KERRY SUPPORTERS ONLY: Did you back Iraq war?

[regnaD kciN]

Poll question: KERRY SUPPORTERS ONLY: Did you back Iraq war?

Let me clarify: I'm not asking what you think about the war now with the benefit of hindsight. Nor am I asking you if you thought Bush did a good or poor job in building a coalition, rallying world support, etc., etc.

Nonetheless, in the last few days before the first missles were fired, did you support or oppose the notion of staging a pre-emptive invasion of Iraq?

I also raise the issue of whether you were of "active" or "passive" in your position. An active supporter or opponent of the war would be one who participated in marches, wrote letters to the appropriate officials or to their local newspaper, or otherwise tried to let their opinion be known to the public at large. A passive supporter or opponent may have been clear in their own mind, but either kept their opinion to themselves, or, at most, wrote about it on DU.

Remember, this is for Kerry supporters only.

Just before the war started, what was your position on it?

[THUNDER HANDS]

1. I strongly opposed it

Marched against it, ect.

But Kerry's vote doesn't bother me the way it does other people here. I realize that not every candidate is going to please me 100% of the time.

[LuminousX]

17. Forget the vote for a second and consider Kerry as a person

Was he FOR the war or AGAINST the war?

With current knowledge, would he have altered his positon if he could?

[Gman]

2. Talk about setting people up

that's what this poll is intended to do. I expect the results of this poll to be used against Kerry supporters later. Hide and watch.

While the war was and still is absolutely wrong, its irrelevant right now vis a vis the issue of getting Bush out of the White House. We can't stand another 4 years of Bush. This attitude of "I don't want Bush, but I want someone that is ideologically pure as the driven snow" is counterproductive.

[mmonk]

3. it can't be irrelevant

lest people don't care to learn from it concerning the future.

[Ripley]

5. Exactly. If war and thousands of deaths are not "irrelevant"...

What is relevant? And voting for the war and Gestapo like bills for political reasons shows a lot of weakness of character.

[Gman]

7. The focus needs to be on Bush

Plenty of lessons have been learned, and there'll be plenty coming out in the coming months that show how we were lied to and deceived. Furthermore, preemptive war is not popular with the majority in the country.

We need to quit obsessing on ideology and focus on getting a Democrat in the WH. We have plenty of time to work on the rest after that. Besides, the chances of a preemptive war under a Democrat are infinitely smaller than they would be under a puke.

[regnaD kciN]

4. Nice faulty attempt to read my mind, Gman...

I do have a specific reason for asking this question, which I'll explain once there are enough responses. But, although I don't like Kerry, the reason isn't to play "gotcha" with his supporters.

[Gman]

8. Heh, heh!

Ok, I'll hide and watch!

[regnaD kciN]

30. O.K., here's my response...

Back when the IWR passed, I remember a great deal of anger here on DU, with much of it directed against Kerry. I remember many, many posters declaring that they would never vote for him. I also remember millions of people showing up nationwide in protests designed to try to "stop the war before it starts." Assuming that the anti-war sentiment here was a microcosm of that in the streets, I would figure that there would be a correspondingly large number of people, almost all of them Democrats, who would never support Kerry for president after that vote. Yet, on the other hand, I am seeing massive and broad-based support for Kerry now that the votes are being cast.

I had one of two possible explanations for that:

1) That Democratic voters had "forgiven" Kerry for his IWR vote, or at least found his "I was misled" explanation more credible than I do.

2) That those who opposed the war still have the same animosity toward Kerry, but were only kidding themselves back in the days of the mass protests that they represented anything but a minority of the Democratic Party; and that, in fact, they are now being overwhelmed by the votes of a large, as it were, "silent majority" of "centrist" Democrats who supported the war, dislike the so-called "Bush-hatred" of Dean and those on the left, and are backing Kerry over some of the anti-war candidates at least in part because he voted to authorize the invasion.

Hence, my question. If the poll results showed that a majority of respondants were supporters of the war, it would suggest that #2 was the case. If otherwise, #1 would be a more likely explanation.

[seaglass]

9. can't play gotcha with a non-scientific poll anyways,

it's self-selected and there is no way to ensure only Kerry supporters are responding.

In any case, I voted the one just above the dingbat - answer no. 5 I believe.

[isbister]

13. Hey! Kerry supporters only

;-)

If its a setup poll, so be it, I understand Kerry's position.

[HFishbine]

14. It's relevent

For people who care about good judgement in their elected officials.

