The Xtian Right's contribution of mass hypnosis techniques in

[aspberger]

the American political arena. The faith healers and evangelists of this country, are among other things, master hypnotists. The jump from the camp meeting tent to the political convention has helped the right to consolidate power.

The effects of the right's mass hypnosis has been stunning. With a reasonless zombie purpose, we have been stringed along on Bush's march to the abyss. It's time to break the mad spell that has been put on this country.

The reader of this post may think, "not me buddy, I am immune to the right's psychic lobotomies". Yet ask yourself where does about all the rancor, the division, the defeatism, the suspicion, and all the anger of the Democrats in general come from?

Commonsense, unity, brotherhood, and putting on our thinking caps are the best antidotes for the hex. Also a positive outlook in the next elections will create a contagion of enthusiasm and cause a cure for the politically duped common person.

[undergroundpanther]

1. More on this church hypnosis

I agree it once had me in a thrall almost ruined my life.


When I was in Assembly of God, the way the music was done, the lighting, the order of the sermon, the way they spoke was all a very sophisticated hypnotic induction.

http://www.unknownnews.net/050611d-610up.html


Evangelicaldom, as a movement, is giddy with power right now, and verbose with proclaimations of good faith in the public sphere. But there are many within the evangelical ranks who experience this moment of empire not with exhileration but with vertigo. It's like a bad joke: What happened to the gospel on the way to the coliseum?

http://www.therevealer.org/archives/timely_001969.php

[FreedomAngel82]

11. Interesting

I never thought about that. My church is seen as very old-fashioney in how we do things. The preacher is great and very non-biased. I have no idea what his political beliefs are and he's never made any type of indication if he's republican or what and I don't know who he voted for in 2004. It would be interesting to find out. :shrug: All the young adults my age (I'm twenty-three) are all very pro-Bush but my brother and I. I don't know why. I'm getting the courage to speak up more when I get the chance but I'm still a wee bit shy. :blush:

[proud patriot]

2. So should we throw cold water on the victims, to wake them ?

I mean there are techniches to wake someone
correct?

[undergroundpanther]

3. I don't think so

When they are THAT deep into psychosis..And honestly I think it IS psychosis because I was under so much fear and stress during my time with Assemblies of God,I hallucinated I thought my partner had been raptured out of Wa wa.I was delusional. And anything I saw could have been taken as spiritual warfare or as a sign.

I really was psychotic.Jesus and evangelical churches made me suffer inside.It was terrible believing.


I am very afraid for this country because religion isn't about freedom of ones personal faith or chosen beliefs or even making someones life better anymore it's about world domination for selfish sometimes sociopath narcissistic people willing to make other desperate lonely or abandoned neurotic people psychotic and serve them with promises ,fantasy,threats hypnosis and fear..It's a infectious mind game that is very hard to get out of your head.It shackles you with love and hate at the same time and the only way out of the cognitive dissonance is faith in obedience..and bible literalism,the very shit making your mind break down.

[FreedomAngel82]

13. This is why so many people are against organized religion

Not only because of this but because so many of them are hypocrites. So many times you hear about a person who claims to be a person of faith be apart of an affair or something else like that. It turns people away. Plus, men usually dominate in religion and they want to control everything. Not all of them do but those who are big-time loud mouths about religion. My preacher is great. I really respect him and he does care for people in a sincere way. You can tell by how he is as a person and what he talks about in his sermons. He doesn't preach to us but he just talks to us like he was having a normal conversation. He's never preached about dictating our lives but gives advice and we can choose to follow it or not. I think the thing that people forget about with any type of organized religion is how God gave us all freewill. He does forgive us and He doesn't hate people. All these rules are guidelines for helping our lives. In the end it's about personal responsibility and how you rule over your own life. Sometime read the book of Proverbs. It's a really great book with tons of advice on your life and takes on a lot of issues that people in general deal with. If people actually read their Bible's instead of proclaiming to be Christian and just following what someone else tells you and picks and chooses what to use in a lesson you'd see that in Proverbs King Solomon tells us to think and use our brains. Don't just willfully follow someone because they claim to be like us. For all we know they could be leading us on the path to distruction.

[undergroundpanther]

4. Kick

People need to read this thread

!!

