just where the hell is the american opposition?

[Bhaisahab]

sorry for intervening in an internal american issue, but it is really amazing that the righteous rage at bushco seen at DU is completely missing in the political party DUers vote for - the democratic party. if this was happening here in india, given the monumental white lies and cheating indulged in by bushco, the opposition would have crippled parliament through walk-outs and sit-ins, and grabbed every opportunity to stage nationwide mass rallies against the govt.

why are the people you all elected saying the same bullshit the rightwing is saying? why are they not uniting and leading the opposition to bush?

just asking because its really strange, considering america is supposed to be democracy-r-us, and not a one party state.

[IdaBriggs]

1. Damn Good Question -- Not ONE Good Answer.

I think they are practicing the "can't we all just get along?" philosophy of SITTING ON THEIR COLLECTIVE BUTTS hoping to find a way to not get targeted by the GOP's money machine in the next election cycle.

[AtomicKitten]

2. Well, more Americans than not

think BushCo sucks. Now if we can just herd them together.

[wli]

3. same place it was during Nazi Germany in the late 1930's

Either rolling over for the reich wing, apathetic, or cowed.

[Bhaisahab]

6. so why dont you folks replace them?

i'm serious. the elections are next year right? how about if all eligible DUers pledge to give elections a shot? just a little pledge, just like a new year's resolution. maybe 10% of those who pledge will actually give it a serious try. maybe out of that 10% five or six could go on to fight the elections. and who knows, maybe a couple could win. that will make a 'small at first but big in the long run' difference, i'm sure. maybe bartcop won't have to photoshop pink tutus on democrat faces after 2006. who knows guys. its america after all. anything's possible!

[wli]

8. I'm looking at getting involved somewhere.

I'm not sure yet, but the BOE or similar sounds like a good idea.

[hootinholler]

10. With whom?

The corruption embodied in this government spreads across the aisle. THe power structure of Congress is such that to really accomplish something you need the majority.

Over the past 20-30 years the best was to hope for one party in control of each house, thus, limiting the damage that can occur.

The other issue is it take at leat a million dollars to run for a seat in the house. More to run for the senate. How can anyone raise that kind of money and not be beholden to someone.

-Hoot

[Bhaisahab]

11. maybe state funding for candidates

would solve the money problem. here too parliament is debating state funding for election candidates. its one way to check corruption at its root.

[hootinholler]

13. Now you see the catch-22

You need control of the congress to reform it.

I would run, but, I would loose.

-Hoot

[magnetism]

47. no way!

We had the majority for DECADES. We can get it back. Paagal is right. Start small and grow the movement. Get the message out and change will happen.

[SeanQ]

33. Some of us are looking for good DU minded candidates -

that's why Paul Hackett got so much support from here. Hopefully many more will turn up in the 06 elections.

Unfortunately getting elected in the states costs a lot of $$ just to get started. It's a deterrent when you already have a dem in office who has been using their DC influence and connections to raise funds already. A challenger needs to have enough capitol to win a primary and then compete in the main election.

And the appeasers and long-term insiders in the party in DC are not going to give one of us an iota of help. So until Dean is sufficiently empowered in the DNC to shove the current house leadership aside when needed and help/fund candidates directly from the national coffers, there is a steep start up cost.

Personally, if I didn't live in Eastern Massachusetts I'd still go nose around my local Dem office and start getting to know people and would seriously consider running if my rep was a repug or DINO. Even if all it meant was putting a little local pressure on them and getting a little free press to voice some opposition questions.

Hopefully many people out there are considering it, or at least looking around them for possible candidates.

[Toots]

36. You live in a Democratic Nation, America is a Fascist Nation

Money does all the talking around here. If you don't have access to over a million dollars then you have no voice. Big money sticks together.

[Proud_Lefty]

61. We gotta tackle the voting problems

Or any election held won't serve democracy, only the Republicans who bought the machines to manipulate the votes to a Bush supporter win.

[whirlygigspin]

4. there is no opposition

Unfortunately over 50% of Americans just tune it all out, choosing to Merrily drive off the cliff of history in a shiny SUV.
weeeeeeeeeeeee!



paagal bigrio?