[LuminousX]

18. I'm a Dean supporter, I opposed/oppose the Iraq War

I am proud of my stance and if you want to use it against me in the future go ahead.

In fact, I would like to see a poll like this for Dean supporters and see if any Dean supporter reacts with paranoia over it.

You say the war was/is wrong. Does Kerry think the war was/is wrong?

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

6. I still don't blame him for his vote...

I was disappointed, having been ardently against pre-emptive invasion without exhausting all means of diplomacy, but I still do not blame him for how he voted. This is was a no-win situation for most Democratic Members of Congress. You support the war, you face what Kerry faces now. You don't support the war, you're labeled un-American and if WMDs had turned up, you don't have a chance in hell of winning in the general election. Add into this the fact that, even possibly despite your gut instincts, all the official intelligence you've been presented with indicates there's nuclear and chemical weapons practically hanging from the rafters out there, and well, unless you're in a position to be safely elected or re-elected, you don't have much choice in this one. Let's be honest, despite what you think of Bush, you'd like to believe the President of the United States would not blatantly lie, risking the lives of our soldiers and risking our international credibility, in the exact manner that he has. It's practically incomprehensible, yet Bush has managed to do just that. That's why I've given him a pass on his war vote. He did what he thought he had to in an unenviable position with only lies from the White House on which to base his vote.

I'll note that I'm originally a Gephardt supporter and that I'm ardently ABB.

[Gman]

11. The context of the vote

was that it was a month before the 2002 elections. The GOP intentionally rolled this out just before the elections for political purposes. Since the resolution said for Bush to go to the UN, it served a good political purpose to just vote for it, make him go to the UN and get on with the election.

Bush did go to the UN, the UN refused to go along. Bush defied the UN and did it anyway. It could be argued that Bush was in violation of the IWR because the UN failed to give its approval...

Everyone that voted for IWR has an excellent alibi in that they believed the "administration" that bald faced lied to them.

and I know this thread is not about the IWR.

[isbister]

15. Bush was in violation of the IWR

period. Not bacause the UN failed to give its approval but because he did not meet Congress' conditions in order for the authority to be granted.

[Gman]

22. That too...

I was pretty much in favor of the IWR even though I was against the war because I felt it set some pretty high hurdles for Bush to clear to go to war in Iraq. Instead of clearing the hurdles, Bush completely disregarded them and did what he intended to do all along.

[isbister]

24. I think we may have

a different world had the Democrats been able to hold or gain in the Senate in 2002.

[LuminousX]

29. Nice to see Congress moving so quick to pass a resolution to chastise Bush

I mean if they really feel Bush violated their trust and violated their resolution, you'd think they would take some sort of action, even if it is just symbolic.

[regnaD kciN]

32. Could you say a bit more about this, please?

Not bacause the UN failed to give its approval but because he did not meet Congress' conditions in order for the authority to be granted.

As I recall it, the only condition required of Bush was that he notify Congress in writing, within 48 hours after military action began, that every effort at peaceful resolutions had been tried and had failed. Note that this was not something Congress could evaluate and decide to approve or disapprove -- it was all left up to Bush's say-so. Per the terms of the IWR, Bush was the sole determinator of whether we had reached the phase of "last resort," and Congress could have no further say...the IWR itself was their advance blessing to whatever he decided to do.

If you have any further information that contradicts what I have just written, please bring it forward here!

[fiorello]

16. I don't blame him either

I remember - being violently opposed to the war, but even so thinking how hard it was for democrats in Congress to vote against: the line was floated that the US needed a credible threat to put pressure on Iraq.

In my town, every third house had no-war sign - but my brother-in-law (in a working-class Democratic rural town) said he wouldn't put up a sign, he's afraid someone would put a brick through his window. I'm a coward too.

Credit to Dean and Kucinich for speaking up early, but I don't blame Kerry (my candidate). A Kerry administration would never have made this war; it was hatched in the Bush-Wolfowitz right-wing cuckoo factory. Don't blame Kerry.

[MaineDem]

10. Held signs, walked in marches, stood in vigils

My signs said "Wait for the UN" and "Osama Bin Forgotten?".

[isbister]

12. Never, for one instant, was for anything about it

Just before the war started, what was your position on it?

Long before, just before and after I was very much against it(Mom, a lifelong Democrat, told me I hated America).

I also raise the issue of whether you were of "active" or "passive" in your position.

Active.

I will add that I thought Saddam had something as far as WMD goes.

[LuminousX]

19. I, too, thought Saddam had WMDs

But I opposed the war.

