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"Go Massive. Sweep it all up" - more powerful than Downing Street?

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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 09:40 AM
Original message
"Go Massive. Sweep it all up" - more powerful than Downing Street?
The meeting on which the DSM were based occurred in July, 2002 ... they clearly show that bush and the neo-cons had an agenda to invade Iraq whether they had evidence or not ... "the facts were being fixed around the policy" ...

And there is evidence going back much further than that that the neo-cons wanted to invade Iraq ... but evidence cited in the article below, not new evidence, seems to be even more incriminating ... it shows that Rumsfeld's immediate reaction to the 9/11 attacks was to question whether it could be used to justify an attack against Saddam ... this was further confirmed in Richard Clarke's book ...

Interestingly, the article's primary focus was on the "commission of errors" made by the 9/11 Commission ... in choosing between labeling LIHOP/MIHOP as reality versus conspiracy theory, one can freely debate whether the specific evidence provides adequate justification to decide one way or the other ... but when information is clearly covered up on a wide-scale, when obvious leads are not even pursued, when the integrity of people like Senator Bob Graham or Sibel Edmonds does not provide sufficient basis to investigate further, something is clearly wrong ... i am not an expert on the specific allegations used to support LIHOP or MIHOP ... but on the strength of what clearly appears to be a massive whitewash, i'm am strongly inclined to believe 9/11 was either a LIHOP or a MIHOP ...

The following article appears in this week's "Village Voice". The "leaked notes" referenced in the article refer to notes describing conversations that occurred hours after the 9/11 incidents ... btw, I have not included sections that relate to the "errors of commission" made by the 9/11 Commission.


source: http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0534,mondo1,67096,6.html

As reported by CBS News, based on leaked notes from a National Military Command Center teleconference, the Secretary of Defense was surprisingly reluctant to make much of the call: "Rumsfeld felt it was 'vague,' that it 'might not mean something,' and that there was 'no good basis for hanging hat.' In other words, the evidence was not clear-cut enough to justify military action against Bin Laden. But later that afternoon, the CIA reported the passenger manifests for the hijacked airliners showed three of the hijackers were suspected Al Qaeda operatives."

According to the notes, Rumsfeld learned that "one guy is associate of bomber"—the Al Qaeda suicide bomber who attacked the U.S. warship in Yemen in 2000.

At 2:40, the notes report, Rumsfeld was beginning to take aim at the target close to his heart: He wants the "best info fast. Judge whether good enough hit S.H. at same time. Not only UBL . Go massive. Sweep it all up. Things related and not." This was the first indication that Rumsfeld was disregarding specific intelligence clearly linking the attack to Al Qaeda and instead had begun to fantasize about getting Saddam Hussein.


Hours later, White House terrorism adviser Richard Clarke went to the White House for meetings that Clarke believed would concern U.S. vulnerabilities, possible future attacks, and what might be done to prevent them. As he writes in one of the most famous passages from his book, Clarke "instead walked into a series of discussions about Iraq."

"At first," Clarke writes, "I was incredulous that we were talking about something other than getting Al Qaeda. Then I realized with almost a sharp physical pain that Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz were going to try to take advantage of this national tragedy to promote their agenda about Iraq. Since the beginning of the administration, indeed well before, they had been pressing for a war with Iraq. My friends in the Pentagon had been telling me that the word was we would be invading Iraq sometime in 2002."

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stubtoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. It all continues to tie together
into a tidy little package. The betrayal of our nation by the neocons is breathtaking.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
2. "Go massive. Sweep it all up. Things related and not."
The ravings of a mass murderer. Things related and not? To me this suggests that he didn't give a shit HOW MANY CIVILIANS were caught up in his bloodlust.

Fascists everywhere would be proud of this armchair butcher.
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
3. Is this news?
I thought it was already established that 9/11 was used as an indirect pre-text to attack Iraq.
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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. sheesh ...
from my post, and i quote: "not new evidence" ...

i posted this because i wanted to emphasize the contents of the leaked memo and compare the importance of Rumsfeld's words, which btw i was unfamiliar with before reading the article, to the DSM ...

to answer your questions, it is NOT news, it's discussion ... that's why i posted it in the "General Discussion Politics" forum and not in "Late Breaking News" ...
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. My bad.
Just sayin...though the extended Rumsfeld quote is a new one for me.
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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. no problem, tb ...
i think the quote is incredibly incriminating ...
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meppie-meppie not Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. almost 3000 dead on 9/11 warrant a thorough investigatio not an "official"
Edited on Thu Aug-25-05 10:33 AM by meppie-meppie not
whitewash or complacency. To do otherwise is to spit on their graves. People have to be held accountable for what happened and they have not. There have been many promotions but no firings or trials. So, until this matter is honestly dealt with, It's still news!

Edited for typo
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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. how fitting ...
just a coincidence? i think not ...

when i read your post, it said you have EXACTLY "911" posts ... i have to say, i'm a little suspicious ...
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meppie-meppie not Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. oh wow! that is weird. I hadn't even been keeping tabs on my posts.
Don't know what you're suspicious about but I assure you there was no nefarious motivations behind me posting when I did. I'm just very fed up with people saying things are either "not news" or "old news". The MSM failure to cover the News and the failure of a country to hold the mass murderers in office accountable gets me to no end! I was pleased to see your post initiating this thread because these matters mustn't die until those responsible are held accountable and suitably fried!
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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. i'm not much on conspiracy theories
but bush, cheney and the rest of them should be shot at sunrise for prosecuting the Iraq war ... and i really have to wonder about the judgment of those who empowered them ...

and as for 9/11, i've read extensively on the evidence ... much of it seems to lead to a he said/she said kind of argument ... why weren't the planes scrambled sooner? ... they weren't scrambled sooner because blah, blah, blah ... what is more disturbing to me than the back and forth over specific "facts" is what appears to be a cover-up, a very intentional cover-up of thoroughly investigating many of the important details, all of which seem to NOT fit into the nice clean explanations we've been giving ...

trust has been broken ... it's been incinerated ... it's been pulverized ... i DO NOT TRUST the conclusions of the 9/11 Commission ... this does not necessarily mean that 9/11 was a LIHOP/MIHOP but because i don't trust those who said it was not, i've moved into the LIHOP/MIHOP camp ... why would they cover-up the truth if their conclusions were not lies???
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meppie-meppie not Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. You are exactly in the same mindset as myself and for the very same
reasons. Election night 2000 to me was an ominous note of things to come. Lying and cheating their way into office it has all gone downhill from there. The murders that happened on your own soil followed by the 100,000 + dead overseas and still no one is held accountable and no justice has been meted out.

trust has been broken ... it's been incinerated ... it's been pulverized


I feel the same way mate. On a free association test given the names of any in this administration and what automatically comes to mind is "liars", "murderers" "thieves" and it just goes on...:mad:
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Al-CIAda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
12. .
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Al-CIAda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-05 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
13. .
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