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quaoar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:42 AM
Original message
Latest smear against Cindy: She's anti-Semitic
How are they going to top this one for outrageousness?

http://www.israpundit.com/archives/2005/08/cindy_sheehan_a.php

Don't call left-wing media star Cindy Sheehan an anti-Semite just because she's funded by a group that advocates the destruction of Israel. Call her an anti-Semite because she believes that a dark cabal of Jews is running the US government:
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kbm8795 Donating Member (337 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:44 AM
Response to Original message
1. For a bunch of people who claim to be christians
they sure don't have any trouble pulling out a crystal ball and manufacturing every false witness they can muster. . .

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oscar111 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Churchill anti-semetic?
is my memory right? seem to recall a post here that said it.

need i add, churchill is a freeper icon.
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AntiCoup2K4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 05:13 AM
Response to Reply #3
11. Ironic isn't it?
Since their mentality is much more Neville Chamberlain.
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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #3
20. I don't know if Churchill himself was anti-Semitic...
I've never seen any evidence to that effect. However, while Churchill was under-secretary for the colonies, he recinded a lower level order restricting Jewish immigration into "Manditory Palestine" only three days after it was issued. He also deployed a regiment of cavalry to the area to quell mounting violence between Jews and Arabs.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #1
39. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
greyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
2. That's just a lone asshole imagining that.
Omri Ceren being the delusional asshole.
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skids Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Yeah, I don't see a real RW push in this.

...but if you are worried, try to see if anyone can fish out a picture of one of the Stars of David amongst the crosses placed at Crawford.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. Deleted message
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Muddy Waters Guitar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:07 AM
Response to Original message
5. Vintage Rethug/neocon smear tactics
Piss all over the people who've been screwed by their warmongering. Sheehan's comments and opinions are complex, and they've done a bang-up job distorting her comments, taking them out of context, and otherwise pushing the sort of hatchet job that the Bushies love to force on anyone who stands up to them.
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ltfranklin Donating Member (852 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:07 AM
Response to Original message
6. I don't know about Anti-Semites...
and I don't know about Zionists....

But, Jeeze Louise, I sure know about Zealots after reading Israpundit.com!




From Wikipedia:

The term Zealot, in Hebrew kanai means one who is jealous on behalf of God. As a word in English it means anyone who is overly zealous. Specific uses in popular culture also exist. Particular aspects can focus on religion, politics, but can also apply to any other area where partisanship and its related dogma are fostered and encouraged.

While "excess of zeal" may be used to refer to very common and individual instances of excess, "zealotry" tends to be reserved for cases where excess zeal is shared with others, and has formed or merged with a dogma; typically with ideological self-perpetuation as among its primary foundations. The espoused use of force and violence to propagate the ideology, is a common characteristic of this self-perpetuation; perhaps inline with the "ends justify the means" rationale.

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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:14 AM
Response to Original message
7. ok, i clicked on the link
"Don't call left-wing media star Cindy Sheehan an anti-Semite just because she's funded by a group that advocates the destruction of Israel."
http://www.israpundit.com/archives/2005/08/cindy_sheehan_a.php

and the group is the Crawford Peace House. OH PLEASE!!!

am i going crazy or are these people insane???
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #7
27. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. The majority of Israelis are for PEACE not war!
It is unfortunate that the only views that get aired in the US are the views of neocons and Israelis opposed to peace, such as the ones that are calling for the death of Prime Minister Sharon for pulling out of Gaza.
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Andromeda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 04:09 AM
Response to Original message
8. Laura ( not Bush) said:
"Because I hate to criticize a woman whos son died in service to this country I will give her the benefit of the doubt and assume perhaps she is being exploited by radical leftists who actually wrote the letter and put words in her mouth or have brainwashed her in her grief.

