There is no excuse now to blame Blanco or Nagin since FEMA is

[Maraya1969]

in full force in Texas. Ask a repub to explain that one.

[sarcasmo]

1. Right on. They are destroying that argument has the feds finally take

control.

[SouthernDem2004]

4. Huh? The feds have not taken control. The Gov and Mayors are

running the show.

FEMA SUCKS!

[Maraya1969]

6. Then why have I seen army trucks lined up read and waiting with

ice and water and food? Blanco declared and emergency on Saturday previous to Katina. Why didn't those same tucks come down with the same supplies?

Is the Governor supposed to know how to plan for an emergency evacuation and all the necessary details? I thought the Governor states the emergency and it is mostly the Federal Government's responsibility at that point.

[SouthernDem2004]

14. They are National Guard trucks.... They are state controlled.

States and local governments plan evacs and for disasters. NO's mayor failed to implement an evacuation in a timely manner. His delay cost lives. His failure to request the resources he needed cost lives.

States and cities along the Coast have detailed evac plans. Ours in Biloxi and Mississippi worked great. The people that stayed choose to do so. MS even counter-flowed the interstate to help LA.

I fail to see why you do not think a state can handle the details. The people in DC do not know more about the area then the locals. The Feds have nothing to do with storm prep. They are supposed to come in after and asisst. To bad they suck at that.

[windbreeze]

19. A question then....

Did the Governor of La...send her National Guard troops into Iraq? Or did the FED GOV'T DO SO???? and wasn't it FEMA, who wasn't allowing anyone into NO to help? The Red Cross said it was...When the Governor Stated to the FEDS/Bush that she had no way to take care of the emergency facing them, several days ahead of Katrina making landfall...It was then up to Bush/Fema/HS...who the hell ever, to get that show on the road asap, and work with local authorities...DID you hear any of the calls??? From Nagin/Blanco??? Cause I sure did......how about the trucks and troops now already in place in Texas...WHERE were they for NO???? The same size hurricane, with a far more disastrous capability due to a below sea level city..yet...

In my book...the blame is right in the yard of 1600 Pa. Avenue...DC...because it took only one signature to deny the money for the levees/ACE's....and that one belonged to Bush...even AFTER a computer simulation was done a year ago, showing exactly what was going to happen if a storm that size hit NOLA...HE knew, and has been cutting funds for that city since 2001...the last cuts came this year in June...far easier to spend $200 BILLION to repair damage, that could have been prevented with a few million over the years...

Anyway...I certainly hope that everyone manages to escape this storm...perhaps Bush better give a little more thought(and funding) to that global warming that isn't happening...
windbreeze

[Maraya1969]

23. Remember Bush declared a state of emergency of the NORTHERN

Parishes in Louisiana? I still don't understand that one. But obviously the President has the authority to declare an emergency which supposedly turns on some other agencies and creates protective measures. But then again this is the Bush Administration. Can't expect too much from them. It's every man to himself these days.

[nyhuskyfan]

21. We're clearly the only government in the free world that can't handle this

Why can't a federal agency be responsible for helping the state and local governments mobilize resources ahead of time? You know, help provide shelters, naval hospital ships, military bases, etc.

State and local politicians change all the time. Every eleection cycle there are new people coming in and people who have never been in a crisis situation are forced to act. The federal government can bring expertise and resources to the table that locals can't. Heck, if FEMA was set up like the FBI and CIA so the personnel didn't change with every presidential administration, you could guarantee experts would be able to help run the show -- preparing ahead of time and making sure that people's lives aren't completely in the hands of rookies to crisis management.

Remember, one of the best thing Witt's FEMA did under Clinton was set up disaster preparedness programs in a variety of areas around the country. Project Impact was the name of it -- and Bush got rid of it entirely within two months of getting in the Oval Office.

New Orleans' mayor should have done better and acted sooner - but 80 percent of the city evacuated, and computer models predicted 65 percent.

[Maraya1969]

22. Sounds like an oxymoron to me.

"They are National Guard trucks.... They are state controlled."

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Maraya1969]

7. FEMA should have the resources to provide a mass evacuation.

They are now under Homeland security and they SHOULD be in charge when there is a national disaster.

They weren't there for NO and now they seem to be all over the place for Texas. I know part of it is learning from experience but they shouldn't have had to learn from experience. They should have learned because that is their job!

And they should be the ones directly connected to the hurricane specialists. Where the Hell were they when Katrina was coming? Someone in their agency should have been assigned to Hurricane control.

Now I'm sure there is some department for that but it is too late for too many people.

[SouthernDem2004]

11. It is the State's and city's job to evac.

[Maraya1969]

8. What about all the Governors of Bumblefuck city in the middle

of bumble fuck USA? Are you saying these Governors, (or Sheriffs as they are called in a lot of cities) should be schooled in mass evacuation and disaster response? If they declare a NATIONAL, (may I repeat that - NATIONAL) emergency there should be a NATIONAL response.


There was NO NATIONAL response for Katrina.

[nyhuskyfan]

10. Exactly...

The reason to have a FEMA is to have an organization that has expertise in these matters. A tornado could rip through Anytown, USA this weekend and those people would have zero knowledge in what the hell to do.

The Federal government also has access to infinitely more resources than any local government possibly could.

Blaming the locals for the evacuation is just cowardly. While there could be things that the locals did better, the federal government is supposed to be there for national emergencies. Expecting 100 percent evacuation was impossible -- so the people left behind, regardless of whether it was 1,000 or 100,000 deserved better than they got from their country.

Frankly, we've become the laughingstock of the world -- and it isn't because of Ray Nagin.

