WHERE THE F**K IS THE DEMOCRATS' PLAN???

[UrbScotty]

It's right here:

www.democrats.org/agenda.html

See, many of us often either pay too much attention to the 'liberal' media or refuse to open our eyes.

"So why haven't they been talking about it?" They have been; but, again, is the media balanced?

[Nictuku]

1. MSM has buried it (n/t)

[Zorra]

2. Add "Free Beer", and we have a winner. n/t

[OregonBlue]

3. I think this is all too general to get anyone's attention. It's all very

touchy feely but not specific.

[Asgaya Dihi]

4. Agreed

I haven't looked it all over in detail yet but so far I'd have to agree. I'm on the part about honest government and they suggest some good basic ideas such as honesty, but when I click on the more details link I see articles about how bad some of our problems have been rather than how how we're going to fix them. Where's the solution?

We don't need good catch phrases, we need a plan.

[OregonBlue]

5. yes we do. I think that the problem with coming out with an actual

plan is that the Repukes will start dissecting it immediately. I'm hoping that Dean has made a judgment to "keep his powder dry" until the campaigns really begin but, I could be wrong. Maybe they really don't have detailed plans on any of this.

The other problem is that whenever the Dems come up with a good plan, Bush tries to co-op it and in fact does a pretty good job.

The best plan I've heard so far came from Bill Clinton, re: The United States becomes the world leader in renewable, sustainable energy. We become the world green leader through subsidizing research into alternative energy, et. Bush will never co-op this plan because it will eliminate his oil company buddies.

This is an issue Dems can win with. Even though large amounts of money would be spent up front, it's money that could go ONLY to American corporations doing business in America and it will provide energy Independence in the long run, get us out of the Middle-East, clean up our atmosphere, etc., etc., etc. It's about investing money in America, to Americans for the good of Americans and the Planet.

Of course, it's a dangerous plan. When Bush even hinted at such a plan in his state of the union speech, he was called to task by the OPEC countries who threatened to switch to Euros for oil instead of dollars. It would take real balls on the part of Dems to challenge OPEC and it would mean the U.S. would have to move fast to develop alternative fuels.

I want to see a real plan, not platitudes!!

[Asgaya Dihi]

6. I hope you're right

We've got a lot of work to do in this country and don't have time to waste, but if it's just a matter of strategy and they do come out with something solid that's fine and I'll back them if it's good.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

22. do you people even watch or read the news

This DEMOCRAT PLAN is everywhere!

Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 09:49 PM by Jeffersons Ghost
thanks mdmc read this:


Howard Dean's Five-Point Democratic Agenda on Face the Nation

News

By Lee Russ, Section OpEd
Posted on Tue Feb 14, 2006 at 09:13:12 AM EST
Last Sunday, 2-12-06, Howard Dean was one of two guests on Face the Nation. For a man who gets a lot of smear from the right, and grief from Independents and some Democrats, he was making a lot of sense.

Among other things, he laid out a very reasonable five-point agenda for the Democrats, and put Ken Mehlman's recent attempt to portray Hillary Clinton as "too angry" in proper perspective.

....
Elisabeth Bumiller: Let me go to politics, domestic politics. Senator Chris Dodd told The New York Times last week that the Democrats seemed to be losing their voice when it comes to the basic things that people worry about. I mean, you're the chairman of the party, do you agree with that assessment?

Howard Dean: It's certainly not true. I can tell you--I can tell you what our agenda is for the '06 elections, which we have agreed to go with Senator Reid, Leader Pelosi and others.
One, we want honesty and openness back in government again. Two, we want a strong national defense, first of all, based on telling the truth to our citizens and our soldiers before we send troops abroad to defend America. Three, we want American jobs that will stay in America using energy independence as a new industry to create millions of construction and manufacturing jobs. Four, we want a health-care system that works for everybody, just like 36 other countries have in the world. And, five, we want a strong public education system so we can have optimism and opportunity back in America. I think that's a pretty good agenda, and I think it's one that can win it for us in '06.