As for Jeremy Brock, if she did speak those words then yes the statement amounts to anti-Semitism. The statement wasn't merely a criticism of foreign policy but a traditional blood libel blaming Jews for her sons death. The same old conspiracy theories of the hidden hand of Jews controlling everything. No American soldier has ever died in defense of Israel, they have always fought their own battles. However American soldiers have died in defense of other countries, even muslim ones, yet no one gets angry over those losses. I hear no complaints about American soldiers dying for those people. It seems that certain people only become enraged at the mere prospect that their sons might be risked in some military adventure that just might happen to benefit Israel even if that's not the real purpose. Can you imagine the reaction if we actually did go to war to save Israel like we did to save Kuwait and Saudi Arabia in the gulf war, or in Kosovo etc.?"

Seem like there is more than one school of thought on this.

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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #8
22. What they see
"If we just let our vision of the world go forth,
and we embrace it entirely and we don't try
to piece together clever diplomacy, but just
wage a total war... our children will sing great
songs about us years from now."
-Richard Perle
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Caleb Donating Member (251 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 04:50 AM
Response to Original message
9. Did she actually say that stuff?
Edited on Sun Aug-14-05 04:51 AM by Caleb
Because that site doesn't look very credible and they don't offer any good links. RW blogs aren't usually the ideal source for the truth.
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Warren DeMontague Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 04:56 AM
Response to Original message
10. Israel has far more to fear from Bush and his "Left Behind" nutbags.
They only 'support' Israel as far as it fits their wackjob "end times" script. Come "The Rapture", Jews are screwed--- just like everyone else who isn't a righteous Avenger for Jesus.

And the only country the Neo-Cons are really interested in protecting in the Middle East is Saudi Arabia, anyway.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
13. Deleted message
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Bullshit!
The PNAC agenda does benefit Isreal and they are neo-cons.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. Are you saying she was killed for Israel?
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #18
24. She???
I think you have your genders mixed up. Being anti-PNAC, anti-neocon and anti-war is not anti-semitic no matter how hard some try to paint it as that.

To some, any mention of Israel connection with the US that is not in glowing terms, equates to anti-semitism, which is a crock, imo.

I hope the job here is well done and this gets moved to the basement where it belongs.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. I meant "he,"
Edited on Sun Aug-14-05 12:44 PM by Jim Sagle
Being anti-PNAC, anti-neocon and anti-war is not anti-semitic no matter how hard some try to paint it as that.

Blaming the war on Israel IS antisemitic, no matter how hard some try to whitewash it.

To some, any mention of Israel connection with the US that is not in glowing terms, equates to anti-semitism, which is a crock, imo.

I agree, but that's not what happened here. Blaming the war on Israel IS antisemitic, no matter how hard some try to whitewash it.

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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #32
46. Cindy blames the war on bush
you seem to miss that point which she has made MANY times. Because she mentions PNAC and Israel in one, repeat, one sentence you, myopically, block out all else. Pretty sad, really. Myopia can be cure by widening one's view to understand the whole issue rather than picking and choosing isolated sentences with which to further YOUR agenda.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. You are using a rightwing discussion board as your source?
Even the mod in I/P won't let you post that type of source down there!
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. I used google. It's right there in the post.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. You are using the lies from the GOP smear machine to attack Cindy?
Shame on you!
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. So does this mean you are part of the "I don't care!" crowd?
Let's see how far you are willing to go down this path...
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #31
35. Not very far at all. I was rooting for Cindy Sheehan until I saw this
ugly quote.

And I'm not willing to condemn her outright. She's gone through a trauma that I just can't imagine. Justified rage must be coursing through her veins 24 x 7. And to be fair, she has not emphasized this "war for Israel" stuff more than a couple times that I know of.

Everyone is flawed. So if she mostly emphasizes what she KNOWS - that her son died for no good reason - I'm with her. But if she becomes the Charles Lindbergh of our time, she will do immeasurable damage to the left, the anti-war cause, and American democracy.

And BTW, it's not about me.

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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. Let's agree that Israel had nothing to do with Iraq war
We both know that to be true, even while we disagree as to which political elements in the Likud and in the US had a stake in the outcome of a US-Iraq war.

I think I would rather wait for a more reliable source for a quote, and I would also want to consider context.

