Nader Factor 2008?

[electionhistorian]

What do DU folks think about the chances of another run by this guy in '08? Does it even matter?

Seems like he was hardly a factor in '04. But a big reason for that is we were prepared after 2000 and pretty much neutralized him from day one in '04. So what about it - does that need to happen again in '08 (if he runs), or is he all washed up anyway?

[NoPasaran]

1. Nader who?

[Rainscents]

2. Who's that?

[MadMaddie]

3. I don't want to think about Nadar near any up coming election cycle....

he needs to be neutralized and rendered ineffective....

[skylarmae]

4. you forgot, 'really old' in your question -

too old by '08 maybe.

[ulysses]

5. how did "we" neutralize him in '04?

:eyes:

I doubt he'll run again, anyway.

[electionhistorian]

7. That's what I'm wondering

A lot of people think he was the decisive factor in 2000 - 97,000 votes in FL and all that. But it doesn't seem like anyone thinks he was a factor at all in 2004. Maybe that's because his support just faded after four years of Bush, due to greater unity against W. But there was also a greater effort to prevent Nader from playing the spoiler in '04 than there was in 2000. I don't know what that involved, but I know people were better organized last time around, and it seems to have worked. That's all I meant by "we." I'm not trying to speak for anybody...

[ulysses]

9. the need to get rid of Bush

led many to vote for Kerry who might not have otherwise - I can't say I wouldn't have voted for Kerry had Bush not been as horrible as he is, but it was the first presidential race since 92 that I didn't vote Green.

I don't think there was a particular effort at keeping Nader support low, though.

[peace frog]

6. "Seems like he was hardly a factor in '04"?

How can you suggest that votes for Nader are of no consequence? Had his votes gone to Kerry, we would have won.

If there is a third party candidate in '08, please let it be an ultra RW fundie type who will capture the 15-20% of hardcore conservative votes. By siphoning those votes from the Repubs we have a real chance for Dems to take back the White House.

[electionhistorian]

10. That's true...

But 2004 wasn't at all like 2000. What did he get, like .1% of the vote in '04? I know that still makes a difference but it's not like getting 3%-4%, which makes the difference much more significant. Just wondering what accounts for the difference between 2000 and 2004. Personally I don't think that his supporters coming back inside the tent tells the whole story, because I think they pretty much knew the risk they were taking in the first place. So I think the real story is the preparation and the organized opposition in place in 2004.

[peace frog]

11. Yeah ... well

if there is a god, Nader will not run again. He serves only to steal votes away from a real presidential candidate, as unfortunately seen in '00 and'04.

[Radical Activist]

12. The reality

is that anyone who voted for Nader in '04 is never going to vote for a Democrat unless its someone like Kucinich. Its unrealistic to claim Nader was stealing votes from Kerry. Had Nader not been in the race in '04 they would have likely voted socialist or not voted at all.

[peace frog]

14. Friggin' teases

Stay home if you can't vote for a real presidential nominee, losers.

[Radical Activist]

15. Are you on recess?

Like Nader or not, I think my point is correct. Nader voters in '04 would most likely not have voted for Kerry regardless if Nader was in the race. Stay home if you can't have a discussion without schoolyard taunts.

[peace frog]

16. I am home thank you

and YOU need to get a sense of humor to *get* my posts. Smooches, RA. :hi:

[TransitJohn]

17. You are right

I can't imagine voting for Nader in '04. I thought about voting my conscience in the last election, which wouldn't have been Nader but Brown/Herbert, but didn't. I proudly voted for John Kerry. I really wish that Kucinich or Dean had had the backing of the Democratic Party, as either would've been much easier for me, and call me crazy, but I think either one would've been a stronger candidate. Also, as a caveat, I give myself much more latitude to explore my options, as a resident of Wyoming, I know where my 3 Electoral College votes are gonna go.

[formernaderite]

20. uh...you do know about the electoral college

it depends on the state, whether Nader has any effect..and I saw NO state in 04 that he would have flipped the margins. If anything, I think the greens will be running a stronger candidate. Particularly if the democratic candidate is seen as weak on the anti-war vote.

[peace frog]

22. The Greens will be running a candidate?

That is excellent news for the Republican nominee, who stands to lose nothing and gain everything by it. Thanks for playing.

[we can do it]

8. FUCK THAT NARCISSISTIC ASSHOLE

Go away already....

[onehandle]

13. Washed up. nt

[radio4progressives]

18. There will be so many other Third Party Contenders, Nader will fade into

history dust bin...

The Feckless Dems think they have something going for them just because Bush is so low in his numbers, and certain a name or two in the Republican party has been tainted with the "corruption" brush, that will mean a glorious victory for us...

they're not paying attention to how they are being perceived.

I heard a remark repeated about Bush's Tin Ear mentioned a few days ago not for the first time over the Dubai ports deal, Harriet Miers, Social Security..

Well the repukes aren't the only ones with a "Tin Ear".

Both parties are suffering from the same desease mightily, as the Elite-O fiasco showed, as this Censure Resolution demonstrates and so many other things.

The Dubai Ports deal completely exposed the power the Dems do actually have in getting an issue front and center - it's merely a question of political will. Why is necessary for the Dems to rely on what only the Republicans want and think before they act?

The question will be how many third parties will emerge and campaign for presidential election in 2008.. Nader will be a blip on the screen if that.

[Minnesota Libra]

19. Contact neocons and see if they have some more money then we will know nt

[JeffR]

21. Yes, he'll run. No, it won't matter.

eom