[blm]

5. True. Tim LaHaye constructed the LEFT BEHIND series for that very purpose.

LaHaye used to publicly assert his mind control expertise in the late 70s and has been a longtime associate of RevMoon's who is a more wellknown master of mindcontrol techniques.

[ClayZ]

6. I read the whole series and I am easily hypnotized.

I think I read it to arm myself against stupidity and watch what bunk they spread. My husband sometimes listens to Rightwing Talk Radio for the same reason. I can't bear listening.


"cure for the politically duped common person" I love this line.

We need to bottle someting like, lavender pasteles, and sell that one!

[FreedomAngel82]

14. Yes

People don't read and research their own Bible's themselves if they are of the Christian faith. So many people jump on the bandwagon because it's the "in" thing. I've never read the series of books (don't care to, the only one I need is my Bible) but I've heard a lot about them. :shrug: But the only book that should matter is the Bible. Read and study yourself. Don't just willfully and ignorantly follow someone. Even if they're your own preacher at your home church. How do you know they're telling you the truth? Someday they may lie to you. You never know. This is why you should investigate and study yourself.

[Up2Late]

7. Sounds about right, here's a link to some useful info

I've been trying to get the word out that the RW ReThugs have been using the techniques of a "Mind-control Cults" for a while now:

<http://www.howcultswork.com/>

[FreedomAngel82]

15. I remember not long ago I saw something interesting...

It was on MSNBC and it was about a Christian cult. This girl was drawn in and she was a real and true sincere Christian. She believed in God and Christ and was a pretty normal and good person. Then she found this group of people who claimed to be Christian at her college (she went away for school) and they asked her to join. According to her they started doing weird things and told her what she could and could not eat and that she could only talk to them and nobody else. It was very strange and scary. Luckily she was able to get out.

[BrklynLiberal]

8. Very much like the ancient medicine man/witch doctor used his bag

of tricks and smoke to gain control and intimidate the tribesmen, the RW Dominionists and Fundamentalists have "hypnotized" their flocks..
It has just been updated using modern day communication techniques and psychological theories.

Same shit/different millenia.

The ancient Greeks and Romans would have been mortified to think that some day their religions would be categorized as "mythology".

One cannot counter "faith" with logic. There is no logic to faith. It is based in magic and fear. It seems to appeal to the basest and most primitive parts of the human spirit.

It takes a combination of charisma and incredible kindness to lure people away from the dark, unquestioning side of religion. Does this exist today? People say that if Jesus came back today, he would be ignored at best, and committed at worst, or perhaps even lynched.

[nashville_brook]

9. there's that fraud problem, too

there's no worse dupe than being duped of who we are. we won the last 2 elections. we were winners. not losers. our identity has been stolen.

[FreedomAngel82]

16. That's why I think

You have to turn off the tv. Of course there are many people out there who think the media is liberal and repeat it like the truth. :eyes: But I've grown so much as a person these last few years. I believe in my heart that God has been apart of that. I've changed a lot and have really matured more and more patient and my priorties have changed. I know who I am and where I stand on issues and who I can trust without the media's help. :)

[NAO]

10. Insulated Community - Groupthink - Ingersoll's Description of Revival Psyc

The Religious Reich are masters of Belief System (BS) formation, modification and maintenance.

The Church system is unmatched by anything in the mundane secular world. Large numbers of people who do not ever think about or discuss ideas in their daily lives attend meetings every week where they sit and listen to lectures about metaphysics (nature of reality, origin, and destiny) and ethics (right and wrong) in integrated talks called 'sermons'!

Christians are encouraged to 'seek fellowship of other Christians' AND they are discouraged from being 'worldly' or from being 'unequally yolked' with unbelievers. This serves to reinforce their very odd beliefs which have no correlate in ordinary experience or sensory data - it makes unreal things seem real if everyone pretends. And by keeping to their own, they insulate themselves from those who do not accept their beliefs and whose conversation might sow seeds of doubt.

Further, they are inoculated against escape from the BS by being taught that 'the devil' tries to deceive them with 'vain philosophy'. They are told not to rely on 'mere human reason'.

And there is a strong emotional component in their ceremonies.