[theHandpuppet]

5. I've been wondering the same thing

Well.... not wondering, really, since they're still where they've been since Jan 2001 -- hiding under the bed until (they hope) the storm blows over. Come out, come out, wherever you are!

If it wasn't for a few Dems like Conyers and Hackett, the Dem party would be virtually invisible. Opposition party? What a laugh. If they can't mount some aggressive and vocal opposition with Bush's numbers at 36%, then it makes me believe they're all dipping from the same trough. I know that's harsh, but at this point, what else is a person to believe?

[CrispyQ]

46. You have the beginnings of an excellent LTTE in your mini-rant!

If they can't mount some aggressive and vocal opposition with Bush's numbers at 36%, then it makes me believe they're all dipping from the same trough. I know that's harsh, but at this point, what else is a person to believe?

Or perhaps you should consider writing & sending it to every dem rep & senator. I think the next DU Activist challenge should be for each of us to write a letter to all the dem reps & senators expressing our outrage at their lack of outrage.

[European Socialist]

51. I said pretty much the same thing yesterday-and got my thread locked.

Makes you wonder what's happening here at DLC Underground.

[democrank]

7. Good question.

Unfortunately, in order to be seen as a patriotic citizen here in America, one must buy a yellow ribbon car magnet and keep quiet. If that rule isn`t followed, the Republican political machine (with the help of corporate media) will come after you with vengeance. This rule applies even if you`re a Vietnam War veteran...unlike Chickenhawk Bush or Chickenhawk Cheney...or an Iraq War veteran...or the parent of a slain soldier.

Progressive Democrats who dare post a negative comment here about the DLC (the Republican wing of the Democratic Party) frequently receive a few replies from other Democrats admonishing them for dissenting. In other words, accept the status quo and shut up. Everything is beautiful. No cause for alarm.

[ElectroPrincess]

9. We have NO, repeat NO National Media Coverage ...

We ARE out there but the Corporate led boot licking National USA media machine - is only focusing on "Everything Bush-Co." When the forgoing grows old, they attempt to fill our time with hype of the most inane order.

With the exception of a few outlets, we are TINY in the investment and corporate media world.

The republican led noise machine dutifully repeats the lies. It's a sick situation. :(

But SOME very important leaks are surfacing ... hope springs eternal: Drip drip drip ...

[Vinca]

12. I'm perpetually angry about this very question.

Where are our elected Democrats? Why do only a small handful truly represent us? Voting them out or running against them is tricky business because we strive for a majority in both houses. Votes in congress are almost more important than votes from citizens. An unknown DUer might run, split the vote and a Republican could get the seat. I'm not saying they shouldn't be challenged, but it would take a VERY special candidate who was sure to win. IMHO, the vast majority of us are better used pestering the hell out of our elected officials until they listen.

[electropop]

25. We need to support progressives in the primaries.

But once we have our Dem candidates, we have to stand behind them, whomever they are. Better watered down Dem than pure evil Puke.

[Vinca]

44. I agree completely. Try for what we really want in the primaries,

vote for whichever candidate floats to the top in the general election.

[NJCher]

14. truth of the matter is

Almost the entire elected body is out of touch with the citizenry. Republicans and Dems alike. There is no representation of the people (save for Conyers, Waters, et al) because the represented are the people who bought and paid for these senators and congressional reps.

Yeah, it could turn around but there's a long, long way to go.


Cher

[WhoWantsToBeOccupied]

15. "why are the people you all elected..." WE DIDN'T. Elections = fraud

[Wabbajack]

16. Neither a walk-out or "sit-in"

would accomplish anything.

[burythehatchet]

23. Nonsense. That's what non-violent resistence is all about

the other course is violent resistance.

[Le Taz Hot]

27. Bullshit!

Tell that to Ghandi and MLK.

LTH

[Wabbajack]

29. #1 Dems walk out of congress

pubs pass mesures unanimously.


#2 Dems "sit in". In the house that's meaningless. In the Senate they can fillbuster and object to unanoymous consent measures, and the pukes with full media backing against the "shamefull unconstitutional obstructionism of the Democrats" will use the nuclear option to change the rules so a majority can do as they please.

[democrank]

35. Earth to Wabbajack......

Sit ins and walk outs don`t accomplish anytjing? Did your high school history books have a few chapters ripped out?

