Oil Wars, We're All Culpable.

[leanin_green]

Okay, get ready with your flame throwers, because, I'm going to probably piss a few people off. Then again, maybe not, I know we're all thinking something along the same lines.

I, like so many others here, feel that the status of American foreign policy is driven by oil interests and natural resources vital to our current way of life. In truth, when has any war been about anything else?

However, in this imperial push for what we need(or more exactly, what the current administration thinks we need), we are all culpable. As a nation, we are like junkies that need a fix. And, like addicts who are running low on their own supply and short of the funds to get some more, what do we do? Start thinking of ways to get the funds to get what we need. Do we think in terms of getting work? Nah, there's no time to wait for the paycheck. We gotta think of a way to score, and fast. Do we work with our friends to get what we need? No way, their all addicts too and will only think of themselves. No, it's time to take care of No.1. Do you see where I'm going with this? Just look at how we're taking the surge in gas prices. The oil corporations have been floating this plan out for quite a few years now. Periods of rising gas prices to see how long it would take until we squeal, then lowering them a little until we back off and maintaining a new higher price that everyone could live with. Do we demand new technologies or alternate fuel sources? There is some of that going on, of course. But not en masse. Because the engine that runs our way of life runs on oil products, we complain, but we pay. I do it, you do it, because we don't know any other way. We're locked in our addiction and feel helpless to do anything about it. Are we helpless? No, not really. Of course, as any recovering addict will tell you, changing isn't an easy proposition. It requires a will that isn't our will. A willingness to acknowledge we have no power over our addiction and a openness to receive help from others. We have to come to the realization of what our addiction is doing to us as well as those around us. To continue in our addiction would only lead to the destruction of ourselves and any life we touch. This is where America is at this moment. Instead of calling on our innate ability to be innovators and creators of new technologies, we have fell into the grasp of our suppliers. Control has been maintained through artful deception and underhanded manipulation. We have tried all the symbolic gestures of refusal to continue with our suppliers, but we fall back into using every time we turn the key in the ignition. A pitiful state of affairs, to say the least. How do we break this cycle? What can be done to rid ourselves of this insidious supplier that maintains our addiction for its own profit? I put the question to you all. I'm as culpable as all of you and genuinely can't see a way out short of violent withdrawal.

[The Traveler]

1. Curse you, leanin-green

I can find no fundamental flaw with your argument. Curses.

[leanin_green]

11. Coming from the Traveler, no less, a pox on your house!

Thanks Traveler, I appreciate the chuckle.

[The Traveler]

14. Any time, bud

:7
And may the flies of a thousand formerly frozen and currently farting Siberian peat bogs infest your pubic hair.

:evilgrin:

[leanin_green]

15. Bwaaaaaaa, ROFL.

Now I have that song running through my head:

May the bird of paradise fly up your nose.
May your wife be plauged with runners in her hose.
May an elephant crush you with his toes.
May the bird of paradise fly up your nose.:headbang:

[EST]

2. Hmmm fair analogy...

Abstracting from one person to the multitudes doesn't really work, however. The addiction will only be cured and stay cured by a price that is simply too extravagant to promote regular use. We know one hundred dollars a gallon would work, with the only remaining question being, how much less will also work?

[sendero]

3. Here's the problem..

... the populace has been virtually encouraged by our own government and certainly by the corporate elite to abuse energy use.

Because it is they who are making all the cash, they who have a vested interest in continuing down the same old road.

Activists have begged Congress for decades to do something about alternative fuels research, to enforce stricter fuel economy standards on cars and to stop acting like SUVs are trucks - they've done very little because the work for the corporations, not for us.

Americans are in for some hard lessons in the next few years. I really don't think cheap petroleum energy will ever be back. And we are totally unprepared for it, and there is plenty of blame to go around.

[leanin_green]

12. I'm not looking to blame, really. But. . .

in order to change a problem, it seems reasonable to me to acknowledge there even is a problem and what's my part in it?

[Chemical Bill]

4. I agree, that's why I run biodiesel.

I bought a diesel car in March of 2003 (sound familiar?) and now drive a 5 hour round trip to fill may car and some gas cans with American made fuel.

