Does the Democratic leadership live in a sound-proof bubble?

[PlanetBev]

Don't they hear what's going on in the rank and file? Don't they realize that we think they're a bunch of spineless, dickless, don't-give-a-fuck-just-let-me-pick-up-my-paycheck slimey worms? Don't they want to win? Don't they see by now that playing it safe will always end in failure?

They remind me of kids at a Thanksgiving dinner. As long as they get a little gravy on their 'taters, they're just happy sitting together at the kiddie's table.

I hate these weasels. Everytime someone like Howard Dean, John Murtha or Russ Feingold stands up, the Democrats flee in terror in all directions. Everyday that Bush sinks, they are being handed golden opportunities, but are too stupid and weak to take them.

[HillDem]

1. Feingold is practically leadership

And hes got some big brass ones.

And we WILL win in 06.

[PuraVidaDreamin]

2. They don't work for us the people anymore

They work for the corporations

[Jim Sagle]

7. They lose because corporate cash pays them to lose. Losing is their job.

[Warpy]

9. I've long suspected this is the case

because they're all rich men who actually got tax cuts and want to keep them.

In any case, they are there to play Colmes to whatever Hannity the GOP offers up, to make token noises about principles and then nod agreement with the vastly superior GOP programs just before the cut to commercial.

I'm sick of conservative candidates. I'm sick of men who take their marching orders from the DLC website. I'm sick of men who have completely sold out the party base every chance they get. I'm sick of candidates who put corporations ahead of people and dogma ahead of common sense.

And I'm not wasting my precious vote on them ever again.

[PuraVidaDreamin]

16. I'm tiring too.

Every weekend I get out the the peace vigil
Instead of doing fun things with the family on holidays'
I trek out to the Rotary to blog. Sometimes stand out
in front of the nearby military base by myself with signs
decrying this war, and honoring our dead soldiers.
Make phone calls to Washington offices, and local legislatures
offices- write them letters, at least once a week.

Gone to marches- started the medical tent outside of
Camp Casey two in Crawford- Planning action in a months time that will likely land me in jail.

I remember a funner life, just mountainbiking me and my dog-
taking my boys to music festivals- only 5 years ago, things were
just so much simpler than.

I make more money, and have nothing to show for it.

All I ask from my congress people is to stand up and listen to we the people.
We are not happy and we would like to see you change things in whatever
manner and option you have open to you. NOW

btw- wanna see what I'mm be holding on Sunday during our Rotary Blog

[Erika]

8. You mean the republicans?

Or can you give us specifics?

[Daphne08]

25. Unfortunately, this is true, and it gives me no pleasure saying

that.

Until we can separate the corporate lobbyists from OUR representatives, We the People will continue to be ignored.

[proReality]

3. Frankly...

I think a lot of them sleep in the same bed with some of the neocons. They just don't give a damn what any of us think.

[Erika]

11. Who are you talking about?

Can you give us specifics?

[marmar]

4. I don't get it either...

and we're burdened with Joe Lieberman, a complete cancer on the party.

[WildEyedLiberal]

5. Howard Dean IS Dem leadership.

Just sayin'.

[Erika]

10. Yep n/t

[radio4progressives]

6. i can't say i disagree with ya...

the Elito-O fiasco claims that they're just a minority and don't have enough votes - well they didn't seem to care much about that during the Dubai Ports deal - did they? They didn't give a flying fuck what the numbers were in the Senate - they vowed to fight and hound and play the "you can run but you can't hide" loop endlessly -

but now they return to their supine positions like slugs hiding under rocks in the redwoods. bastards.

[stillrockin]

12. I hate them too.

We need to vote in some real Democrats.

[Erika]

14. Who would you suggest as a real democrat? n/t

[SaveElmer]

13. Frankly...given the constraints the work under...

I think Reid and Pelosi are doing a good job.

I also think Howard Dean at the DNC is doing an excellent job as well.

[yngliberal]

17. DLC?

Do you support the DLC?

[Andromeda]

20. He supports the DNC...

he didn't say DLC.

[SaveElmer]

26. Irrelevent to this discussion...

What is the implication of your statement?

Neither Reid, Pelosi, nor Dean are in the DLC.

The DLC has it uses...I criticize them for some things and support their ideas on others.

[aden_nak]

15. Almost as dense a bubble as Bush, most of the time.

[aaronnyc]

18. It's all politics

They understand that the rank-and-file are going to be mad at them for not going along with censure; they regret this: it will make fund raising for the DNC harder, it de-activates the base, it gives rise to the possibility of a 3rd Party, and it generally makes the Democratic Party look weak and unorganized.

