Ohferkrissakes .... Bev Harris on MSNBC talking about BBV

[Stinky The Clown]

The good thing is the issue is being discussed openly on teevee

The bad thing is, Bev Harris is discussing it openly on teevee. She's saying the right things ..... but ...... ?

[madinmaryland]

1. I hope we don't slide back into the Bev Harris mess here again.

At least someone is talking about them. Anything about the fiascos in Maryland yesterday. That needs to brought up!

[Kelvin Mace]

3. You need someone with credibility

It doesn't do you any good to have a person demand accountability who refuses to explain what she has done with all the money she has raised so far.

Bev Dudley (aka Harris) has been caught in repeated lies and still continues to tell new ones.

[Stinky The Clown]

6. Maryland was a part of their conversatrion

Not the focus, but raised as an example.

The conversation was like the first lesson one would get were one studying the issue. Very basic stuff.

[madinmaryland]

7. Thanks for the info.

I'm glad the issue is at least being discussed, whether it is in Maryland or elsewhere. Though I know the history of Bev Harris from the multitude of threads over the last couple of years, at least someone IS talking about voting irregularities.

[Kelvin Mace]

2. MSNBC needs to ask her why she posted a fake 990

which the IRS has never seen, a form full of math errors and questionable totals.

Almost $1 million was raised and Bev still hasn't accounted for it, nor has she explained why she was raising money illegally in her home state.

[Marnieworld]

9. sure they should focus on this instead of stolen elections?

Priorities people!

[Kelvin Mace]

10. You can't make deals with the devil because it is convenient

Bev Harris has lied repeatedly and failed to account for over $1 million in funds she raised. This is the person you want to hold up as the poster-child of "accountability"?

[pnwmom]

77. Are you saying that she didn't account to the govt. for $1 million?

Then why aren't they coming after her?

[troubleinwinter]

93. And you know they aren't?

I wonder when those headlines will hit. Just about when we don't need it? Thanx loads, Bev.

[fuzzyball]

70. Yes, I don't believe in being a crook simply because my goal may

be a worthy one. No siree/madam, fuzzy will not stoop that
gutter level. Achieving the desired results by any crooked means
may be OK in some people's books, but not mine.

[pnwmom]

84. And how do we know that she has done anything "crooked"?

Except for a bunch of anonymous postings here?

[fuzzyball]

119. If not proven in a court of law, we don't know if Bev has done anything

wrong. But I was commenting in reply to marnieworld who
wants us to ignore any wrong doing simply because it is
not the priority. Well I agree BBV is higher priority than
BH misuse of contributions. But that does not mean we ignore
one for the sake of priority.

[Kelvin Mace]

125. My name is David Allen

My postings have had my name attatched for some time.

Bev knows my name and address and phone number.

While many of us post with user names, many of us had posted our real names in the past.

Who are YOU, by the way?

[troubleinwinter]

132. Bev also knows my name and address

and posted my name, town, county and state along with my DU user ID on her website after I made a copy request (per IRS law) of a public document.

[pnwmom]

78. And how do you know this and what evidence do you have?

It's amazing that the IRS hasn't done anything, don't you think?

[troubleinwinter]

94. YOU DO NOT KNOW THIS AT ALL: "IRS hasn't done anything"

[Kelvin Mace]

126. So, is this Bev's latest talking point?

The IRS is not after me, so I did nothing wrong?

Is this REALLY what she wants to do, wave a red flag in fron of the IRS?

[LittleClarkie]

85. They could give a flying fuck about that. Be grateful she's saying the

right things. The media doesn't care who is bringing the message. And she likely won't be remembered for herself so much as for her message. The big picture is that she brought the message to the media. The little stuff, like her IRS filings, while it might be important to some, is not part of the big picture as far as the media is concerned.

[Kelvin Mace]

127. The media in many places has done a damned good job,

despite Bev alienating and threatening many of them.

Bev is advocating for an organizination that DEMANDS accountability from corporations and government, yet you seem to believe that holding HER accountable for how money has been spent is wrong?

[donsu]

4. ohferkrissakes leave Bev alone - she's not the enemy

nt

[WHAT]

5. k&r...

your post, that is.

[jen4clark]

46. Likewise.

[Kelvin Mace]

8. Anyone who takes almost a million dollars

then lies about how they spent it IS the enemy.

[blondeatlast]

11. Yep, I completely agree.

It's an important issue--it just needs a new spokesperson for certain.

[Kelvin Mace]

17. Precisely

There are a number of experts and activists more competent to deal with the issue.

[snowbear]

12. She's NOT the enemy, but the rightwingers have made even lefties think so!

I have to admit, they are sneaky sons of bitches!!

Not you Sparks.. .. but the wacko wingnuts who were able to effectively launch a smear campaign POSING AS DISGRUNTLED LEFTIES in attempt to disgrace her name.

We seriously have to be careful about the comments people - even here make concerning Bev.

Some have completely bought the scam line, sink and hooker.. and others know she's fighting for us, but..

The wingnuts even gone so far as to claim that Bev Harris is a Freeper.

I've met her and believe me -- she is NO Freeper.

It's sad that so many have fallen for wingnut tactics to smear Bev Harris. They have everything to lose though, so they make her public enemy #01.

They're evidently good at convincing (some) people because a small handful of DU'ers bought the b.s. on Bev..

I'm greatful for the job she's done to expose those creeps.

[acmejack]

15. You should be very careful in dismissing these claims.

Perhaps you are unaware of the truth, I would simply ask that you do due diligence & no more before making such claims and hurling accusations against people who I personally know. They are not scammers and they are not liars. Please do not make such accusations here against fellow DUers.

It is not, I repeat not a bogus line and it behooves you to investigate it and know the truth before you besmirch the integrity of good people here. Do you think all these old line DUers simply invented these stories? Look in the archives and educate yourself before you impugn any fellow DUer! I trust I will need to say no more to you on this subject.

[Kelvin Mace]

19. Here, here!

AcmeJack speaks soothely.

Try starting with this link:

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Kelvin%20Mace/2

[yowzayowzayowza]

16. Bought the scam?

Which "smear tactic" exactly is responsible for her inability to account for her million dollar windfall? Methinks, nay after supporting her for some time, meknows the "scam line, sink and hooker" are hanging from YOUR mouth RITE NOW.

[Kelvin Mace]

18. Are you accusing me of "posing"?

I've got news for you, the vast majority of the folks on this board against Bev are WELL-ESTABLISHED "lefties".

