UTAH Rave Video -- PLUR meets HEIL

[aion]

If you folks have any plans to go a-raving, you may want to watch this video first.

http://www.aionblog.com/?postid=96

[tk2kewl]

1. i only get the sound

something wrong with the embeded player... i got it when i played it in the real player

[aion]

2. You probably need latest version of real player

[tk2kewl]

3. something wrong with the embeded player...

i got it when i played it in the real player

[Mr Rabble]

4. Holy shit. This is scary.

Will the MSM pick this up?

No chance.

[tk2kewl]

5. the guy who made the vid should submit it to Current

[GCP]

6. Holy crap - WTF happened there?

It looked like the army broke up a rave - with helicopters flying overhead the whole time.

[tk2kewl]

7. yep... i'll get you a link to a firsthand account

[tk2kewl]

9. Link to story

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/8/22/13030/7546

[pacalo]

8. "Put your camera down or you're under arrest." Fascism, indeed.

Un-be-lievable. What in heaven's name justified this?!

[aion]

10. From the Daily Kos story

Oh another interesting fact.. the police did not have a warrant. The owner of the land already has a lawsuit against the city for something similar. A few months ago, she rented her land for a party and the police raided that as well. And catch this, the police forced her to LEAVE HER OWN PERSONAL PROPERTY. That's right. They didnt arrest her, but made her leave her own property!!!

Don't get it twisted, this is all going down in probably THE most conservative state in the USA. And this is scary.. a gross violation of our civil liberties. The police wanted this party shut down, so they made it happen. Even though everything about this event was legal. The promoters spent over $ 20,000 on this show and did everything they had to to make it legit, only to have it taken away from them by a group of radical neo-con's with an agenda.

This was one of the scariest things I have ever witnessed in person. I can't even begin to describe how surreal it was. Helicopters, assault rifles, tear gas, camoflauge-wearing soldiers.... why? Was that really necessary?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/8/22/13030/7546

[SheepyMcSheepster]

11. wow, very scary. eom

[Squatch]

12. Sherrif's statement:

Link

Rave Party
Utah County Sheriff's Office shuts down Rave Party in Spanish Fork Canyon.

During the summer of 2005 the Utah County Sheriff's Office has seen an increase in the number of large Rave parties that have occurred within Utah County. Approximately four weeks ago the Sheriff's Office became aware of another possible Rave party that was to occur somewhere in Utah County on August 20, 2005.

Tickets were sold through a Salt Lake vendor, Uprock, for $20.00. Tickets could be bought in advance and directions to the exact location of the Rave would be provided on the day of the event.

Utah County mass gathering ordinance prohibits the gathering of two hundred and fifty or more persons without a permit, bond, and Utah County Commission approval.

[aion]

13. It was pitch-dark -- how would the sherrif know there was 250+ people

Sherrif's have spin-doctors too. This was a gross display of force. And since when did law enforcement officers begin covering their faces up like Sith?

[Squatch]

16. The helicopter with the spotlight?

:shrug:

[aion]

22. Hah!

They might suggest even something as high-tech as infra-red. The raid was well-coordinated, and the 'troops' were on the property by the time the ærial spotlights came on. Whirlybirds kick up a lot of dust and debris, and it's a bit silly to suggest that the DJs didn't notice a bright spotlight in the sky.

[Squatch]

24. So, you're an expert in surveillance, eh?

Utah County Major Crimes was contacted to assist with undercover surveillance.

[aion]

30. I never said I was an expert

But I did take 4 semesters of Logic as a part of my philosophy degree. You can't have it both ways.

It's difficult enough to prove #s via ærial cameras. Ask anyone who has any experience with daytime protest events where numbers are routinely under-estimated by governmental agencies. This was during the night, so one would reasonably conclude that it is made all the more difficult still.

Now I suppose you could argue that the Sith had a spy inside the ticketing operation, but that is nothing but pure speculation.

[Squatch]

32. Once more for the people in the back of the classroom...

Utah County Major Crimes was contacted to assist with undercover surveillance.

[aion]

34. Once more for those who can't see the point of the original thread

The police would need to prove that they knew a priori, as a matter of fact, that there were over 250 people. This knowledge has not been demonstrated. 'Undercover surveillance' is not a catch-all phrase to thwart logical inquiry. And don't hand me that bullshit line about protecting sources and methods.

