The truth about Dean's Troubles lies somewhere between these POV.

[KoKo]

These two excellent articles with different viewpoints are interesting in that the truth about what happened to Dean may be all of this, or somewhere in the middle. There may well have been BBV issues in New Hampshire and elsewhere and that can't be ruled out. But, these articles are an excellent read for those of us who supported Dean and, like myself, still do.
----------------------------------------
Dean's dizzying descent
How and why did the Vermont juggernaut implode so quickly?

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Thomas F. Schaller
(SNIP)

The conventional wisdom is that a "dated Dean, married Kerry" buyer's remorse sank Dean. It's an apt concept but wrongly applied. If Dean's steadfastness on Iraq evokes buyer's remorse among mainstream Democrats, it's because Dean reminds them that they bought Bush's justifications for invading Iraq and now regret it. Kerry's evolution may have been purely opportunist; indeed, his tough talk on Iraq came only after Dean proved it was politically viable. But Kerry's fickleness became an unexpected blessing because his shifting stance has affirmed many voters' feelings about the war, whereas Dean's consistent and insistent opposition may create an uncomfortable dissonance.

What happens to Dean if his long-shot Wisconsin-Michigan-Washington strategy fails and Kerry (or Edwards) captures the nomination?

Dean says he will fall in line behind whomever the Democrats nominate and will encourage his loyalists to do the same. If Kerry is smart, he will avoid the temptation to respond to Dean's attacks and instead reach out to Dean's supporters. After all, in many ways Dean made the nomination a more attractive prize by almost single-handedly picking up a defeated Democratic Party, dusting it off, and putting it squarely into the national partisan fight again. The painful irony for Dean is that he is unlikely to get the chance to be the Democrats' man in the ring for that fight.

On "Meet the Press," Dean noted grudgingly that the other campaigns have stolen or borrowed his themes. He and Trippi knew they had created something special. It's a shame they didn't quite know what to do with it. (SNIP)
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/02/03/trippi_neel/index1.htm

(Get the Day Pass on Salon.....this is worth a read)

And:
THE SCREAM
By David Podvin

On December 1, 2003, Howard Dean was ahead by twenty points in the polls when he appeared on Hardball with Chris Matthews and said, “We're going to break up the giant media enterprises.” This pronouncement went far beyond the governor’s previous public musings about possibly re-regulating the communications industry, and amounted to a declaration of war on the corporations that administer the flow of information in the United States.

It was an extraordinarily noble and dangerous thing to do: when he advocated a truly free press, Dr. Dean was provoking the corrupt media conglomerates that control what most Americans see and hear and read, and thereby control what most Americans think.

The media giants quickly responded by crushing his high-flying campaign with the greatest of ease. This time, they didn’t even have to invent a scandal in order to achieve the desired result; merely by chanting the word “unelectable” at maximum volume, the mainstream media maneuvered Democratic voters into switching their support to someone who poses no threat to the status quo.

John Kerry is a member in good standing of the feeble Daschle/Biden/Feinstein wing of the Democratic Party, a group of politicians whose disagreements with the mercantile elite tend to be merely rhetorical. Any doubts about Kerry’s level of commitment to his stated progressive beliefs were conclusively answered in 1994 when he proclaimed himself “delighted” with the Republican takeover of Congress. The media oligarchy knows that a general election race between Kerry and George W. Bush will insure a continuation of its monopoly, regardless of who wins.
More.........
http://makethemaccountable.com/podvin/media/040201_TheScream.htm

[rucky]

1. Yes & Yes

These are all honest assessments.

For me - I didn't fall for the scream for a second, but buyer's remorse definately kicked in. It certainly wasn't about the war - seeing as I didn't switch to Kerry. It wasn't any one gaffe in particular - just one gaffe too many that I could no longer continue to ignore Kucinich's strengths. I still recognize & cherish all of his accomplishments. I hope he can stay competitive to the convention. I would be delighted if he got the nomination. Failing that, I'd like to see him lead our party as DNC chair.

[JasonDeter]

2. John Kerry could backhand his wife on national tv

kick his neighbors dog and still be a better choice for America than bush*.

[elb77]

9. appalled by your statement...

what a shitty thing to say

[MAlibdem]

23. Probably true

Politicians should be judged by their policies. Though the wife-slapping might get him into trouble with the cops.