Bill

[leanin_green]

13. There's one person who get's it. Way to go and spread the knowledge.

[barbaraann]

5. Could you please add some paragraph breaks?

Then I will either agree with you or argue with you. :-)

[welshTerrier2]

6. addicts with a program for change ...

first, just a suggestion ... it would be much easier to read your post if you broke it into a few paragraphs ....

i've started something like 5 threads in the last couple of days trying to raise awareness about the devastation US energy policy is having ... we are looking at the risk of global war, global warming that threatens all life on the planet, the virtual end of the US economy as it exists today and a major disruption in our quality of life to say the least ... it's unfortunate, but one good insult thread about Rove will get about 10 times the number of responses as threads discussing energy policy ...

and viewing oneself as an "energy addict" and doing the "individual thing" to make a difference is always fine for starters ... i know several people who commute through urban traffic on their bicycles because they are committed to making a difference on this issue ... most people think "it's cool but eccentric" and would never join in ... hardly the underpinnings of an effective movement for change ...

and some will make the usual market arguments ... when gas prices hit $100 a gallon, consumers will demand better mass transit and alternative, i.e. non-fossil based, fuel sources ... well, i suppose there's some truth in that but it hardly makes for an enlightened, pro-active energy policy ...

the real solution should be, and could be, effective government ...

the only way we'll ever get anywhere is by convincing other people that our vision is the right one ... this won't be easy ... we're up against people with billions and billions of dollars invested in the status quo ... as "big oil" has realized all-time record profits over the last few months, it's hard to imagine they'll be eager to chart a different course ... the same is true for many elected officials who are "lobbied" (ya know, bribed) by them ...

what we need to do first and foremost is to clearly define what we believe and why we believe it ... step two is regaining control of our own party and convincing our leaders to "get with the program or get the hell out of our way" ... i'd like to believe the American people, if they knew the truth, would insist on better policy ... the problem with today's Democratic Party is that it is paralyzed with fear and, at least to some degree, is dependent on the same corporate infrastructure ...

so, my script to get from here to there is 1. identify the scope of the problem and the risks it poses 2. define our values and build a policy based on them 3. educate and organize those most likely to accept our message to build a political force 4. target the power structure most likely to be receptive (i.e. the Democratic Party) 5. try to convince existing "leaders" to utilize their high profiles to support us and replace them if they won't 6. craft a message and a campaign for our platform 7. get our candidate with our platform and our movement behind him out in front of the American people to communicate our message ...

we are indeed addicts ... if we don't plan for energy alternatives, the "withdrawal" will indeed be violent ... it doesn't have to be that way but i'm afraid too many take democracy and their way of life for granted ... we who see the future clearly are the ones with the greatest responsiblity to awaken America to the devastation that is surely coming our way ... we cannot afford to focus only on the battle for political control at the expense of the issues of greatest concern to the country ... it is incumbent upon us to bend the direction of the Party and then the country to our will ... trying is not enough; we have to succeed ...

[1932]

7. But the corporatocracy is most culpable.

They're doing things that nobody would approve of if voters understood what was going on.

[wli]

8. All part of the plan to consolidate the corporate police state. n/t

[Bushwick Bill]

9. Jim Kunstler agrees.

August 15, 2005,
Before I even get started, I will qualify my remarks this week by reminding you 1.) I'm a registered Democrat, and 2.) I'm not "pro-war."

<snip>

Because as Shearer was twanging on about WMDs and Iraq and how deplorable the whole thing is, I started wondering about Shearer's real life in Los Angeles, and imagining him driving from his house in one of the better sections of the city to the studio where he does the show, or Shearer motoring across town to Melrose Avenue for sushi, or Shearer tooling up into the canyons above Hollywood to have drinks with friends, or Shearer transporting a child, perhaps, twenty miles down the freeway to a soccer game. And I was wondering what kind of car Shearer drove, and I couldn't help imagining it was probably not a cheap car, and perhaps not a little tiny car, and if Shearer was married or lived with somebody, then his wife / partner undoubtedly had a car, too -- because that's how life is lived in Los Angeles, despite some of their strides in public transit. And as I imagined Harry Shearer driving around Los Angeles in an expensive car deploring this terrible war in Iraq, I couldn't shake the feeling that Shearer was getting, so to speak, a free ride.