[Stinky The Clown]

14. Specificity is what kills us every time ... EVERY time

The electorate doesn't do specifics. They do feelings and impressions. For far, far too long, we dems have been too intellectual in our campaigning. We deserve the impression given of us that we're wonky nerds, not people of action.

The best practice it to have policies that are stated in evocations ... words that evoke images or feelings.

If we get into specifics, what we get in return is a whole bunch of RW shriek monkeys, each with unlimited media access, and each one assigned one nit to pick. And they pick it endlessly. We are then reduced to defending our specifics (to an increasingly tuned out audience), all the while failing to get out the bigger message.

"You can do better with your money than Washington, DC, can."

That won the tax issue for them. The specifics were horrible to everyone who makes less than a couple of hundred thou, but that didn't matter. They sold the **image**.

In the meantime, we had our guys out there telling us how they'd do better and gave us endless ways their model tax code would work.

Nobody was listening. They already had their icon ... their image .... their feeling.

In 06 and 08, would it not be better for us to go after them on, say, security, not with plans to supply every port with hypotheoretical quadrant ray technology generators suitable for looking inside sea containers for the entire spectrum of strontium pistachio gama rays, and then say how we'd pay for it by rolling back the third tier of the quantitative excise tax on the first 400 billion in new wave fees, but by simply saying short, concise words and phrases

Just look at the first point made in Dean's video clip:

HONEST leadership and OPEN government (goes to Abramoff and Plame and delay, etc. **and** to exclusionary hearings and jackbooted House leadership.)

REPUBLICAN CULTURE OF CORRUPTION - no need to add anything to that ... its obvious and unassailable

FUNDAMENTAL REFORMS (trite to be sure, but in today's climate, it resonates)

ACCOUNTABLE TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE (trite again, but even the most deluded knows what cronyism and special interests are, even if they deny it, in their heart of hearts they know its a good thing)

So, no .... no specifics.

Image.

Icons.

Feelings.

That's what wins.

[smoochpooch]

20. You are absolutely right,

Neither the media nor the average citizen has the patience for long, detailed explanations. Hopefully, we won't need any this year!

[Bushknew]

27. WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!

It’s sad but true and the proof is that many people still think Saddam was responsible for 911.

Remember how the gallery of right wing monkey TV hacks nit picked on how
emotionless Gore was? Then as Dean showed some emotion at his own pep rally
they crucified him for it.

The Republican mantra was restoring honor to the White House.

I definitely agree that our mantra should include phrase like:

Fiscally responsible

HONEST leadership

OPEN government ACCOUNTABLE TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE

I love how these hacks now want to hear what the Democratic ideas are!!!!

It’s like a child that didn’t listen to their parents advise, got mixed up in the wrong
crowd and now find themselves looking at prison time. Mommy, Daddy, what
is your advise now?

The best idea WAS to let the inspectors search for WMD in Iraq dumbasses.

Our presence there will not "stabilize" the region. I don’t think it possible
to stabilize that region.

[Raksha]

31. You're absolutely right!

What sells are sound bites, NOT specifics!

[gordontron]

32. as long as it backed up by specifics

I agree that our message needs to be strong, simple, and have a nice ring to it, but we need a load of examples. The question republicans will then ask is "ok but how will you change_____" and we can't just fire back generalizations. Still I think you are fundamentally right.

edit: I can spell reeelllyyyy well

[Imagevision]

7. Dem Plan? - let them self destruct which is currently happening

what plan did Bush have as his poll ratings were at 43% before 9-11 - was the plan wait until 9-11?

[Greyhound]

12. Repukes suck and we're not repukes, is not a plan.

[Yoda Yada]

8. If Bush is such a great leader....

...why is he always whining about the Democrats not having a plan? The Republicans control three branches of our government....THEY are supposed to be leading the country, NOT asking the opposition for a plan!

