"Does the Senator support censure or criminal activity?"

[ClassWarrior]

Ask that when you call your Senators' offices today, and wait for the pause when it dawns on the staffer what a the dilemma Feingold's censure resolution presents to his or her boss.

In my case, the staffer said, "The Senator has not made a statement on that yet." The resonse to this, of course, is, "So there IS a chance the Senator DOES support criminal activity?"

Framing, people. Framing.

NGU.

[rodeodance]

1. and JUST DO IT (call your Senators--Dems and Repugs alike)--they

need to know where you stand.

[ClassWarrior]

6. They ARE supposed to be our representatives. At the very least...

...they have to listen to us. So give 'em an earful.

NGU.

[rodeodance]

9. at the very least --JUST DO IT>

[ClassWarrior]

25. .

[rodeodance]

2. and here is his Censure petition to sign.

http://www.progressivepatriotsfund.com/page/petition/nsa0206

[AlamoDemoc]

3. Thanks for the link. Signed, sealed and sent n/t

[rodeodance]

4. Lovely

[calimary]

28. And seconded!

Guys - whether your reps are in on this or not, IT IS VITALLY IMPORTANT that you weigh in. Especially with the enemy camp. They need to know and hear and see and understand that the numbers are stacking up AGAINST them, regardless how they personally feel about it, or how much they still feel a need to toady up to bush/rove.

[ClassWarrior]

29. Amen, Mar.

NGU.

[flpoljunkie]

5. Sign it and then send it out to your email list.

[PVK]

37. And one from Move-On to sign as well!

http://political.moveon.org/censure/

[rodeodance]

7. nominated

[quaoar]

8. I sent an email to my senator -- Jeff Sessions

which has been ignored so far.

I'm sooooooooooo shocked.

[ClassWarrior]

12. That's okay, it gives you a chance to keep asking the question...

...over and over and over again.

NGU.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

13. he ignores me too

Sessions is nothing more than a mouthpiece for Bush.

[guidod]

36. E-mails don't go very far, call him...

...Toll free: [phone]

[freefall]

67. You have my deepest sympathies. He is slime.

I feel pretty bad about my senators, Snowe and Collins, but at least they have SOMETHING resembling a heart and brain. Sessions is a total slug.

Peace,

freefall

P.S. Come to think of it. Maybe you are better off. At least Sessions is completely recognizable as a slug whereas Snowe and Collins can fool a lot of people.

[texpatriot2004]

10. You're a genius ClassWarrior and you have such a way with

words...

NGU!

[ClassWarrior]

16. As John Lennon once said...

..."We all doin' what we can." (HE was a real genius, by the way. But thanks for the kind words, tex.)

:hi:

NGU.

[The Backlash Cometh]

11. It's actually one of their campaign issues.

You don't reward a criminal by granting him amnesty.

[Higans]

32. Wow. Use that line. Hold them to it!

[EFerrari]

14. Nice.

:)

[ClassWarrior]

24. Thanks for all you're doing on this, pat.

B-):thumbsup:

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

31. .

[DrDan]

15. I just called Sen Bill Nelson't office

they will not say how he is leaning on this effort

[mzmolly]

17. That's goooood!

:toast:

[ClassWarrior]

20. Cheers Mol!

:toast:

NGU.

[radio4progressives]

18. Excellent Idea! Thanks! Making My Calls this Morning with that Question

:kick::thumbsup::applause:

[radio4progressives]

19. Please Call Senator Harry Reid Too With this Question (202-224-3542)

I just spoke to Staffer in Senator Reid's Washington office:

here's what I said:

First I mentioned that I was calling from California but because he is the Minority Leader, charged with getting Democrats in line, I asked if Sen Reid has yet determined his position on Feingold's motion for Censure - mentioning that it was very clear that he was not doing that yesterday -

I also mentioned that i saw photos of Reid on AP wires very apparently admonishing Feingold in the Hallways - and then I told the Staffer that Senator Feingold is the only Democratic Senator with a Spine (i know that's not quite true, but my point was to mention that i hope he runs for President and that I'm sending money to his pac)

Staffer essentially said that he didn't know what his position is yet, but would be happy to pass on my message - then i said it all comes down to whether or not Senator Reid supports Censure or Supports Criminal Activity? That it all boils down to that question.

Staffer was very friendly and said he'll make sure that the Senator gets that message.

Now I'm going to call my Senator Boxer's and Senator Feinstein's office again with the same question.

Censure or Criminal Activity?

That's the issue. thank you for Framing the Question so succinctly. :hi:

[ClassWarrior]

53. This is important...

NGU.

[radio4progressives]

21. reporting back again

Just called Feinstein's DC office and was able to get through - "no position yet" - passed on the message as framed in OP..