I'll match my credentials as a lefty to yours, Bev's or anyone else's, any time.

Also, how do you explain Bev's love of Bush and hatred of Clinton? How do you explain Bev kissing up to Freepers?

Are you calling folks like Skinner a right-winger?

How about Randi Rhodes, Keith Olberman, BartCop, Democrats.com and MANY others?

Bev Harris has done little except take credit for other people's work, get a whistle-blower arrested and snooker over a million dollars from innocent folks.

David Allen
www.thoughtcrimes.org

[Zhade]

22. So you are accusing DU of being in on the conspiracy?

Remember, that lying thief registered Freeper Harris has been banned from DU SEVERAL times.

You do not know what the fuck you're talking about. Educate yourself instead of embarrassing yourself.

[troubleinwinter]

44. "The wingnuts even gone so far as to claim that Bev Harris is a Freeper"

Here is a sampling of Bev's posts on Free Republic

DUmmie FUnnies 06-07-05 ("I Believe" ...AGAIN!!!)
Posted by BevHarris to Purrcival
On Bloggers & Personal 06/07/2005 6:53:24 PM PDT · 102 of 172

Had the Rossi litigation team filed a request for the King County memory cards (we suggested strongly to the Rossi team that they avail themselves of this option), I believe the litigation would have come out differently(depending on what was found). The reason the judge tossed the case out was that he said they had not proved fraud.

The King County memory cards were Rossi's best shot at proving fraud (if it existed, and I suspect that it did, since King County has now destroyed one of its logs and refused to provide the others to us).

DUmmie FUnnies 06-07-05 ("I Believe" ...AGAIN!!!)
Posted by BevHarris to beckysueb
On Bloggers & Personal 06/08/2005 6:37:43 AM PDT · 144 of 172

As for Rossi, we did notify the Rossi team of the problems we were finding with the optical scan, showing how it could be easily fraudulently manipulated, and where to find the evidence. We were told that they were not allowed to present any new evidence by that point (we notified them as soon as we discovered the problem, and BEFORE we even went to Leon County to demonstrate proof of concept)

She has never claimed to have provided the same information to the Democrat Gregoire, only Republican Rossi.

DUmmie FUnnies 05-30-05 ("What do you love?" ---Pitt Posts "Trype" And Conspires With Scamdy)
Posted by BevHarris to franksolich
On Bloggers & Personal 05/30/2005 9:25:15 PM PDT · 349 of 920

Hey, franksolich,

Your sentiments are adorable, but I will be on a plane Thursday and in Cleveland Friday and Saturday. Thus the lovely flowers might wilt.

But thanks for the concept.

franksolich is a leader of the Scamdy gang and administrator of the site.

DUmmie FUnnies 05-26-05 ("My blog is under assault by the graveyard rats" ---Pitt)
Posted by BevHarris to Barset
On Bloggers & Personal 05/29/2005 5:59:43 PM PDT · 726 of 1,014

Most of Black Box Votng funds came in from traditional fund raising outlets: Television coverage, newspaper coverage, radio coverage, and (40%) the traditional method: grants.

Nothing there about her constant soliciting donations on DU or what her website referred to as "chump change" donated by DUers.

DUmmie FUnnies 05-17-05 ("I'm pretty upset right now, and I need an explanation" ---Pitt)
Posted by BevHarris to MisterRepublican
On Bloggers & Personal 05/19/2005 11:13:53 PM PDT · 2,844 of 4,575

"Hmm. I can't resist. Perhaps you can name the board members?"

Start by Googling Jim March, the Republican gun lobbyist who is one of the most active members of our board of directors. He was my co-plaintiff in the lawsuit against Diebold that resulted in a $2.6 million payment by Diebold to the state of California and Alameda County, to reimburse for selling flawed voting machines.
....
Next, for those uninitiated to Internet lynching, you can expect to see a horde of displaced DUers coming over here posting breathless links and unfounded allegations. They'll outnumber anything I've posted by at least 50:1, since I won't be near the Internet until Monday afternoon, plenty of time to unleash the attack dogs.

Bye, nice playing, and yes -- the nicknames (and especially the "Sleepless and Skedaddle" pun) made me laugh. The whole office erupted, in fact, and for 15 minutes were unable to discipline ourselves to stop reading this stuff.

Back to your truth-seeking.

Jim March who posted, "Yes, there's a possibility that this (Qui Tam) will leave Bev and I millionaires." The gun-totin'Jim March who referred to DUers as "commies", and California as a "commie hell-hole".

DUmmie FUnnies 05-17-05 ("I'm pretty upset right now, and I need an explanation" ---Pitt)
Posted by BevHarris to commonguymd

On Bloggers & Personal 05/19/2005 10:24:13 PM PDT · 2,797 of 4,575

>I think 501c have reporting responsibilities correct????

Absolutely. Form 990 and in our case, to ally concerns, we are also getting an independent audit.

Read these threads http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x436340#top http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x437826, look at the 990 and see if you think it was prepared by a CPA (it wasn't signed by one), though it was claimed that "a firm specializing in non-profit organizations" had been retained for the purpose. In early 2005, Bev claimed that a Year-End Statement(June-Dec. 2004) was being prepared by an accounting firm. Never has been provided.

Go check Guidestar. See if the 990 is there. It isn't. It was due to be filed with IRS 5/15/06, but wasn't.

It's also interesting that commonguymd is the person who paid for the Scamdy site. Nice group she hangs with.

DUmmie FUnnies 05-17-05 ("I'm pretty upset right now, and I need an explanation" ---Pitt)
Posted by BevHarris to franksolich
On Bloggers & Personal 05/19/2005 9:43:29 PM PDT · 2,739 of 4,575

As for me getting rich off it, my annual salary is $60,000, no whistles, secret back doors, or gimmicks. My annual donations to Black Box Voting: $70,000, from a Qui Tam settlement just received, my donation checks to be posted online this month. Of the settlement, around $76,000, I have committed to tithe 10 percent to my church, something I do regularly because it is part of my belief system. The remaining amount I will donate into Black Box Voting, tagged as a restricted donation to be spent only on consumer protection litigation.

I have worked therefore full time for a year for (-$10,000). Any one at DU or anywhere else who wants to put in a matching offer, bring it on.

Cheers, and my best to you all.

Bev Harris
Executive Director
Black Box Voting, Inc.

Though she claimed that these "donation checks" would be posted last May, they never were. Nor are they reflected in the 990.

