Can we get a list of the Congressional Democrats who have lost elections

[Guaranteed]

over the past 10 years or so?

I'll start- Tom Daschle, our DLC-oriented Bush-kissing Senate Minority Leader.

[lvx35]

1. Man, you got it in for the DLC tonight, eh? n/t

[Guaranteed]

2. Just trying to refute a myth. nt

[Clark2008]

3. I was just going to suggest we do this very thing.

I've been reading all the threads regarding the DLC vs. the Democratic Wing of the Democratic Party and thought, what better way to put it to a test.

Let's see exactly who wins elections.

[Guaranteed]

4. I'm looking on the net...where would one find this information? nt

[Clark2008]

8. I'd start with the DLC's site and see who are members.

Or, in the alternative, think of some Dems you think are DLCers and Google them specifically - like "Tom Daschle DLC".

We know he lost, so that's one.

I think a better test might be to watch 2006. I'm pushing for a DLCer (don't shoot me) in my state because there really isn't an alternative, but I'm betting he loses. Why? Because, while I agree with MOST (not all) of his positions, he just won't have a strong enough package to combat the Republicans, who, whether you agree with them or not, don't diddle about with their message.

And, maybe we should run a left Dem against Lieberman and see who wins the primary.

Should be interesting.

[SaveElmer]

13. Here's a link to their current members...

About half the Senate's Democrats are on there!!!

http://www.dlc.org/new_dem_dir_action.cfm?viewAll=1

[Guaranteed]

15. Yes, yes, that's entirely true. LOL

Hence, my opposition to them- because they're not just straying from our ideals every once in awhile.

They're running the party that way.

Now let's get a list of those who have lost.

[SaveElmer]

18. I think you are going to find...

That the majority of them lost in states that are conservative...and becoming more so..

Just a gut feeling.

[Guaranteed]

20. Yes...You know...

An even better question than "Why are they losing?" might be "Why are these conservative states becoming even moreso?"

Do we have a lack of leadership there? Are our views not being sufficiently represented? Have we distinguised ourselves from the Republicans there?

[SaveElmer]

22. Those are great questions!!!

Probably a complex answer...one that I am too tired to tackle tonight!!!

[LittleClarkie]

25. Didn't I hear they tend to claim folks who've never asked to be there?

Obama had to have himself removed, for instance, as he'd never given approval to be there in the first place.

[SaveElmer]

30. Don't know...hadn't heard

But Kerry is on there...you ok with that ?

[LittleClarkie]

32. Eh, I'm not one of the "DLC is Satan" people

but I tend to think he's one of their liberal members. The only time he strikes me as being anything close to their agenda is in foreign policy.

[SaveElmer]

33. You are probably right about that...although if you will look here

You will see that some of the DLC Senators coming in for the most criticism are more Liberal than they are given credit for...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1961969

[SaveElmer]

5. No doubt Daschle was very moderate...but

Do you think he would have done better in South Dakota by moving left ?

[Guaranteed]

6. If he couldn't win by doing what he did, his fate was sealed.

And, yes, maybe people would have had more respect for him if he'd distinguished himself from Bush's ridiculous agenda instead of embracing it- so maybe it wasn't sealed. Not to mention how much better that would have been for the party as a whole.

Think about it- compromising your integrity to embrace a losing, failed agenda....you think that's a winning strategy?

[SaveElmer]

11. To tell you the truth...

I think his position as majority leader killed him. He was forced to be out front in opposition to issues with which the vast majority of his constituents disagreed...

South Dakota is verrry conservative, and getting more so...I really don't think a move to the left would have helped him at all

[Guaranteed]

12. But what did he oppose? Virtually nothing.

He was one of the worst.

Watching his responses to Bush's SOTU's was torture.

[bvar22]

14. Moving to the RIGHT...

..sure worked good.