Did Kerry oppose the war? Forget the IWR vote, as it was more a political trap than a declaration of war. Was Kerry FOR or AGAINST the war?

[isbister]

23. Kerry's Statement in Response to the President's Speech to the Nation

Senator John Kerry, D-MA
Washington, DC
March 18, 2003

I find myself genuinely angered, saddened and dismayed by the situation in which this nation finds itself tonight. As the world's sole superpower in an increasingly hostile and dangerous world, our government's obligation to protect the security of the United States and the law abiding nations of the world could not be more clear, particularly in the aftermath of September 11th.

Yet the Administration's handling of the run up to war with Iraq could not possibly have been more inept or self-defeating. President Bush has clumsily and arrogantly squandered the post 9/11 support and goodwill of the entire civilized world in a manner that will make the jobs ahead of us - both the military defeat and the rebuilding of Iraq - decidedly more expensive in every sense of that word.

The Administration's indifference to diplomacy and the manner in which it has treated friend and foe alike over the past several months have left this country with vastly reduced influence throughout the world, made impossible the assembly of a broad, multinational effort against Saddam Hussein, and dramatically increased the costs of fulfilling our legitimate security obligations at home and around the world.

At home, the Administration has given too short shrift to the needs of homeland security, ignoring the advice of their own experts, doing the job on the fly and on the cheap. To this administration, homeland security is a fine political weapon, but not high enough a priority to force a reassessment of their tax cuts to the rich and the special interests.

http://www.cfr.org/publication.php?id=5722

..............................................

[LuminousX]

26. Boil it down to a simple sentence for me

Can I honestly tell people, "Kerry is anti-war."

[bigtree]

20. I'm anti-war

I've marched several times. I gave away t-shirts on which I applied 'Support Our Returning Soldiers' on the front, and a peace sign on the back. Unprompted, I supplied water and food at a march, and rain ponchos at another. I marched my last protest in silence. I hosted marchers at my home once. And I participated in my local peace coalition. I stood with the Friends and others on a corner at one of our town's busiest intersections for a couple of months once a week till that faded.

I never blamed the IWR for Bush's war. I never will.

[LuminousX]

21. Was Kerry anti-Iraq war?

[emulatorloo]

25. War as the *last resort* to disarm, and not unilateral n/t

[LuminousX]

28. So Kerry was AGAINST the Iraq War (as it was waged)?

[welshTerrier2]

27. Called Kerry's office, attended anti-war demonstrations

i called kerry's office (he's my senator) and urged him to vote no on IWR ... and i attended anti-war protests in Boston ... one of them had over 25,000 people ...

for many months, i said i would never support anyone who voted for the IWR ... kerry's vote was tragically wrong ...

now, i consider myself a kucinich - kerry supporter ... i make no defense of kerry's IWR vote ... it stunk ... but you have to look at the big picture ... not just one vote ... and if bush gets another 4 years, i couldn't stand to look at that picture ... kerry is not a pro-war, right-winger ... i'm confident he would have handled things much differently dealing with Saddam ...

kerry is connecting with the voters ... he's a veteran which gives him tons of credibility with some people ... he's outdistancing the rest of the dems even though Dean had a vastly superior organization and way more money ... we've got a good horse way out in front ... i say, let's ride him to the finish line ...

[eileen_d]

31. Passively opposed -- HOWEVER --

Robb is still a dingbat.

Edited to add: Kerry is not the only candidate I support (heck, I haven't even written him a check... yet.)

[DrFunkenstein]

33. Nearly Trampled By Mounted Police In NYC Last February

Although I was very disappointed by Kerry's vote, my position was nearly identical to his.

Also, although few people seem to admit it these days, I was also against the invasion of Afghanistan. But that's a whole other discussion.

[seaglass]

34. By the way, when you do your analysis, you may want to

consider whether Kerry supporters believe that Dean would have voted against the war if he was in the same situation as Kerry.

This is one of the reason the IWR Dean-Kerry battle is not an issue for me, I don't believe he would have voted against it.

[mitchum]

35. Actively opposed...

while aware that a "no" vote from Kerry would have been in vain

[Uzybone]

36. Always opposed to it

and I didnt need Dean or any other politico to tell me that it was wrong.

I marched against it.

Im supporting Kerry because if I wewre to place my support solely on IWR Id be a DK or Rev Sharpton supporter. Kucinich and Sharpton were the only ones who were completely against giving Bush the option to strike Iraq. All the others either voted for or supported similar legislation.