Ingersoll has a nice description of the "Evangelist Revival Meetings" in his brilliant piece, "Why I am an Agnostic":

***

In those days ministers depended on revivals to save souls and
reform the world.

In the winter, navigation having closed, business was mostly
suspended. There were no railways and the only means of
communication were wagons and boats. Generally the roads were so
bad that the wagons were laid up with the boats. There were no
operas, no theaters, no amusement except parties and balls. The
parties were regarded as worldly and the balls as wicked. For real
and virtuous enjoyment the good people depended on revivals.

The sermons were mostly about the pains and agonies of hell,
the joys and ecstasies of heaven, salvation by faith, and the
efficacy of the atonement. The little churches, in which the
services were held, were generally small, badly ventilated, and
exceedingly warm. The emotional sermons, the sad singing, the
hysterical amens, the hope of heaven, the fear of hell, caused many
to lose the little sense they had. They became substantially
insane. In this condition they flocked to the "mourner's bench" --
asked for the prayers of the faithful -- had strange feelings,
prayed and wept and thought they had been "born again." Then they
would tell their experience -- how wicked they had been -- how evil
had been their thoughts, their desires, and how good they had
suddenly become...

Well, while the cold weather lasted, while the snows fell, the
revival went on, but when the winter was over, when the steamboat's
whistle was heard, when business started again, most of the
converts "backslid" and fell again into their old ways. But the
next winter they were on hand, ready to be "born again." They
formed a kind of stock company, playing the same parts every winter
and backsliding every spring.

The ministers, who preached at these revivals, were in
earnest. They were zealous and sincere. They were not philosophers.
To them science was the name of a vague dread -- a dangerous enemy.
They did not know much, but they believed a great deal. To them
hell was a burning reality -- they could see the smoke and flames.
The Devil was no myth. He was an actual person. a rival of God, an
enemy of mankind. They thought that the important business of this
life was to save your soul -- that all should resist and scorn the
pleasures of sense, and keep their eyes steadily fixed on the
golden gate of the New Jerusalem. They were unbalanced, emotional,
hysterical, bigoted, hateful, loving, and insane. They really
believed the Bible to be the actual word of God -- a book without
mistake or contradiction. They called its cruelties, justice -- its
absurdities, mysteries -- its miracles, facts, and the idiotic
passages were regarded as profoundly spiritual. They dwelt on the
pangs, the regrets, the infinite agonies of the lost, and showed
how easily they could be avoided, and how cheaply heaven could be
obtained. They told their hearers to believe, to have faith, to
give their hearts to God, their sins to Christ, who would bear
their burdens and make their souls as white as snow.

All this the ministers really believed. They were absolutely
certain. In their minds the Devil had tried in vain to sow the
seeds of doubt.

I heard hundreds of these evangelical sermons -- heard
hundreds of the most fearful and vivid descriptions of the tortures
inflicted in hell, of the horrible state of the lost. I supposed
that what I heard was true and yet I did not believe it. I said:
"It is," and then I thought: "It cannot be."

***

Why I Am Agnostic
Robert Green Ingersoll
http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/robert_ingersoll/why_i_am_agnostic.html

[FreedomAngel82]