Besides...over the past few years, I HAVE HEARD "plans" (on various topics) from Kerry, Dean, Murtha, Biden, Feingold, Durbin and so on......and what is said within 24 hours of hearing a "Dem plan"?

"Why don't the Democrats have a plan?":grr: :grr: :grr:

(On MTP awhile back, John Kerry listed a 10 point plan of what needed to be done in this country.....24 hours later the media was asking "Why doesn't ANY Dem have a plan?" :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: )

I want to hear a Democrat ask a Republican "What is YOUR plan?...YOU'RE in charge....YOU claim to be such great leaders...

....don't wimp out..... this is about YOU...tell us....what is YOUR plan? :smoke: :smoke: :smoke:

[UrbScotty]

9. Agreed 100% (nt)

[MadisonProgressive]

16. Right, and "stay the course" isn't a plan

[Bushknew]

28. Democrat ask a Republican "What is YOUR plan?...YOU'RE in charge

Spot on

[Greyhound]

10. OK, so I've plowed through the whole "plan" and the only solid

point is support for increasing the minimum wage, and even that does not say what it should be raised to. They are for immigration reform, what reforms? How will it be implemented and when? They are in favor the DHS. Great, another layer of bureaucracy with no specific mandate, nor timetable, nor accountability. They are for retirement security and education and affordable health-care. Wow, and I though they were against all of these things. Maybe they'll come out in favor of mothers and opposition to murder too.

Argh!!!!! :banghead:

[Greyhound]

11. Kick to see a response.

:kick:

[SeaBob]

13. Have Some Backbone

here is the backbone campaign platform

http://www.backbonecampaign.org/platform/document.cfm?ID=7

[mdmc]

15. blame Nader... and we are better then the GOP

what MORE do you want?

[LevelB]

17. When I hear a conservative repeat the "common wisdom"

that the Democrats don't have a plan, I just laugh out loud and say "So, this is the Republican plan? This is how it is supposed to be?"

Tends to get the heads shaking.

B.

[welshTerrier2]

18. nothing on Iraq or Iran in there ???

great plan if the plan is to be a domestic issues only party ...

anything in there about the Dems standing up to bush on Iran? you know, like maybe making a case to the American people that he needs to return to the Congress for authorization before he attacks Iran (if he hasn't already started an attack) ...

a plan that fails to coherently address how to end the insanity of bush's Iraq war and fails to make every possible effort to head off a rush to war in Iran is NO PLAN at all ...

[Greyhound]

19. What plan? There are several pages of platitudes.

FGS the re:pukes:s have done just about everything possible to make it easy to sweep this election, why aren't they moving?

[pat_k]

21. When "they" accuse "us," they are simply projecting . . .

. . .their own guilt/problems/failures.

Occasionally we hear the truth -- that it is the right that is devoid of "ideas." David Brock made this crystal clear in "Blinded by the Right."

The faces of so-called "conservativism" are just minions who are subsidized by more powerful people, who are in turn subsidized by more powerful people who are driven by hatred, irrational zealotry, pathological projection, and the quest for ever more power.

Unlike David Brock, who can think his way out of a paper bag, not many of these folks can make it in the "real world," so they get trapped by their own stupidity in some subsidized position as part of the Republican noise machine, spouting whatever propaganda serves their paymasters at a given moment.

Take note of the accusations, both small and large, that they make. With very few exceptions, they accuse "the enemy" of something they are themselves guilty of.

It is really quite telling.

When they say "Democrats don't have. . ." (take your pick: ideas, an agenda, a plan, a theme, whatever) they are describing themselves.

If they weren't leaving so much pain and devastation in their wake, you could almost feel sorry for them. Look at what the poor things are trying to compete with.