(Guessing someone is goinging to think this hypothetical scenario is true, report it, and we'll see it on CNN tomorrow, kerry will be in jail in a week...haha)

[bloom]

3. "he proclaimed himself ?delighted? with the Republican takeover of Congres

????

[JasonDeter]

5. I am really tired of reporters taking statements out of context

and expecting me to make a judgement against them. If we allow reporters like this to inform us bush* will be president for 4 more years and you can kiss your country goodbye.

[afraid_of_the_dark]

4. I love this part...

"After all, in many ways Dean made the nomination a more attractive prize by almost single-handedly picking up a defeated Democratic Party, dusting it off, and putting it squarely into the national partisan fight again. The painful irony for Dean is that he is unlikely to get the chance to be the Democrats' man in the ring for that fight."

I think that is so true. Dean has done so much for the party, and yet it seems he's become the whipping boy. I hope whoever gets the nomination (although I'm still holding onto hope that it will be Dean :)) will remember that when it comes time to handing out Cabinet positions. I'd love to see him get a chance to work on his healthcare plan!

[blm]

6. Stock tip:Buy Podvin for what he knows. Sell'm for what he THINKS he knows

This is utter CRAP excusing Dean and blaming Kerry as usual.

Podvin is SO stupid he never even knew that Kerry was the one who exposed BCCI, IranContra and Ollie North and CIA drugrunning.

He has actually stated that Kerry never opposed any Republican president.

Uh...history tells a different story - The legacies of Nixon, Reagan and Bush were all changed thanks to the efforts of John Kerry and his standing up to them.

Bush2's legacy will be permanently altered when Kerry beats his ass in November.

[KoKo]

15. blm.......it's the media that Podvin's talking about. Did you read the

whole article?

[zoeyfong]

16. Stupid? How 'bout somebody who thought the Iraq war was a good idea?

Oh wait, that's stupid *and treasonous!*

[Larkspur]

17. Kerry's so called efforts to expose BCCI were as helpful as Lieberman's

investigations of Enron -- all show and no or little results.

Kerry also has a habit of not showing up to vote on or against bills he says he will. For example, the Prescription Drug bill. Kerry made a big deal leaving the Prez race to vote against it but when the day of reckoning arrives, Kerry skips the vote. This is a typical Kerry behavior.

[KoKo]

20. Kick!

:kick:

[Straight Shooter]

21. Kerry doesn't care. Not about you, or how hard you work to get by

"On Thursday, the House of Representatives—with seven Democrats absent, including presidential candidate Richard Gephardt—voted 213 to 210 to approve new regulations that would cut off a universe of Americans—anywhere from 1 million to 8 million—from guaranteed overtime pay. Under the new rules, backed by the Bush administration and campaigned for heavily by business lobbyists, those employees would still have to put in extra hours. They just wouldn't get any extra pay. Instead, some would qualify for comp time—try paying the rent with that—and others would simply be reclassified as executives, even if they wield little managerial authority.

Where were the Democrats? Nowhere to be found. Gephardt was in Iowa getting an endorsement from the International Order of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, promising veterans of the picket line they'd be part of a new American prosperity. Among the leading Democratic contenders, neither Gephardt nor senators John Edwards, John Kerry, or Joe Lieberman returned repeated Voice calls for comment. The office of Representative Dennis Kucinich, a staunch labor supporter who voted against the measure, at least returned a call, as did former Vermont governor Howard Dean's office.

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0329/valance.php
----------------

Apparently those two think enough of overtime that they are willing to issue a statement. But not "I don't care" Kerry.

I am more than willing to stand corrected if Kerry took a bold position on this and fought to protect overtime rights of workers.

[Armstead]

7. I love this line

"John Kerry is a member in good standing of the feeble Daschle/Biden/Feinstein wing of the Democratic Party, a group of politicians whose disagreements with the mercantile elite tend to be merely rhetorical."

Perfect summation.

[blm]

8. If you are partial to Podvin's lies against Kerry.

I guess one would like it.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

25. Sometimes the truth is just the truth.

:shrug:

[blm]

27. Podvin is STUPID.

I'm supposed to believe a guy whose last rant stated that Kerry as Senator NEVER stood up against 3 Republican presidents?

Uh...only an idiot completely ignorant of the last 30 years could make a statement like that.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

28. Nothing to do with Podvin at all.

Some people think Kerry belongs in the Feinstein/Daschle category.
No big whoop. Strong during election time. Weak when it counts.