"...to be spent only on consumer protection litigation". Consumer protection? She stated recently that it is being spent on a libel suit. Maybe she should spend it on litigating against BBV and herself for mishandling donor funds in relation to any IRS penalties. What's funny, is that Bev herself wrote that such penalties are "stiff".

"Back to your truth-seeking."
"Your sentiments are adorable"
"Cheers, and my best to you all."
"DUers... attack dogs."

I won't post the ugliness she posted on Free Republic about Andy. It has been seen enough.

Here's where you can order a Clinton cigar from Bev:

"
Date: Sat, Sep 12 1998 12:00 am
Email: talion <[e-mail]>
Groups: alt.humor.puns

A Renton Washington-based marketing firm, has already begun selling THE
PRESIDENTIAL CIGAR.

"We selected a large-size cigar known in the industry as an El
Presidente," says Talion president Bev Harris. Talion's five-dollar
collector cigars, which feature an official gold seal and a Billy-C
image, measure an impressive (in the cigar industry, anyway) six inches
long, with a respectable 50-ring size circumference.

More info: http://www.talion.com/cigar.htm
Orders (Visa, MC): toll free 1-888-232-1787 or 425-228-7131
or fax to secure private fax line 425-228-3965 Snail-mail orders: Talion Marketing - 330 SW 43rd St Suite K-547 Renton WA 98055

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.humor.puns/browse_thread/thread/714b8ac89b281742/055de7e54e16788d?lnk=st&q=&rnum=24&hl=en#055de7e54e16788d

You can snail-mail your order to the very same address you send your donations to Bev.

[LoZoccolo]

55. Uh, no one did it but her. n/t

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LoZoccolo]

59. She sold Clinton cigars. n/t

[troubleinwinter]

62. 'promos'

A Renton Washington-based marketing firm, has already begun selling THE
PRESIDENTIAL CIGAR.

"We selected a large-size cigar known in the industry as an El
Presidente," says Talion president Bev Harris. Talion's five-dollar
collector cigars, which feature an official gold seal and a Billy-C
image, measure an impressive (in the cigar industry, anyway) six inches
long, with a respectable 50-ring size circumference.

Snail-mail orders: Talion Marketing - 330 SW 43rd St Suite K-547 Renton WA 98055

(She even used the same address mailing address BBV.org uses.)

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.humor.puns/browse_thread/thread/714b8ac89b281742/055de7e54e16788d?lnk=st&q=&rnum=24&hl=en#055de7e54e16788d

One of her little 'promos' for the cigars suggested that buyers sit back and relax with the cigar while reading the Starr Report.

[WCGreen]

13. You don't think if she builds more credibility that the GOP

won't bring up the mishandling of money raised from individuals....

[pnwmom]

79. Kevin Mace appears to have a personal axe to grind here.

He's making a lot of claims about $1 million in unreported funds with no evidence to back it up.

All I care about is the work she's been doing on BBV. Who's been doing more? Certainly none of the DU'ers who are so quick to jump on her case.

[yowzayowzayowza]

88. Put that star to work!!!

Search the DU Election Reform Forum for "Harris 990" and you will find all the evidence you need. Here, I'll do a lil more homework fer ya:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=437826

Who's been doing more? Certainly none of the DU'ers who are so quick to jump on her case.

Gotta link for that?

[Kelvin Mace]

129. Really?

(Oops - this was meant for the poster above you. Sorry)


We have the toughtest anti-BBV law in the nation in my state.

We have OpScan in 76% of our counties, and the TS systems have VVPB.

In our state paper is the dominant record.

In our state, Diebold left after losing a lawsuit to thwart the law we passed.

In our state, CEOs of voting machine companies must sign sworn affidavits about the software submitted for review. Submitting one version, and using another (like in California) means the CEO goes to jail.

The law didn't magically happen, and Bev Harris had ZERO to do with it. It was the efforts of a nice lady named Joyce McCloy who championed the law and got it passed. A nice lady who never asked for ANY money, yet accomplished what Bev hasn't with over a million of other people's money.

A number of folks here DID help with the law.

It is called NC. 223, or The NC Public Confidence in Elections Act. It passed both parties of the NCGA UNANIMOUSLY.

So, you have not a damn clue what you are talking about, which is par for the course for a Bev apologist.

[troubleinwinter]

95. $972,304

Unreported after the maximum two filing extensions and even months later, it was not filed (though she lied, claiming it was filed on the due date).

No evidence? I talked to the IRS several times. I have the names and employee ID#s for you if you want to PM me. Just to double-check, another DUer called the IRS and confirmed it, with name and employee ID#.

I talked to the WA State SoS Office several times, who told me that Bev/BBV was unregistered while soliciting for two years. SoS office gave me (without my requesting it) the State Attorney General's phone number.

But you stated that you don't care.

"Who's been doing more?" That must be intended as a joke, right? Who's been doing more to discredit the movement and smear election integrity activists and organizations? Who, by her own behavior has alienated those in the media who were interested in the issue? Who, by her antics has alienated elections officials who might have been our allies?

Who will hit the headlines discrediting the movement if indicted for state violations, facing jail time and IRS violations... the one that is the 'public face of the movement'?

Are you not interested in the reputations of those who have put their asses on the line working toward election reform? Do you not think we must keep our own house clean? Abide by law?

Oh. You said you don't care. I do.

[Kelvin Mace]

128. It's Kelvin" not "Kevin"

Try to acually read.

The evidence has been posted repeatedly, you just continue to use the tried and true Bev tactic of deny that there is any evidence. Keep denying it in hopes it will be believed and to waste the time of people by forcing them to repost it.

[Vidar]

14. Somewhat better than nothing.

[Kelvin Mace]

20. No!

Intergrity is better than deceit ALWAYS.

A lot of good work is being done WITHOUT Bev Harris and her greedy, ego masturbating.

[Vidar]

21. I'm not going to defend Bev. You're right about here. But I regard

the message as more important than the messenger.

[Kelvin Mace]

23. True, unless the messenger discredits the message

in which case you have to stear clear.

[pnwmom]

71. Personally, I think Ralph Nader is a narcissistic jerk.

But I still buy Consumer Reports.

I think it is easy to separate the man personally from his work product. (Except when he's running for President.)

The same with Bev. There are all these personal allegations, and then there are the proven results of all her work. I'm grateful for the work she has done.