Ours is a tradition grounded in the morality of the Golden Rule and populated by people like David Hume and other enlightenment thinkers who inspired our Federal design; John Stewart Mill, who defined modern thought about the nature of, and limits on, the power a society can legitimately exercise on individual members; John Maynard Keynes and the understanding that private industry can only flourish and create prosperity for all when the power of the people to protect their interests is embodied in strong public institutions; Hobbs and Locke and other social contract philosophers, the list goes on and on.

And what do they have? Their "big idea" of the moment seems to be the Un-American notion of a unitary authoritarian executive, brain child of their "best thinkers" -- people like Scalia, Alito, John Yoo. The roots of such "big ideas" are more often than not found in places that most would be ashamed to cite.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

23. HERE'S THE WINNING DEMOCRATIC PLAN AND PLATFORM!

Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 09:49 PM by Jeffersons Ghost
thanks mdmc read this:


Howard Dean's Five-Point Democratic Agenda on Face the Nation

News

By Lee Russ, Section OpEd
Posted on Tue Feb 14, 2006 at 09:13:12 AM EST
Last Sunday, 2-12-06, Howard Dean was one of two guests on Face the Nation. For a man who gets a lot of smear from the right, and grief from Independents and some Democrats, he was making a lot of sense.

Among other things, he laid out a very reasonable five-point agenda for the Democrats, and put Ken Mehlman's recent attempt to portray Hillary Clinton as "too angry" in proper perspective.

....
Elisabeth Bumiller: Let me go to politics, domestic politics. Senator Chris Dodd told The New York Times last week that the Democrats seemed to be losing their voice when it comes to the basic things that people worry about. I mean, you're the chairman of the party, do you agree with that assessment?

Howard Dean: It's certainly not true. I can tell you--I can tell you what our agenda is for the '06 elections, which we have agreed to go with Senator Reid, Leader Pelosi and others.
One, we want honesty and openness back in government again. Two, we want a strong national defense, first of all, based on telling the truth to our citizens and our soldiers before we send troops abroad to defend America. Three, we want American jobs that will stay in America using energy independence as a new industry to create millions of construction and manufacturing jobs. Four, we want a health-care system that works for everybody, just like 36 other countries have in the world. And, five, we want a strong public education system so we can have optimism and opportunity back in America. I think that's a pretty good agenda, and I think it's one that can win it for us in '06.

[Yoda Yada]

25. So, there you go...we DO have a plan!

As I posted earlier...I have heard many "plans" concerning various subjects coming from Democrats. But the Republicans are so well programmmed that you could give a 10 Point Plan (as Kerry did) or a 5 point Plan (as Dean did), right to their face, and the next question out of the Republican media mouthpiece will be...."So, why don't the Democrats have a plan?":crazy: :crazy: :crazy:

What I WANT TO HEAR is a Democrat saying...."We DO have a plan (plans).....but you are just not listening! It just better serves the intentions of the Republican party to keep saying we don't have a plan. Isn't it a sign of WEAK leadership when you have to keep asking your opposition for a plan?" :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

[UrbScotty]

26. Thank you (nt)

[welshTerrier2]

29. this is pure pablum from Dean

i have no disagreement at all with any of the points Dean raised but let's not go around calling it a "plan"; it's not ...

No mention of Iraq? Iran? are these things not important to Dean? and where exactly is the foreign policy plank? do the Democrats have one? apparently not!!

and most onerous is the implicit argument that we were lied to so that bush could send troops abroad to "defend America" ... message to Howard: bush didn't lie about Iraq so that he could send troops there to "defend America" ...

and finally, even on a domestic agenda, Dean left a gaping hole ... it might be nice of him to address our disasterous fiscal crisis ... the Democrats might just want a plank about getting back to sound fiscal policy ...

[Bushknew]

30. Anybody disagree with that?

[NJmaverick]

24. Awesome point

We ALL need to do what we can to get the word out.

[ulysses]

33. interesting that they use "fair" trade.

I'd like to see what that means in translation.