Which event or period would you pin the turn of political winds

[salin]

Poll question: Which event or period would you pin the turn of political winds

as having started? More Democratic mojo.. more embarrassment for Republicans... more stymieing of bushco desired policies...

Granted fairly recent (certainly after the Bankruptcy Bill passage) - but suddenly more consistent.

I put the timing around the whole Schaivo actions followed by the "Nuclear" showdown over judges.

[TahitiNut]

1. What "turn"?

I don't see a single member of this criminal administration in prison. I haven't seen any reduction in the Republican control of the House or Senate. I hear Democrats apologizing, not Republicans. I didn't see a single judicial nomination get blocked. Not one. I haven't seen the deficit go down. There are still fewer people employed in the private sector than in November 2000. People still cannot afford health care. Innocent Iraqis and American troops are still dying every day, if not every hour. We still spend more on our military than the rest of the world combined. The federal minimum wage has not been increased one penny.

Sheesh! Pollyanna was a pessimist compared to such vacuous delusions.

[salin]

3. that won't happen with a complete lock on govt

but there is a public shift... more distrust and cynicism towards the administration and even more towards the GOP in congress. The shift in public sentiment - if real... will only grow BECAUSE of the total lock of the republicans... because the lock gives them the belief that they can keep pushing and powering things through. Things that increasingly make more and more americans.

TN, this is the first time that I think a sustained shift might begin to occur - and it will be one turning against the current accepted "truths" of Reaganism (trickledown economics... all unions are bad... privatization is always good... etc.) THat means that over time (historical era time speaking) there really could be a public shift that opens the doors in the future (hopefully near future) to give the impetus to some real reforms (such as what you refer) that make our systems look a little more like our other Western counterparts - with more social nets... more constraints on corporate largesse... etc.

In my adult life I have never seen the potential shift that could give birth to a whole long period of public shift in the view of politics, the role of govt etc. By being pushed to the breaking point - and probably further (things will get worse - but finally the public is not uniformly following - thus more aware and more likely to begin to reject the underlying ideology of the contemporary GOP) - a long term change in political discourse, beliefs, and therefor policies may have a chance to occur (ala the shift with FDR and the New Deal).

[BillZBubb]

2. I'm at a loss to detect any turn.

Could you give some specifics? Sure the Bush and Repug poll numbers are down, but the Democrats haven't been able to get ANY traction, nada, zip, zilch, nothing.

The political winds may have died down, but they haven't turned at all. We are becalmed in a sea of dispair.

[salin]

4. we couldn't stop nominations

of any sort - and now, with no real political power, we have stalled some. Bush - at least for public consumption - has said that he will consult dems on judicial nominations to top positions (that didn't even happen when we had control of the senate).

The shift isn't with the democrats in DC - though a few more are willing to speak a bit more strongly than they were a few months ago... it has to do with public sentiment - and that is what has empowered bushco (due to their manipulation of public sentiment) and has at times shut down dems (due to the media hushing - due to the receptive public - ready to believe the stories.) The shift is with the public.

[paineinthearse]

5. Watergate

It gave the rethugs a valuable lesson to be much more careful and calculating. It's where Rove, Corsi and their ilk got their starts.

[ibegurpard]

7. Ouch!

Not what the OP had in mind, I don't think, but i have to agree unfortunately.

[salin]

9. definitely truth to that

but it took them years to execute fully - as the public didn't quite buy their full ideology during the reagan years... with talk radio.. rw think tanks... suddenly far right thinking in the reagan years became normal talk (eg the public conversation/psyche) by the bushco years.

Thing is - there is what seems to be a growing cynicism - even distaste for the policies of bushco that is growing on different fronts. Meanwhile progressives have finally gotten off the ground with pushing alternative conversations (think tanks, talking heads etc.) - that while nowhere near as dominant as the right.. already seem to be having a bit of an impact on the public psyche... and it hasn't taken us thirty years to do so.

The pure arrogance of bushco - and their sneakiness (learned by watergate) - is responsible (not the progressive voices, nor the dems in congress) for shifting public sentiment. The beauty of the reagan approach was that they spoke big but went incremental - so that folks didn't react at all... these folks speak incremental (at first) and speak orwellian and then act big in ways that don't match their speech. They are quite possibly seriously damaging their own party - without much help. Heck - if they are on a bit of self-destruction - what's wrong with letting them just accelerate their own demise. If such a demise can possibly be hoped for.

[Hosnon]

6. Other - When 50% + 1 of the public were against Iraq.

It is politics after all where that threshold means people start losing jobs.

[samsingh]

8. don't underestimate the bush goons or the

naivity of 50.1% of the electorate that will be counted in any election.

[salin]

10. I would never underestimate bushco

nor their ability to manipulate.

But. their own flaws have lead them to push on some fronts that have permanently woken some folks up to a point of cynicism that innoculates them from being manipulated in the same way again. If that group grows by 5%... or 8% of those who vote...