Dean stiff Iowa deli to the tune of $900

[ringmastery]

http://whotv.com/Global/story.asp?S=1617677&nav=5ZinKQq4

Scott will tell you deliveries are a little different, especially one back on the 16th of this month. That was a big order for this small business of four employees. 200 brown bag specials...with turkey, roast beef, ham and veggie sandwiches. The total...$963.01.

As he headed out that day, Scott remembered this customer has paid its bills late a couple times before. So he promised delivery this time with one condition, "c.o.d."

He showed up at the customer's downtown office just in time for lunch. The Dean headquarters was utter chaos. But he couldn't find anyone who'd pay him. They said try the other building next door. Same answer next door, try the other building. Scott went back and forth for 20 minutes. Nobody would pay.

He just assumed they would pay in good faith. After all, Dick Gephardt's campaign paid its lunch bills on time. And Howard Dean has thousands of followers in Iowa. Can't one of them give Scott his money?

[Paragon]

1. Eyes rolling all over DU

Here's two more: :eyes:

[RummyTheDummy]

7. Nice response

I guess it's okay for the Dean campaign to stiff a small business owner out of a thousand bucks.

I mean after all, it is the DEAN CAMPAIGN.

Nice ethics.

[progressivebydesign]

34. Oh.. wake up people!

This kind of stuff happens all the time. It's not "ripping the small business off". It's utter chaos in the campaign. He has an axe to grind... THis was posted in the same spirit. What a stupid story. Rather than submit the bill.. he'd rather bitch to the media. Bush supporter much?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

48. Agreed. The entire article is written as a smear piece

[sangh0]

54. I also agree

This is typical. It happens in every campaign, even the ones that win and are well-funded (redundant?)

[kskiska]

55. Reminds me of the Hillary-didn't-tip-the-waitress

story when she was running in NY.

[TLM]

39. How about you submit an invoice to the AP dept.?

Running around asking volunteers to pay you a grand is just stupid.

You have to go to the folks who actually control the MONEY.

[progressivebydesign]

45. Precicely!

A bill that large CANNOT be paid out of cash. There has to be a paper trail for all purchases. And.. it has to be paid for with a check, for accounting purposes. 900 dollars worth of food for an office of people? Sounds more like a special order for an event... This is just a smear job due to an oversight. Campaign offices are pandemonium.

I mean.. would ANY of the candidates stiff a biz for food money? Really? Makes no sense. None. Even the dimmest of campaigners know that you would never do that. Lose millions in money spent on a campaign over 900 bux???? I think that people are jumping on this because the scream speech attacks weren't successful in pushing Dean down. It's just sad to see the levels to which people will stoop to attack candidates here.

[sleipnir]

2. It's a crime, and should be investigated by the WH, NOW!

As if we didn't have bigger crimes to investigate and trouble ourselves with.

I do see * and his minions prosecuting this to the end. I can only hope that Asscroft takes it up personally, so we can lay the smack down on him.

Forget the War, forget Plame, (wait, the WH already did), investigate Dean's lunch tab!!!!


Arggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


:eyes:

[mdmc]

3. Hi, I'd like to order a grand of food. To the RNC... Right

thank you. Pay as you go.

[funky_bug]

4. mmmm... grapes

Come on... has Scott sent an invoice or bill to Dean?

Really... I've heard of sour grapes... but sour salami? Come now...

[Paragon]

5. It's Deligate, folks.

This is serious.

[funky_bug]

9. Good point

I shouldn't have made light of it in an effort to defend against a needless slam against Dean tonight.

I'm sure if someone brings it to the camp's attention, they'll immediately rectify it.

Shit, that reminds me... I forgot to pay my phone bill. (Just kidding, but the point is... we all make honest mistakes.)

[AngryAmish]

30. heh

[bhunt70]

6. Did he get any Hamm?

[JohnKleeb]

8. hamm says if elected

He would put a stop to people conning delis. I dont trust him though, hes in debt to the meat industry plus he likes to con lemonaide girls. Sorry for bringing in an outside joke. This doesnt seem like that big of a deal to me RE: Dean honest.

[progressivebydesign]

52. I'm out of the loop! I know about Joe-mentum.. what is Hamm??

I keep seeing that this morning... I'm so lost!

