Is John Edwards the next Bobby Kennedy???

[Insurance_Analyst]

Hey, folks!

I realize that the nominating process is just getting started and anything can happen. However, can you guys think of a better person for Attorney General than John Edwards?

I hope the Edwards' supporters don't get mad at me. I'm sure they're feeling good about their chances after Iowa and with S. Carolina coming up. I'm beginning to think that a Clark/Kerry or even a Kerry/Clark ticket with Edwards campaigning with them as the next AG would be very formidable!

[Kahuna]

1. Uh...It's a little too soon to make that proclamation...

I know that everybody is euphoric on Kerry and Edwards after the Iowa caucus. But, they haven't changed. They are the same two men who failed to take it to Bush when they had the opportunity to do so. They are the same two men who failed us as leaders when they had the opportunity to show us what they were made of.

So, if anybody can explain to me what has suddenly changed about them since Iowa, I'd sure like to hear it.

[Insurance_Analyst]

4. I do not hold Kerry or Edwards' vote for the IWR against them...

They voted to give Bush the leverage to go to the U.N.

Bush abused his power. He could've waited for Hussein to screw up and subsequently get France, Russia, and Germany on board!

Bush screwed up Iraq! Don't blame Kerry and Edwards!!!

[mmonk]

5. Edwards's explanations

haven't sounded like leverage to me. But maybe he has changed that stand?

[Insurance_Analyst]

9. Keryy has definitely explained his vote well though!!!

[mmonk]

10. I've become comfortable

with Kerry's approach on that issue.

[Kahuna]

8. They should have known by Oct. of 2002 how deceptive..

bush is. If they didn't know, that speaks volumes.

[Insurance_Analyst]

11. I think Kerry was probably counting on Powell to get Russia, France, and

Germany on board before taking out Saddam!

Unfortunately, Colin couldn't get the deal done!!!

[mmonk]

2. I could concur with that about AG

[Renew Deal]

3. Actually Eliot Spitzer could be better.

Spitzer is a pit bull. He is really tough and finds great angles. Edwards practiced a different kind of law.

[Insurance_Analyst]

6. I think Edwards w/b more recognizable. Thus, from a political...

standpoint I think Edwards would be better than Spitzer. I'm not taking anything away from Spitzer though, as he is a fine lawyer!!!

[JohnLocke]

7. Hopefully without Sirhan Sirhan!

[maxr4clark]

12. I hope you don't mean

he is about to get shot!

Honestly, Bush is the first President that I have ever even worried might try to assasinate an opponent. I hope all of our candidates are safe out there on the campaign trail.

[nomaco-10]

13. I've been following politics for many years....

Bobby Kennedy is one politician that I can honestly say was the real deal. He is probably my favorite politician of all times. John Edwards is no Bobby Kennedy. I think a Howard Dean comparison comes closer than anyone else in this race. At times I have been amazed at how striking the similarities actually are.

[Insurance_Analyst]

14. Edwards has better looks (like RFK) and sounds as populist as Dean

[nomaco-10]

18. Bobby had real fire when it came to ....

racial issues, union corruption and fighting the mafia. He was the brains and the real driving force behind the JFK presidency. He was photographed and filmed many times in "angry mode" over these very issues and the press didn't crucify him. I'll never forget his trip into Appalachia and his fight to declare the war on poverty. What he saw there moved him to tears and then he got ANGRY. Reminds me of someone running right now and I definitely like what I see.

[beaconess]

24. He may have gotten angry, but he never yelled YEAAAAAHRRGGH!!!

Bobby's was a quiet anger that inspired rather than incited.

"I have bad news for you, for all of our fellow citizens, and people who love peace all over the world, and that is that Martin Luther King was shot and killed tonight.

"Martin Luther King dedicated his life to love and to justice for his fellow human beings, and he died because of that effort.

"In this difficult day, in this difficult time for the United States, it is perhaps well to ask what kind of a nation we are and what direction we want to move in. For those of you who are black--considering the evidence there evidently is that there were white people who were responsible--you can be filled with bitterness, with hatred, and a desire for revenge. We can move in that direction as a country, in great polarization--black people amongst black, white people amongst white, filled with hatred toward one another.

"Or we can make an effort, as Martin Luther King did, to understand and to comprehend, and to replace that violence, that stain of bloodshed that has spread across our land, with an effort to understand with compassion and love.

"For those of you who are black and are tempted to be filled with hatred and distrust at the injustice of such an act, against all white people, I can only say that I feel in my own heart the same kind of feeling. I had a member of my family killed, but he was killed by a white man. But we have to make an effort in the United States, we have to make an effort to understand, to go beyond these rather difficult times.

"My favorite poet was Aeschylus. He wrote: 'In our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart until, in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God.'

"What we need in the United States is not division; what we need in the United States is not hatred; what we need in the United States is not violence or lawlessness; but love and wisdom, and compassion toward one another, and a feeling of justice toward those who still suffer within our country, whether they be white or they be black.

"So I shall ask you tonight to return home, to say a prayer for the family of Martin Luther King, that's true, but more importantly to say a prayer for our own country, which all of us love--a prayer for understanding and that compassion of which I spoke.