Senator Boxer's office DC office outgoing message says it's closed (wtf?)
i called san francisco office and the vm box is full. lines are busy.

they are getting inundated with calls but that information is not getting out in the media -

interesting that the public reaction to the Dubai port deal was highly publicized but on issues Democrats care about - not one word is mentioned about the calls flooding in these offices.

interesting, but not surprising.

[ClassWarrior]

22. So what did Di's office say when you asked...

..."So there's a chance she might support criminal activity?"

Just curious.

NGU.

[radio4progressives]

23. lol! No..."I'll pass on the message, thank you for calling"

that was it essentially...

[Stinky The Clown]

26. That worked like a charm!

My senators are Mikulski and Sarbanes, so at least they let me speak my mind.

Neither 'has formed a position' (what the fuck are their choices?)

When told that, my response was "so ... there's a chance the Senator is in support of a ciminal act?"

Silence ...... then .....

"Thanks you for your call. I'll pass your position on to the Senator".

[ClassWarrior]

27. That's great! Thanks for the update...

NGU.

[Higans]

33. Sock it to em...

[ClassWarrior]

34. A success story!

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

30. I called mine again a little while ago. They're going to hear...

...this question from me till I get an answer one way or the other.

NGU.

[EFerrari]

35. Kick

[ClassWarrior]

40. .

[ClassWarrior]

51. .

[Usrename]

38. The question is a simple one.

The administration argues, very effectively through mass propaganda, that the President has the inherent power to avoid complying with the law in order to fulfill his duty as Commander in Chief and protect the nation.

So the real question is: Where the hell does the Constitution say that, exactly? What phrase are they relying on to make such a claim. I can't find one. Can anyone show me the Article and Section where it says that? Of course not. So why do we have so many folks on TV saying that, and no one ever asks them to show the specific clause? It's propaganda folks, and hopefully a call for censure will help break through those lies.

The only text in the Constitution that relates to this is the Fourth Amendment.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

It couldn't be more plain, but until someone asks Gonzales et al to put up or shut up, the public will continue to be lied to by the media.

[drfresh]

39. Called Senator Kohl's office

Asked if he would be supporting Feingold's censure. "He's not sure that -- at this time -- its the best idea....", and then I used this line: "So should I take that to mean that Senator Kohl supports the illegal wiretapping of American citizens?"..... the lady then said its important for hearings to be held first for the facts to come out. I agreed that its important for the facts to come out, but said it was pretty patently clear that Bush had broken the law. "When its time to vote on this matter, if the Senator does not have some balls on this issue, I will be voting for his opponent this fall."

She thanked me for my call.

[IsIt1984Yet]

43. I called Herbie's office, too.

I was told that he'd "like to review the facts before he makes a decision on whether we will support Russ". I told her that if he doesn't, he's supporting criminal activity and becomes a party to said criminal activity. She said that "IF Bush broke the law, he should be punished to the fullest extent of the law". I agreed and stated that it's clear laws have been broken and steps must be taken sooner than later. I also told her that Sen. Kohl must also take the opinions of his constituents into account and asked that she please pass on mine and let him know that if he wants my vote, he'd better start to take a stand against these violations of my constitutional rights.

[drfresh]

47. Good one

I've had the pleasure of meeting Kohl twice... once in high school, once when he hopped on the same bus at a John Edwards event. And some other occasion too that slips my mind. He seems like a nice guy, but he doesn't seem to do much other than try to stay in office.

[IsIt1984Yet]

41. I love it! I assume that was Kohl's office?

He's next on my list.

[ClassWarrior]

42. Herb's a gem.

:eyes:

NGU.

[IsIt1984Yet]

45. Yeah, a real peach.

:eyes:

[adigal]

44. I just sent this letter to Clinton

Dear Senator Clinton,
If you refuse to censure President Bush, please take me off of your mailing lists. I stood by and watched while you allowed Alito to get on the bench. Now you are scared of the big, bad Republicans, so you won't support Senator Feingold. I see no difference between you and your Republican colleagues so take me off your mailing list and count me out for going out to vote this November. Why bother? You and the Republicans are the same when it comes to the big issues.

If you are not going to represent We the People, then you can try to win without Democratic votes. Good luck.

Regards,
Adigal

[ClassWarrior]

46. Nice...

B-):thumbsup:

NGU.

[Trevelyan]

55. I finally managed to get off Hillary's mailing list today. When I tried

before I just got error messages. I said essentially the same thing to her several issues and several months ago. I am glad not to have that DINOs email in my mailbox. I had been deleting them without reading.

[CheshireCat]

64. Great letter

Do you mind if I use the text in emailing my senators?