[countmyvote4real]

10. And then there's the NH waitress that's going to vote Repuke

because she thought the Dems were bad tippers. They were probably press people, but still. This isn't good. I hope the IA Dean people will address this. True or not, it makes us all look bad.

[mikehiggins]

11. This is why cash matters to campaigns

Most companies familiar with campaigns only operate on C.O.D.

Whether its the phone company or the leasing company or the printer or whatever, the smart guys do not extend credit to a candidate. The ones who do get stiffed, almost every single time. There is almost always something more important to spend that money on and once the campaign shuts down, like Gephardt's did, and CMB's and Senator Graham's just who do you approach for payment?

The candidate doesn't sign invoices, his campaign does. No campaign, you're out of luck.

The two million bucks the Clark campaign raised in the last week is what makes the difference. Cash in hand trumps promises every day of the week.

That's why Dean and Clark both can see themselves out lasting Edwards and the others as long as they have to. Kerry might be a different story but getting big donations from big companies will be a big mistake in this campaign.

Money is the lifeblood of a campaign and the smart pols never forget it.

[Loren645]

12. Vincent Hamm would never stiff a deli.

He'd give the meat off his back before he'd do that.

[Hoppin_Mad]

13. He admits they always paid their bills before (late)

What makes him, or this bush league reporter ( A Dean supporter should pay the bill !) think, or suggest that the campaign won't pay this one ?

What a crock of shit.

There's nothing too trivial for the bashers.

[chimpymustgo]

14. Just pay the dang bill. Quit dead beating.

The guys is running a small business - that's a big loss for him.

[mikehiggins]

15. I think Clark should pay that bill

We overshot our $2 million fundraiser goal and have some money left over. It'd be a nice gesture to the small business man if we sent some of that extra bucks over to Iowa to help out.

We may need the deli vote in November.

[chimpymustgo]

16. That is actually a GREAT pr move, especially since Clark skipped Iowa.

Edwards and Kerry should offer as well. LOL.

[maddezmom]

17. maybe they all can chip in and pay the bill :)

[THUNDER HANDS]

18. well we all knew Dean is a tightwad

Personally, it's sad to see his campaign is too.

[Cassandra]

24. Do we even know...

who made the phone call? What if it was someone else (repukes?). I would think that if the Dean campaign had been hungry enough to order food, someone would have been running around the building looking for the money to pay.

[progressivebydesign]

37. We ALL know that? We do?

I didn't know that. He's a tightwad? Really? Based on what facts.. do tell!

[THUNDER HANDS]

44. I think he referrs to himself as a tightwad

Him and his wife rarely spend any money. Personally speaking he's very frugal. His campaign though, is probably spending like drunken sailors if you're to believe the talking heads on tv.

[progressivebydesign]

46. Frugal.. he uses the word.. frugal.

Tightwad is a negative term. Frugal is something else entirely.

[Loonman]

19. Way to go supporting small business, Dean!

LOL......

[bearfartinthewoods]

20. very funny

i wonder how anyone would feel if they didn't get paid this week?

a thousand bucks is likely more than his profit for the week. dean's
campaign sent that guy home without any money to support himself and/ or his family that week.

[Clark Can WIN]

21. I hope they take care of this immediately. Not to do so would be

terribly dishonorable. To make a small business owner wait this long is already disgraceful.

[drfemoe]

22. n.m.

[molly]

23. I just saw him on CNN - he is a very angry

man. He blames everyone but himself for his slide.

[surfermaw]

26. Sour Grapes...have you ever smelled them before

Even if this is true,don't you think mistakes are made every day, do you want to elect a democrat, or do you want to see George Bush back in the White House..keep up junk like this and it is almost a sure thing, we will be looking at republicans for four more years.

[molly]

31. I want an adult Democrat who is electable - that is why

I support John Kerry. :toast:

[progressivebydesign]

36. You're joking, right? n/t

[TexasPatriot]

42. yeah

he's not going to go quietly into the night is he... he's going to go yearghing.

I hope the Dean people pay that bill before the Bush people do. Man wouldnt that be an embarrassment.

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[progressivebydesign]

40. "Chubbie Deanie Babies"????

Umm... why is this thread so personal? Are people really nervous about Dean doing well in New Hampshire. The personal attacks are rampant against him.

