Hackett's showing: A Democratic win or loss?

[WI_DEM]

Poll question: Hackett's showing: A Democratic win or loss?

Some posters say that Paul Hackett's four-point loss in a VERY Republican district is actually a win since it shows how vulnerable the GOP may be in 2006 if they can hardly win in one of their strongest districts (certainly the strongest GOP district in Ohio).

Some posters say it's a loss--that a WIN IS A WIN but a loss, no matter how narrow, is still a loss. And besides it's those voting machines which cost the Democrats the race.

So what say you?

[Inspired]

1. Only in America

can a loss be considered a win.

[WI_DEM]

7. Certainly in 2000 a loss was considered a win by the Supreme Court

But there are losses which are considered moral victories. Another example, New Hampshire, 1968--President Lyndon Johnson, the write in candidate received 49% of the vote against Sen. Eugene McCarthy whose name was on-ballot and got 42% of the vote. Johnson won the primary as a write-in and yet most commentators said it was a loss because it showed how vulnerable Johnson was due to the Vietnam War. That is how I view this Hackett election--The GOP won, just barely, but it demonstrates how vulnerable Bush has become.

[hobbit709]

2. Unfortunately

it shows the neocons that they now have to steal 535 races instead of just one.

[mikelewis]

10. which they are quite capable of doing....

ain't that the bitch

[liberalnurse]

3. Those nay sayers

fail to look at the effort of a brave man and discourage future ambitions for brave Democratic souls. Such negativity sours the milk.

[snowbear]

4. Look at the demographics and history of that district and CROW like Hell !

Because he did an AWESOME job! ~~~ :bounce: ~~~

[IndianaGreen]

5. Hackett showed that there is much to be gained by attacking Bush

Enough of the appeasement malaise that the Democrats have been suffering from since the recount fiasco of 2000. We should have stormed the Supreme Court back then after their judicial power grab as people in other countries do when they are fed up with tyranny.

[rasputin1952]

6. He stripped away 20+% of the regular R vote...this is a win! For

Pete's sake, he should have been clobbered, but it was basically a squeaker.

No doubt about it, the GOP is in HUGE trouble...:D

[DemInDistress]

8. a loss is still

a loss.Yes he came close but still no cigar for being close.I cant understand how each and every vote gopers seem to pull it out at the end of the election,52-48% Just how many votes did Deibold add to Schmidt and subtract from Hackett.Will we ever know,can we ever know? Hell 3500 vote margin needs to be examined.I smell foul play..I heard Humidity canceled some votes,how many?

[mikelewis]

9. I say both -

Hacket wasn't running alone in this race. He had a lot of people bringing him national exposure and it energized a lot of people. His fund raising was fantastic and his message came through quite clear. He was an Iraqi Vet who opposed the war. He seemed charming and dedicated and really put a good face on the Democratic Party as a whole. That's a win in my book.

Regardless if the race was stolen or not, it was also a loss. In the end, he goes home and Mr. or Mrs. Schmitt goes to Washington.

One quick note about Schmitt. I have no idea who this person is. To me, it's just another filthy Republican. I don't know if this person is a man or a woman, black or white or something in between. I really don't care. If it's an Ohio Republican, it's crooked and hateful.

[Pystoff]

12. Ditto

I am the only other person to vote with you so far.

This was a loss in the real world but a moral victory.

Moral victories make you feel good eventho you came up short kind of like being an unranked team and almost knocking off the #1 in their stadium. This can be a harbinger for 2006 if the Democratic party doesn't pat themselves on the back and crow about this and instead charges ahead with head down like a bull. Hackett can run again for another seat and should be backed to do so if one is available.

Populism folks that how to win if the Democratic party wants to knock these bastards off for a long time.

[Mojambo]

11. It's a good sign, but things will likely be quite different in 2006

Not to be a downer, but the pullout of troops before 2006 will drastically change the dynamic of those elections.

