Would you support a candidate for prez who made an ethnic or racial joke?

[_Jumper_]

Apparently we have such a candidate running for president...

[Keebs]

1. Why not?

If we can't laugh at ourselves, who can we laugh at?

[_Jumper_]

6. What?

You approve of ethnic and racial jokes?????

[Nazgul35]

34. that's not laughing at ourselves...

that's making fun of another group of people using stereo types...

[bicentennial_baby]

2. NO!

Makes me sick it does...and he's my Senator! :mad:

[SeveneightyWhoa]

3. But Hillary Clinton isn't running!

Hehe.

[_Jumper_]

8. Good

:D

[Cocoa]

4. is this the Kerry thing?

the thing about him dancing ok for a white guy?

[bicentennial_baby]

10. No, this:

"Or perhaps the candidate who receives the worst introduction speech of the campaign wins. At that Friday event in Manchester, Sen. Fritz Hollings, D-S.C., introduced Kerry with a long, rambling speech that included the word "Chinaman." As Hollings was explaining that "50 percent of the furniture in this country comes from China," a shockingly loud pop crackled through the speakers and startled most people in the room. "Some Chinaman got mad at that," Hollings said to laughter. (Later, when more noises popped through the speakers, Kerry politically corrected the joke to, "This Chinese guy is still around.") Hollings also declared that Dick Cheney "is the Jesse Jackson of the Republican Party. He wants it all, his time has come!" A few people applauded when Hollings said he was about to finish."


http://slate.msn.com/id/2094401 /

[mzmolly]

21. I do believe this is at the very least a GAFFE and a major one at that...

Oh well it wasn't Dean, so it wont get any attention in the mass media.

PHEW!

[_Jumper_]

23. Sad but true

Yet we will see the fraudlent "I have a Scream" footage 500 more times this week. :eyes:

[MurikanDemocrat]

52. I don't see anything offensive about it

It's not funny, or maybe I don't get it, but I don't see what is derogatory about it.

[frustrated_lefty]

5. A Christian, a jew and a muslim walked into a bar.....

Jokes are jokes, I don't really care about them unless they are clearly mean-spirited and meant to hurt or inspire hate.

[_Jumper_]

11. Such jokes are dehumanizing

What do you think about Rush Limbaugh's "ebonics" parody? Is that racist or good-natured humor in your book?

[frustrated_lefty]

26. Re-read my post.

I don't care about them unless they are meanspirited or meant to inspire hate. We all have to be able to poke fun at ourselves. As long as it's fun, laughing together. That may be a subtle distinction, but it's never been one I've had difficulty making.

I'm from the south and I LIKE Jeff Foxworthy. "You might be a redneck if...."

[_Jumper_]

27. Okay

Maybe Kerry can use his ten favorite ethnic jokes in a campaign ad.

[genius]

48. Exactly.

THank you for the common sense.

[xultar]

7. Depends on what the joke was and how they managed the

situation afterwards. Hillary's joke was not a joke, it was more of a stereotype thing. No biggie. She handled it good.

The thing with Kerry and the guy about the Chinaman that was bad.

But they got it shut down quickly.

[_Jumper_]

14. Stereotypes are no biggie?

????

[xultar]

45. I'm black so I've had to deal with them, and I say that they are

no biggie, why because everyone of every race and religion has a stereotype. There are stereotypes of southerners and northerners, New Yorkers and Californians. Women and men stereotypes. Chihuahua stereotype and a Golden Retriever stereotype.

Everyone has a stereotype. So it's no biggie

[TexasMexican]

9. Depends on the "joke"

n/t

[_Jumper_]

13. Read it and decide for yourself

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=237650

[TexasMexican]

28. Thats bad.

Maybe not as bad as some obviously racist joke about blacks, but it wasnt very funny, didnt make much sense.

It didnt seem obviously racist to me, but maybe thats because I didnt understand it well enough, after reading that little blurb on the the first post of the thread I didnt really have much of a desire to learn what the fuck he was babbelling about.

Admittidly I'm not much of a Kerry supporter, the fact that Fritz Hollings supports Kerry especially makes me not want to support him.

My dislike of Fritz isnt particularily about his racist views, but mostly because of his support of the RIAA, however this certainly doesnt make me like him any better.

I seriously hope Dean beats Kerry, if not Dean atleast Westly Clark.

[_Jumper_]

29. He is damaged goods IMO

He slipped and slips are the only time we can really see a politician's bad side. I won't trust him on civil rights. ABK.

[bicentennial_baby]

30. Check your pm Jumper

I sent you some info

[_Jumper_]

32. Ok

n/t

[Kathy in Cambridge]

57. My grandfather is old and says "Chinaman"

I don't think he means anything bad considering he's an old union guy and a communist. I think it's his generation. Can we all just take a breath here? our generation may be PC but we grew up with a whole different cultural lexicon than old people.