[yowzayowzayowza]

74. These are FACTS regarding her PROFESSIONAL...

behavior. Educate yourself: http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Kelvin%20Mace/2

[pnwmom]

75. I followed the links and don't see a lot of facts.

Just opinions, spin, and insinuations.

Harris has obviously had bad blood with certain individuals, and I'm in no position to know who's right. But those are personal issues. Meanwhile, she's done a lot of important work. For example, as noted in the dailykos:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/1/15/19174/3163

It was Bev Harris who discovered that "Sen. Chuck Hagel, R-Neb., had an ownership share in Election Systems & Software (ES&S)" and "ES&S voting machines count all the votes in Hagel's home state of Nebraska, except in those counties that tally ballots by hand...When she posted the information about the situation on her (previous) Web site, she promptly received a cease-and-desist order from ES&S lawyers. She e-mailed the cease-and-desist order to 3,000 of her media contacts."

It was Bev Harris who found the Diebold source code on the internets, and took the appropriate steps to get it in the hands of people to examine and determine its flaws.

It was Bev Harris who first posted internal Diebold/Global Election Systems emails online, and took the appropriate steps to spread them far and wide. Diebold shut down her blackboxvoting.org site for 30 days as a result, during which time she did not have access to her files, the emails, the source code, or membership lists. But David Allen did.

It was Bev Harris (same link as #3) who was under investigation for a hack into the Bellevue, Washington company known as VoteHere. She correctly (IMO) recognized the subsequent attempt to convince her to look at the hacked information as a set-up.

[yowzayowzayowza]

87. You obviously didn't read far enough, as...

there are at least three falsehoods in your accounts.

[Kelvin Mace]

106. You cite a lunatic poster on who has a diary on Kos

this is NOT the same as an actual posting by Kos, Georgia10, McJoan or some other CREDIBILE blogger.

Facts:

Bev did NOT post the internal emails on line, other folks did because Bev was afraid of being arrested.
Bev did NOT find the source code first, this was clarified by report Ronnie Duggin.

There is NO WAY you actually read the postings we provided since they contain not "opinions" but ACTUAL postinsg of Bev's words, and the experiences that other people have had with Bev FIRST-HAND.

[Kelvin Mace]

105. Uh, no

CU is independent of Ralph Nader. BBV is NOT independent of Bev.

These are not "personal" allegations, they are allegations (many proven) of financial misconduct. Bev has FAILED to account for almost $1 million in funds she raised. She has posted FAKE 990 forms and has FAILED to file correct 990's with the IRS. We have now moved from the realm of personality quirks to felonies.

Bev has DESTROYED her credibility on this issue by mismanagement, fraud, lies, libel and slander.

[AtomicKitten]

24. Why is it that people sharpen their elbows in groups?

It has been my experience that people in groups tend to want to float to the top and be recognized and do that by climbing over other people. Bev Harris has done some damn fine work on BBV. The rest is petty chatter on the internets that pales in comparison to the work she is doing on something that has shaped our current nightmare and will continue to do so until it is fixed.

[yowzayowzayowza]

25. Pathetic.

Tharze indeed one born every minute.

[AtomicKitten]

26. yes it is pathetic

people piling on someone who has dedicated her life to a problem that has devasted this country
that's so very internets, doncha know

[yowzayowzayowza]

27. Funny, I felt the same way...

about Bevz 'tude towards Andy's illness: people piling on someone who has dedicated his life to a problem that has devasted this country
that's so very internets, doncha know

[AtomicKitten]

28. here's an idea

Maybe you should let these little dramas that have nothing to do with you play themselves out without getting so emotionally invested.

[yowzayowzayowza]

30. .

[AtomicKitten]

32. *

back at ya

you are a clever little monkey; the mods will never suspect what your avatar means

[yowzayowzayowza]

33. ...

...speaking of emotional investments.... :dunce:

[ldf]

54. "these little dramas"

you can NOT possibly be referring to andy?

your credibility is now in the shredder.

enjoy.

[AtomicKitten]

63. Andy who?

I don't even know who you are talking about, which makes you rash and judgmental, and your credibility is now in the crapper. Enjoy.

[Kelvin Mace]

107. If you don't know who Andy Stephens is

and don't know the story of how Bev and her little gang of Freepers LITERALLY hounded him to the grave, you cannot be paying close attention.

[AtomicKitten]

117. I have since read your allegations

from a variety of sources and, again, you are basing your entire complaint on a subjective analysis that consists of accusations. You are participating in an on-line character assassination.

Enjoy your jihad.

[Kelvin Mace]

130. I hardly call quoting Bev herself

and her own postinsg on BBV "subjective"

[Kelvin Mace]

41. Dedicated her life?

Oh, PUH-leaze.

Bev dedicated her life to stuffing her pockets with cash.

[tkmorris]

29. OK this is absurd

I hardly think that her utter failure to account for the massive amount of money that was donated to her organization is "petty chatter on the internets". Her treatment of Andy was also despicable. I could go on about her book, or qui tam lawsuit, or a number of other things but it's already been done a million times over here. The woman has behaved in a fashion that ranges from pointlessly hostile to completely psychotic.

If you want to continue to put your faith in her, fine, but don't act as if people don't have legitimate complaints about her behavior. That's just good old denial.

[AtomicKitten]

31. Faith? No, I acknowledge the good work she has done.

And the fact that I haven't subscribed to the internets jihad isn't denial, although you seem to think those that don't share your opinion are in denial, which is pretty narcissistic.

There is this immature bent on the internets, not exclusive to DU to be sure, of reverting to an almost childlike melodrama of campaigns to discredit and all must join or be deprived of the secret handshake.

I'm not a follower, particularly when I smell a pile-on. And not acknowledging, no, being annoyed by someone having the audacity to even mention the excellent work Bev has done in trying to protect the vote reeks of a pile-on. I figure if she is guilty of the heinous crimes you accuse her of, you and your internets pals are doing a swell job of trashing her and don't need my participation. And if she's not, I have better things to do than trash a woman who is trying to protect my vote. And sorry to disappoint, but none of us are qualified to make that judgment, at least justifiably and with any certainty.

[JohnnyCougar]

34. Bev Harris = Zero Credibility

Bev Harris is not trying to protect your vote. Bev Harris is looking out for Bev Harris. The protecting your vote thing is mostly an illusion. She is probably doing far more harm than good to the anti e-voting movement.

