(NYT) John Kerry: The Speech the President Should Give

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/opinion/28kerry.html?hp=&pagewanted=print

TONIGHT President Bush will discuss the situation in Iraq. It's long past time to get it right in Iraq. The Bush administration is courting disaster with its current course - a course with no realistic strategy for reducing the risks to our soldiers and increasing the odds for success.

The reality is that the Bush administration's choices have made Iraq into what it wasn't before the war - a breeding ground for jihadists. Today there are 16,000 to 20,000 jihadists and the number is growing. The administration has put itself - and, tragically, our troops, who pay the price every day - in a box of its own making. Getting out of this box won't be easy, but we owe it to our soldiers to make our best effort.

Our mission in Iraq is harder because the administration ignored the advice of others, went in largely alone, underestimated the likelihood and power of the insurgency, sent in too few troops to secure the country, destroyed the Iraqi army through de-Baathification, failed to secure ammunition dumps, refused to recognize the urgency of training Iraqi security forces and did no postwar planning. A little humility would go a long way - coupled with a strategy to succeed.

So what should the president say tonight? The first thing he should do is tell the truth to the American people. Happy talk about the insurgency being in "the last throes" leads to frustrated expectations at home. It also encourages reluctant, sidelined nations that know better to turn their backs on their common interest in keeping Iraq from becoming a failed state.

The president must also announce immediately that the United States will not have a permanent military presence in Iraq. Erasing suspicions that the occupation is indefinite is critical to eroding support for the insurgency.

[LightningFlash]

1. Well it's been a while....

But finally Kerry says something I can really agree with. :yourock:

He seemed unafraid to say the most obvious things about Bush's war: He lied us into war, our friends families are dead...

But he's still not being strong enough. This bunch plays backstabbingly dirty, eloquent words won't carry the day.......Let's have Howard Dean take the helm and tell the world what Bush's war is about....

:D :thumbsup: :puffpiece:

[politicasista]

11. Here is what Dean should say

I expect Mister * to say I am a lying, draft dodging war criminal who mislead everyone into war. I am going to bring the troops home now. YEEAARRRGAH!:sarcasm: :rofl:

[second edition]

21. Funny! n/t

[LightningFlash]

33. Dean should just speak the truth.

We're in a war based on a bunch of bullshit, and thousands are dead. There's nothing more to say until we know the scope of those lies. :mad:

[rhett o rick]

50. * didn't dodge the draft, he went AWOL. I think that is treason. nt

[Vickers]

54. Even worse than AWOL...he's a deserter.

No matter how late you are, if you don't show up for something in the service, you are AWOL. If you don't show up for 30 days, you are guilty of desertion.

I beleive the maximum penalty for desertion in time of war is execution by a firing squad.

[endarkenment]

49. I'm missing the part of the text where he says

that the Bush administration 'lied us into war'. Kerry continues to refuse to admit that this war was a mistake, that it was started on false pretenses by an administration engaged in deliberate acts of deception.

Stand up John and speak the truth.

[Marnieworld]

64. My thought exactly. eom

[LittleClarkie]

71. He had trouble coughing out those words during the campaign as well

Wrong war, wrong time, wrong place was as close as he could come.

The Boston Globe did a piece on the campaign where one of the aides said it was because he thought he'd hurt the soldiers in the field by saying that what they were doing was wrong. It was a real road block. I wonder if that came from knowing folks like McCain.

So he calls for ways to get the troops home as soon as possible, and that is his way of supporting them. He's one of the pottery barn people.

[Oversea Visitor]

2. Gee after spending a bomb on

more then 10 superbases in Iraq dont think neocon wants outs.
After all taxpayers foot the bills. Their company just pump the oil and sell. Its a win win for them. No sir no leaving. No way unless they drag away screaming and kicking. They will rush right back if you let them go though hehe.

[Corey_Baker08]

3. Thank You President Kerry n/t

[FloridaPat]

4. "our huge military presence stands between the Iraqi people and chaos"

Is Kerry watching what's going on there? And he expects * to tell the truth! And so what if * announces we won't have a permanent military presence. * Lies. No one is going to believe him. Why does anyone think * should come clean about everything. He is a liar. There is no reason to believe anything he says at anytime. I really want the word "impeachment" coming out of all Democratic mouths all the time. * lied, and people are dying every minute.