"We can do well in this country. We will have difficult times; we've had difficult times in the past; we will have difficult times in the future. It is not the end of violence; it is not the end of lawlessness; it is not the end of disorder.

"But the vast majority of white people and the vast majority of black people in this country want to live together, want to improve the quality of our life, and want justice for all human beings who abide in our land.

"Let us dedicate ourselves to what the Greeks wrote so many years ago: to tame the savageness of man and make gentle the life of this world.

"Let us dedicate ourselves to that, and say a prayer for our country and for our people."

Indianapolis, April 4, 1968

[nomaco-10]

30. Why do some people keep trying to mis-characterize

the Dean Iowa speech as angry. He was clearly revving up his supporters and had a smile on his face. Be fair.

[beaconess]

31. I was responding to YOUR post in which you compared, impliedly, Dean's

anger to Bobby's. Are you now saying that Dean is NOT angry?

[beaconess]

16. No one thought Bobby Kennedy was the "real deal" until just a couple years

before his death. Before that, he was despised by liberals, looked down on as a lightweight nepotism beneficiary, and, unlike Edwards, was considered a nasty, ruthless SOB. He evolved into a remarkable man, but until the mid-sixties, Bobby Kennedy was no Bobby Kennedy.

[nomaco-10]

21. I respectfullly disagree with your analysis

of Bobby Kennedy. Read post #18 and look at his run for the White House before he was asassinated. The majority of this country would beg to differ with you that supported him in his bid for the presidency in 1968 and that was a lot longer than two years ago.

[beaconess]

23. Read my post

I didn't say until a couple of years AGO, I said until a COUPLE OF YEARS BEFORE HE DIED."

[nomaco-10]

25. I stand corrected on the misrepresentation of the time frame.

[beaconess]

27. No prob

[lastknowngood]

15. Edwards bowed out of the

senate reelection because he saw the writing on the wall. He wasn't going to be reelected so he stepped up. I don't yet see the dedication to overriding principles and devotion to service. The whole Kennedy family was impressed with the idea of having come from privilege they were obligated to serving in leadership positions in the government.

[beaconess]

17. Actually, all of the polls showed that Edwards would have won reelection

[dusty64]

19. So I guess we

ought to thank him for giving a potential Senate seat to the rightwing. I don't see any of the qualities I have heard Kennedy had (I don't remember him) in Edwards. Sorry, but I just see another politician with his finger to the wind.

[beaconess]

22. In other words, he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't

Noted.

[dusty64]

26. In a way, although

I admit my personal bias is possibly in the way (he really does nothing for me) and is my fourth choice of the top four. From my reading of history this Country would have been a far better place were it not for a killer's gun. I've often imagined how different things could be if both Kennedys hadn't been murdered. I'm just not getting that comparison to Edwards, I simply don't get the "leadership" vibe from someone I've seen dodge the opportunity to fight for the People and cave to so many extremist demands. To me that is taking the easy way out and looking out for oneself only. If he was looking like a winner in the NC Senate race (and I've seen evidence it was not a sure thing), it probably would have been more useful to have stayed there and tried to at least obtain one part of government for our side.

[beaconess]

29. Let's not fall victim to Kennedy revisionism

First, let me say, I adore the Kennedys, Bobby Kennedy in particular. It still breaks my heart to think what kind of country we could have been had he lived.

But let's be realistic. Until the mid-sixties - after the pain of his brother's death etched empathy so deeply on his soul - Bobby Kennedy was the kind of politician that many of us would have despised. He was ruthless, stubborn, could be terribly mean and callous. But more important, as Attorney General, although he did some good things, he also was sometimes woefully weak on civil rights, pushed through the nominations of racist Southern judges and trampled on civil liberties. In some ways, he had more in common with Ashcroft than the Bobby Kennedy we later came to know and love.

To his credit, he evolved and grew into an amazing person, but let's not allow our love and nostalgia for him make us turn him into a saint. That not only distorts reality, it diminishes his legacy. The fact that he was so flawed makes his transformation even more remarkable and wonderful to me. I'm not impressed by saints who do the right thing. I AM in awe of flawed individuals who do the incredible good that Bobby Kennedy did.

[dusty64]

32. OK, you obviously

remember him and I'll defer to your knowledge. I only know what I've read and the history only tells part of the story as we all know. I knew nothing of the judge thing, disturbing. I do sometimes think how things would have been different had they lived however vs. Johnson and Nixon, interesting. Everyone is flawed, and I make no illusions that any of the candidates are perfect. Each one has their pluses and minuses and it is hard to make a choice at times. I guess the "outsider" thing is a big appeal to me as I want things shaken up (I'm sick of business as usual). I know none are truly an "outsider" however, some are just less tied to the establishment than others.

[DemLikr]

20. Edwards was impressive on Bill Maher last night on HBO

He seems much more confident, relaxed and quick on the draw than when I last saw him on there maybe six months ago.

[Insurance_Analyst]

28. Bill Maher is great! I look forward to it on Fridays.