I don't know if you were around when she was slandering others on here, making up stories, and then basically abusing DU and turning it into a personal fundraising tool for herself all the while lying about what she was doing and the results she was getting. It made many people who donated a lot of money really pissed off. Thank god I never donated, but frankly, I saw right through her from the beginning. You should put a lot more doubt into a lady who probably still is a member of free republic and used to profit from selling toys mocking the Clinton sex scandal.

[tkmorris]

35. Oh for chrissake..........

Look there are some things that are so self-evident that to ignore them is denial. Not simply because I think them, simply because it is so. Calling me narcissistic doesn't make you right, it just reduces the level of debate.

BTW, I'm no follower either. Once upon a time I devoted time and resources to helping Bev and BBV because I believed it was worth doing and that she was devoted to that cause. It took quite some time before I accepted what my eyes told me; Bev only cares about herself. She has repeatedly acted in a fashion that helps her while HURTING the very cause she presumes to champion.

I am not trying to trash anyone. I simply feel that Bev is detrimental to getting real voting reform, and that it is important that people know that. I don't know quite what an "internets pal" is but I am fairly certain I don't have any. Unless I can count you.

[Kelvin Mace]

42. So, faking documents to account for

how money was spent is OK with you? Stealing other people's work is OK with you? Sucking up to Freepers is OK with you? Selling out a whistle-blower is OK with you?

[troubleinwinter]

45. "...the secret handshake." That's pretty funny.

Bev recently went on a delusional rant, making accusations of a "secret society", "secret club", "a private club, with no one who can be held accountable, accessible only through invitations and a secret handshake".

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Kelvin%20Mace/16

[pnwmom]

72. Don't you think that if she really has failed "utterly" to account for

millions, this Republican government would have already gone after her?

So what is your evidence of this? I'd like to see it.

[Kelvin Mace]

108. Why?

She is destroying her and OUR credibility nicely all by herself.

You have been shown links several times in this thread and apparently not bothered to read them.

Tell you what, if you REALLY want to know about Bev's mismanagement and illegal behavior, I'll be happy to explain it to you on the phone. I'll give you an toll free number you can reach me at and I will go over the links with you one by one. My dime, you pay nothing.

[Kelvin Mace]

40. And what exactly has she done,

pray tell?

[AtomicKitten]

69. I'd direct you

to the BBV website, but you know perfectly well where to find it. You are being obsequious and would ignore all evidence proffered even if I did leave you a trail of bread crumbs.

[yowzayowzayowza]

73. Clue Phone.

Itz for you: http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Kelvin%20Mace/2

I'll give you a hint... The DUer you just responded to and the author of that journal is the original publisher of her book. His site is http://www.BlackBoxVoting.COM

[AtomicKitten]

80. snaps

for your gracious response * sarcasm * ... why people feel the need to inject snarkiness into dialog is beyond me.

I've read the info and still what I have written, that she has done good work on the issue of BBV, stands. Whatever else you may think of her, to deny that is to be purposefully oblivious. I have read the accusations but that doesn't entitle people to summarily convict her without proffering her side of the story. And there is another side.

But, for me, rather than taking sides in an issue that has too many questions unanswered, I will again reiterate my admiration for the work she has done and that I appreciate it, having worked with Rep. Rush Holt's office on HR-2239 for EVM accountability. From my perspective, the ultimate goal of clean elections is what is important. This other stuff is ugly shit posted on the internets with no real certainty as to the real, unbiased, unfiltered story.

In other words, I won't be joining the pile-on. And if you feel the need to continue to denigrate those not willing to join your crusade against Bev, again, have at. I appreciate all the work people have done on the issue of election fraud. That is my concern; not personalities. I have seen former business associates go after each other like wild dogs. That's not something I'm interested in.

[yowzayowzayowza]

90. Ummm...

why people feel the need to inject snarkiness into dialog is beyond me.

Your post to which I replied (#69):

You are being obsequious and would ignore all evidence proffered even if I did leave you a trail of bread crumbs.

Are there any mirrors in your world?

...whatever...

Ignore the history of her behavior at your peril. Good luck with that.

fin.

[AtomicKitten]

101. and to you

good luck with all that hate and anger

[troubleinwinter]

97. "too many questions unanswered"

Aint that the truth. Why has Bev never answered the questions over these months? She and her followers who report directly to her, follow every DU post related to her, as evidenced by her outing of my personal information and responses on her own site to a few DU comments, posted on her site. She never answers the inconvenient questions. So you are correct, "too many questions unanswered"... should she ever choose to answer, there are enough people here who read there to pass it along.

You say "there is another side". OK. What is her "side" on failing to file the 990? What is her "side" on failng to deposit employees' payroll taxes? What is her "side" about illegally soliciting funds? What is her "side" about donor money going to pay IRS penalties?

So let's hear "her side". She never has offered answers.

[AtomicKitten]

102. maybe

she doesn't feel shows owes an explanation. That's certainly understandable with the abject annihilation she is getting here. Not much point defending oneself to an audience that has already reached a verdict. Lots of accusations, but the "evidence" offered here as proof of her sins which I have reviewed is short on actual facts and long on insinuations and extrapolations. So, I will continue to be grateful for the work she has done and wait until charges are brought against her for the things she is accused of by some here. That would be the reasonable course of action if your accusations are correct, right?

[Kelvin Mace]

111. She is REQUIRED BY LAW

to file a 990 with the IRS and to provide one to any member of the public who asks.

The 990 she posted is a complete fake, full of math errors and questionable expenses. It is not even signed properly. The IRS has never received a 990 from Bev, which is a violation of the the law as well.

Explain to me why Bev would post a 990 full of fake information?

[AtomicKitten]

115. perhaps that is between

Bev and the IRS. If you are insinuating that she is being allowed to get away with something illegal, particularly in light of the context of a cause that is a thorn in the side of Republicans (whom the IRS serves at the pleasure of), you may want to rethink that notion.

Regardless, I will reserve judgment. I am a bit put off by your screed against a person, any person, here at DU. You are opening yourself to being sued for defamation and your aggressive campaign of personal destruction is really not cool.

Have at. I'm done. Enjoy your jihad.

[Kelvin Mace]

131. I DARE Bev to sue me for defamation!

She will not because she will LOSE and lose BADLY.

David N. Allen
blackboxvoting.COM

[Kelvin Mace]

110. What you are not interested in

is the truth.

[AtomicKitten]

116. I'm not interested in a pile-on

Your "truth" is an extrapolation of statements and phrases, accusations, and insinuations.

[pnwmom]

81. Clue phone.

He obviously is not a disinterested, objective observer of this mess. There is no way, as far as I can tell, for an outsider to know what really happened between them.

