ONLY 08 candidate who CAN win is the one who believes in machine fraud

[blm]

And works to expose it and works with DNC to secure the machines BEFORE the election.

End of story.

[glitch]

1. Agreed. nt

[tatertop]

2. Exactly

I am quite certain every politician knows about machine fraud.
Why this is not being addressed front and center I have no idea.

[hedda_foil]

3. Of course they all know about machine fraud (& every other type of fraud)

The deal is that both sides cheat as much as they can. Where Dems control, they do it. Where Repugs control, they do. Fraud is a party thing, see -- part of the game. The R's seem to be a whole lot better at it than the D's right now, but the D's don't want to give up the fraud advantage where they have it. That's the dirty little secret of American party politics and that's why the fraud issue goes absolutely nowhere. Crappy software and hardware that doesn't count accurately though -- why that can play havoc with computer-based fraud just as much as it can screw up acurate counts. THAT they worry about. That's one of the reasons why the nonpartisan "inaccuracies and errors" argument gets traction while the fraud argument is consistently batted down as tinfoilhattery.

Fixing the machines probably will NOT fix fraud. That's going to take massive and continual citizen oversight to gain control over election procedures. There is no magic bullet and no quick or easy way to get there, which is maddening but true. We can do this thing, but only if we work step by step from every angle ALL the time,to turn this whole fetid system around -- never slowing down, never giving up, and never giving in.

[tatertop]

10. How do you like Mark Crispin Miller's book, "Fooled Again"?

There has always been fraud, but not like this.
The pukes have an absolute stranglehold on the vote.
If we don't start winning some elections soon it will be a long long
time till we get the chance again. And at a price that is unthinkable.

[grannylib]

8. Just spent the last ten minutes sending the latest election fraud stuff

out to all the MSNBC, Fox, CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN shows.
I don't get it either.

Well, yes I do...it's reThuglican corruption and fraud, and the entire administration is illegitimate, and if the media covers this, it's admitting it's failed as miserably as * has.

[blm]

18. That's the kind of action it is going to take - - every day for months

until it starts to catch on. That's being a citizen. Salute.

[DELUSIONAL]

4. kick

[jwirr]

5. I seem to remember that Kerry had thousands of lawyers

checking for evidence of fraud after 04. They did not find enough in time to do anything about it. IF there had been any early clear evidence there would have been a challenge. Real evidence has not come out until much later. How do we set up surveillance so that we can detect hard evidence early enough to allow the process to be challenged?

[OrangeCountyDemocrat]

7. Yeah.....THOUSANDS Of Lawyers....Sure!

He took all the money he had saved up for an investigation, and ended up giving it all to the democratic party. The lawyers never did crap investigating what took place.

Mr. Kerry....please continue doing your job as Senator. We need you there now. Your time and chance of becoming president is over. Please don't cost us another election in '08.

[blm]

14. If he is the only one who believes in machine fraud to expose it, he WILL

win - and even you should be able to see that.

If another candidate does, then it is theirs to win.

[blm]

13. They were NOT looking at machine fraud - they were looking for civil right

violations and such. Kerry and the DNC had Gore's team working on that area, based on what they found in 2000 - no one put a team together to secure the machines BEFORE the election. That is what the DNC needs to put together - an anti-fraud unit in every county to test the machines BEFORE votes are cast.

AFTER is too late.

[msongs]

6. bush believed in machine fraud...AND he won. You are right! nt

[Totally Committed]

9. Does anyone have accurate information on whether Howard Dean

is working on Voter Fraud at all? I can't remember if I read that he was or wasn't, and know there are some here who can probably tell me and maybe provide some links?

I'd really like to know if this is part of his 50-State Strategy.

Great point, blm.

TC

[sandnsea]

12. Voters aren't committing fraud

Election officials may be, it's election fraud.

[OzarkDem]

11. Agree n/t

[Jai4WKC08]

15. The ones who understand about election fraud

Are the ones working hardest on 2006. Unless we can win the House, we won't have legislation to safequard fair elections in the future.

It'll be hard enough to win elections in November, given that so many manipulated voting machines are already out there. But it's a lot harder to control the outcome in 400+ individual districts than it is in a handful of key states in a national election.

[blm]

16. I sure as hell hope that the machines are secured BEFORE Nov 2006.

.

[Jai4WKC08]

17. Don't count on it

We have no federal law, are not likely to get a federal law, and in most of the states using them, the SoS are Republican.

We must take back the House, even up the Senate, and in so far as we can, bust our butts to elect Democratic SoS in every state. Nothing is more important.