[Squatch]

35. Well, here you go...

To wit:

At that point it was again verified that the Utah County Commissioner's office had no knowledge of this nor had a permit been obtained.

Utah County mass gathering ordinance prohibits the gathering of two hundred and fifty or more persons without a permit, bond, and Utah County Commission approval.

Hence:

Utah County Major Crimes was contacted to assist with undercover surveillance.

QED

[aion]

37. You have demonstrated nothing

Show me the part where they explain how they knew conclusively that there were 250+ people. Your explanation seems to stop right at that all-important juncture. If you know what QED means, then surely you know what 'a priori' means with regards to probable cause.

[Squatch]

38. And like I said, they had numerous surveillance assets, including

but not limited to, aerial observation, employing platforms that are equipped with both visual and other detection systems such as infra red and thermal imaging.

And, from the release:

It was verified that more than 250 individuals were at the party...

Presumably by employing one of these surveillance assets to determine, before the LEO raid, the number of people at the rave.

[aion]

40. Unlike you, I do not believe all that the government feeds me.

They know that they need to demonstrate a priori knowledge of the number in attendance. Therefore, they will claim, without specifics, that they determined this number properly before moving in. Remember how SURE the Bushistas were about Hussein?

I have read numerous accounts of the story, including the Salt Lake Tribune article, and nowhere does it say exactly HOW they knew the number in attendance. The SLT article claims that there were 400 people. So we're looking at the difference between 249 people and 400, in pitch-dark.

The probable cause affidavit would explain exactly and specifically how they knew this number.

[Scout1071]

42. So, they just came to do a quick head count with an army, helicopters,

dogs, tear gas, etc?

[tk2kewl]

14. it was my understanding that they had all the permits and

a $2 mil insurance policy

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/8/22/13030/7546

[Squatch]

17. I don't think we've heard the entire story...

[tk2kewl]

20. i certainly hope there is more too it than it appears so far

[pacalo]

15. Assuming the sheriff's facts are true, which conflict w/the kos poster's

account, what warranted the military coming out with guns & tear gas to do the sheriff department's job? This is wrong, wrong, wrong in America!

This is a legal concern, as I see it.

[Squatch]

19. Military? It looked like SWAT.

Like I said, I don't think we've heard the most accurate or complete story.

[tk2kewl]

23. according to the Utah Herald these guys are SWAT

http://www.harktheherald.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=62703&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0

[Squatch]

25. I figured as much. It would take an executive order from the

governor to mobilize the NG to assist in this action.

[tk2kewl]

26. there you go being all rational and shit

[Squatch]

28. Sorry, my bad.

:rofl:

[whistle]

18. Was that why Utah National Guard were brought in on a permit

...violation?

I think we are going to see much more of this around the country. Wait until the military draft begins.

[Squatch]

21. From the link: (no Nat'l Guard)

Utah County Major Crimes was contacted to assist with undercover surveillance. Both local and state SWAT teams were called in to control the crowds ( Utah County Metro SWAT, Utah Department of Corrections out of Salt Lake and Gunnison, Department of Public Safety and their helicopter and Provo SWAT) approximately 90 law enforcement personnel combined.

[whistle]

31. They were in military type camouflage outfits not SWAT blues

[Squatch]

33. You mean like these guys?

Grantsville, Utah SWAT team

[aion]

36. Wikipedia on Gestapo

The Gestapo was established on April 26, 1933, in Prussia. With members recruited from professional police departments, its role as a political police force was quickly established by Hermann Göring after Adolf Hitler gained power in March 1933. Rudolf Diels was the first head of the organization, initially called "Department 1A of the Prussian State Police".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gestapo

[wli]

27. looks like a large number of lawsuits can be filed

1. violating Posse Comitatus (criminal)
2. numerous counts of false arrest (criminal)
3. numerous counts of assault and aggravated assault (criminal)
4. 4th amendment violations (criminal)
5. 1st amendment violations (criminal)
6. civil suits for various forms of harm, medical costs, etc. (civil)
7. civil suits for the promoters' financial losses (civil)

Probably more. Sounds like deep legal doo doo for the offenders here, unless (of course) the case is heard by Federalist Society Klansmen.

[evermind]

29. So... anybody for Salt Lake City Mayor's anti-Bush protest??

I wonder how it will be policed?