[SouthernDem2004]

13. Its laughable saying the locals would not know what to do.

Here in Biloxi we had a plan to evac and it worked great. The state of MS has plans that include LA and AL. The states counter-flow the interstate for one example just to clear LA. Local and state governments know their areas better then some pencil pusher in DC.

Evacuation and preparations are the job of local and state officals. FEMA is an after response. FEMA response was horrible and still is to this day. FEMA needs to be disbanded.

[nyhuskyfan]

20. I'm talking about the relief efforts, not the evacuation

FEMA needs to exist to assist in the relief efforts. It just needs people who aren't horse experts running it.

It seems like a pretty simple concept to me. A disaster hits, lots of people need assistance, the federal government responds. And the people responding should be experts in the field. It's pretty easy for state and local resources to get swamped.

FEMA disbanded? Hardly. There aren't many more important roles of government. It needs to be there -- it just needs to be run correctly.

[Maraya1969]

24. Ok so Biloxi gets a Red Star for the day. Not every city is as large

as Biloxi or has enough money as Biloxi. And FEMA'S response when Clinton was president, (can't remember the name of FEMA'S director at the time) would have been front and center and they would NOT have sat on their asses looking like horse trainers watching a show.

If Katrina had happened on Clinton's watch it would have turned out much differently. I cannot even fathom Clinton playing around at some fund raiser the day after such a horrible disaster.

[SouthernDem2004]

12. Mayors run cities nor governors. Does not take much to evac a small city.

[DoYouEverWonder]

15. The Mayor evacuted 80% of NO BEFORE Katrina

and that's in a town where 100,000 households don't have cars and no help from HS/FEMA. What is wrong with that?

[SouthernDem2004]

16. He delayed the order for evacuation and failed to secure transport for

those without the means to leave. He delayed giving the order by 15 hours after being advised by the weather service. 15 damn hours! He did not request additional transport. It was not FEMA's job or the Federal government's to evac his city.

This is not the time to make excuses. I do not care about politics when it comes to life and death. Failures need to be examined realisticly. Nagin failed, Blanco failed and FEMA failed to respond quickly to any area.

[DoYouEverWonder]

18. Maybe if Bush would have returned Nagin's phone calls

during and after the storm, and maybe if the Federal Government didn't deliberately withhold assistance, things would have gone a bit better.

Plus do you have a citation to back up your claims? The Governor of LA wrote to Bush two days before the storm. On Sunday afternoon Bush took a few seconds from his busy schedule to declare a State of Emergency. From that point on the Federal Government was in control of the response to the disaster, at least according to their National Response Plan. But I doubt if Bush every bothered to read even the Cliff Notes version of that one.

[Igel]

3. But at the same time, it's White and Perry

calling the shots, and implementing their evacuation plans.

They've called for NG to be prepositioned, and gave the necessary 48 hours notice for call-up. They have gasoline for gas stations on its way, per their evacuation plan; an add-on to the plan is gasoline trucks for those out of gas on the freeways, and contraflow traffic. They've arranged, using mostly their own resources, for evacuating Galveston, and estimate a 90% compliance rate, and for buses to retrieve those unable to get themselves out of storm-surge areas.

I'm not sure who's providing the airlift that they've called for, FEMA, NG, or airlines.

Things aren't going smoothly. They bungled the TSA-employee business; they didn't foresee the panic that Katrina would induce, leading so many people that don't need to leave to hit the roads. But the locals are doing what they're supposed to.

In fairness to, and criticism of, Nagin, at this point in NOLA they were contemplating the forecasts, and had barely called for a voluntary evacuation; the mandatory evacuation was still future (and we'd expect it only at 5 am tomorrow morning). Part was knowing that a mistaken evacuation is better than a late one; part was having a longer timeline, an additional day between when the hurricane passed Florida, and when it's due to hit.

But I don't have any real problems with what the locals have done. If FEMA's doing things, it's not doing a great deal, except in preparation: appointing liaisons, moving materiel in range for hauling the stuff in, but keeping it out of the danger zone.

[Totally Committed]

9. "There is no excuse now to blame Blanco or Nagin since FEMA is

in full force in Texas. Ask a repub to explain that one."

White Christian Republicans (Bush's "peeps"! -- and his "base"), and plenty of 'em. He is thinking Electoral College, and re-election or Perry, his loyal soldier in the Lone Star State.

Just an opinion.

TC

[hamsterjill]

17. No reason to blame Nagin

I agree.

And will someone please answer my DUMB question (albeit a legitimate one). If it's the NATIONAL guard, why is everyone saying it is STATE controlled?

I thought when a state of emergency was declared by Bush that the act of him doing that meant that FEMA took the reins. FEMA directs the effort from that point forward in conjunction with local authorities, but FEMA is the one in the driver's seat. Therefore FEMA (as bad as it is) is the responsible party.

And a state of emergency was declared in New Orleans well before the hurricane actually hit.

I'll gladly (and humbly) listen to differing opinions so that I get fully educated here.

[lawwolf]

26. National Guard

I shall try to answer your question. The national guard is state controlled. They can be federalized and called up and sent overseas (I don't know where the authority for that comes from.) But when they are on US soil, the president doesn't control them, the governors of the states do.

A state of emergency does not mean the feds take over, it is just a necessary step to allow FEMA and other federal agencies give assistance. The feds still need permission from the state to go take actions in the states. That is because of the idea of federalism. The states are sovereign except for the specific powers granted to the federal government. The Constitution does not grant the federal government the power to "invade" a state.

At least that is my understanding.

[newyawker99]

27. Hi lawwolf!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[lawwolf]

28. Thanks

I've been reading for over a year now, just decided it was time to join and post something.

[Raiden]

25. The discrepancies between the two Hurricanes

are pretty apparant. It's dispicable.