[SaveElmer]

17. Well I don't really think he did....

I'm not saying moving left isn;t a good idea in some instances...for example Van Hollen defeated Morella by moving to her left...even though she was quite a liberal Republican. A good strategy in Montgomery County, Maryland..

It's very difficult to see how you can apply a blanket strategy to every locality.

I think Daschle lost for the same reason Morella did. His constituents finally decided that if they were going to have a right of center representative, they may as well elect the real deal.

[Guaranteed]

19. That's right. nt

[SaveElmer]

31. Do you have evidence that he compromised his integrity?

I mean if getting elected was all that was important he certainly could have gone further right than he did...

What did he campaign on that he didn't believe?

And, I am of the opinion that his losing wasn't that bad for the party...I don't think he was a very effective leader. I also think that the leader needs to be strong politically at home. Daschle never was so he couldn;t be the spokesman we needed.

[Mass]

7. Is ND more liberal than SD?

Because Dorgan (though a DLCer) is a lot more liberal than Daschle.

[SaveElmer]

9. Neither is liberal...

But North Dakota still has a bit of a populist streak from its Non-Partisan League days that does make it more amenable to Democrats than South Dakota.

I'm not really sure Dorgan is more liberal than Daschle...I'd have to peruse their voting records...I would guess they are pretty close...but Daschle had the added pub from being majority leader, which probably forced him to do things South Dakotans may not have approved of.

[Hippo_Tron]

28. Dorgan and Conrad are both more liberal than Daschle

Part of the issue is that neither has faced a serious challenge in recent days. Until 2000, there were really no "red states" and "blue states". Although states were somewhat predictable in presidential elections (although not nearly as predictable as today), they were much less predictable in their voting patterns for lesser office. Democrats dominated the Governor's mansion in Utah for many years. Democrats had a constant winning streak for Senate seats in Nebraska for many years. Dorgan and Conrad, Dachle as well, were both elected before the country had so much partisan divide. Now they continue to be re-elected largely because of seniority and because they haven't faced a tough challenge like Daschle did.

[Guaranteed]

10. And he's a current Senator. nt

[SaveElmer]

16. North Dakot and South Dakota...

While both conservative are quite different politically. North Dakota gave birth to one of the most effective statewide populist movements in history...the Non-Partisan League..

There are still vestiges of it there...

Also, North Dakota has hisorically been friendlier territory for Democrats in local and statewide office.

I think if you looked at Dorgan and Daschle's voting records...they would be almost identical!!

[fujiyama]

21. As you can tell,

I have no love for the DLC, but Daschle was a special case in some ways.

Considering S. Dakota is pretty conservative and it was a presidential election year...it was an uphill race for him all along.

Keep in mind the repukes also claimed he was being obstructionist (which is a joke in and of itself)...and I did hear there may have been issues with the way Thune played to racism against Native Americans.

Ultimately, this is not to excuse Daschle's cowardice (and God was he an awful senate minority and majority leader) , but the lesson here is that it's stupid to have your party leader come from a bright red state.

As for senate losses overall for DLC candidates, I believe that every one of those that were running for senate from the south in the past two elections were affiliated with the DLC.

[ISUGRADIA]

23. Carol Mosley Braun in 1998; Cleland, Carnahan in 2002

[Guaranteed]

26. Cleland and Carnahan, who both voted for the IWR, but neither of whom

were saved by their votes.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=107&session=2&vote=00237

[LittleClarkie]

24. Who cared about the Native Americans in his state,

was a victim of Jeff Gannon's smear and appeared, when I saw him, to be a decent man.

You were saying about Mr. Daschle?

[Guaranteed]

27. LOL case closed!

You're talking about the guy who ran as CLOSE to Bush as he could, right? Who freely passed out pictures of himself kissing Bush's cheek?

[LittleClarkie]

29. I didn't see it, but I'm not in his state, so I'll take your word for it

but what I said is also true.

A bad strategy, perhaps. But still, a good man.