I also propose we agree that one of the consequences of the Iraq War will be a backlash against Jews, regardless of how we felt about Bush and/or the war. How do deal with such situation is a legitimate topic that deserves to be aired, but not here and not now.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #37
53. How likely is it that this link was faked?
Edited on Sun Aug-14-05 02:10 PM by Jim Sagle
I also propose we agree that one of the consequences of the Iraq War will be a backlash against Jews, regardless of how we felt about Bush and/or the war.

I reject your proposal. No fucking way will I accept one IOTA of blame for what this piece of unelected filth did in our name. I hated and feared this thuggish little psycho even before he was nominated, much less selected. He and his crowd have deliberately ruined every venue they've entered, foreign and domestic. That's the plan: smash, grab and run. They'll take the oil, the surplus (already gone), our Social Security money and everything else they damn well please, unless they are stopped.

And as for what's suitable for public debate on DU, I'm a firm adocate of shitcanning the I/P forum altogether. But it's not my call.

I do wish we could maintain some semblance of unity in the face of this regime of giggling looters, torturers and killers. But this unity will NOT come at my expense or the expsnse of my brothers and sisters.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #13
23. I find YOUR comment to be racist, and race baiting.
Edited on Sun Aug-14-05 11:54 AM by bvar22
It is possible to oppose the policies of Israel and PNAC without being antisemitic.

Anti-Sharon does NOT equal anti-Jew or even Anti-Israel.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #23
30. There is NOTHING racist in what I posted. I quoted Cindy Sheehan.
That's what I did.
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quaoar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. You called it anti-Semitic filth
Do you believe that calling for Israel to withdraw from Palestinian territory is anti-Semitism?
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. That's not all she said. She said her son died for Israel.
Edited on Sun Aug-14-05 12:58 PM by Jim Sagle
And THAT'S antisemitic filth!
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #36
45. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #45
49. Thank you. And neither - ESPECIALLY neither - is everything that happens
in DC.
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frictionlessO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #30
40. No you took her quote out of context.
First off PNAC/neoconism has a lot to do with Israel Likkud, not the State of Israel but perchance certain policies. Not the Jewish people as a whole gain certain policies.

I am Jewish, I support the context in which Cindy made this statement.

I do not think she is repeating anything other than the truth, not anti semitic filth. You can be against the governemnt of Israel and their policies and still love the Jewish people. Same thing as with soldiers and war.

As far your posts on this thread whether you intended to or not you just pushed a rw attack point against those who stand for peace.

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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #40
50. OK.
You can be against the governemnt of Israel and their policies and still love the Jewish people. Same thing as with soldiers and war.

I AGREE. But you CAN'T say "my son died for Israel" unless you have some real ugliness in your soul.

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frictionlessO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. Or severe trauma maybe??
Again the pretext is important here, Jim. She is talking about the PNAC/neocon-Likud connection.

Can I get you to agree with that?
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #52
54. Yes, but she made connection out to be the whole story.
And yes, trauma is the likely cause. That's why I can't write her off completely.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #30
41. Translation: "The Jews killed my son."
The above is the "Race baiting" comment I was referring to.
That comment does NOT appear on the site you supplied the link to.
If you ARE quoting someone else, please supply the proper link.
If you are NOT quoting someone else, the comment IS Racist and Race Baiting!


Will YOU take responsibility for this inflammatory distortion?

Translation: "The Jews killed my son."
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
15. Anyone that says Palestinians are human gets the anti-Semite label
by those Americans that support the extremists in Israel that are threatening to murder Sharon for pulling out of Gaza.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:01 PM
Response to Reply #15
25. nail on head.
thank you.
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quaoar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
19. Drudge is now trumpeting this as his lead story
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. This is the latest smear attempt by the rightwing
Edited on Sun Aug-14-05 12:04 PM by IndianaGreen
with the help of their enablers in the internet.

Here is the test:

You are standing in the middle of the road outside Bush's Crawford ranch.

On one side of the road is Cindy Sheehan together with other gold star mothers and their supporters.

On the other side of the road is rightwing radio personality Mike Gallagher with his gang of inbreds shouting "We don't care!" at Cindy's group.