[PuraVidaDreamin]

48. Well Kennedy's office says the same as the others

He's studying the issue.

Guess we'll just have to see what his office peeps say tomorrow.
Another 24 hours should be all he needs right?

[ClassWarrior]

49. Keep asking the question till he gives you an answer.

That's the beauty of it. You can stay in his face every day till he commits.

NGU.

[FogerRox]

50. Frame this BUsH . . . . . . .Russ Rox

[PBass]

52. Bump for brilliant framing of the issue. (eom)

[bleever]

54. Kicking for a very simple question: censure, or criminal activity?

NGU!

[Trevelyan]

56. Kick!! Very helpful for people calling their Senators to support Russ'

courageous stand... Where are the Dems?? Boxer, Kennedy, Levin (hah), Feinstein, REID????

We the people, need to have a say in who the Democratic leader is and I vote for Feingold. We can't wait!!!

Is it more than a rumor that Kerry is going to support Censure?

x( :( :argh: :shrug: :dem: :kick:

[makeanoise22]

57. Well guess who my Senators Are?

The Honorable Bill Frist (R)
The Honorable Lamar Alexander (R)

I have emailed them both but now will call with the question at the top of this forum, and I will let you know what they say...

If the Democrats don't rally behind Feingold, they are useless cowards...
I have been telling all of you for 2 years, this is your GUY to run for President...

Anyway, will return with the responses of my Honorable Senators!
LOL

[makeanoise22]

58. and so I called my Senators and...

the spokesperson for FRIST said,
"Sen. Frist believes the President committed no wrong doing or anything illegal, however, I will forward your message to him"

for Alexander, i was given a voice mail...but left a message...

We'll see...

[ClassWarrior]

59. That's great. Next time you call the Fristians on this, challenge them...

"How can the Senator make a judgement like that without an investigation?"

Keep piling it on.

Great job!!

B-):thumbsup:

NGU.

[calimary]

60. And another kick!

THERE!

This is IMPORTANT, guys!

[ClassWarrior]

63. .

[FogerRox]

61. Excellent frame - yes Kick

[pat_k]

62. Not "Framing" -- Just Simple Truths and Moral Positions

A vote against Censure doesn't turn them into accomplices in Bush's crimes. They already were accomplices. A vote against Censure would just confirm the role they are already playing.

Their silence made them accomplices. Every day that they failed to accuse and demand accountability, they served the criminals.

They may feel like the resolution is putting them on the spot or needlessly forcing them to go on the record, but that is not what this is about at all. By introducing the Censure resolution, Sen. Feingold is giving them a golden opportunity -- a chance to redeem themselves and finally take a step away from complicity.

You hit the nail on the head on what we need to be asking our Senators.

They are lost in a fog of rationalization. We need to pose the stark questions and keep prodding them to tell us why they hesitate.

But, we need to do more than read them the riot act. We need to ask WHY they hestitate to take this opportunity to shed the bonds of complicity. We can't directly challenge their rationalizations they assert them. If we don't challenge and stamp out the wrong-headed notions that block principled action, they'll continue to invoke those notions to dismiss whatever we hit them with.

[ClassWarrior]

65. It is framing - framing Simple Truths and Moral Positions...

...as opposed to the RW, which uses "Orwellian Language" to frame its simple lies and immoral positions.

NGU.

[pat_k]

66. IMO, the term "framing" puts focus on "message marketability". . .

IMO, the term "framing" puts focus on "message marketability". . .

Lakeoff's insights into how our thinking and emotional reactions are shaped by metaphor are significant, and I'm delighted that his work is finally getting the attention it has long deserved ("Metaphors We Live By" was published back in the '80s, long before "Moral Politics" or "Don't Think of an Elephant: Know Your Values and Frame the Debate").

Unfortunately, "framing" and "re-framing" are fast becoming overused, and misused, buzzwords.

I'm sure people don't intend to shift the focus off morals and values when they talk about re-framing, but I'm seeing that happen. You may not be falling into the trap, but for many, the "Moral" part of "Moral Politics" and the "Know Your Values" part are getting lost as they focus on how to "Frame the Debate."

Words shape thinking. We can avoid pitfall is if we stop to consider how new buzzwords may be shaping our discourse and thought.

To me, it is far more critical to identify simple truths and moral positions that cut through fascist crap and foolish notions, than to define new "frames" for our "messages."

As you point out, the former task can be defined as a form of the latter, but when we skip over the fact that we are talking about some basic truths here, we risk getting caught up in a world where "message" trumps meaning or reality.

The insights that come with understanding the emotional context we create with the language we use can help us boil things down to the basic truths that guide action. If the goal of analyzing the context or "frame" is to manipulate -- and that is what many seem to focus on -- we get in trouble.