<snip>

Harry Shearer with his attitude of moral superiority reminds me of my neighbor here in Saratoga Springs, the lady with the "War Is NOT the Answer" bumper sticker on her Ford Expedition. For people who want to keep on enjoying an easy motoring utopia, war is the answer.

<snip>

This, of course, is the predicament of the Democrats, my own party. They have no interest in modifying the nation's suicidal suburban sprawl lifestyle either, only in the easy pretenses of political correctness. Instead of twanging on WMDs and the depravity of the war in Iraq, I'd like to hear someone like Harry Shearer (or John Kerry, or Nancy Pelosi, or Harry Reid) stand up and pitch for restoring the US passenger rail system. I'd like to hear some of these assholes propose some meaningful changes that Americans can make in behavior so we won't be so desperate to engage in military contests over the oil we need to drive for sushi in Los Angeles.
http://www.kunstler.com/mags_diary14.html

[opihimoimoi]

20. Well said...thank you...sending Sashimi/sushi w wasabi/sake

[candice]

10. I conserve gas by using it as little as possible, combining trips...

I'd love to live in a place where I could bike or walk anywhere. I'd be killed pretty fast on a bike (and the freeway fumes knock me out).

My next car will be a hybrid.

The Saudis want to keep the price at such a level that alternative energy won't overtake them. Save as much gas as possible and buy alternative vehicles.

[opihimoimoi]

16. Many many solutions but the withdrawl pain too much to bear

[cleveramerican]

17. If you look at hybrids....

with a cold detached look... crunch the numbers you'll see why they are going unsold.
The Prius is an exception, it has its own identity and look, Its instantly identifiable as a hybrid. Toyota's hybrid.
The Civic is the more troubling one. It looks like a regular civic, but costs more to buy. The projected cost to replace the batteries in year 7 or 8 is about $6k. They are going unsold because if you are thinking it'll cost less to own you just wrong, buy the number an ordinary civic still has significantly lower ownership costs and costs less to buy to boot.

The lexus and the ford models are finding similar fates and for the moment at least, hybrid ownership is more of a fashion statement than a lower cost alternative.

if gas goes to $100/gal this will change.

[mhr]

18. Read The Hirsch Report

He says essentially the same thing in Bureaucratic speak.

"The peaking of world oil production presents the U.S. and the world with an unprecedented risk management problem. As peaking is approached, liquid fuel prices and price volatility will increase dramatically, and, without timely mitigation, the economic, social, and political costs will be unprecedented. Viable mitigation options exist on both the supply and demand sides, but to have substantial impact, they must be initiated more than a decade in advance of peaking"

http://www.projectcensored.org/newsflash/The_Hirsch_Report_Proj_Cens.pdf

[opihimoimoi]

19. Bush not capable of comprehending anything more than a one

paragraph shit thing...Even the "OSAMA IS COMING TO GET US" failed to motivate his ass.

[MadeinOhio]

21. Well hold on there, just a minute.....

I thought we were fighting a war for our freedoms because they hate us for our freedoms? :sarcasm:

You mean all that spelunky isn't true?? :shrug:

You mean the real reason we're doing this is because PNAC wants to dominate the globe, owning its oil reserves? Dang! How come the media never reported none of this?

It can't be true, oh but it is. Even though we didn't see it on TV.

I can picture this argument going on everywhere, not just democratic circles...

[TrogL]

22. What do you propose to do about it?

I cut down a tree last night using a chainsaw.

It runs on a 40:1 mixture of gas to oil, it uses oil for the chain and oil-based lubricatant in the chain bearing. Using an electric saw woudn't have helped (in fact I did use an electric saw for the smaller branches). It still needs lubricants and the power station down the road runs on natural gas.

I doubt if we'll see a non-oil-based lubricant (eg. buckyballs) in the stores for another 10 years. A hydrogen-fuelled chainsaw just isn't going to happen and I wouldn't be able to lift a battery-powered one powerful enough to bring down a full-sized tree.