[Raya]

10. The whole Goal of Corp Media is to deminish Kerry's Achievement

We keep forgetting: they want Bush. Positive coverage of Kerry is
inspite of the goals of the Powers That Be.

[Taeger]

11. Single Word Quotes

Single word quotes like:

Any doubts about Kerry’s level of commitment to his stated progressive beliefs were conclusively answered in 1994 when he proclaimed himself “delighted” with the Republican takeover of Congress.

are a sure sign that he's misquoting Kerry. An entire sentence is the bare minimum. Even that is frequently taken out of context.

[Cocoa]

32. nice catch

they use that trick in ads for movies. :-)

[KoKo]

12. I really meant this post for Dean Supporters. If one reads both of the

articles they aren't attacking Kerry they are pointing out strategy and media manipulation.

I'm sorry that Kerry folks seem to think this is an attack on them. It certainly wasn't meant that way.

[blm]

13. Hold Podvin up as a source and I'll scream bloody murder.

He is as dense as can be and is so singleminded about Dean that he claims Kerry has NEVER once stood against a Republican president. That sound like an honest journalist to you?

Tell it to the legacies of Nixon, Reagan and Bush that Kerry's efforts changed forever.

Tell that to Bush2 who will have his ass pounded by Kerry from here to eternity in November.

[KoKo]

14. There are people who agree with Podvin and there are those who agree

that it was Dean's lack of strategy after the media made him the front runner which hurt him badly with the voters.

As I said blm, I posted this for Dean supporters, like myself, to think about. And, I think the BBV issue that Eloriel is working on in NH may be something we need to get concerned about no matter whom we support.

I've not always been a fan of Podvin's either, but I do feel what he said about Dean's statement about "breaking up the Media conglomerates" cost him big time.

Since I first joined DU the Media Manipulation has been my biggest interest. Even more than the individual candidate. I feel that was a big factor with Dean's coverage just as it was with Gore.

Some might feel that Gore wasn't the best candidate if the media could abuse him, and some might feel that Florida went for Bush. I personally don't accept that about Gore and I won't accept that Dean's Scream and "anger" did him in either.

I think that the truth lies somewhere inbetween. But they are hard truths and if our Democratic Party doesn't address the media issues Dean has brought up, we will never be strong again.

That's why I thought Podvin's article was worth the read, whether it has some mis-statements about something you think is unfair about Kerry or not......it's the media. They will do it to Kerry as they've done with Dean and the rest. We should all be concerned.

[blm]

19. Based on that theory, then Kerry got nailed FIRST by the media

and NONE of you Dean supporters want to admit it.

Do a timeline. Dean got a press plane shortly after this release. Dean then got a TWO national covers in July. Kerry's candidacy was declared dead for months by the media whiich dried up his fundraising. Dean then gets FIVE national covers right before the primary.

June 2, 2003

Kerry Seeks to Reverse FCC's "Wrongheaded Vote"
Commission decision may violate laws protecting small businesses; Kerry to file Resolution of Disapproval

Washington, DC - Senator John Kerry today announced plans to file a "Resolution of Disapproval" as a means to overturn today's decision by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to raise media ownership caps and loosen various media cross-ownership rules.

Kerry will soon introduce the resolution seeking to reverse this action under the Congressional Review Act and Small Business Regulatory Enforcement Fairness Act on the grounds that the decision may violate the laws intended to protect America's small businesses and allow them an opportunity to compete.

As Ranking Member of the Senate Committee on Small Business and Entrepreneurship, Kerry expressed concern that the FCC's decision will hurt localism, reduce diversity, and will allow media monopolies to flourish. This raises significant concerns about the potential negative impacts the decision will have on small businesses and their ability to compete in today's media marketplace.

In a statement released earlier today regarding the FCC's decision, Kerry said:

"Nothing is more important in a democracy than public access to debates and information, which lift up our discourse and give Americans an opportunity to make honest informed choices. Today's wrongheaded vote by the Republican members of the FCC to loosen media ownership rules shows a dangerous indifference to the consolidation of power in the hands of a few large entities rather than promoting diversity and independence at the local level. The FCC should do more than rubber stamp the business plans of narrow economic interests.

"Today's vote is a complete dereliction of duty. The Commissioners are well aware that these rules greatly influence the competitive structure of the industry and protect the public's access to multiple sources of information and media. It is the Commission's responsibility to ensure that the rules serve our national goals of diversity, competition, and localism in media. With today's vote, they shirked that responsibility and have dismissed any serious discussion about the impact of media consolidation on our own democracy."
________________________________

You want to claim the media went after Dean for throwing out a noncommittal barb against them on a show, yet you IGNORE the resolution against the FCC decision that Kerry sent up to the Senate as a catalyst for the media's dirty dealings against him for most of last year.