In the distance comes the Bush SUV caravan on their way to a GOP fundraising BBQ.

What will you do? Will you walk over to the Cindy side of the road? Will you join the Gallagher goons? Or will you block the road to force Bush to stop and talk to Cindy?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #19
33. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
38. Deleted message
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liberaliraqvet26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:10 PM
Response to Original message
42. right wing jews always label anyone who...
critize anything done by the Israeli govt as ant semetic. they have been doing it for years.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. Sharon is rightwing, yet he is hated by the RW extremists
Terms like rightwing and leftwing do not fit neatly when applied to other countries, particularly Israel.

Anti-Semitism does exist in America, and can be found among the Left and the Right. What we got here though, is a GOP smear campaign against Cindy in which they are trying to smear her with anything they can.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:41 PM
Response to Original message
47. Lt. Col Karen Kwaitowski Career Military, NSA, State, NSC, Also a Reagan
appointee and was assigned to work with the OSP, has said there were 3 reasons for starting this war with Iraq

1. To protect Israel

2. To get our bases out of Saudi Arabia

3. To control the flow of oil in the middle east

As she would be a person to know, I tend to believe her. Stating the facts does not make Ms. Sheehan anti-semitic (actually, since most jews are of European decent very few of them are actually of semitic blood. Never made sense to me because to truly be an anti semite, one would have to be against the Palestinians) anymore than it makes Ariel Sharon the Pope.
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. Wrong!
From her interview in The LA Weekly:

What do you believe the real reasons were for the war?

KK: The neoconservatives needed to do more than just topple Saddam Hussein. They wanted to put in a government friendly to the U.S., and they wanted permanent basing in Iraq. There are several reasons why they wanted to do that. None of those reasons, of course, were presented to the American people or to Congress.

---snip---

So if, as you argue, they knew there weren’t any of these WMD, then what exactly drove the neoconservatives to war?

KK:The neoconservatives pride themselves on having a global vision, a long-term strategic perspective. And there were three reasons why they felt the U.S. needed to topple Saddam, put in a friendly government and occupy Iraq.

One of those reasons is that sanctions and containment were working and everybody pretty much knew it. Many companies around the world were preparing to do business with Iraq in anticipation of a lifting of sanctions. But the U.S. and the U.K. had been bombing northern and southern Iraq since 1991. So it was very unlikely that we would be in any kind of position to gain significant contracts in any post-sanctions Iraq. And those sanctions were going to be lifted soon, Saddam would still be in place, and we would get no financial benefit.

The second reason has to do with our military-basing posture in the region. We had been very dissatisfied with our relations with Saudi Arabia, particularly the restrictions on our basing. And also there was dissatisfaction from the people of Saudi Arabia. So we were looking for alternate strategic locations beyond Kuwait, beyond Qatar, to secure something we had been searching for since the days of Carter — to secure the energy lines of communication in the region. Bases in Iraq, then, were very important — that is, if you hold that is America’s role in the world. Saddam Hussein was not about to invite us in.

The last reason is the conversion, the switch Saddam Hussein made in the Food for Oil program, from the dollar to the euro. He did this, by the way, long before 9/11, in November 2000 — selling his oil for euros. The oil sales permitted in that program aren’t very much. But when the sanctions would be lifted, the sales from the country with the second largest oil reserves on the planet would have been moving to the euro. (emphasis added)


Finally, anti-Semitism is not about "blood line," but about discrimination against Jews. The term was created in the late 1800's to put a word on the rising hate and prejudice against Jews in Europe. Please consult a dictionary, and you will discover that anti-Semitism refers ONLY to discrimination against Jews. To 'devalue' the word is just another wat to dismiss and deflect discrimination against Jews!



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OldLeftieLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
48. It takes a very, very special kind of American patriot
to smear and defame a Gold Star Mother.

Yeah, take a bow, you worthless fucks.
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Moderator DU Moderator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-05 02:14 PM
Response to Original message
55. Locking as Inflammatory
Why do we ever give any bandwidth to such tripe?
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