Despite this, they feel that voting for censure would have been even more politically damaging. The wire-tapping debate is one of the few issues where the public still supports Bush; to argue for censuring a president (something which has only been done once in U.S. history) on an issue where the majority of the public thinks the president is right about, would be politically disastrous. The wire-tapping issue is: fear/security vs. civil liberties - never has civil liberties won that debate among the American public. If you don't believe me, remember how in '88 Dukakais was constantly attacked for being "a card carrying member of the ACLU"(only in America would that be considered a bad thing).

Moreover, censuring a sitting president is very serious thing, and the idea of doing it makes a lot of the public nervous. Right now Bush is floundering - the recent drop in his approval rating is due to declining support from Independents and Republicans (Democrats have consistently hated Bush for years). Democrats voting to censure Bush is just what would get independent and conservative voters right back in Bush's camp.

Independents have largely disapproved of Bush over the past couple years because they see him as too partisan and divisive - if the Democratic Party were to rally behind censuring Bush they would see the Democrats as the one's who are being partisan and divisive. Censuring a sitting president is a very strong symbolic gesture, but it does nothing of any practical purpose - essentially, all it does is embarrass Bush. Thus, moderates will see the Democrat's attempt to censure Bush as evidence that they are more interested in appealing to their base (who will get an emotional satisfaction out of seeing Bush shamed) than they are in unifying the country. The Democrats would be perceived as engaging in just the kind of overtly partisan politics which many independents have grown tired of seeing from the Bush administration.

Republicans have finally started to tire of Bush over the past year. The most notable examples of this, are Harriet Miers and the Dubai Port Deal. There is also a growing split between Evangelicals and traditional conservatives which has caused some of the drop in Bush's popularity. The one sure-fire way to get these people stead-fast behind Bush is if they feel that he is unfairly being attacked by LIBERALS; the feeling of being under attack by liberals has always motivated the GOP base (think 1994). Also, remember how liberals rallied around Clinton during the impeachment hearings - it wasn't because they were particularly fond of Clinton's policies - but, it was because they felt the need to defend him when he was being unfairly attacked by people they despised (GOP leadership). Conservatives will feel the same way if they see Democrats pushing to have Bush censured.


I could write a lot more about this, but I really should go to bed. I just wish people understood that doing what is right morally has nothing to do with doing what is right politically. Sorry to be so cynical and pessimistic, but anybody who has seriously studied political strategy will tell you the same thing.

[Andromeda]

22. Good post.

You've brought up some good points. Please come back sometime and elaborate some more on this subject.

[bklyncowgirl]

23. You make some good points about the politcs of ths, however...

I would like to say though that we are reaching a point where, according to that wild-eyed lefty Sandra Day O'Connor, we may be in danger of losing our constitutional form of government.

In addition, how do Democrats convince the public that they are able to stand up to Osama Bin Laden if they are unwilling to stand up to the likes of George Bush, Dick Cheney and Bill Frist?

I'm hoping for a good instructive debate on this issue followed by a party line vote that of course will go down in flames with the Democrats standing strongly ad proudly as the defenders of the Constitution.

A girl can dream can't she.

[Greyhound]

19. Not stupid but they are weak. Too weak to wean themselves from

their corporate masters. They take their marching orders from those that pay their way. Our opinions are just something to not talk about as elections draw near.

[OneBlueSky]

21. it's worse than that . . . they're neither stupid nor weak, but . . .

just in government for all the wrong reasons . . . with VERY few exceptions, they honestly don't give two shits about you, or me, or any American other than themselves . . . they're mostly wealthy white folks whose motivation for running for office was to become part of the ruling elite -- the "in crowd" -- and to enrich themselves financially and politically . . . except for those very few, anything they might say about "serving the people" is nothing but platitudes and pure bullshit . . .

[Greyhound]

28. Agreed.

[MrBenchley]

24. No....

But they do recognize that our internet cowboys are atiny fringe group....

"Don't they hear what's going on in the rank and file?"
The rank and file in the real world is gearing up to win elections all around the country this fall.

[ClassWarrior]

27. Call your Senators and ask them this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2512789&mesg_id=2512789

NGU.

[Atman]

29. Censuring the president IS a very serious thing

As is illegal wire tapping.
As is illegal warring.
As is torture.
As is appointing know-nothing cronies to important posts.

You know the list...it is endless.

Meanwhile, CENSURE, while you say it is "a very serious thing," is still merely a motion filed on a piece of paper, over which a bunch of men and women are simply asked to raise their hands in support. No one will die or lose their next meal over a Bush censure vote. But it will certainly send a strong message, and add a much-needed footnote to the history books. Not to mention the most important aspect...it will finally energize this demoralized base.

[shance]

30. So is mass genocide in Iraq and Afghanistan oh, and in New Orleans

n/t