Who is the gutsiest Democrat in office today?

[elperromagico]

Who's our best fighter?

[rhiannon55]

1. Russ Feingold

[Oceansaway]

2. Russ Feingold....n/t

[AndyA]

3. Russ Feingold, without question. A true Patriot.

[blm]

9. Please show his 13 yr record of battles he led and stuck his neck out.

Because he always seemed pretty quiet to me. He has good voting record- but I didn't see him leading the tough battles. publically.

IMaybe I missed it - can you list them for me as a helpful tool?

[blm]

12. dupe

.

[AndyA]

15. Are you forgetting his stance on Impeachment?

Certainly that is one of the most important issues facing America today. And he stood almost alone on it. Where were/are the rest of them?

[blm]

19. He offered a censure as an alternative to impeachment because he

said he didn't believe a president should be impeached at a time of war.

Boxer, Harkin, Kerry and Leahy support him on censure.

And censure had no legal remedy attached.

But he's been there 13 years - please list the battles he took on or helped lead.

[CarlVK]

23. I guess you saw that John Kerry isn't listed, so far.

Call me psychic....

[blm]

27. Doesn't botner me - I expect few have studied the actual records and

few have noted the actual battles of all the Democrats during their terms.

People should assess FACTS that can be found in the historic record, instead of the impressions they are fed by corpmedia or by left blogs.

But I understand that a great deal of DU posters are new to politics and are mainly familiar with the last 6years via what they have gathered from blogs, forums. and the especially lousy corpmedia.

But, I trust real information will move them eventually.

[CarlVK]

76. I say Conyers.

He is the only one so far who has even started fleshing out articles of impeachment, and let me tell you the case against GWB is a country mile long. I've seen no others even come close to that.

Actions speak.

[pnwmom]

78. I agree about Conyers. He's great.

[AndyA]

28. The question asked who is the GUTSIEST.

I define being gutsy as more than participation in battles. It's an attitude, an ability, a presence. Feingold has all of these.

Unless the original poster wants to edit or clarify the question to say "Which Dem has been involved in the most battles?" I stand by Feingold, as do, apparently, a lot of other DUers.

[blm]

30. Ok - Where was the attitude, ability, presence when those who WERE

taking on difficult battles and issues could have used the help?

Are you saying Russ was TOO capable, had TOO much attitude, and TOO much of a presence to stick his neck out during the toughest battles?

Then why have them if you're not going to use them when your compadres and others are on the frontline?

No man is an island - or SHOULDN'T be.

[AndyA]

33. Gutsy.

1. Feingold was the only senator to vote against the Patriot Act when first voted on in 2001, due to his belief of the potential of civil rights infringement.

2. Led filibuster against renewal of the Patriot Act, which created some compromise to the act, but Fiengold still voted against the new version, one of only 10 who did, again due to the belief that civil liberties would be violated.

3. Voted against the war in Iraq.

4. First senator to call for withdrawal of troops from Iraq and ask for a timetable to be set.

5. Vote to censure Bush.

6. Supports legalization of same sex marriage.

Sometimes Feingold doesn't vote with the Dems, and I'm not saying that's right or wrong, but it does take guts to vote against the majority of your peers. I don't always agree with the way he votes, but I do believe he's a fighter and has the guts to stand by his beliefs.

[blm]

39. Voting is one thing - taking up the FIGHT before the vote is another

and the GUTSIEST thing ANY senator or congressman can do is take on government corruption - you win no friends and make a ton of enemies, all of who are targeting you for the duration of the investigation wheteher it be one year or five years.

[AndyA]

58. In YOUR opinion.

Government corruption is certainly a big one, I also think standing up for gay rights is also a biggie. Talk about controversy!

We'll just have to agree to disagree, I think Feingold is the gutsiest. That's my opinion and I'm sticking with it.

End of conversation.

[blm]

64. Then you would acknowledge who the first senator to submit gay protection

bill to senate LONG before they became a voting block.

And the guts it took to ADVOCATE for gays to serve openly in the military, including testifying before congress.

But, I guess that doesn't count if you don't WANT it to.

Facts are facts and opinions are based on facts for most people.