[Wabbajack]

53. Please read post 29

I'm talking about members of congress doing this to "shut down" congress. It would not work and would only make things worse.

[endarkenment]

17. isn't the ancient tradition of eunuchs familiar to you?

'cause that is what the Democratic "leadership" is composed of. I couldn't agree more. Where is the anger? Where is the outrage? Why are these spineless gutless fools standing by while we slide into fascism and drag the world into a conflagration it could easily avoid?

[SeanQ]

37. Not all are (Boxer, Conyers, Kennedy, Lee to name a few)

But yes, the vast majority of them seem to be next to useless at the moment, with more than half unwilling to even support those that will stand. Lieberman and the DLC and their ilk have convinced them that being the nicer republicans is a safer path to reelection - as if getting reelected should be the top priority of anyone with moral values in this freaking disaster!

The other problem paagal is that we do not have a true parliamentary system. We lack many of the excellent checks on power that a full parliamentary system provides, so many of the tactics used in your government are simply not real options here. Personally I would _love_ to see a real yearly full question period for our presidents and members of their cabinet!

[endarkenment]

40. yeah well that is why I qualified the ball-less wonders by 'leader'

The DLC 'new dem' corporate whores have done a good job of marginalizing everyone in congress who is not with the program.

This shit has got to break.

[niallmac]

18. We are too comfortable

in an ever desperate sort of way. Magnetic car stickers is all the revolution you are seeing now.Those of us who actually take peacefullly to the streets are showing others how it is done.
Will $3.00 gas be an economic tipping point? I don't know.
What will be the political tipping point? The only hope for this democracy in my miind is
a voter revolution. People must finally question this rah rah BS and realize this is their country. The U.S.does not belong to the Bushes or G.E. or Radical Cleric Pat Robertson or even to namby pamby politicians on both sides of the aisle.
I'm going to break into a rendition of This Land Is Your Land in a minute because I am into my second cup of coffee but do I not speak some truth oh my brothers and sisters? Verily?

[vickitulsa]

20. I think you do speak the truth

and I've got my autoharp out and tuned up, ready to accompany you as you sing out loudly on the chorus of This Land Is Your Land!

But the problem with the co-opting of our election process so that the ones we WISH to put in office are often NOT ending up there is monumental.

I just turned on the morning news on MSNBC to see that there is now violence occurring at gas pumps across the nation as the prices reach an alltime high. This signals something important, and is what I've been predicting for a long time, having worked in the energy industry (as they like to think of themselves these days, but it's really just the same old Big Oil of the Bushes) for 33 years.

One man was killed at a gas station and at another a clerk was stabbed by a "customer" when he tried to stop him from stealing over $50 worth of gasoline! Now THIS is going to bring some action from some quarters, I can almost promise you, folks.

IF the war in Iraq had delivered the assured crude oil supplies that Bushco *promised* it would, things would be different. But IT HAS NOT DONE THIS!!

And there are no signs that such assurance will be forthcoming, either. The "insurgents" are not stupid, and they are attacking the oil pipelines in Iraq in all parts of the country faster than the Americans can get the Iraqi repair crews they've trained out to do the crucial repairs. I think our enemies recognize that this crude oil supply business is even more important to most Americans than the attacks on U.S. soldiers or Iraqi soldiers and police or even innocent Iraqi civilians. When the PAIN AT THE PUMP gets this bad, the public here within American shores will get mad enough to DO SOMETHING, IMO.

And when they make the connection that Bush LIED about how this war in Iraq was going to ease our pain when we fill up our gas-guzzling vehicles at the local petrol stations, even Bush supporters are going to be hard pressed to keep on praising him and his lying cabal for the great "victory" in Iraq!

I have believed it is this very thing -- the unceasing increase in gasoline prices to Americans -- that WILL cause many to rise up and protest a war that is not resulting in any of the "rewards" for average U.S. citizens that W promised.

Frankly, I am willing to endure the pain in order to see my beloved country AWAKENED to the nature of the enormous FRAUD that has perpetrated upon us.

~VV

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Mich Otter]

19. Americans prefer the bliss of ignorance.

Most Americans have bought the propaganda that we are the best. They won't take an interest in what others are doing that we can learn from. It is foolish to assume we cannot get better.