[southerngirlwriter]

43. Having worked in food delivery for years, I can tell you...

that your suggestion works on a small order. On a huge order like the one described -- over 200 sandwiches -- you have to set the stuff down, haul in the extras (napkins, mustard packs, etc.), and try to make some order out of the situation. What's he supposed to do, stand in front of the table where he's set the food with his arms outstretched and say, "No one gets around me till it's paid?"

Besides, why should he have to treat the campaign of a Presidential candidate the way delivery drivers are trained to treat suspicious-looking teenagers???

Is it too much to hope that a major Presidential candidate is going to treat a small businessman with respect and decency and common honesty? He should have been handed the money plus a sizeable tip ON THE SPOT.

That's what an honorable campaign would have done.

[askew]

27. This exact story was being sent around about Gephardt about 3 weeks ago.

Except it was before the caucus and because the owner was stiffed he would no longer support Gephardt in the caucus and was looking at Dean. So, while I do believe that it is possible that someone forgot to pay a bill. I am sure, if this was a true story it could have been straightened out by now. So, I am leaning towards useless rumors being circulated.

[Robb]

32. Just more negative campaigning

...by the Ham Sammich 04 camp. :silly:

[diamondsoul]

28. I'm inclined not to believe the story-

HOWEVER

Dean supporters making light of this, calling it "sour grapes" and repeating the defense of Howard Dean without knowing for certain should be ashamed.

Doubting it is fine, I doubt it, simply because most people who demand c.o.d. don't give up the goods without the payment, period. If I had been this guy and the claims were true, I'd have flat said "I have your food, and you'll get it as soon as the money is paid, as promised CASH ON DELIVERY means cash on delivery.".

My problem with the responses is this, some here imply that the deli guy was stupid, gullible, or otherwise womehow at fault for what he claims is a failure on the part of his client- The DEAN Campaign, to pay their bill. He trusted the staff of a freakin' candidate for the Presidency of this country to treat a small business owner right, and somehow HE'S to blame???:wtf:

Look Dean folks, here's how it works- any allegations against your candidate's campaign staff ARE allegations against your candidate. Why? Because ultimately HE is directly responsible for overseeing their behavior. He started this thing, he hires and fires or hired the guy/gal he trusts to do so on his behalf, and it IS HIS RESPONSIBILITY.

So you have doubts? No problem, so do I, but don't dismiss it without even bothering to check with the campaign, and most assuredly don't blame the guy who is the alleged victim here. That's just BS. If Joe Trippi were accused of accosting a woman on staff, would you claim it isn't Dean's problem and that the woman asked for it or was gullible?!

[southerngirlwriter]

33. I am utterly appalled by what I'm hearing in this thread.

This is not a "broad brush" statement, although I'll risk my very first moderator warning to say this.

The Dean supporters here who are making light of this truly frighten me. It's probably not true, of course -- but if it is, then the campaign of a man who wants to be President has STOLEN nearly a thousand bucks from a small business.

This is a joke? This is worthy of eye-rolling?

Great. Nice to know DU is so full of rich people that 900 bucks means nothing. PM me for my address. You can all send me 900 bucks, since it's such a nothing amount of money that it's worthy of an eye-roll and scoffing at.

Aside from, several months ago, expressing a slight preference for Edwards, I have stayed out of this primary, even declaring over and over again my intention to vote for ABB. I still have just a slight preference for Edwards, not a rabid one, and will not be working for anyone's campaign.

However.....I am going to investigate this story. If it's true, then the combination of the THEFT from a SMALL BUSINESS on behalf of a candidate's campaign and the DISGRACEFULLY ELITIST attitude of his supporters here will be enough to keep me home in November if he's the nominee.

What is the difference between voting for someone who steals from the poor to help the rich and voting for someone who steals from a struggling small business to feed the rich lunch?

There is no difference.

Dismayed and appalled,
sgw

[progressivebydesign]

35. "stolen"????

You know you really are risking it here. To say that a man who did not get his deli bill paid had money "Stolen" by Howard Dean is egregious. Howard Dean does not personally pay the bills of his campaign. Have you had absolutely no political experience? The office handles that.. the treasurer writes the bills. Things are crazy... it's an oversight. AND.. it's a smear against Dean. What some people won't do to attack candidates on DU. It's sad.

And.. I bet that man has been paid by now.