But look at the work Harris has done through BBV. Starting up from nothing, she's accomplished a lot. She's obviously alienated a bunch of people along the way, but how much have her detractors accomplished with regard to BBV?

[Kelvin Mace]

112. She has accomplished a lot

A whistle-blower faces prison so Bev could pocket $76,000 from her qui tam. She of course promised to give that money to BBV, yet, the donation is ABSENT from her fake 990.

[Kelvin Mace]

109. If I want Bev's lies, I can call Bev and ask for them

[pnwmom]

65. And if she gets some Republicans worked up about the problems with

Diebold and other electronic voting machines, what is the harm?

Don't all honest Democrats and Republicans want to have accurate voting? Republicans SHOULD be just as concerned with vote tampering as we are.

[AtomicKitten]

68. yes

You are right, everybody should be concerned about election fraud. When the Republicans realize they may be the victims of fraud, then they will rush to fix it. To this point, the fraud results have consistently been in their favor, so I don't know if we have reached the tipping point.

[Kelvin Mace]

113. Voting reform is happening

but it is no thanks to Bev Harris.

Want to see REAL anti-BBV work? Check out NC Coalition for Verified Voting. They drove Diebold from the state, passed the toughest anti-BBV law in the nation and didn't take a dime from ANYONE.

[snowbear]

36. Ok.. here's the deal with Bev as far as I'm concerned, then I'm done....

.... with this thread.

I've met her.. She's been busting her butt on our Diebold lawsuit up here and has been incredibly helpful. I don't know anything about a "temper" that I've read elsewhere -- I only know what I've seen of her. Very professional, powerful speaker, and completely dedicated to her mission.

There are evidently two sides to this story though because there's an awful lot of people that have a very negative opinion of her.
-------------------------------------------
A Daily KOS Member states- http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/1/15/19174/3163

Bev Harris, an American Hero - Part 4, a Conspiracy to Malign
by Bozos Rnot4 Bush
Sun Jan 15, 2006 at 04:17:04 PM PDT

"I've never asked people in a diary to recommend it before, but I'm asking now. I have uncovered solid evidence of a devious, coordinated campaign to discredit Bev Harris and BBV research, which strikes at the heart of something we all should support - our right to vote, and have our votes counted.

Here's my opening salvo:

Shortly after Bev Harris' site was shut down by Diebold in September 2003, Bev Harris wanted to set up a new site as a temporary measure, because the California Recall was only a couple of weeks away. Ignoring Bev's initial (edited) objection, David Allen (her publisher at the time, fired in 2004, and now the overt leader of the "BASHBEV.COM" movement) contacted Tom Flocco's right-hand man, who set up this insecure site.

His name is Robert Mendenhall Jr. of Whitestar Website Design. He only had a handful of clients. Besides tomflocco.com, his only other claim to fame was this site for Vreeland crap. Not coincidentally, Andy Stephenson was a regular at the Vreeland site, as well as moderator at the insecure temp site.

Clearly, Tom Flocco is a right wing disinfo freak, and very proud of his right-wing ties, and hey...there's his right-hand man Whitestar (Robert Mendenhall Jr, David Allen' buddy) again!

I'd like to close this chapter with a quick refresher on what Bev Harris has done for us. Those who have accused her of being a freeper, a scam artist, not on the side of truth and justice, yada yada yada, should be deeply ashamed of themselves. Her story is a testament to what an average, everyday American can do, when confronted with something that has to be done.

THERE IS NO BETTER EVIDENCE IN THIS WORLD THAN EVIDENCE THAT PROVES SOMEONE "WALKS THE WALK," INSTEAD OF MERELY "TALKS THE TALK."


Bev Harris - Blackbox Voting
-------------------------------------------
Evidently, from what members here are saying-- she used to post here @ DU?

Sorry.. I guess I just haven't dropped in there enough to understand why theirs a rift going on? :shrug:

-------------------------------------------
Here is another article from TPM about her (mostly about voting machines) that came out a few days ago-

http://houseoflabor.tpmcafe.com/blog/background_n015e/2006/sep/14/to_err_is_human_but_use_diebold_computers_to_really_screw_the_pooch
-------------------------------------------

I don't want to tick anyone off here who is not fond of her.. I've read how some people are mad at a call she made to Randi Rhodes, then another thread suggests it wasn't even her who called. Oy.. who knows!?

All I know is that the KOS gang seems to be pretty adamant that a very effective "swiftboating operation" has been underway against Bev. (By looking at the site BASHBEV.COM ... the seem to be on to something. - they are certainly on to something.

-------------------------------------------
I can only say this.. She's working very hard for us. And I'm not aware of the personal problems that some of my DU buds have with her, so I think I'll just bypass these types of threads.

I just hope --- I really, really hope ---- that a "devious, coordinated campaign to discredit Bev" is not underway (and there it is... I sure hope no one @ DU has fallen for it) KOS mentions that many of the people involved in BASHBUSH still post at DU.

That's all - :shrug: -- Thanks.

[yowzayowzayowza]

37. Before you run away and hide.

You mite do a lil homework and discover FOR YOURSELF why MzH wuz banned here twice:

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Kelvin%20Mace/2

...Bozo BS again & more anti-BBV conspiracy theories. How tired.

[rman]

38. Entirely according to expectiation

It's what the RW does best.

[tkmorris]

39. Used to post here?

Yes she did, and for quite awhile. It's a pity you weren't around then because if you had been you would understand quite well what issues many of us have with her.

My advice is to read all you can from the link Yowza provided, including especially the material linked to from that journal. There's an awful lot there, but you NEED to know this stuff if you want to even begin to express an opinion on Bev.

You apparently have arrived late to the Bev party. And, you are impressed enough by what she seems to be doing that you are trying to see her bright side. That's understandable, and there's not a bit of blame I'll give you for it. After all, once upon a time I believed in her too. However, after seeing her shenanigans over a period of time more or less first hand I came to the conclusion that her activism is a sham. In reality she seems out to make a name for herself, and as many bucks as she can in the process. There were many times I truly feared she had become totally unhinged, and might require psychological assistance. She acted utterly paranoid, without any obvious cause. I have come to prefer the conclusion that it was an act designed for dramatic purpose, and not true psychosis on her part but I cannot say with any degree of certainty.

