reckon anyone will ask Kerry about Skull and Bones?

[Syrinx]

We know Bush won't discuss it, will Kerry? Will he put it out on the table? Will he put his country above some stupid or evil club?

[JI7]

1. how old was he then ?

[buck4freedom]

7. Actually it was asked...

A campaign staffer was asked and replied:

"John Kerry has absolutely nothing to say on that subject. Sorry."

He did admit to being a member on Meet the Press. He was asked directly about the club and said "It's a secret." and then quickly changed the subject to his regular stump speech.

I have to disagree with those who think there's "nothing to this."

If there were nothing to it, then he and Bush wouldn't side step the issue at every opportunity. When your political career is at stake you'd be more prone to come clean or at least characterize it as a true "fraternity" in the tradition of Animal House. That they won't do either leads me to believe there's a LOT more here than meets the eye.

BTW: did you know that Bill Clinton's primary backer from his days in Arkansas was Pam Harriman, widow of Averell Harriman? Averell Harriman was a backer and close confidante of Prescot Bush, George H.W. Bush's father. William Averell Harriman was inducted into the Skull & Bones in 1913.

Once, is coincidence, twice is weird, dozens of connections is pretty telling.

[YouMustBeKiddingMe]

2. It's a non issue. The voting public doesn't care about his frat club

reckon anyone will ask Bush about snorting coke?

[Piperay]

3. The general public

doesn't know about S & B and if they do they don't care so this would just be a waste of a question.

[Syrinx]

4. it has aroused curiosity on DU...

And this seems like a good chance to get to the bottom of it, if we, as a society, want to ask.

[The Magistrate]

5. Not Really Curiousity, Sir

There are a few pople who come to the table convinced Hidden Masters rule the world, who make much of the matter, and a greater number by far who possess more sense of the world around them, and find the belief a good source of comedy. Those who flog the thing on are not curious, far from it: their inquiry has stopped long ago, and that in a cul de sac.

[JailForBush]

6. That's a very rude response -

Kind of like suggesting anyone who asks about Skull and Bones are Elvis Presley conspiracy theorists.

The who Skull and Bones controversy revolves around the MEMBERSHIP. The fact that John Kerry beloned to a secret, elitist "frat club" that counts George W. Bush, George H.W. Bush AND Prescott Bush among its members - not to mention other members who have been appointed to extremely powerful positions.

Suggestions that these are merely coincidences can be countered by noting the club's small membership. Is the Skull and Crossbones sort of an underground Good Old Boys' Club, designed to help promote its members into powerful positions? I believe "60 Minutes" thought the club important enough to discuss it.

It's better to ask these questions now, because if it DOES become an issue during the campaign - and I'm definitely going to publicize it on my website - it could cost Democrats' votes.

Think about it: How are we going to question Bush's decision to invade Iraq, if his opponent voted for it? How can we question him about Skull and Bones if his opponent is also a bonesman?

Granted, there are many other issues that Bush can be targeted with, but if we start casually dismissing them or making up excuses, we could paint ourselves into a corner.

[The Magistrate]

8. Exactly Like That, Sir

Congratulations on your perspicacity.

The matter will not become an issue of any seriousness in the general election. It entertains a few people to give it great importance, and entertains a great many more to watch them do so.

You will find considerable criticism directed against the criminals of the '00 Coup for their blunder into Iraq in the general election, no matter who the candidate is. You will find the people hold reponsible for it the reptile who authored and sold the policy, and no one else. That is what happens when you are the executive.

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[xchrom]

10. perhaps thinking of the skull and bones thing

differently is more to the point.
i don't believe in an official frat house representing a secret society controlling the world.
i do believe that the ''elite''{for lack of a better word} have concentrated their efforts to steer america and the world -- i.e. it's a small club that ceo's and members of boards belong to and easy to get on the same page as a result. it could be almost instinctive for people to believe they know best and exert their influence to acquire a certain outcome. and that out come may, in fact, not be best for average citizens.

[The Magistrate]

11. That Is A Reasonable View, Sir

In any society which concentrates wealth and power, which includes all societies of any size and complexity throughout human history, there will be elites and they will rule, generally to what they concieve to be their own best interests. The wisest will understand that the more broadly they construe their own best interest, the better their own position will be; the more foolish will construe their own best interests narrowly, and require soon enough a good deal of routine violence to maintain their positions. In such a circumstance, better to align with those who see that it is in their own best interest to improve the lot of the people, and oppose those who feel it in their own best interest to grind from the people all that they can into their own hands.

[xchrom]

13. well said as usual

and i guess that my point would be that the more narrow view has effectively co opted the thought process of too many on both sides of the political aisle.
i.e. gatt and nafta or the war in iraq, etc.
the voter has no recourse to set things right on their own behalf for a variety of reasons. media control, the religious right{the virtuous citizen manipulated by an unbelieving elite}, global economic interests pursued at the expense of the common worker, apathy in the population, etc.

