They will go after Edwards next because they think they can paint Kerry as another Massachusetts liberal, just like Dukakis. Whether they can do that or not is debatable. The point is that they are out with their long knives.

We need to defend all our candidates from their assaults, no matter who our favorite might be at this time. Governor Dean mentioned in passing last night that we should not be pushed into talking about gays and race, but about jobs, healthcare, and education. Those are Democratic issues that connect with the people. Talking about gays, guns, and race in public debates only falls into the Republican/corporate media trap. And they will frame the questions and guide the debate to the issues that they wish to talk about. We support gay rights, affirmative action, and certain gun control measures as a Party, but we do not and cannot win by debating those issues as the standard of our Party. That's the choice we have to make.

We need to understand what is happening and not let them frame the issues as if every public forum is a Hannity & Colmes talkshow. They were looking to clear Bush of any future charges of AWOL or desertion by getting Clark to discredit those charges last night. Luckily, Clark did not fall for their bait... And they were pissed. They fear those candidates that can get out the votes. They like for the electoral process to be a controlled experiment.

[LuminousX]

1. Agreed.

[bearfartinthewoods]

42. how is this any different than the dean people wanting to stop

the race while he was ahead?? if kerry is the one, we will know soon enough. every criticism of him is not sourced from 1600 pennsylvania avenue. and nothing, i repeat NOTHING we come up with here is news to bushco.

[bicentennial_baby]

2. Yep

We must unite to fight the Right!! :bounce:

[Cuban_Liberal]

3. Absolutely.

It's quite clear that they intend to 'Gore' whoever our nominee is, after last night's debates. 'Circle the wagons' is a good strategy. :)

[Faygo Kid]

4. Oh yes, they are coming. You are right.

I have been disturbed for many months over the tone and tenor of GD: 2004 primary. None of us have seen what Karl Rove, Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity have in store for us, and all those who dare to question Bush. Now, it is starting. We are incapable of the hatred and lies they are going to throw at us, and our nominee, whoever that may be. It has worked for them before. From what I have seen, it may work again, as they have the support (or at least the acquiescence) of the media. Whoever your candidate is, don't let us become a desert wasteland of destruction, because the future of the nation and the world depends on defeating GWB.

[janx]

15. The sad thing is that they've been doing this for a couple of

months. A lot of the brouhaha in here was a result of it, but people refused to realize that.

There has been right wing propaganda flying all around DU.

Keep in mind, too, that we are online here. How do you know that someone with whom you are conversing is really what s/he portrays herself or himself to be?

Some extra caution is called for during the rest of this primary season (and of course the general election too).

[NewYorkerfromMass]

It's not over yet

Kerry is still not a sure thing.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

5. I agree on the Kerry = Dukakis strategy they are polishing up

Fortunately we'll be ready.

[GumboYaYa]

6. I agree as well.

I have been discussing this in a different thread for awhile this morning.

IMO we need to start thinking about how to frame the issues and respond to the attacks we know are coming.

I want all the candidates to start talking about the "right-wing echo chamber" instead of hitting each over the head with the very things that coe out of the echo-chamber. If we don't, our nominee may win the battle to be nominee, but get slaughtered in the war to be president.

[Name removed]

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[Nazgul35]

9. ahmen!!!

You forgot to say....

"If they can't take it now, how are they going to face Rove in the Fall?"

We need to make sure they are battle tested!

Of course, Dean stood up to four months of attacks...the current front runner and the other two guys only have to deal with five days of it......

Some test!

[Maddy McCall]

10. I have seen many Dean supporters offer a friendly hand to supporters of

other candidates, but I never have seen you do so.

I am seeing a great decline in animosity on this website. Hope sooner or later you will decide to join us. :shrug:

[mzmolly]

12. I have seen a successful ABD movement cultivated here and I see glee

that a goal has been accomplished. *phew* Now those of you who were involved in that movement are :scared: that your guys next.

Well guess what he is... :D

I think this thread is about 6 months too late myself. But that doesn't matter now does it? The threads from Dean supporters who called for a truce were shot down/ridiculed.