Lastly, I want to link for you an audio clip. This is Bev Harris on the Randi Rhodes show, several days after Randi had aired a plea for people to donate to BBV and had been attempting to contact Bev about those donations. Mind you that during this time period Bev had several odd encounters with the media, including one episode where she was scheduled to appear on Olberman's show but had a tizzy fit with the producers and ended up not doing so. It's too much to go into here but you can read about it in the linked material Yowza gave. Here's the Randi Rhodes audio.... http://blackboxwatchdog.com/content/clips/bev_randi.mp3?PHPSESSID=bb6aa0a415c9dedb00172ed8d95a9568

[Kelvin Mace]

43. Quoting this psycho

does little to advance your argument.

His "evidence" has been debunked.

You met, I worked with her. She has been indicted with her own words and actions.

She was banned twice from DU for her abusive behavior. She has made enemies all over the place. She faked her 990 and one of these days the IRS is going to catch up with her.

[troubleinwinter]

47. "By looking at the site"

"By looking at the site BASHBEV.COM ..."

There is NO 'BASHBEV.COM'. It does not exist. It is a figment of Bozo's/John Dean's mind. He is a paranoid crackpot.

[salin]

49. Odd... I typed bashbev.com into my browswer

and here is what I got: http://msxml.excite.com/info.xcite/search/web/bashbev.com

no address - and close finds were:

groups.yahoo.com/group/BevHarrisEnemiesAnalysis/

www.dailykos.com/story/2006/1/15/19174/3163

scoop.epluribusmedia.org/story/2006/1/15/212746/69...

All of this seems to be defending bev against this alleged website which doesn't seem to exist. The alleged website doesn't even exist in a Google Cache (which would still exist had the 'bashbev' site ever existed outside of the imagination of the poster 'John Dean' (whose name shows up in the three links that did come up when I tried to go to Bashbev.com)

Or, not.

[troubleinwinter]

50. The whole thing is a figment of his imagination.

Kinda like an 'imaginary playmate' that children invent to keep themselves entertained.

Sadly, he seems to truly think his delusions are real, and that he "will post the proof any minute now!". This has gone on for two years that I've seen. Oh, well, if the endless hours he devotes to his belief that he is perpetually digging up the magical smoking guns to expose the great conspiracies of leftie-freepers keeps him happy, I suppose that's the best we can hope for, since he apparently does not have access to proper medications.

[salin]

51. It appears that if he repeats it enough

and links to his own work on other sites as evidence that this 'other website' exists... some folks will fall for it - and the idea that there is a conspiracy... and that "some people on DU are also posting on the (imaginary/nonexistent as far as my googling can tell) website". *sigh* Good people, with a burning concern for one of the major issues of our time, caught up in a sideshow/opportunistic money drain, sidetracked and believing the sideshow.

Lately local activists have gotten the county elections clerk to start paying attention to some major concerns. Earlier he and other groups (that were thought to be likely to be concerned/sympathetic) almost walked away from the discussions after some materials (and a taped talk?) from BH organizations that were deemed to be so confrontational/fringe - that the issues were initially dismissed out of hand. It took another four months or so to move the discussion forward again - and now some real serious action is happening (including a series of 'public spot checks (running ballots through' on random voting machines in the days running up to the election to detect potential problems (not just on those machines but overall) - machines that will be under lock and key until the elections... My point is that while the discussions have a long way to go, they have begun locally - but they were set back a bit by being dismissed (initially) as fringe due to the tone and tenor of BH info (a tape of an interview, I believe, that was given to the clerk and the local (liberal - in this community) league of womens voters. Only after months of work from local activists - using more academic sources (you know, the ones that BH regularly disses once they no longer are serving her PR machine) - that the issue (of potential problems with voting machines and elections) has been taken seriously by local officials.

on edit:
Note - for anyone with questions about my comments here, I will be off line (not on DU) for the week starting late morning Sunday - if you want to challenge me, or question me - please send me a PM - as this thread will likely long be archived before I am able to return to post/respond. I just didn't want anyone to think that I was ignoring or being combatively silent (ie say something, and then disappear) by design.

[troubleinwinter]

53. "tone and tenor of BH"

A local county elections officer (a friend who is adamanty pro-paper ballots and anti-DRE) told me that Bev's antics make her own work in desperately trying to convince her peers across the state to go-with/stay-with paper ballots incredibly difficult, because Bev is regarded as a crackpot (they've seen her in action). Her antics do make winning officials to our side more difficult.

The messenger DOES matter. County officials can be some of the MOST important allies in our work.

A person who goes around the country alientaing media personalities & county officials, smearing voting activists & organizations, and will not abide by IRS and state laws is NOT a good messenger for this vitally important issue.

[pnwmom]

82. Where is the proof, or even the evidence, that she isn't abiding by

IRS rules and state laws?

I've just seen a bunch of claims, but no evidence at all.

[troubleinwinter]

86. Here you go:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x436340#top

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x437826

[troubleinwinter]

91. They are long threads, and you wouldn't want to overlook this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=436340&mesg_id=436531

Another thread posts the penalties for violations of this law, including hefty fines and jail time (up to a year).

I sure wouldn't want to be a Member of the Board, especially Vicky Karp, who signed the supposed 990. Interesting that Bev didn't appear to sign it. I have never thought Bev was stupid at all. Mad Cow Disease maybe, but not at all stupid.

Evidently Board members can each be held individually and personally responsible for violations leading to IRS penalties.

It would be a shame to see donations go to pay for malfeasant behavior by the organization's officers, don't you think?

If the Board is unwilling or incapable of properly overseeing an organization with nearly a million dollars in donations, abiding by their own state law, IRS filing and properly handling employees' withheld tax monies, do you think it should be exposed and corrected?

I wonder if donors' money is best utilized in a non-interest-bearing account. I wonder why the supposed 990 was not signed by a CPA. I wonder why the numbers on the form don't add up. I wonder why it was not filed on time, despite 6 months of extensions. I wonder why I still have not received a complete 990 request response. I wonder why payroll taxes were not deposited.

Do you think donors should expect their hard-earned money to go to the purpose for which they sent it rather than penalties for failure to abide by law? Do you think it would be interesting to get answers to these questions? Maybe you don't, because you have the answers... if so, please post them, because we have never been given any of these answers at all.

[Kelvin Mace]

114. The 990 she posted is an obvious fake

and we called the IRS and they have said they have not received a 990 from her.

It's called a telephone. Call them from yourself and let us know what they say.

I'm betting you won't.