[YvonneCa]

9. I think John Kerry knows what to expect...

...from this administration. I hope impeachment happens, too. I'm glad that, in spite of this, Kerry leads the way forward on Iraq.:patriot:

[karynnj]

10. Obviously he is watching what's going on and describes it well

At this point I doubt he expects Bush to tell the truth, But He is right to rhetorically demand it. (Bush should tell the truth.) What Kerry is doing is coherently describing the situation and recommending a solution that Bush will not take. Why? Because Kerry gives an intelligent solution to get us out with a prayer of keeping the area stable. Bush lied to get us in and now he's lying about our goals.

Kerry is also calling for an investigation into how Bush "used" the intelligence to get us into war, There it is very clear that he is asking openly if we were lied too in such a way that it begs the answer, yes.

[DisassemblingHisLies]

19. ITA.

It was clever of Kerry to point out in a matter of fact way that Egypt, Jordan, France & Germany offered to send troops but were refused & given the excuse that there was a "requirement that troops be trained in-country."

One would have to be seriously out of touch not to have heard how stressed & over-burdened our troops are, yet the Chimpster is too petty & obstinate to accept their offers of assistance? Does he really "support the troops", the Republicans should be asking themselves.

[klebean]

25. touche' DisassemblingHisLies!

should be a talking point if ever the media could do their job...
Bush - hiding behind our troops at Ft. Bragg; troops he's denied reinforcement
from the international community - yes, that's the question: does bush really
support the troops?
Good on Kerry.

[DisassemblingHisLies]

65. No doubt why Ft. Bragg was chosen as his latest backdrop...

It's located in Rep. Walter "Freedom Fries" Jones' home state. It's meant to be a slap to Jones following his bi-partisan bill calling for troop withdrawal.

Jones said he'd rather lose an election by doing the right thing rather than doing the wrong thing.

[JI7]

12. he wouldn't have written this if he thought Bush would tell the truth

[zann725]

18. I want Kerry to FINALLY admit HE Won the Election. Enuf is Enuf!

Impeachment would be a heck of a lot easier if the REAL "batter" stepped up to the "Plate." Sitting in the dug-out...calling 'plays' from the sidelines is nice, but enuf is enuf...get out-on-the-field John, NOW! We need you. The nation needs you NOW!

[Nothing Without Hope]

27. I agree. And the DNC is STILL denying that electronic vote fraud was

a significant enough problem in the 2004 election that it affected the election outcome. Kerry and the others are still only talking about those long lines for machines, but not the electronic voting fraud. Yes, those long lines are a scandal and must be addressed. But if the electronic election fraud machine is not exposed and destroyed, we have not only lost democracy, we will never regain it.

At what point does continued silence on this huge issue become complicity in the crime?

[karynnj]

31. At this point, the argument should be that going forward

we need to make sure the system has integrity. I hope Kerry, Clinton and Boxer are planning to address electronic fraud in their bill. Ignoring 2000 and 2004, the very fact that the machines CAN be subject to tampering, means we have to fix it. Concentrating on fixing the problem is the most important thing we can do now.

[karynnj]

30. He can't do that without iron clad proof

which no one has. Sad as it is, voter suppression in Ohio may have cost him the election.

[LittleClarkie]

5. posted at DailyKos as well

They'll eat me alive, of course. But I like to keep the dozen or so Kerry people over there happy.

[second edition]

22. Thank you!

We know they will bash him, but you are performing a great service to the Kerry supports over there.

[LittleClarkie]

23. I hope so

There are some folks that show up every time I post so I know they've subscribed to me. I'll keep on keepin' on, despite being called a shill.

[politicasista]

6. kick

:kick:

[Erika]

7. Bush tell the truth?

That is sooo out of character.

[Pachamama]

15. Sociopaths don't know how to tell the "Truth"....so your right, it would

be soooo out of character and frankly, impossible for him to do....

[YvonneCa]

8. It's reassuring to know that President Kerry...

...is still working for us. :patriot:

[LightningFlash]

13. This is what we need to get rid of and....QUICKLY I may add...

http://www.prospect.org/print-friendly/print/V12/7/dreyfuss-r.html

The new DLC needs to be purged from the party so that it is no longer throwing its corporate bullshit everywhere, more than 58% of america is just struggling to get jobs. They don't give a crap about the DLC's bullshit tax cuts, its strategies, its reforms and policies.

And you know what everyone is sick and tired of? Their cozy relationship with the right, and with fascists.

They need to be stopped plain and simple. The DINOs need to be kicked out of Ohio and Florida, and Michigan, in the name of the people!

:patriot:

[Pirate Smile]

14. That was extremely substantive and had many new ideas I've never

heard of - excellent work!