I question the Dean bashers HERE who now call for a truce...

So if you'll pardon me I have to :puke:

[kentuck]

17. Surely you did not mistake me for a Dean supporter, did you??

:) I have been trying to give all our candidates a fair shake.

[mzmolly]

25. I knew you weren't a Dean supporter. Dean supporters called for a truce

several months back and were laughed at and ridiculed told to *buck up*

We had stop Dean movements recruiting members on this very board, remember? Imagine my surprise to come here today and see the (call for a truce ... now)

When Dean lost Iowa people here were GLOATING! I can honestly tell you Dean supporters privately agreed NOT to do that if we won.

I find this thread to be the MOST hypocritical thread I've ever read here at DU. No offense to you personally.

[kentuck]

30. Sorry you feel that way....Better late than never, I suppose?

Hopefully you will see what is in your best interest also?

[Name removed]

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[mzmolly]

27. I'll ante up later...

I'm out for now. I've bookmared this thread, and will be back to show you hypocricy in action later.

[Maddy McCall]

29. Yes...please show me where I said ABD.

I never said that. But happy hunting! :-)

[Name removed]

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[liberalnurse]

33. I second that feedback.

The "suck-it-up" ranting was rendered by those who found fleeting pleasure by taunting and belittling.

An apology is a required option.

[Fleshdancer]

8. I'm still licking my wounds over the DU attacks Monday night

I'm a team player and eventually I'll get there, but MANY DUers were needlessly nasty Monday night. It didn't bother me that Dean placed 3rd in Iowa, what hurt was sifting through the numerous rightwing talking points about Dean's pep rally on a "Democratic" forum.

It just seems a little silly right now to suddenly circle the wagons as soon as a candidate other than Dean starts to feel a little heat from the media. I know it's an emotional response and in a week or so I'll be back to normal, but I'm being as honest as humanly possible regarding this topic.

[Cuban_Liberal]

13. Monday night was inexcusable.

The stuff I saw here Monday night churned my stomach. :puke:

[mzmolly]

14. Exactly.

Pathetic and pathetic and did I mention pathetic... :eyes:

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

16. I would have to agree.

Too many attacks on candidates, from members of this forum, are straight out of repuke talking points. It has severely limited my enjoyment of participating here. Hence, I don't come here much anymore. I just don't need the agita.

[blm]

22. People should stick to the politics and issues and NOT get personal.

Not get personal with other posters and not get personal with the candidates, unless, of course, what they have done personally reflects on the issue.

[LuminousX]

26. Every wound is remembered

The fact of the matter was Monday night/Tuesday was deplorable. I was disgusted, hurt, and angry.

The sudden awareness that the treatment of Dean was beyond acceptable is a good thing. I believe we can say negative things about our candidates. I can criticize Edwards for his inexperience in elected office, I can criticize Kerry for IWR. Others can criticize Dean for his lack of foreign policy experience. I will not start a negative thread against a candidate, nor will I invade a positive candidate thread (e.g. a congratulatory thread) with a negative comment (like going into a thread announcing an endorsement and calling the endorser a loser.) I do not promise I won't make negative comments in discussion threads about polls, etc., but I do promise that the comments will not be sniper attacks.

Taking glee in the suffering of others is a little sick, especially when the others are brethren in the party. I don't expect anyone else to do this, but just imagine if they did.

[Hoppin_Mad]

54. Agree 100 % - and I took close note of from where the attacks came -nt

[edzontar]

55. Indeed. I shall not forget.

I have no intention of behaving that way, either, when and if the attacks come to the other candidates from media puke land.


Let's make the shameful behavior of those creeps our anti-model.

[kentuck]

11. We'll get to hear plenty of anti-gay, racist, pro-gun speeches at....

the Republican convention. We cannot let them hijack our Party just to spiel their racism and homophobia. We know they are going to spend hours talking about civil liberties and gay marriages. Let's just not let them do it on our time. It would not be wise. We will do it on our own schedule.