17. I'm a Christian and a lot of that isn't true

We do have conversations about all types of things. I've gotten into discussions at my church with my age group about all types of things that's going on in the world and talking about a lesson from the Bible. We're encouraged to think and be out in the world and all that. Now I think there are probably some groups who are like this. Yesterday at my church the sermon was on personal responsibility. It was about not blaming someone else for what you do and he used the example of Adam and Eve and how Adam blamed Eve for what he did and my preacher talked about how we're the one's who are in control of what we do. Not anybody else. Sure, Satan and the negative one's can tempt you but in the end it's up to you. That's why, for example, if you know you have a problem with drinking and alcohol to try to stay away from a situation that can put you in that place or around it or have a friend to help you with the problem. If you do drink and go down that path you have nobody to blame but yourself. And how do you know it was Satan and not just you? For example there's this girl I know who is a vegeterain and she doesn't eat a lot of meat and things like that. My mother was saying how she was being tempted to do so and she was blaming Satan. I thought that was ridiculous because it's your body's reaction to not having something. Those who blame Satan are looking for a cop-out of personal responsibility and that's not what it's about. When the time comes to meet God it's me that's going to be judged and what I do and my actions. If I blame Satan on something it's still my fault.
We are never discouraged from being wordly but quite the opposite. We want to be apart of the world just not consumed with worldy pleasures. What we want to do is be a friend to the world but put our posessions up in Heaven (what matters to us). We are encouraged to fellowship and be with other Christians and have other Christian friends because they are like us and they help to re-energize you and to give you strength as friends. They understand what we go through and can help us get through something that is a trial to us (like with drinking again). I am not any better than someone else who is religious. I'm my own person and just here doing the best I can to get through life and the stages of life. My religious beliefs help me get through the rough parts because I know that this isn't what all my life is about. So everything in your post NAO is totally BS. My preacher has never talked about agony or hell. He talks about lessons that can be applied to our lives daily and used here on Earth. Any preacher who preaches soley on Hell, in my opinion, doesn't really care about the message of Jesus Christ and what he was about. We don't have sad singing in our church. They're all gospel hymns and more updated hymns as well. I love a lot of the songs we sing. This person has not ever heard every sermon in the world. He/She should come to my church.

[Lars39]

19. You haven't sat through many fundamentalist revivals, have you?

The descriptions were accurate.

[cilla4progress]

22. Individual variation

I think it's wonderful this is what you are hearing at your church, and I home more churches continue to preach this. Good for you for thinking for yourself!

I found last weekend, as the first sort of mainstream Christian church I attended with our visitor, that the minister did absolve believers of personal responsibility: all glory to God for anything/everything good that happened; and all blame to Satan when someone is led astray.

Can you explain to me how this is not removing personal responsibility?

I think it just depends on individual preachers and churches. Just as with education - it comes down to that specific teacher in the classroom, how the educational experience is manifested.

[seabeyond]

12. i have found where the religions have found the power....sinner

youa re a sinner. they force and reinforce the you are a sinner. on all fronts they attack, you are a sinner. to the point the person feels their only hope is the religion and maybe, maybe they can put an end to the sinnin. but they wont be able to as they chant, i am sinner. they will have to prove self right, time and time again, and continually going to church to stop the sinnin.

before coming to texas, real close to the south, the churches i went to never harped on the sinner. just didnt hear that much. talk more doing for others, being our lite, walking jesus path, love yada yada....but here, from the youngest of age they start with you are a sinner

[FreedomAngel82]

18. It's not that way at my church

I live in Tennessee and it's not that way where I go. I can only speak for my church and where I go. Not even my grandparents church is that way and one of my favorite preachers James Watkins. At the end of the sermon though there is an invitation song and people can come up and talk about a problem or they can tell how they want to be baptized. If you're wondering being baptized is a symbolic ritual to show how you are being washed in Jesus and you're being burried in your old life and coming up to your new life in a spiritual sense and dedicating your life to Christ. I really do like going to church and hearing my preacher's sermons. He always has really good stuff that can be applied to our daily lives in t he here and now. Yesterday's was about personal responsibility. I think that if all a preacher talks about is hell this and hell that then they aren't ture missionaries from God. I've never had a preacher talk much about hell. Only one time I can remember my current preacher has talked about the book of Revelation and that wasn't even about hell either. It was about the promise of overcoming this life and being back with God and to encourage. I think if someone is being negative all the time then they aren't right and really aren't truly from God. Look at Jesus Christ for example. He wasn't ever negative in anything. Even when he was being taken away. That should be our example. If you're wondering I am apart of the Church of Christ.

[johnnomac]

24. Texas? Ouch

I was actually in Texas yesterday morning. (It's SO nice to be back in Canada.) I have noticed that the preaching of a certain Christian organization based there really clashes with me. They really push the "You're letting God down" line, as well as the guilt. Now, for a lot of people on this board, you would expect them to disagree with this group. But I am a born-again Christian.

This organization gave us one sheet which "recommended" how to spend an hour of prayer time, by breaking it up into 12 sections, each 5 minutes long. Now, don't get me wrong, I think the idea of praying for a full hour is great. But I see my faith as a relationship. And you can't break a relationship into 12 5-minute sections. They are almost at the point where they try to break down the faith into 5 bullet points or 3 easy steps, which worries me. Because this group affects so many American teenagers, I would hate to see that mentality spread around your country. But now I've started rambling.