[NightOwwl]

16. Could also be titled:

"The Speech the President Would Give (if Bush Hadn't Stolen the Election)"

[bklyncowgirl]

29. Nice one.

"Or what you could have heard tonight if you idiots had paid attention."

Either way good work Senator Kerry. Lots of good points. Maybe this will help start to form a Democratic party consensus on Iraq. Right now the Democrats are all over the place and can't propose any alternatives as a party because no matter what any Democrat says some other Democrat will take a potshot at it.

[DisassemblingHisLies]

17. Goooo, President Kerry!

There's certainly no way the chimpster could formulate ideas & articulate them as well as President Kerry did in that LTE. Chimpy can barely get by reading what speechwriters lay out for him.

[second edition]

20. Great Kerry opinion piece.

Those of us who paid close attention and listened carefully know John Kerry offered many of these suggestions during the election. They made sense then and they make good sense now. It's a shame people were caught up in the "strong and resolute" bull sh*t. Bush is actually strong in only his stubbornness and resolute in never admitting to a mistake. Kerry is offering sound advise, Bush should really consider implementing many of these suggestions. My guess though, is Bush will ignore them all and continue on the same wrong path.

[kerrygoddess]

24. The Real Deal! N/T

[ngGale]

26. Well, IF Kerry was President we wouldn't be in...

this quagmire. If anybody knows a quagmire when they see one, it's John Kerry. I'm sure he's chomping at the bit to rip w to shreds.
I'll settle for impeachment! <Kerry is my President> and I'm sticking with him.

[sendero]

45. Why do you think that?

I mean, after all, Kerry's basic message is the "pottery barn - we broke it we have to fix it", no?

We can stay there for 20 years and we won't "fix" it, so I'll just have to respectfully disagree with Mr. Kerry.

[Nothing Without Hope]

28. Here's a graphic that could replace the blivet**'s lying speech:

War Paint photo found at today's issue of AllHatNoCattle.net - may take a few seconds to load.

http://www.allhatnocattle.net.nyud.net:8090/war%20paint.jpg

[CWebster]

32. Kerry's usual take: I could've done the job better

Someone give him the hook. There is no triangulating or salvaging this war crime. What we need is someone to call it what it is--not to say that we needed more troops to accomplish exactly WHAT???????

[flpoljunkie]

34. JK called for more Iraqis to be trained and faster, not more US troops.

And this: "The president must also announce immediately that the United States will not have a permanent military presence in Iraq. Erasing suspicions that the occupation is indefinite is critical to eroding support for the insurgency."

This, Dubya, will not do, and it is crucial.

Tonight will be more of, "SUPPORT THE TROOPS, SUPPORT ME, CRITICIZE ME, YOU'RE CRITICIZING THESE BRAVE TROOPS, INCLUDING THOSE STANDING BEHIND ME" AND "STAY THE COURSE--DON'T CUT AND RUN" BULLS*IT.

The problem is the "course" is not working!

[CWebster]

36. I know you kiss the ground Kerry walks on but

he has ALWAYS complained that there were not enough troops--and now he complains we need to train more Iraqis faster to be our proxy force?

get fucking real

[Mass]

37. And you are of those who think he cannot possibly be right

once in a while.

Get real!

I imagine that your solution is to leave Iraq immediately and pray that more chaos does not ensue.

[CWebster]

38. He ain't right here

and he never was.

It starts with telling the truth---and I'll tell you what, Kerry won't recognize the truth until the tide turns and it reaches critical mass---and even then he will still try to spin it to his political benefit.

[Mass]

39. Happy to see I was right!

Thank you for confirming that (that Kerry cannot ANYTHING right). That will avoid that I waste more time talking to you!

[second edition]

47. You know the truth? I would like to hear about it.

Otherwise, as is usual with your posts, they are jaded because your anger clouds your judgment. Kerry has always maintained that we went to war not having enough troops on the ground, nothing new there, how can you not see the benefit of going into this war with more troops rather than less? Kerry, didn't start this war, Bush did. Kerry has always stated this war action was only to be used as a last resort after all other initiatives had failed and we had the support of other nations so that we were not going into this alone. John Kerry is the only senator I have heard so far who actually has "plans", with detail, for bringing this war to an end with positive results and a win for our soldiers.

[CWebster]

56. You are not angry?

Something is wrong if you aren't. And yeah, I am doubly angry at Democrats who aided and abetted this war crime and more often than not enabled the criminals since Bush and company grabbed the reins.

You don't seem to fucking GET IT!!! Sending in more troops FOR WHAT? TO ACCOMPLISH WHAT "MISSION"? WHAT "WIN FOR OUR SOLDIERS"?