[KittyWampus]

19. Truer Words Never Spoken. I Am Now 100% Behind Dean If He Gets The Nod

What the Rightwing has done has simply made me realise in no uncertain terms that they are trying to fuck with our heads, our Primary and our votes.

But I WILl be posting articles that discuss our candidates flaws & flip flops.

But then, I never really have attacked any candidate for the stupid crap that can go on here.

[Cuban_Liberal]

32. We all need to admit ONE thing to ourselves:

It doesn't matter which of the 7 we are talking about, they are magnitudes of order better-suited to be President than is Bush.

[grisvador]

21. Congenial Debate

The Presidential hopefuls did a great job of not rising to to the bait cast into the waters - They all maintained their poise and deftly hit some home runs with their answers. Moreover they remained focused on the prize - eliminating the Repug administration and not attacking each other.

But the sharks are swimming and the chum tossed about by Peter Jennings is just a drop compared to what is in store from Karl Rove. Americans deserve to know what the candidates opinions and thoughts are on important subjects, and the candidates need to be able to handle the tough questions and turn them into Democratic talking points.

I hope that the media turns up the heat during the primaries and grows a back bone to ask Bush the same questions. I really would like to hear George asked - are you a deserter? and hear his response.

[kentuck]

28. yes, even Joe Lieberman said, "Nice try", but he didn't fall for it.....

That was nice to see. Maybe we can unite as a Party if they all see that anything they say or do can be exploited and blown out of proportion at any time.

[liberalnurse]

24. Maybe later but not yet.......

Funny now that another is the front runner, folks want to play nice. Apologies may be in order for that to occur.

[denverbill]

37. Now that we've spent 3 months bashing Dean, and he's not in first now,

all you Dean supporters should stop being so bitter and stop attacking all the candidates. After all, now that we've bashed your sorry asses for 3 months, we've all got to start pulling together.

Fat chance.

[liberalnurse]

45. I have yet to see one apology.......

I sense a truce is not what is being request but just a shoulder to cry on....

I'm still open to an apology to the Dean Camp.

[denverbill]

46. Not me.

These crybabies made their bed, and can now lie in it. For the last 3 months, I've been posting only positive stuff about my candidate and staying away from GDP2004 because of the constant trashing of Dean and Dean supporters. And all we ever heard was "It's the primaries. If your candidate can't take the heat from us, he can't take it from Karl Rove." Threads were posted about Howard Dean's wife's looks and allowed to stand for hours.

[Fleshdancer]

50. It's hard not to react that way

like I said, this week, it's hard not to react on an emotional level. Nothing would feel better than to sling the mud as hard and fast as we've been receiving it lately. Nothing would feel better than to create patronizing, demeaning threads about the poor performances of certain candidates in last night's debate. And yes, we know who they are.

However, next week, when I'm ready to turn off the emotion, I plan on working for Dean 3x harder than before. Will I say positive things about the other candidates any more? Probably not. Will I write letters to ABC when they pull reporters off of other campaigns like I did for Kucinich? Probably not. Will I yell "bullshit" when reporters make stupid stories about how Kerry eats a sandwich? Probably not.

I won't sling mud but I have no interest in standing up with supporters of other candidates when they relish too much in the attack of Dean. My excuse will be that I'm just too damn busy working on my own campaign. I wasted too much energy writing letters and getting mad at the media whores for what they also do to the other candidates. No more. Good luck to them, I wish them well. May the best candidate win, regardless of what I think of their supporters.

[edzontar]

56. I agree that the past behavior of many here has been shameful

Indefensible.

We know who they were, and I will not forget it ,ever.

But I have decided that i shall not become one of them either.

Not ever.

These folks brought their divisive and destructive voices to the forum at a time when many of us had been active for months on other campaigns.

They tried to destroy this forum, and I'd say they almost succeeded.

Almost.

Remember--we were the ones who tried to stop the insanity in the name of unity and the greater struggle.