[For PaisAn]

12. What joke?

What was the ethnic/racial joke and which candidate made it?

[Seldona]

15. Hell no.

There is no excuse.

I am not a PC freak, but some come on.

Definately not Presidencial material imho.

[Cocoa]

16. there's a huge flaw in this question

this plays into the myth about "PC", that taking offense is some kind of witchhunt, where people are going around trying to catch people that cross some kind of arbitrary line.

People don't take offense to hypothetical comments, they take offense to things that people actually say.

[pacifictiger]

17. Political correctness

has become way too prevalent - lets face it, every ethnic group has flaws based on generalities - some are really rather amusing. As long as the jokes are spread evenly around, I don't see the problem with learning to lighten up and laugh at ourselves. Comedians make a living out of it. It can serve to keep us all in touch with humility by shining a mirror on our most ludicrous behaviour. Better to be out in the open than snidely hiding in the closet.

[_Jumper_]

18. It is okay to have such a person elected president?

?

Comedians that make a living off of ethnic and racial jokes lack the talent to make real jokes.

[SeanQuinn]

19. It's a Shame

Chinese people deserve respect.

[_Jumper_]

20. I agree

Too bad some people don't give them respect because their numbers aren't large enough to constitute a major voting bloc. I wonder what people like Hollings, Kerry, Hillary Clinton, and Moran REALLY think about blacks and Latinos.

[Cocoa]

22. "such a person?"

I completely disagree with you that raising sensitivity to offensive language is the same thing as dividing people into "good people" and "bad people."

If that's the way it was, we'd get nowhere, everyone would be constantly on the defensive. That's the way the anti-PC people try to portray things, it divides people.

The way it actually is, is that people call attention to language they find offensive, thus educating the people that used the offensive language. Often that person apologizes. This unites people, and leads to social progress.

[_Jumper_]

24. We need standards for presidents

Anyone who may be a racist should not be president. I, as a minority, certainly will never vote for such a candidate.

[Cocoa]

37. as a minority myself, I have to dispute this

recklessly calling people racists and throwing accusations around to hurt candidates doesn't do us minorities any good.

There's real racism out there, you know?

[fujiyama]

51. What did Kerry say?

I know what Hollings said, and it was wrong, but Kerry didn't actually use the word "Chinaman" himself. Plus, it seems as though he was trying to difuse any tension by joking with the Asian person in the room.

I agree he should have condemned it immediately, but I think this has more to do with political expediency, which we should all know by now, is very much like Kerry to do.

[mmm]

25. There are no Saints among men

no one can lay claim to having perfect thoughts;
all we can ask for is perfect action.
At the end of the day all that matters is that we have done the right thing.

[Edge]

31. I think people need to lighten up.

This country has gone way over the edge with PC. People need to get a sense of humor and lighten up.

It's alright to make jokes...as long as they weren't intended to put hate on a person/persons of a different background. (ie race, religion, sex, etc...)

[_Jumper_]

33. Yeah it was just an ethnic joke

To bad some uppity people don't "know their place" these days.

[Edge]

40. So what was this joke?

Evidence?

[corporatewhore]

42. this one

Or perhaps the candidate who receives the worst introduction speech of the campaign wins. At that Friday event in Manchester, Sen. Fritz Hollings, D-S.C., introduced Kerry with a long, rambling speech that included the word "Chinaman." As Hollings was explaining that "50 percent of the furniture in this country comes from China," a shockingly loud pop crackled through the speakers and startled most people in the room. "Some Chinaman got mad at that," Hollings said to laughter. (Later, when more noises popped through the speakers, Kerry politically corrected the joke to, "This Chinese guy is still around.") Hollings also declared that Dick Cheney "is the Jesse Jackson of the Republican Party. He wants it all, his time has come!" A few people applauded when Hollings said he was about to finish."

[bigtree]

35. wouldyou support a candidate who made a big deal about something like this

just to get elected?

[Fleshdancer]

41. Would it be any worse than to support a candidate who

let an ethnic "joke" slide just because the person who used it endorsed him/her so that he/she could get elected?

This seems worse to me than the opposing politician who made a big deal about the "joke" to get elected.

[bigtree]

46. These things don't just slide. The candidate in question would deserve to

be judged on his entire record, not on a joke that is ethnic or race-based. No example here though. See Jumper's other post. I think a joke from 1997 and the apology given and accepted are enough to lay off of someone. I actually believe that no one would say a thing unless they for some reason had something to gain by tearing the other candidate down. It seems to me that a positive examination of these candidates records is more than enough to make a decision on . Racial and ethnic jokes are . . . well, jokes.