[burythehatchet]

21. not enough f***ing curry in the diet

[Burried News]

43. I don't think your not PC - but you are very funny.

Still laughing.

[paineinthearse]

22. Feingold gets it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2028238

Framing it in terms of national security.

[mopinko]

24. the real control is who gets on the ballot

we are supposed to have a people's house, but the party decided who to support. usually, the party picks the candidates. an ordinary person will be allowed, and maybe even given some support, IF they feel they have no chance. but if the seat is really open, a carefully chosen person will run. and if you DO get elected, but do not tow the line, you will face a well funded challenger, and plenty of bad media attention, in your next election.
everything the government does these days is about money, and who gets it. we have a corrupt kleptocracy. and the media is avery much a part of it. the watch dog is a lap dog.
maybe we, the liberal bloggers "in piss stained pajamas" out here telling the truth, will change things. cuz truth is what is lacking here.

[welshTerrier2]

26. just where the hell is the Indian opposition?

the question you raised is exactly what most of us are fighting against ... the Democratic Party, for far too long, has failed to function as a real opposition party ... whether the motivation for this is that our Party has been taken over by the right-wing or whether it is just the result of misguided political calculation, we have few in the Party who represent us ... but the problems we face go way beyond internal political parties ... paagal, i see the problem as international, not national and certainly not just in the Democratic Party ...

look at the evil that is being cooked up for us all between your government and ours ... it's a story in today's headlines (not in the US, of course because Americans believe the world ends at their own borders) ...

here's a link to the article: http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=76774

The Indian Government has hired the most powerful lobbying firm in the US to help them "get around" some of the restrictive rules regarding the development of "advanced nuclear technology" ... the lobbying firm is made up of a veritable parade of former bush appointees including one guy who actively participated on bush v. Gore in Florida in 2000 ... what we have here is a situation where greater access to nuclear technology is being acquired by bribing the US Government by using the services of well-connected right-wing operatives ...

i'm glad to see citizens of other countries "intervening" in critical issues in the US because they have global implications ... it's the same reason that Americans need to start understanding that power, greed and corruption can't be addressed without looking beyond our own borders ...

so I would ask the same question of you that you asked of us: is there a "left-wing" in your country that is fighting against the promotion of "advanced nuclear technology" or have the greedy capitalists taken control of your government with little or no effective opposition?

[Bhaisahab]

58. there is a very strong left presence in the government

in fact, the left parties - communist party of india and communist party of india (marxist) - are propping up the centrist congress govt. if they withdraw support to the govt, it would collapse. which is why the pace of "reforms" (i.e. lets play catch up with america and create a consumption crazy middle class) is slowing down as left pressure is forcing the govt to address structural imbalances in india's economy.

regarding nuclear technology acquisition, the left's view on the recent pact between america and india on nuclear cooperation can be found here:
http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl2216/stories/20050812005500400.htm

[welshTerrier2]

59. thanks, paagal !!!

that was a great article you referenced ...

it was stunning after the type of media we now have in the US to see the comments from the Left actually published in the paper ... the Left in this country is nowhere to be seen ... hopefully that is changing ... we've been so ostracized by our own party that only now do we seem to be gaining some momentum ...

especially disturbing in the article you cited, and there are numerous indications of this, are the references to the coming confrontation between the US and China ... what a nightmare that's going to be ... i've read articles about China's oil contract with Iran that could be threatened if the US attacks Iran ...

in the US, we live in the belly of the beast but most of us are still sleeping ...

anyway, thanks for getting back to me ... it's great to find others around the world who take an interest in what's going on ...

[MadHound]

28. Well, we have this little problem,

It is called the two party/same corporate master system of government. This has become increasingly apparent over the past fifteen years, but it only with the Bush administration that people are starting to wake up.

And though people are finally starting to realize the truth, there is still that disconnect between realization and action. There are several things that we could do about this problem, but it seems that people don't wish to do them. For instance, we could vote for the Greens, who don't take corporate cash. But many many Democrats think that such a vote is pointless(though the truth is that if all of these naysayers would get out and actually vote Green, the Greens would win), and besides, they don't want to be tarred with the brush of being part of the "loony left"(though quite frankly anybody to the left of Attila the Hun is tarred with that brush)

We could also start working for publicly financed election campaigns, but that is going to have to happen on a state by state basis, which can be an exercise in herding cats, depending on a particular state's laws and legislature. In addition, there are many many other things on the left's plate, the largest of which is stopping this war.