[southerngirlwriter]

38. Have you ever worked in food delivery?

I have. When you deliver food and they refuse to pay you, it's called theft. People go to jail for that. It gets reported to the franchise, the insurance company, and to the police as a ROBBERY.

By your logic, we can't hold * responsible for what people in the White House do. After all, it's the office. He can't be responsible for what everyone in his administration does, can he?

[TLM]

50. Yes in fact I have.... and with large orders and large bills...

Are never paid in cash by random employees or volunteers. Rather large orders are handled on a credit card BEFORE delivery... or in the case of catering services on an invoice basis.

I really don't believe this story. No food service business owner who does any level of volume service would make a 1000 bucks in food without some form of deposit or without getting a credit card.

And they would not run around trying to get paid by random volunteers, but rather would submit an invoice to the campaign.


This is BS.

[progressivebydesign]

51. I disagree.

The man has already stated that campaigns "always pay their bill late". He accepts billing on the orders. For GOd's sake, are you so hepped on attacking Dean that you would insinuate that they stole this food? Be reasonable. The guy bills the candidates. A political office does not keep 900 bux around.. it has to be billed with an invoice and paid by check. It's an oversight. If you're looking for a smoking gun on Dean.. look elsewhere. I do find it amusing to see people on DU accusing Howard Dean himself of stealing the money. That's priceless.

[southerngirlwriter]

53. What I find amusing

is the way that rapid supporters of various candidates go around assigning feelings and motives to other people.

Get this through your head. I DO NOT CARE WHO THE FUCKING NOMINEE IS. Even Sharpton would be a better choice than Bush, and I will vote for any Democrat on the ticket -- including my cat -- in November before I will vote for Bush UNLESS that Democrat gives me a very good reason not to. As I won't vote for Bush, that means the unenviable choice of staying home, something I have never done. I registered to vote at 8:00AM on my 18th birthday.

I have no strong negative or positive feelings about any candidate, again, excepting already expressed slight preference for Edwards.

The Dem candidate stealing from a small business is reason enough for me to stay home. I would say this if it was Edwards's campaign that had STOLEN 900 dollars worth of products from a small business. IF this story is true and the man doesn't get paid in short order, I will stay home. It has nothing to do with it being Dean whose representatives STOLE from this man. If my Grandmother were running for President and her campaign STOLE 900 bucks from a small business, I wouldn't vote for her, either.

We all understand that you love Dean, okay? You don't have to prove the depths of your devotion by defending him no matter how egregiously bad his and/or his campaign's behavior. No one is doubting your loyalty oath.

Reading this forum makes me feel like I need a shower. Now I know why I logged out of DU and didn't log back in for a month. Time to sign out again. Sheesh.

[diamondsoul]

49. No he doesn't but HE IS RESPONSIBLE

for making sure HIS bills ARE paid. It doesn't matter if that bill comes from the deli guy's hand or the Mortgage company halfway around the world. The BILL APPLIES TO HIM AND HIS STAFF!

OMG, the ridiculous lengths people will go to to excuse really criminal behavior is sickening. I don't know that I believe the story, as I asserted in the post this person above responded to, but do try reading the arguments presented before you defend "eat and run" crimes, please.:eyes:

[AntiCoup2K4]

29. Are the media whores desperate or what?

They get a week's worth of mileage out of a 2 second scream and when that fails to do the job they bring up a fucking deli tab??

Anybody having 1992 flashbacks yet? The media whores are after Dean even worse than Clinton. That should speak volumes. They ain't looking at Al Sharpton's lunch history, are they?

[progressivebydesign]

41. Okay.. what the hell is "who tv"??

Where does this story come from? The bill is already paid. I'm certain of it. If you've ever worked in a campaign.. you cannot just hand over 900 bux when the deli guy shows up. The bill is submitted, and the treasurer writes the check. Often, in the campaigns I've worked in, the bills are paid late.. not because they are "STEALING" or "STIFFING" the biz owner, but because the treasurer is not in the office where the items are being delivered, or someone with the authority to spend that much money is not available. It's a fucking oversight people!

I'm amazed at how quickly people flock to this stuff, regardless of the candidates, on DU. We rail against the stupid voters for believing everything they hear in the media.. and then we jump on any story that confirms our biases against another candidate.

[incapsulated]

47. That's what I'd like to know..

whotv? what?