[ldf]

57. how sad.

i was once like you.

i thought i saw someone doing something about bbv.

she came here quite often to post, and have others do research for her. (du is an EXCELLENT source for research, if people believe in you...)

i supported her. i donated to her.

but there were questions that were never answered. quite a bit of money was never accounted for.

her true colors slowly came out.

and then there was andy.

she is evil.

[Name removed]

64. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yowzayowzayowza]

92. Sad, indeed.

The questions are about facts that MzH finds inconvenient.

[tkmorris]

96. Jumping Jehosephat, what does it take?

After all the information that has been posted on this thread, up to and including a fake tax form, you don't even BEGIN to have doubts? You continue to paint her detractors as "sad", "judgemental", and "rumormongers"?

There is nothing worse in life than a fanatic. I can understand you not wanting to just take our word for it, and demanding facts to back up allegations, but to ignore all of that when it is GIVEN to you, and instead attack the very people who give it to you, well I don't even know what to call that.

Bev herself didn't stretch this far to defend her actions. She may be mad as a hatter (or not) but she knew when to cut bait.

[AtomicKitten]

103. fanaticism

... as in the gang-bang annihilation of someone's character. The absolutism regarding her alleged crimes is rather breathtaking. The evidence you so confidently point to is at best insinuation. If she was guilty of the crimes she is accused of, she would be prosecuted. Just not liking her isn't prosecutable in a court of law, although you have clearly fine-tuned your efforts.

Your accusation of fanaticism is a textbook case of projection.

[Kelvin Mace]

118. Ms. Harris has threatened to sue me

DU, and dozens of other people for libel and slander, yet such a suit has NEVER materialized.

The reason is that the truth is NOT defamatory, it is the truth.

It is amazing how many well-established liberals would have to be lying for Bev to be telling the truth.

[pnwmom]

76. The govt. requires that nonprofits account for their funding.

If she hasn't been doing that, don't you think the govt. would be coming after her? People are making claims about large sums of money here. I don't think the Bushies would be turning the other cheek.

[Kelvin Mace]

120. Give them time.

Of course, when they do, apologizts will come out and claim persecution.

[LoZoccolo]

60. So is Keith Olbermann part of the conspiracy? n/t

[pnwmom]

83. No, he's just someone she was rude to.

One of the many, apparently.

[Kelvin Mace]

121. Right, Bev abuses his staff, and it is Keith who is rude.

Of course. How silly of me.

[lonestarnot]

48. Personally, I don't give a fuck who is saying the right thing!

[pnwmom]

66. She has done a lot of good work showing the problems that

have occurred with voting machines across the United States.

She's a showboater, and she has poor personal skills, like a lot of people (Ralph Nader is one who comes to mind). But that doesn't negate the good work that she has done, and the attention that she's brought to the issue.

[Kelvin Mace]

122. She has done damned little except put a lot

of money in her own pocket.

[MasonJar]

52. Kudos for Bev and for anyone willing to donate the time she has

to saving our democracy.

[Kelvin Mace]

58. Have you even bothered to read the evidence against Bev?

Evidence of her own words and actions?

[troubleinwinter]

61. She doesn't donate her time.

She gets PAID.

She spends plenty of her paid time devoted to smearing activists and organizations who actually DO dontate their time without pay (not to mention paying their own expenses), and who have made true ACCOMPLISHMENTS for verified voting.

It is reprehensible that donations made in the hopes of fighting for verified voting is ending up in the pockets of someone who does so much to damage the cause.

You have much reading to do.

[pnwmom]

67. She donated A LOT of time before the grants started coming in.

And they came in because of the work she had done at her own expense. Do you think that overnight people suddenly started handing her piles of cash?

[tkmorris]

98. Horsehockey

The very first action she undertook was to write a book, which she expected to sell. It was nothing more than opportunism in the end, much like her Monica Souvenir Cigars.

[troubleinwinter]

99. I'm not sure she ever expected to sell it.

A couple of years before she wrote the book, she wrote an article called "How to Raise a Lot of Little Cash-Cows and a Few Big Moo-Lahs".

She suggested that her readers find an 'undergound' or 'counter-culture' subject and write a book, claiming that they were quite popular, then give it away free on-line, in order to draw people to one's site where the real 'moo-lah' could be raked in.

[tkmorris]

104. That's an excellent point

I had forgotten that. I do remember that she would come here and "give away" chapters, or at least portions of them, all the while writing breathlessly about how the gubmint was out to get her and she might have to disappear for a few weeks.

To be honest I think she DID believe she would sell enough copies to us "counter-culture" types to make a few pennies on the deal. I think she just got in over her head when the calls started coming in from the real media. She had no idea how to cover her own butt anymore.

[Kelvin Mace]

123. And if she steals people's money in the process

that's OK with you?

If she consorts with Freepers and attacks a dying man, that's OK with you?

If she libels and slanders people like Avi Rubin, Rebecca Mercuri and Doug Jones, that's OK with you.

If a whistle-blower goes to jail so she can stuff cash in her pocket, that's OK by you?

If she accuses the folks who run DU of vile conspiracies, that OK with you?

[tyedyeto]

89. No fan of Bev and BBV, but who else can get the message

to the corporate media?

In the recent primaries, I have heard here at DU about touchscreen machines spending a night or two at a precinct workers home,glitches in Maryland with touchscreen machines, etc.

But I haven't heard any of MSM or corporate media reporting these issues.

Personally, I think Bev Harris is full of shit and pokes her nose out when she thinks it's a 'popular' thing to do.

Is anyone else getting the Diebold inaccuracy count to any of the big new corps out there? And are they reporting it on a regular basis?

[troubleinwinter]

100. "who else can"?

How about someone respectable, with credibility, someone who doesn't (deliberately?) break Rule #1 in the article she wrote a few years ago, about the top 10 rules in Public Relations: Don't blow it when you have the chance to advance your product with a media opportunity, such as a radio or TV interview. Hmmmm, a professional PR person has broken Rule #1 repeatedly? Makes ya wonder.

Who else? There are many respectable, knowledgeable, experienced people who can (and have) spoken on the issue to and been broadcast on the corporate media. Yup, even DUers that you know right here.

Bev may be the loud one right now, but to our peril.

[Kelvin Mace]

124. VoteTrust USA is a good start

NC Coaltion for Verified Voting, etc.

There are DOZENS of groups working on this issue, and they are actually doing something, not posing for cameras and taking people's money and failing to account for it.

[The Magistrate]

133. Locking

This has become a flame-war.