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Is Feingold demanding an "Immediate" pull out from Iraq?

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:01 PM
Original message
Is Feingold demanding an "Immediate" pull out from Iraq?
Maybe he is, but I can't find where he said that.

If someone can tell me, and put up a source of the information, I would appreciate it.

In another thread, there was reference to Feingold's call for a "pull-out" date, but I have problems with calling that "an immediate" pull out, as so much can happen in 1 year and 4.5 months!

Here's what I've culled on Feingold's position.....He wants the President to offer up a plan....and if he doesn't, than we should get out soon....like in about 1 1/2 years.

My resolution does not dictate deadlines or dates certain. And it does request flexible timeframes for achieving our goals in Iraq rather than imposing any, because drawing up timeframes is best and most appropriately left to the Administration, in consultation with military leaders. And, of course, any timeframe has to be flexible -- there are variables that will affect how quickly various missions can be accomplished. But it's hard to conceive of an effective strategic plan that isn't linked to some timeframes. That is what the Administration needs to share.
snip
Mr. President, it is also clear that we must not accept a false choice between supporting the status quo in Iraq and "cutting and running." The status quo -- staying a rudderless course without a clear destination -- would be a mistake. The course we are on is not leading to strength. In fact, Mr. President, I am concerned that it is making America weaker and our enemies stronger.
--Russ Feingold
http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/releases/05/07/Iraqstatement.htm

"Intense American diplomatic and political engagement in and support for Iraq will likely last long after the troops' mission is accomplished and they are withdrawn. I expect that we will continue some important degree of military and security cooperation with the Iraqis, as we work with them and with others around the world to combat terrorist networks, whether they are operating in Iraq or Afghanistan or England," said Feingold.

"But it's almost as if talking about completing the mission in Iraq has become 'taboo,'" said Feingold. "It's time for senators and Members of Congress, especially those from my own party, to be less timid whilethis Administration neglects urgent national security priorities in favor of staying a flawed policy course in Iraq.
http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/releases/05/08/iraqwithdraw.html

"We have to go on the offensive to show the American people that we're not afraid to disagree," Feingold said.

He said he believes that an immediate withdrawal does not make military sense but that the public needs reassurance that the Iraq operation is moving purposefully toward completion. "We need to talk in Congress about this more openly and freely," Feingold said. "There's a rudderless quality that is making people nervous."
(Emphasis added)

http://www.startribune.com/stories/484/5579747.html
===========

Feingold is asking the administration to come up with a plan, and pressuring them to come with some dates of sorts, and providing his own suggestion. He does not however, profer up a plan.

Another voice in the Democratic Party, Wes Clark. is giving the administration a plan, and letting them know that if they don't change their course, that pretty soon, it won't much matter what they do; that Americans will demand that the troops be brought home, and that they would be justified.

It can be said that Feingold did exactly what Democrats are being criticized by the press. He offered a critique and very little in a way of a plan, beyond stating that rather than "staying on a rudderless course", the admin needs a plan and needs to provide it to the congress.

Far as I am concerned, if the Bush Admin stays with it present course, it may be in six months that Americans will be demanding a pull out. Seems like Feingold is allowing for quite a window! Or at least, it doesn't sound like "Out now"....as some want to suggest.

Personally, I don't see any real points of disagreement between the Wes Clark and the Russ Feingold position beyond one giving a date certain as part of a demand that is not included in any resolution that he has offered.

In fact, what I see what they are saying basically the same thing and are more in concert with each other than with the rest of the Democratic crew.

Are there others? and what are they saying specifically?
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NVMojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
1. Can he stop an invasion of Iran? It's coming ...
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Can who?
Feingold? Clark? Bush?

Please give me more to go on.
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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
3. not according to Helen Thomas
she wrote: "Sen. Russell Feingold, D-Wis. is proposing a total pullout of American troops by Dec. 31, 2006. Why wait a year?"

source: http://www.rutlandherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050827/NEWS/508270308/1039

i think Feingold's plan is anything but a firm call for withdrawal ... it had a "way too cautious just dipping his toe in the water" feel about it ... we need bolder leadership than that ...
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. So is there a politician out there who is?
and what is their plan and their provision for any ensuing aftermath?
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. its a staged pullout and certainly bold at this time.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. What do you mean?
"Staged pull out"...and certainly bold?

You mean 1.5 years away? or the fact that there is not real "meantime plan" being offered?

I don't understand he comment that you offered.
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Texas_Kat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Since it's rumored that the Bushies will begin pulling troops
out next summer (just in time for the 2006 elections), how is Dec 2006 helpful?

I wonder if Clark may have meant sooner than summer '06 (if we could get some of the other points he built into his plan activated).

Anybody got a guess?

Ok, I know it's not realistic to believe dimson (*) would follow Clark's advice, but could Clark's plan be on its feet and beginning to work in 6-8 months?
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CityDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 07:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. At least it's a start
Once we start talking about a pullout, people will begin to seriously consider it an option and it may happen even sooner.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. I understand what you are saying.....
and I think that both Feingold and Clark are leaning the public in that direction if Bush continues on with his failed "course".

However, my op was asking if there are some who think that Feingold is demanding an immediate pull out; cause he is not.

My next question in the OP was; are there any politicians with juice currently demanding an immediate pullout. If so, who are they? I'd like a source that provides their timetable.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
5. Where is Indiana Green when you need him?
:shrug:
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liberaliraqvet26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
11. No.
he's looking for the end of '06, probably the most rational plan yet
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Feingold didn't offer a "plan".....
He demanded a plan from the admin, and projected an exit date. There is a difference.

A plan instructs one how to proceed point by point. Calling for withdrawal of troups a year and 4.5 months from now doesn't constitute a plan....but rather an exit date without provisions for the 18 months in between nor how this withdrawal would occur.

You can certainly correct me if I'm wrong.

How many troops can be killed in 18 months? We've had 1800+ killed in 2.5 years.


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flaminbats Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
12. victory is the only kind of immediate pullout..
if there is no strategy for immediate withdrawal when beginning a war, there will be no strategy used as it ends.

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I'm sorry,
can you clarify that please? I think I understand what you are saying, but I'm not certain.
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flaminbats Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. I'm only agreeing with you!!
We withdrew immediately from Mexico without chaos during the 19th century, simply because we won! We slowly retreated from Vietnam in chaos because we had nothing to win, but if we had set clear military objectives to be met it would had been an immediate withdrawal..mission accomplished!

Basically Feingold is saying it's too late for an organized withdrawal from Iraq, and the sooner we accept this the fewer will ultimately die.
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
16. One would hope so. Any other plan would simply be a waste of lives.
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