[KoKo]

29. Kerry was my #1 before IWR, then he dropped, then he was boring in debates

and he waffled about Iraq until he saw how it was going.

Dean did the heavy lifting and grunt work. Did you stand out on street corners with signs against the Iraq Invasion? If you did and you still support Kerry then it's Principle. If you didn't and you support Kerry then it's because you like the guy and buy into Electability.

For folks like me who think Gore WON in 2000 and who worked their heart out protesting this Invasion and stood while people flipped the bird and yelled stuff at them out their SUV windows and inhaled gas fumes for hours and still were against this "Invasion/Occupation" then you have to understand we go with those who "brung us to the dance." Not, those who were waiting with the "Prom Queen."

nuff said.

[Straight Shooter]

22. blm, I would rather not think about Kerry "pounding" bush's a**

Maybe another metaphor that doesn't evoke such a hideous mental picture?

[blm]

24. sorry. My Bush hate shows at times.

.

[KoKo]

18. Kick

:kick:

[D G]

26. I believe I agree with Schaller's premise (the first article)

I haven't gotten my day pass to read the whole thing, but this leaped out at me, really clarifying something I thought might happen:

If Dean's steadfastness on Iraq evokes buyer's remorse among mainstream Democrats, it's because Dean reminds them that they bought Bush's justifications for invading Iraq and now regret it. ... But Kerry's fickleness became an unexpected blessing because his shifting stance has affirmed many voters' feelings about the war, whereas Dean's consistent and insistent opposition may create an uncomfortable dissonance.

In short: Dean's appeal was limited because when the truth hurts (i.e. Bush lied, people died) there some folks who get angry and get motivated, but many others who simply don't want to feel the pain and turn away from it. Is this "good" or "bad" - who can say, but it's reality. Funny how Kerry's "gray area" stance on the war worked out for him.

The second article looks like it's based on several premises I don't agree with, and I'm not a Dean supporter, so I'll leave it at that.

[KoKo]

30. D G.......thanks for a most "fair" read on this.....I appreciate it...

because I saw what you did. But, reading both articles in full especially the Salon one which was very meaty and I think very fair in most respects would flesh it out more. But thanks for taking the time since you aren't a Dean supporter. :-)'s to you for fairness.

[ShadowCabinet]

31. Wow, some reporters get it...............

Two excellent pieces.

Going into the Iowa caucuses, it did strike me that the Dean campaign was turning the whole volunteer movement in the wrong direction. Although, I support Gov. Dean, I never really understood what was to be accomplished by flooding Iowa with tons of volunteers (especially in the silly orange hats). As stated in the article, it gave the unintended impression that the campaigne was more for the volunteers and not to address the concerns of the voters of Iowa. In hindsight, the whole "Perfect Storm" campaign was a stratgic blunder and it cost Dean Iowa.

The now infamously dubbed "I have a scream" speech is a clear example of media manipulation and distortion, pure and simple. Going into the start of Iowa and before NH, that whole meme was being floated regarding Gov. Dean's stability and electibility. Again, hindsight being 20-20, Trippi and those in Dean's inner circle should have recognized the signs of upcoming witch-hunt to find proof of the instability. Up pops the Iowa concession speech and it's ludicrously spun (including shamefully, by many folks here on DU) that Dean is "out-of-control", he's "in meltdown", and so on. That mantra was replayed by the media for the next 7 days in endless repetitions by the news organizations to sledge-hammer the point home. Now, well after the fact, ABC news releases footage showing that the original aired version was in fact due to the selective mic'ing done and that on view from a participant level in the crowd, Dean was shouting to make himself heard above the din of the crowd.

What really distresses me it that this is being played out in front of us in real-time, and yet folks refuse to acknowledge a media induced "take-down" of the one-time front runner.

A word of caution to my Kerry friends - watch, look and learn. What is transpiring now will occur following the Republican convention. The media will spin that Bush is "unbeatable" with the same regularity and intensity that Dean was "unelectable".

[Cocoa]

33. I actually think Dean is just a weak candidate

the number of votes he's been getting is about right for the quality of candidate he is, especially compared to his competition.

The anomaly was when he was puffed up into a phenomenon that I never thought was very natural.