And another factor is that steps are being taken, and a precious few of our Democratic leaders are speaking out against this misadministration. However when you have 95% of this nation's media controlled by five corporations, three of which are directly vested in the war machine, these outspoken leaders are either drowned out or ignored.

And quite frankly, many many of my fellow Americans are still too content, stressed or busy to do something about these problems. Thus, until things get worse, there will be no mass uprising to throw the bastards out. There is a note of hope though, due to the realities of this war finally hitting home, along with the strain of higher gas prices, a great many Americans are indeed starting to stir. So stay tuned, things might just get very interesting relatively soon.

[drm604]

30. The problem is at least partly due to our winner-take-all electoral system

It's an obsolete 18th century system that effectively prevents any third party from having a say. If another party does gain any amount of prominence at all, it simply ends up siphoning votes from the dominant party that is closest to it politically. This is what happened in 2000 with Nader. The electoral system needs to be changed for the good of the people, but neither of the parties in power has any incentive to do so.

As far as taking to the streets: It is happening in relatively small numbers now, mostly by people who have little to lose. Many of them are young people who as yet have no children and no financial responsibilities and therefore less to lose. Others are people who feel they have nothing to lose which is greater than what they've already lost - Cindy Sheehan, for example. Most people who have responsibilities and substantial things to lose are reluctant to risk it all and would rather watch others do it. As long as people are relatively comfortable and have more to lose than to gain most of them won't act. This is simply human nature, I'm not excusing it but it is what it is.

I think that this is slowly changing. As more people see loved ones killed or maimed in this war, and as gasoline prices continue to climb and place a greater and greater strain on people's budgets, more people will begin to act. As someone in another post noted, there have already been a number of unfortunate violent acts at gas stations. This is ABSOLUTELY NOT the proper way to act (it must be non-violent) but it does show that people are becoming desperate enough to act.

The other thing that may happen is that as more and more people start to act by speaking out and attending demonstrations, etc., others will feel more comfortable and secure in joining them. It will become more socially acceptable and less risky to speak out.

Give it time. I think it's happening. The fact that it was so long in coming doesn't speak well of the American people, but we are what we are. Comfortable people are unwilling to take risks, it's human nature. But I think that we're near the tipping point.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

31. Anyway, for what it's worth - it's here for downloading.....watch it.....

explains alot

There's Something in the Air but, it's NOT on the Airwaves

http://savefile.com/projects.php?pid=281090

[win_in_06]

32. To be fair

I don't think India is exactly a model democracy itself

[Bhaisahab]

56. oh no! my point is not to say we have a better democracy

our "democracy" is a fucking sham, that is to say its exactly like the american version - the rich call the shots, and the poor (who are a hundred times poorer than the poorest americans - i'm talking people who sell their children for a dollar's worth of provisions) are sandwiched between exploitative businesses and corrupt governments. dont get me started on the state of democracy in india. besides, as i always point out - india is nothing but a third-world america.

nope. my point was simply this - that regardless of the state of democracy in india, the opposition parties literally take the govt's ass if half a lie is discovered. of course there's no altruistic motive behind that. because when the opposition comes to power, they'll lie too. opposing a govt which is caught lying is basically a tactic to wrest power. and man, bushco has given the opposition in america so many blatant lies! its unbelievable they're not taking advantage!

it is from this perspective that i posed the original question.

[berni_mccoy]

34. I wholeheartedly agree.

I've been asking the Democratic members of Congress/Senate to force a STOP TO EVERYTHING... NO BILLS until impeachment is on the floor.

[mtnsnake]

38. The silence of our party spokespeople is DEAFENING and gutless.

It's my biggest pet peeve.

Good post!

[Mr Rabble]

39. dont bite the hand the feeds you.

For the most part, this is corporate fascism.

Left and Right are merely distractions.

[endarkenment]

41. Yes.

They don't care much about winning, they care more about not rocking the boat, keeping their comfy career paths, the vineyard vacation, the big ass house, the trophy wife, the whole nine yards of K-street corporate-whore career.

it is going to take a crack up of monumental proportions to blow this shit apart.