The GOP is going to do everything in their power to make sure that the mid-terms are not a referendum on Iraq.

Democrats are going to need a WHOLE lot of Hackett's to make the Iraq issue stick after the pullout. I'm not sure they have enough.

We'll see.

[FrenchieCat]

13. The man's a winner.....

who is geographically challenged based on where he resides.

In many other places, he would have been replacing whatever Repug would have faced him.

It wasn't an outright loss, as that seat was not supposed to be challengable.....and we were not expected to pick it up...so nothing has changed, making the fact that he is not in congress a moot point.

However, it was a big loss to the Republicans who now realize that the right Democratic candidate can get many Republicans, who might not otherwise, vote Democrat...while all the while that Democratic candidate is calling the President names.

All in all, it's no loss at all....and in the long run, it's a win.

[rzemanfl]

14. To paraphrase another thread, his mistake was calling * a

"lying son of a bitch" instead of a "lying motherfucker" thereby losing some dog lover votes.

[terrya]

15. It's a win.

It shows that there's disatisfaction with Bush in even the most Republican of districts. Hackett was quire aggressive in his criticism of Bush and his policies. This race showed that even in a heavily Republican district, a lot of people agreed with Hackett.

And this is only encouraging for 2006.

[matt819]

16. Sorry boys and girls

I hate to be a downer, but this is a loss. End of story.

This election has demonstrated that the voters - okay, the voters of this one Congressional district - don't give a good god-damn about patriotism or service to country, or, as it turns out, a pro-gun stance. They are chickenhawk warmongers, anti-women's rights, anti-gay rights, for tax cuts for the rich. These people don't care about the loss of life in Iraq and Afghanistan. They don't care about anyone who is not white and Christian (preferably evangelical). If someone calling himself a Democrat espoused these views, he would be elected. Hell, if someone claiming to be an alien abductee espoused these views, he would be elected. Damn, the alien would be elected.

But a rational, intelligent, patriotic American who takes another position doesn't stand a chance.

This is not a warning for * and co. It is a warning, rather, that we are facing a generation or more of this brand of politics. Remember, folks, * today espoused belief in intelligent design rather than evolution. Tom Friedman noted in a column today (a few months after Krugman made the same observations) that the US is 16th in the world in broadband connectivity. The South Koreans are cloning animals. I don't give a damn about animal cloning; my point is that they are taking chances, they are exploring the limits of technology. We are failing every step of the way.

I don't see a way out. These crazies are perfectly happy to take us headlong into the 17th century in terms of education, technology, diplomacy, etc.

This development is depressing beyond imagination, and I am fed up with the rose-colored glasses perspective. We are in serious trouble, and it's only going to get worse.

[rzemanfl]

17. Glad you aren't pessimistic. n/t

[matt819]

18. And I'm having a good day!

Look, I'm not going to change my politics. And I'll continue to fight the good fight. But I don't see any way out of this mess.

[rzemanfl]

20. I worry that the way out won't be in my lifetime, I will soon be 58.

(Tomorrow in fact). Do you think they will still try to run the "greatest country in the World" scam when we are a global outcast bankrupt second rate theocracy?

I've been angry for five years, but lately have been less angry and more depressed, to the point where a good day is a rarity.

[FrenchieCat]

21. Well happy birthday....anyways!

Don't be angry or depressed tomorrow...cause it won't change a thing.

Instead, make it one of those good days! :hi:

[rzemanfl]

23. I think I replied to the wrong post. See above, 1 of those days. nt

[rzemanfl]

22. Thanks for the Happy Birthday, although I shouldn't have

mentioned it.

I think there is a good chance of a military coup before January 2009. The military has to be fed up with Bushco. I guess there's not alot of difference between someone who took power with a gun and someone who took power through crooked elections.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

19. A democrat with backbone who doesn't well up in tears and

bow down when a pug tells him to apologize. Appears as though people like that. Imagine what he could have done had he entered the race early and called bush a few more choice names! ;)