Damn right I am mad and I can not make these letters big enough.

[flpoljunkie]

43. I repeat Kerry does not call for more US troops in this NYT op-ed, but for

faster training of Iraqis as well as suggesting that Iraq "should make use of its tribal, religious and ethnic militias like the Kurdish pesh merga and the Shiite Badr Brigade to provide protection and help with reconstruction."

[BridgeTheGap]

35. Where are the Iraqi people in all this?

I agree with most of Kerry's assessment of the situation in Iraq. However, any proposal to keep U.S. troops there flies in the face of what the Iraqi people want. A recent poll there indicated 87% want the U.S. (& British) military out of their country.
I think Kerry is concerned about how it would look if we "cut and run," (now there's a piece of political "framing!") but the will of the Iraqi people has to be considered in this matter. They know better than anyone the risks of handling their own security and they also know how much the U.S. presence fuels the resistance. We are imposing our will on them. It is arrogant of us to draw the conclusion that they need us to protect them from themselves.
Hold a referendum and let the Iraqi people vote on this (drawing the Sunnis into the electoral process) and select new leaders who are not seen as U.S. lackeys. If the Iraqi people ask us to leave, we can do so with honor.

[second edition]

41. No permanent military presence in Iraq,

Kerry mentions this in his opinion piece. I come to the conclusion that he is suggesting the administration should plan effectively to begin withdrawing our troops after December of this year.

[Mass]

42. The referendum could be a good idea, I agree

It should be held under the UN supervision (which is probably difficult, but worth trying).

However, there were a couple suggestions in this article that are worth listening too, in particular the fact that they use the existing militia to help creating Iraqi forces more rapidly than by building from nothing a regular force (the other implication being that these forces would not be as subservient to a US govermenent as an army created and trained only by the US army).

It is also good that he is calling for an exit plan with benchmarks (even Kennedy recognizes that a time table was a bad idea Sunday on CNN and called for the same sorts of thing).

[confludemocrat]

40. Reads like a warmed-over 2004 (bankrupt&adrift) campaign speech

So he thinks or implies (you can never tell with Kerry, because he insinuates and beats around the bush so consistently) that we stand between the Iraqi people and chaos. No John, we are the bringers of chaos, we have the humvees they are attacking, we hired the police and army they are killing every day. We have the helicopter gunships and jet bombers that level cities and whole neighborhoods. We made Al Sadr a criminal for exercising free speech. We loosed mercenaries answerable to no one on that country.

We set up the reconstruction effort that hired on cronies of Bush to the exclusion of all others. No electricity, no water, no security.

End the occupation, begin the end of chaos.

Anyway, he sounds like he thinks we need more troops there, but won't say it, of course, being something favored by only 10 percent of the population. More smart 2008 politics.

This is a warmed-over campaign 2004 speech that still won't face facts, we must withdraw and stop the 2008 positioning, Kerry, you simultaneously reek of personal ambition and the failure to make the point of the immorality of this war and for that you will be consigned or should be consigned to historical oblivion.

[flpoljunkie]

44. Geneva Convention requires that occupier must leave occupied country

stable and capable of governing itself.

Kerry's suggestions would work toward doing just that, but the question is, will Dubya take any of these very good suggestions?

[CWebster]

46. Kerry's own words

Our mission in Iraq is harder because the administration ignored the advice of others, went in largely alone, underestimated the likelihood and power of the insurgency, sent in too few troops to secure the country, destroyed the Iraqi army through de-Baathification, failed to secure ammunition dumps, refused to recognize the urgency of training Iraqi security forces and did no postwar planning. A little humility would go a long way - coupled with a strategy to succeed.

Our mission in Iraq...underestimated..insurgency...too few troops to secure the country...urgency in training Iraqi security..

Take off your damn blinders--he is operating with the same fundamental false premise and game plan.

[second edition]

53. This is Bush's war not Kerry's!

We are in it, so lets get it right and get out!

[CWebster]

57. Kerry's words:

"How do you ask the last man to die for a lie?"

There is no getting it right. Kerry shouldn't be lending it any credibility.

[flpoljunkie]

59. We did not have enough troops to stabilize country after Baghdad fell.

The administration marginalized and forced General Shinseki to retire for saying it would take several hundred thousands troops to stabilize the country.

[Mass]

48. But should we care about the Geneva Convention?

No, this is just a piece of paper that we should ignore totally.