Go Dean, and Go DP!!!!

[edzontar]

58. And you will never see one.

They are beyond redemption.

I say ignore them, work hard for our candidate, and pay them back in the most satisfying and constructive way--through victory!!!!

[LuminousX]

38. We need to be bigger than that

We can show them that we have taken our hits, suffered their wrongs that they may think we deserve for early attacks against their candidates, but if the crap here Monday night and Tuesday doesn't even the score, nothing will.

Let's draw a line and say from this moment on, we do things differently.

[kentuck]

39. I understand how you feel....

But I have posted this thread and I can tell you that I am a supporter of Kerry but I have said good things about Howard Dean and General Clark also. My loyalty to Kerry is not yet to the point where I would try to destroy every other Democrat just to see him nominated. That would not be high on my priority list. I refuse to paint myself into that corner. The stakes are too high.

I like the way Howard Dean showed the passion at his concession speech. I liked the way General Clark did not fold under the pressure to denounce Michael Moore. I liked the way Edwards took a stand on the lobbyist influence in Washington. I liked the way Al Sharpton sympatized with Governor Dean in a very humorous manner. I liked the way Kucinich showed the people of NH how many jobs they had lost because of Nafta and the WTO...I liked the way Lieberman refused to fall for the ploy to attack his opponents. "Nice try", he said.

[mrgorth]

31. No chance

We've tried this before. The hate runs too deep now. We're helping the thugs.

[liberalnurse]

49. I request an apology....but...no one seems

to have the desire to come forward. Silence speaks for itself.

[GumboYaYa]

34. Wow, a thread urging cooperation for the good of the party

turns into a battle of two wrongs make a right. We are dead meat in November if we don't stop this nonsense now.

[bicentennial_baby]

35. Frustrating

:argh:

[Cuban_Liberal]

40. The 'circular firing squad' mentality:

There's a lot of that here on DU, and it's in the best Democratic tradition; sadly, this year is unlike any other election year in our history. We cannot indulge ourselves in the petty, self-destructive behavior we have seemimgly enjoyed in the past, because the stakes are far greater than ever before: will our Republic survive another Bush term in office?

I'm all for putting away the long knives.

[surfermaw]

47. A coming together

I have been on this board for awhile, never speaking mean about any candidate, it is my opinion that any one of the democrats are better than George Bush...so please take a leaf from the republican book, and support the candidate no matter who he is...And really who knows who it is going to be.

I am for Edwards, but when Dean seemed to be breaking through, I was much in his corner, I come here every night to pick up any promising message about the other candidates and took it to another board, and frankly I probably reposted more on Dean than I did on Edwards, not only those two, but all the candidates, I could help any way that I could...Please do as I am going to do, when the cream rises to the top support the preson...or we will never see another democrat in the white house.

Strange thing happen in politics, Dean could be on top in a few weeks, frankly I like D.K..but I don't think he can be elected.

Now for the Media on Howard Dean, this was nothing but right wing Karl Rover revenge,democrats why do you fall for such junk, I saw Dean as he made his speech, actually I thought he was doing as many coaches I have had in the past, rallying his troops to go into N. H. and win... It was nothing but right wing smearing....WAKE up Decorates or go down in flames....I bet Karl Rove is sitting in the White House laughing his ssa off at how disturbed we are on this board.

[rmdude]

48. This is critical - we need to step back and look at the big picture

I've always felt strongly about this and have been frankly disappointed (long time lurker) at the negativity. Fact of the matter is that any of our guys (yes, even Joe) is magnitudes better than the current resident. Each one has unique qualities and would make a fine leader.

While I'm a Dean guy and will give him 100% of my support during the primaries, whoever eventually takes it will have my full support. We need to keep our eyes on the prize - bottom line is the chimp must go!

[edzontar]

57. I am going to try to keep positive, but will never forget what was done

I am not going to particiapte in the flogging of peopls' hopes, in the slandering of good people's names, in the attempted destruction of our party, under NO CIRCIMSTANCES.

But I will never forget.