[GoBlue]

42. When you exclude the spoiled brats and the cowards who enable them

their ain't a whole lot of real opposition left... or right.

[snot]

45. Here's a plan

1. We must PUSH for election reform (auditable paper trails; no tabulation by private parties).

2. We must PUSH all efforts for media reform.

3. And maybe we need to form a resolution among ourselves, and officially inform the DNC, that we will not give one cent or drop of effort to help Dems who are not working for our priorities. In short, WE NEED TO ORGANIZE.

I think the list of priorities should be SHORT, or we'll be weakened through disagreement among ourselves.

[Lexingtonian]

48. well...

Every country has a somewhat different tradition. When things go wrong in France, the tactics of the French Revolution are revived. In India it's those of Gandhi.

Our quasi-unique trouble is that we're a traditionally colonial/colonizer society, multi-ethnic and multicultural and divided into de facto castes, and we've smashed into Modernity head-on. Other countries with more cultural and political unity have been able to sideswipe it, to draw out the process over more generations. But in the U.S. there are all the tensions and contradictions of both First and Third World countries. We have subsocieties that live rather exactly as their ancestors did in feudal medieval Europe in their minds, just with nicer technical gizmos; our political shorthand for them is the Christian Right. And places where the comparison is the barrios of Latin America and the slums of Lagos. Furthermore there is the Cold War, which we have materially survived by is psychologically not quite overcome. It did a lot to stifle social evolution and impoverish the country to the point where the worst social problems could not be deal with generously or carefully.

The effect has been as in other societies running into Modernity- there's a phase of embracing the increased economic opportunity and socially liberal attitudes, the idea that the future is progress and the Past essentially misery, and people elect progress-creating politicians. Then the limit of these things is reached, economically and socially; people arrive at the limits of the change they were taught good and reasonable and imaginable. Then the reactionaries show up and paint the Past as more orderly, reasonable, desirable, virtuous than the Present and not as bad as previously claimed. They promise to keep the 'good' changes (prosperity/war victories) and roll back the 'bad' ones (opportunity/rights to the oppressed, i.e. breakdown of government enforcement of caste/ethnic/gender/religious boundaries). The U.S. did the first phase of this, the relatively liberal time, from ~1932 to ~1968. The second phase of it has continued from ~1968 to the present.

I believe we are seeing this second phase come to and end; both have lasted half a normal lifetime each if that is so. This reactionary phase has simply had all the excesses that come from the Right wing and Conservative rule- a grotesque intensification of the traditional social hierarchy (and its abuses) as the public face, and an inevitable living in and recapitulation of the inadequately resolved Past as what it fills the time with. Under George Bush we have relived the arguments of the American 1960s, given the Vietnam game a second try in Iraq, and are now into the mid-1970s with the pace accelerating further. The silver lining to this dark cloud that refuses to lift is that, as a historical pattern, it means the end of the issues and this Past and the elites championing it as political matters. The people championing this Past were given all the power and wealth to refight those old fights to resolution; they've gotten the perfect second chances and blown most of them, changed a few unsettled matters to what they had to become. They're not getting a third chance: they're done, All That is done.

And that makes for this wierd political dynamic in this country. The older generations can't quite disentangle themselves from this reconfrontation with the (or, their) Past. The younger don't see what any of it has to do with themselves and that it's essentially irrelevant, beside the point, in the world of the present.

Older Democratic politicians are simply not stepping outside this national drama to resolve the national Cold War Past- they're simply more comfortable with it than with the present. Moderate and conservative voters are captivated by it, but as it drags on and refuses to be about a happy and tidy ending they're looking at their watches and slipping to the exits- and finding them locked. Liberal voters are the people who never liked the play or its actors.

And that's the wierd social dynamic at work. Modernity is too troubling to fully contemplate or make a political selling point, but Democrats are the party that the American People is telling to be the guides and ushers for it. They're unwilling and unsure of the role- it is hard. Republicans are the party of the Old Order of things, the feudal corporation and the feudal Church and feudal subordination- liege/slave- mentality and its occultism.