:sarcasm:

[confludemocrat]

52. So why didn't he invoke that? We have to build his case for him?

Anyway, from another thread:

"Nothing will change until the Americans leave," Deen, 33, said at his home in Baghdad's Saydiyah neighborhood. "The resistance will not stop until the Americans go away. Once they leave, we can then only figure out if there is any hope of the Sunnis and Shiites coming together."

[endarkenment]

55. where does it say that?

That would indeed be odd. Occupiers could simply claim that they cannot leave now because the instability caused by resistence to their occupation prevents them from leaving. It would be a simple catch-22 escape clause legitimizing perpetual occupation. I think you are misreading the GC.

What kerry should have said is;

"How do you ask a man to be the last man to die for a mistake?".

[confludemocrat]

61. Yes, GC as cited above would stand the intent of the GC on its head

The convention seeks to prevent what we saw at the outset of the occupation: total lawlessness and destruction. It is not for creating a pretext if having been the biggest contributor to the problem, to justifiably be the solution also. Come on.

[second edition]

51. Sound like nothing short of immediate withdraw will satisfy you.

There are however,many augments against going your route. I'm not going to argue them with you now, I just wanted to point out that the increased military presence Kerry mentions is to come from the Iraq's not the US.

[confludemocrat]

70. You are right, ideally get going to the border tomorrow

We are not helping things to say the least. As in Vietnam, our military (an awesome enemy killing machine if we are ever invaded) in a foreign country immorally and illegally= many innocent dead without an end in sight. An admission that the war is wrong and we must get out would serve as a start.

As good Democrats, what should be asked for by all of us is a clear moral distinction between our position vis a vis Bush rather than hazy shading and equivocating that Kerry is so adept at or smart "positioning" that Kerry is so bad at.

[rhett o rick]

58. The speech Kerry should give. "Voting for the war was a mistake and I am

sorry..............."

[ScamUSA.Com]

60. yep

Im still upset with Kerry for rolling over and enabling the current Administration.

I dont trust him, and he's my senator.

[politicasista]

66. Yawn

:boring:

Some people will never be satisfied. They want Kerry to strangle Zippy and say "Bring the troops home now or I'll knock you out. :sarcasm:

[CWebster]

68. Zzzzzzz and some will accept any ol Republican

with a D after his name and accuse others of not being satisfied.

[rhett o rick]

69. You are sooo wrong. I will be satisfied when those Demo's that voted

for the IWAR admitted they made a mistake. They were supposed to save us from a crazy President. But no, for whatever reason they supported the crazy President. In some ways they are worse than he. They went along because they didn't have the guts to do the job they were elected for. This is not a pure democracy, the people don't get to decide what the government does directly, and for good reason. Instead the founders set up a representative form of government. I no this is all lost on you.

[ScamUSA.Com]

72. I must say he did a great job

with his speech today

[Roland99]

62. Here's the email going about from John Kerry...this is near the end!!

Here's what I think President Bush needs to address tonight - and we need to hold him accountable:

* The president must announce immediately that the United States will not have a permanent military presence or bases in Iraq.

* The United States must also insist that the Iraqis establish a truly inclusive political process and meet the deadlines for finishing the constitution and holding elections in December.

* We need to put the training of Iraqi troops on a true six month wartime footing and ensure that the Iraqi government has the budget needed to deploy them.

* The administration needs to work not just at security but at reconstruction -- Iraqis need to see the electricity working and the water flowing.

* The administration needs to get Iraq's neighbors off the sidelines -- they can't afford a failed Iraq on their doorstep, and Bush-style unilateralism needs to bend to getting these countries on board.

* And the administration must immediately draw up a detailed plan with clear milestones for the transfer of military and police responsibilities to Iraqis after the December elections. The plan should be shared with Congress.

It's the only way we can set the stage for American forces to begin to come home.

The next months are critical to the future of Iraq and our security. If the administration fails to take the kind of steps I outlined today, we will stumble along, our troops at greater risk, casualties rising, costs rising, the patience of the American people wearing thin, and the specter of quagmire staring us in the face.

I urge you to watch the president's speech tonight with a careful eye and to act in every way possible to demand what our troops deserve - leadership equal to their sacrifices.

I like that first point...a LOT!

[YvonneCa]

63. Kerry on CSPAN2

Kerrygoddess posted an alert that Kerry will speak about Iraq on the Senate floor...no time given.



link:http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1891307:patriot:

[globalvillage]

67. Kerry speech expected within the next half hour. n/t.

[kerrygoddess]

73. Text of Kerry's speech today...

http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/default.asp?view=plink&id=1174

Coverage from Salon's War Room - http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/default.asp?view=plink&id=1175