I mostly agree with you about the "you're a sinner" thing. I think that a lot of RW groups need to ease off that. However, I still think it is an important part of the message, and does need to be told to people. I don't think they emphasize it enough at my church, to be honest.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[cilla4progress]

21. Thank you THANK YOU!

I'm so relieved to read this discussion (in truth haven't read it all yet...had to write in 1st...bursting with animus from yesterday's church experience...).

Yesterday I attended my first fundamentalist church service - it was at a Presbyterian church, so I expected it to be "mainstream;" was I ever wrong...! I was taking a visiting S. Korean exchange student; I am a Unitarian pagan. In true Unitarian spirit, I approached the experience with an open, unjudging mind, and, through the first part of the service, strove to find our common ground. Everything was going along OK until....

the minister (who had the persona to be either be a minister or, well, a game show host - stupid jokes no one laughed at; very superficial and theatrical) started calling me and my kindred, "liars", "decievers", and yes - "THE ANTICHRIST"! I could not believe it! He also condemend ALL other religions (did he mean other Christian denominations, as well, of course, as Islam, etc.?) All the things I've heard from others over the years which, I have to admit, I did not - COULD NOT - truly believe, came true. Having been raised in a liberal, humanist religion (Ethical Culture Society), and morphing to Unitarianism as an adult, I have been insulated all my life from this. So, while horrific, this was a valuable experience - though one I will NEVER re-enact.

Yes, the minister said that progressives - "religious liberals" (though not politicial liberals - get that!) are appearing as the world is in its last hours, and must be gotten rid of - they are the "other." And this is where the brainwashing/programming came in: the minister blended FEAR (the last hours) with repetitive, hypnotic readings from the Bible which were -- you guessed it - PROJECTED ON A BIG SCREEN at the front of the room! There is no other way to view this than mind control.

The worst part was I had my 12 yr. old atheist daughter with me, and I was fearful for her. We decided not to take the communion, which I understood condemned us to hell (so much of what the minister said was hocus-pocus gobbledy-gook, I wasn't quite sure what the "rules" were!). It also made us stand out and my daughter says people kind of moved away from us when they saw us refuse the bread and wine! My daughter handled the experience probably better than me, with that pre-adolescent blend of sarcasm and dismissiveness. I was hurt, shocked, scared, and felt like I needed a shower really bad afterwards!

I can't wait to go back to my OWN Church next Sunday, where a new member/friend will be presenting a service on East Indian mysticism, and where I can dwell with people who believe we are ALL inspired, valuable, worthy, and accepted, and where we even tolerate those who tell us we are the cause of the world's ills.

[shrike]

23. Well, having grown up Catholic

I can tell you that the laity was more likely to nod off during mass, due to boredom. The priests of my youth were not good preachers. So much for hypnosis at Sunday mass.

Although I've noticed their speaking skills have improved in recent years. The pastor of my church does a fairly good job of keeping people engaged, though the last thing I would call him is a hypnotist.

[LittleClarkie]

25. Because I'm sick

And a Monkees fan, I'm reminded of one of their episodes, the last one, where everyone was hypnotised by an eye on their television sets.

A gigantic pot plant saved them all.

:D

[Lone_Wolf]

26. I believe that there is something about the mind of a typical conservative

that makes them very prone to following the directions of others. I've noticed that Conservatives are very good in arranging themselves in a pecking order or hierarchy where one follows the direction of another, presumably higher person. You see this phenomenon all of the time with them supporting Chimp, one of those televangelists, one of the talking heads on TV, etc. They'll follow their perceived leaders over the cliff and fight tough and nail for them. They won't question their superiors, even if they know their superiors are lying. This trait is probably what makes them very organized. This could be the mass "hypnosis" you observed.

I've spent some time lurking and observing the posting activities of members of Freak Republic and it is very interesting. There is a very definite hierarchal order over their. You have a handful of "leaders" and the rest follow. This is not to say that there isn't debate over there (there's some disagreement on trivial matters), but all in all, they march in lock step with each other. It is really quite remarkable how little independent thought the typical Freeper has.