[wyldwolf]

36. What if a candidate used an accused racist in a TV ad to attack Dean?

Soon after reprimanding Dean for his elitist remarks to southerners, _________ was on TV with an ad for his own campaign. According to a report in The Hill, a Washington periodical, the ad "featured Ashley Bell, a Louisiana State University law student. Bell was himself embroiled in controversy last month over allegedly insensitive racial remarks." The paper added: "The student, who is president of the College Democrats of America, called the GOP's gubernatorial candidate in Louisiana, Bobby Jindal, an 'Arab American and the Republicans' token attempt to mend bridges long burnt with the Arab American community.'" The student continued, describing Jindal, the son of Indian immigrants, as Presdient Bush's "Do Boy," i.e., yes man. The Louisiana Democratic party said it was sorry.

[Fleshdancer]

38. The President is suppose to lead ALL Americans, regardless of color or

ethnicity. Perhaps it would be easier for me to see the humor in a racial or ethnic joke, but I'm a white American so there's a level of ignorance that goes along with not having the joke be about me or people like me. Now if a politician stood up and made a sexist joke, hell yes I would be mad.

I don't get the "we're too PC" crap anyway. The whole point is to be respectful to one another...not a bad concept. If we teach our children to respect others, why is it so hard to expect the same out of adults and especially our leaders?

[corporatewhore]

39. I have been called a couple of "lovely names"tocrack a joke using chinaman

is horrible

[bhunt70]

50. Some people don't understand that Chinaman is not the same as

Irishman, scotsman etc.

Doesn't make it right though.

[oxymoron]

43. From these accounts, I don't see that Kerry made a joke.

When did Hollings jump into the race? :crazy:

[Rhiannon12866]

44. I would say no

But these remarks didn't strike me as being particularly egregious. It just sounded like they were being silly. But then, it wasn't my particular ethnic group that was being joked about. These guys should know better, since they are used to operating in a national forum. I just hope that the press doesn't run with this, as they did with Dean's "I Have a Scream" speech! If I have to endure that one more time, I really will scream!:argh:

[genius]

47. The most offensive comment was Dean's flag comment.

As for jokes, everyone has made one about at least one group at some point in their life - so how about if we avoid giving any ammo to the Rethugs. Often people of the joked-about group make the most jokes about their own group and takes the jokes in good humor when others tell them. This is because most of the jokes are ridiculous, like "What happened when the _____ forgot to pay his garbage bill? They cut off delivery." Irish people tell Irish jokes. Polish people often tell Polish jokes, etc. Italians often get a laugh out of Italian jokes. The only really offensive jokes are the ones about attorneys.

[The Traveler]

53. Oh yeah? I **love** lawyer jokes

Q: Why do sharks never attack lawyers?
A: Professional courtesy.

Q: What is the difference between a catfish and a lawyer?
A: One is a bottom dwelling scum sucker. The other is a fish.

Q: What is the difference between a dead lawyer and a dead snake one the road?
A: There are skid marks in front of the snake.

[MercutioATC]

54. So Kerry's Chinese now?

I've heard a lot of outrageous claims from him, but now he's Chinese?

You're correct. The Irish tell Irish jokes. Blacks will occasionally use words with each other that are considered racial slurs when spoken by whites. For this arguement to extend to Kerry's "Chinese" comment, he'd have to BE Chinese.

Hey, maybe it's true, but I just don't see it...

[MercutioATC]

55. kick

[MrSlayer]

49. Sure, people need to get over that shit.

Everyone is so damned sensitive anymore. A joke should be taken for what it is, a joke. And if you're referring to the Kerry thing, you're reaching for shit. Everyone knows the Italian army is useless in battle. Just read some history.

[Dark Star]

56. Absolutely not.

This has nothing to do with PC.

This has to do with people not having empathy or realizing what's appropriate.

Bigotry, whether it's verbal or a symbol (confederate flag, swastika) has no place in politics.

For those who think we are being too sensitive, take a look at old films of governor wallace blocking school doorways - you'll get such a kick out it!

R E S P E C T - everyone deserves it.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

58. The irony: misogynist rheyoric is perfectly acceptable here

it makes me want to :puke:

[Hekate]

59. This is really a "gotcha" question, isn't it?

Let the one without sin cast the first stone, okay? Remember The Overarching Goal, People: Get Bush Out.

We are not talking about "Ax Handle" Maddox, "Bull" Connor, or George Wallace here, are we? And it was not the candidate himself who made the lame-o joke past its expiration date, if my scan of the postings was right. So unless someone comes up with some hot new evidence of membership in the KKK or the like, please let us focus on what we all agree we want to get done, which is to overthrow the Bush regime at the ballot box this year. Bush talks compassionate conservativism and holy-moley born-again, but he is doing his utmost to destroy affirmative action and opportunities for the poor of all races.

Hekate
County Affirmative Action Commissioner,
1989 - 2001

[Piperay]

60. Yes I would IF

his record proves that he is not really a racist. I ABSOLUTELY don't like someone telling jokes like that, they DEFINITELY go down in my opinion but still actions speak louder than words.