[The Magistrate]

14. That Is An Unfortunate Fact Of Our Lives Just Now, Sir

Certainly the most grasping of cliques holds power now, and too many even among those who are a few shades better are in the grip of obsolete doctrines concerning trade particularly, for though globalization and abolition of tariffs are tricked out nowadays as new things, they are really very very old, and have never benefited any but the controlling capital interests of a national economy that held a near monopoly on manufacturing. But it is what is largely taught as gospel, and people are no more inclined to examine it closely than they are to examine closely any other faith.

But it does seem to me it is worth noticing the shades of difference among the various factions of the elite, and backing those who are more sensible and less grasping than others. There are real fractures among the economic elites, and what is good for one is often destructive to others. These should be exploited, where possible.

[JailForBush]

15. So you're looking for an elitist candidate who's just a shade different

from George W. Bush? And if a candidate who convinces you he's a shade different is lying just a shade...?

[IndianaGreen]

17. Bush is Al Capone. Kerry is "Bugsy" Siegel.

They are both gangsters! The difference is that the former is a public bully and brute, while the latter is suave and sophisticated.

The real question is, why are we electing gangsters in the first place?


Benjamin "Bugsy" Siegel

[The Magistrate]

19. You Know The Answer To That, My Hoosier Friend

Where is the government that is not at bottom a gang of armed thugs?

The old Chinese character for government derives from a pictograph of soldiers attacking a house; this is not a new problem, and if it has not altered in character or admitted of any solution a half dozen millenia, you may forgive me for not expecting the conundrum to be solved in my lifetime, or even that of my children....

[IndianaGreen]

22. I prefer Elliot Ness

over a prowar, pro-PATRIOT Act, DLC corporatist that is in the back pocket of Monsanto.

[The Magistrate]

23. What Is To Prefer About Mr. Ness, Ma'am?

He simply worked for a larger and better armed gang, insisting it be paid a decent rake-off from Mr. Capone's spoils....

[IndianaGreen]

26. Ness stood for the rule of law

Neither Bush nor Kerry believe in the rule of law. The PATRIOT Act is ample evidence that they both want an all-powerful central government, answerable to no one.

Kerry's silence about the Guantanamo concentration camp, and the mass killings of civilians by our indiscriminate bombings in Afghanistan and Iraq, speaks volumes about how Nixonian this man truly has become.

[The Magistrate]

28. What Is The Rule Of Bourgeois Law To A Radical, Ma'am?

That is merely a system for securing property, and nothing more.

There was nothing unlawful about the war in Afghanistan, and you are knowledgeable enough to know nothing in either venture can be properly called mass killing.

You know, too, that anyone who goes to the country on a platform of ending the confinement of suspected Al Queda members at Guantanemo will certainly fail at the polls; the people of the country have no particular problem with that faciulity, distasteful as it may be to you and me.

[JailForBush]

24. That's not true. Though not government is pure, we have had

relatively clean governments in the past - at least clean enough to accept labor reform, civil rights reform, etc.

The last thing we need now is defeatism. If we can't expect to reform government even in our children's lifetime, then what's the point of voting?

[The Magistrate]

27. Who On Earth Is Speaking Of Mere Reform Or Corruption, Sir?

The point on the table is the very nature of governance in a complex society concentrating wealth and power, as all such do and always have done. You ought to recognize the Anarchist critique of government; it is an apt one, that no serious student can challenge: government is an armed force claiming a monopoly on legitimate use of violence within a defined geographical area. All else, including control of the issuance of currency, and the expropriation of a portion of all economic activity within that area, flows from this.

[The Magistrate]

18. You May Cry For The Moon All You Please, Sir

The world must be taken as it is.

You will never see a candidate for President of the United States who cannot be described as a member of an elite faction.

[JailForBush]

21. Well, if people aren't even going to make an effort, then I suppose you're

right. It's called a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[The Magistrate]

25. If You Are Going To Make An Effort, Sir

Try and make one with some prospect of success....

[Algorem]

29. What a massive load,your excellency.

[The Magistrate]

30. Romantic Failure Is More Your Style, Then, Fellow?

"Moral victory is a synonym for defeat."

[IndianaGreen]

9. No Blacks or Jews or women in Skull & Bones

I am sure that the Left will mention this to illustrate the corruption of the American political system. This is an election that Skull & Bones will not lose no matter who wins in November!

[molly]

20. Yes, there are now

[isbister]

12. nope n/t

[CWebster]

16. nah

They don't ask him about anything. It is all simply a given--he is presented and accepted as the assumed.