Rocky calls for Bush protest

Mayor angers some Republicans, war vets

By Bob Bernick Jr. and Lisa Riley Roche
Deseret Morning News

Salt Lake City Mayor Rocky Anderson has angered a few Republicans, and perhaps a few foreign war veterans, by calling for Utahns who oppose President Bush's environmental stands, the Iraq war and other Bush policies to protest when the president visits Utah's capital city next week.
Bush is scheduled to address the 15,000-member Veteran of Foreign Wars convention in the Salt Palace on Monday.
Anderson, a Democrat who serves in an officially nonpartisan office, sent an e-mail Friday to selected environmentalists, Democrats and a few of his top administrative staff. It said of Bush's visit: "Don't let him come to Utah and not see huge opposition, even in the reddest (most Republican) state. This would send such an important message. A tepid response will just send a message of apathy and resignation."
Anderson went on to write: "Let the Bush administration — and the world — hear from Salt Lake City!!! The advocacy community should be organizing the biggest demonstration this state has ever seen!"

http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,600157220,00.html

(See also: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4424317&mesg_id=4424317 )

The forum at http://www.404audio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14814 has 9 pages of reaction to the rave story, with a few posters linking to different videos of the events (which I haven't viewed).

[SoCalifer]

39. The way I see shit like this

Is that these American hating, Nazi, God Damn Sons of Bitches are waging war on American citizens and the Constitution itself. There is NOTHING else to call shit like this.

And as long as Americans are attacked this way, I for one can hardly wait for the day when we all band together and (under the red, white & blue colors of "our" flag and the Don't Tread On Me flag) once again lay the smack-down on all these nazis.

Then sit back and enjoy some popcorn and listen to all their pathetic "I was just following orders" excuses.


I took the liberty to slighty edit this great speech:

It is natural for man to indulge in the illusions of hope. We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth, and listen to the song of that siren till she transforms us into beasts. Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty?

I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience. I know of no way of judging of the future but by the past. And judging by the past, I wish to know what there has been in the conduct of the American ministry of police for the last ten years to justify those hopes of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness with which gentlemen have been pleased to solace themselves. Is it that insidious militarization of our civilian police forces and the legislating away of our freedoms for the promise of security?

Trust it not, sir; it will prove a snare to your feet. Suffer not yourselves to be betrayed with a kiss. Ask yourselves why these peaceful gatherings, and peaceful protests are received with those warlike preparations which darken our land and subvert our Constitution. Are armies outfitted with war materials against lawful citizens necessary to a work of love from our government? Have we shown ourselves to be so unwilling to reconcile with those within our government who subvert our Constitution that force must be called in to win back our love? Let us not deceive ourselves, sir. These are the implements of war and subjugation; the last arguments to which kings resort. I ask gentlemen, sir, what means this martial array, if its purpose be not to force us to submission? Can gentlemen assign any other possible motive for it? No, sir, she has none. They are meant for us: they can be meant for no other. They are sent over to bind and rivet upon us those chains which the American ministry of police have been so long forging.

And what have we to oppose to them? Shall we try argument? Sir, we have been trying that for the last forty years. Have we anything new to offer upon the subject? Nothing. We have held the subject up in every light of which it is capable; but it has been all in vain. Shall we resort to entreaty and humble supplication? What terms shall we find which have not been already exhausted? Let us not, I beseech you, sir, deceive ourselves.

Sir, we have done everything that could be done to avert the storm which is now coming on. We have petitioned; we have remonstrated; we have supplicated; we have prostrated ourselves before all the thrones within our government, and have implored its interposition to arrest or impeach the tyrannical hands within its ministry of police and its own offices. Our petitions have been slighted; our remonstrances have produced additional violence and insult; our supplications have been disregarded; and we have been spurned, with contempt, from the foot of the throne! In vain, after these things, may we indulge the fond hope of peace and reconciliation.

There is no longer any room for hope. If we wish to be free--if we mean to preserve inviolate those inestimable privileges for which we have been so long contending--if we mean not basely to abandon the noble struggle in which we have been so long engaged, and which we have pledged ourselves never to abandon until the glorious object of our contest shall be obtained--we must fight! I repeat it, sir, we must fight!

.

[Cult]

41. Link with first hand accounts on DU

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4425241