Protest is secondary stuff in this situation. The political dynamic of power is painfully simple- it's now all about the electorate, having given power to the Right, telling it to solve our problems. The Right has used up (and exploited) all the easy ones, so it's down to the hard ones and fundamental ones- and Reality is no easier on them than anyone else. And it fails, incrementally. Oil. Iraq. Taxes/debt. Their 'coalition' of Cold War debtors and former colonial powers. Al Qaeda continues to attack. The American economy continues to bleed wealth and jobs. Their politicians are slowly being caught in corruption almost comprehensively in a slow dragnet. On social issues they're stalling, knowing that any decisions (either way) about major issues will cost them wavering supporters.

What you're seeing now is a society that is incredibly exhausted, overall, by its internal fight (now running for 15+ years). Control is held, but ever more weakly, by a hardcore American Right also exhausted and hanging in there on sheer willpower, on desire, to fight the changing of their world. They're manic-depressive. There's nothing better they would like than to find some concrete Enemy to fight rather than keep facing their own failings and Reality at odds with their designs. That's why presently American "issues" are so wierd/beside the point and the responses to each other dysfunctional, like exhausted boxers at round 14 or 15, without punch. The game is about the Right's desire/will at this point, and they're struggling to maintain it. (If you watch George Bush much, that's an increasing emphasis of his.)

Since 1988 we, here in the U.S. political system, have used up four major political factions after brief periods of control and a bunch of Third Parties. The moderate (compromising/compromised) factions of both Parties are defeated. The weaker poles of the two political axes, the Left and the Conservatives, are defeated. We have the Right crumbling now.

Every midterm election seems to destroy the next powerholding faction's control in Congress. Liberals remain the last effective and intact faction- I believe we'll win next year and in '08, the electorate has a job for us to do to win the Culture War and clean up the worst of the wreckage. Our war is going to end in our victory. But as the Right dies we're seeing the moderates also slowly recovering; they're going to become our opposition.

[Burried News]

49. "The Right has used up (and exploited) all the easy ones,"

What were those? I don't see them as having solved any of those?

My read is they went to fear and war ASAP because there agenda is far more radical than your thesis supposes, and they could only rule by fear and distraction.

I'm not gounded enough in political theory to go much further with this but the reasonableness of your discussion in and of itself will prevent one from getting to the truth of what is going on here. Somebody is maneuvering both parties as has occurred in 20th century Germany and Russia.

To discuss this as an American historical/culturally determined phenomenon removes players from the scene that need to be at the center of a discussion. Your approach alows them to remove themselves from the spotlight and rework the crowd again. Frankly for all it's reasonableness it adds to the CONfusion.

[Lexingtonian]

52. uh, yes

""The Right has used up (and exploited) all the easy ones,"" What were those? I don't see them as having solved any of those?

I didn't say they solved them. They did just enough that Americans didn't demand any more change/action than what they did. The 2001 tax cuts. No Child Left Behind. Afghanistan. Saddam Hussein and the "embargo". Of course they (being fools and thieves) overreached, and now they're going to get punished.

My read is they went to fear and war ASAP because there agenda is far more radical than your thesis supposes, and they could only rule by fear and distraction.

That is not quite to understand their electorate. Their electorate was terrible during the late Clinton years- terrified of the way things (the world, American society) were changing despite the prosperity (which was disproportionately in Blue States, btw). The end of "morality" is what Henry Hyde said was taking place after the Senate voted to keep Clinton in office.

And these are people who lived through long stretches of the Cold War. They don't mind war so much as long as it doesn't cost themselves anything tangible. A lot of the reason the U.S. got into the Vietnam war as deeply as it did was frustration being taken out at the powerless and existential fear felt during the whole Cuban affair.

I'd love for you to point out what their "agenda" is- these sorts of people don't really have anything we term 'plans'...it's like asking a Hell's Angel where the gang is going. 'To Hell' is the correct answer, but they'll tell you somewhere on the map.

I'm not gounded enough in political theory to go much further with this but the reasonableness of your discussion in and of itself will prevent one from getting to the truth of what is going on here. Somebody is maneuvering both parties as has occurred in 20th century Germany and Russia.

I'm sorry, I don't agree with your paranoia and demonology. I'm convinced of the dreary and foolish banality of what is taking place. It's a weird occultism to think that the Democratic Party is part of a conspiracy or that somehow a few Democrats can step onto a podium and speak a spell that smashes the opponent. Howard Dean tried; it didn't persuade or really work. I see it as orthopraxis. As for those Sinister Forces, they're not exactly proving themselves by demonstrations of their strength. Just why they would let the Republicans collapse as they have rather than ride them to Glorious Victory?

To discuss this as an American historical/culturally determined phenomenon removes players from the scene that need to be at the center of a discussion. Your approach alows them to remove themselves from the spotlight and rework the crowd again. Frankly for all it's reasonableness it adds to the CONfusion.

I wouldn't go as far as Determinism. But what we are dealing with is, finally, the dying and burial of a lot of old ideas. Yeah, these boys are milking them for all they're worth, that's true. But the American electorate has, in its collective wisdom, always provided just enough political opposition to prevent the really fatal excesses.

A long time ago I was told not to go into politics professionally, that it was all immaturity being played out and ancient resentments being indulged. The longer I watch the more true it seems.

I don't think the conditions for dictatorship, or whatever it is you imagine, are really there. I believe Americans are where there is no distinct Enemy left, no one to do violence to that would do us any good. I believe the Right pretends otherwise at the moment but is itself no longer convinced. Might makes Right hasn't worked. More of the same is clearly going to lead to the same result. There's nothing left to believe in for the Right, nothing to evoke.

[Burried News]

54. Yes. I agree with your comment below and appreciate the reply.

"it was all immaturity being played out and ancient resentments being indulged. The longer I watch the more true it seems."

Some of the resentments are over 5,000 years old and they are a serious driver of events. Let's watch the DLC maneuverings as the CONs seek to have both horses in the 2008 race wear their colors.

[meppie-meppie not]

50. hear, hear! I ask this same question every day upon rising.

Amazing isn't it?

[lunchtime]

55. Sorry to be off topic here...

But I've never spoken to anyone in India before, and this question was the first thing that popped in to me head:

What's your take on the outsourcing of American jobs to your country? Is it a help or a hinderance to your nation?

[Bhaisahab]

57. i've aired my views on outsourcing here before

which is - outsourcing is a result of globalist-corporate greed, and countries like india are just taking advantage of it.

the prevalent view here is that outsourcing is making india a serious force in the globalized economy, and therefore is america's greatest gift to india. what most people do not seem to grasp is that outsourcing is not a "gift", its cold business. tomorrow, if angola or zimbabwe offer cheaper services, the outsourcing industry in india would collapse before you can say 'invoice.' which is why outsourcing industry leaders are now stressing on building india's quality of service and moving up the value chain. at a presentation, one analyst ended his slide show with - "they came for cost, but they will stay for quality."

a more regressive view that was often aired when i was employed at HP's outsourcing unit in Bangalore was that outsourcing is payback for the billions of dollars stolen from india by the french, british and portuguese between 1650 - 1947.

but that is a minority view - you could call it a redneck view.

i think Gandhi was a genius. I really want him back. You know what he said - he said that the economy of independent india should be local. Everyone should live in small, self-sufficient villages with local markets that stock anything one could ever need for a decent life (this does not include air conditioners and SUVs). people should be encouraged to distinguish 'needs' from 'desires', and focus on consuming only as much as the natural habitat surrounding them can allow. its not too difficult to achieve, that's the way we had been living for millenia. gandhi's vision of local economies could have been the "indian dream", as opposed to the "american dream" where every thing is super sized and where limitless consumption is encouraged.

[lunchtime]

62. Thanks for answering!

Jimmy Carter once suggested that Americans learn to live leaner, but that went over here about as well as dog poop in a hotel ice machine. I guess Americans had long since learned to consider air conditioning and materialistic consumption a way of life, much as it is in the rest of the Western world.

I have a feeling that it would be difficult to stuff that Genie back in the bottle, if large portions of the people in your country get used to consumption for sport. Living in Florida, I can't pretend for a minute that I could get by without air conditioning, so wishing you well in that regard would be hypocritical of me.

Has any of the money brought in by outsourcing helped your nation to develop public infrastructure, like roads, hospitals and public services, or were they already fine before the arrival of those companies? I ask because it would be nice if there was some kind of silver lining.

[gokar]

60. 911 has spooked Americans for atleast next 15 years

[Chemical Bill]

63. They get shot, die in crashes, anthraxed, etc . n/t