[karynnj]

43. Number 4 is wrong

Senator Kennedy was asked about his call to withdraw troops in February 2005. Feingold did suggest a flexible target date by which we are out in August 2005.

As to the Patriot act the problem in 2002 was that it contained some necessary tools - such as those the Republicans fought for most of the 90s to control international money laundering. In 2005 when they renewed it, the alternative was never that it would be gone - it was either the original or the new.

Many who voted for the new one, which was better than old one, introduced an amendment within the next week that would amend the new one - Feingold was one of the sponsors with Kerry, Kennedy, Durbin and others. They felt that the bill they got was as good as they could get with the current Congress.

[AndyA]

59. As good as they could get with the current Congress.

And that says a lot. The current Congress is one of the absolute worst in history, but since they've worked so little, who could really expect much in the way of accomplishments?

Thanks for the correction about number 4, with so much going on it's difficult to keep all the details straight.

[mtnsnake]

34. Feingold's stance on impeachment was the most UN-gutsiest stance possible

because it was an alternative to impeachment, period. His move to censure was more self-serving and it was far from gutsy.

[9119495]

65. Some of us supported Russ because we thought it was wrong

the pres. had his penis in an intern's mouth. Should he be removed from office for it? Probably not...but scolded for being so stupid? Hell yes.

I actually went through a phase where I wanted Clinton to resign so Gore would get some on the job training and show he was the best man for the job (some thought he was incompetant).

I felt the Feingold move was a way of not excusing the pres. behavior but injecting a little reality into the discussion.

[blm]

67. Feingold knows the law - he knew no LAWS were broken by Clinton that

would deserve impeachment. He voted AGAINST censure because he thought impeachment was the proper remedy in a case that cried out for censure.

He also said he was offering censure as an ALTERNATIVE to impeachment for Bush even knowing Bush broke the law.

Isn't that a little ass backwards?

Clinton's shenanigans should have gotten censure - Bush's crimes against the constitution deserve impeachment.

I like Russ OK - he's usually a good vote on issues, though not so hot on confirmations. He has had some stirring moments in recent years, but he's not exactly a fighter in the trenches on many issues.

He rarely came out to support other Democrats in their battles, and that's just not cool, imo. But, I do see he's been coming around in recent months, so that bodes well for the future.

[rep the dems]

71. I've said this before and got all kinds of shit for it, but I think I need

to say it again: Clinton lied during grand jury testimony. I'm not saying he should have been removed from office for that, but we can't just forget that. Feingold took a stand against him just like he did with Bush, proving that he is a gutsy senator. It does seem strange to me that he would not support impeachment if he believes all that he says about Bush, but Feingold is dedicated to getting a democratic majority in '06 and probably knows that suggesting impeachment at this point could jeopardize our chances.

Let me just remind everyone I'M NOT SAYING THAT CLINTON'S ACTIONS WERE WORSE THAN BUSH'S, OR THAT CLINTON SHOULD HAVE BEEN REMOVED FROM OFFICE.

[blm]

73. Except that lie did not rise to the level of perjury - Russ knows the law

He KNEW there was no perjury committed and that the entire issue never even involved a crime of office as required under the constitution.

[and-justice-for-all]

80. Sure is and so is Murtha..

[KyndCulture]

4. Feingold and Conyers

[Nite Owl]

10. I'll second that. n/t

[KingFlorez]

5. Hillary Clinton, Barbara Boxer

[av8rdave]

6. Feingold...hands down!

[CarlVK]

7. Russ Feingold - John Conyers

It's a toss up between the two.

[Dob Bole]

8. Well, Dean. But that isn't public office...so I vote Byrd. nt

[cali]

11. Sorry, but this is a dumb question.

We actually have lots of dem fighters. Not as many as we should have, but still there are dozens of them. Here's a few aside from Russ: Henry Waxman, John Conyers, Bernie Sanders, Barney Frank, Sheila Jackson-Lee, Barbara Lee, Edward Kennedy- and those are just a few. Why so many here constantly act as if there are no worthy dems in Congress is a mystery to me. And yes I know Bernie's an independent. I count him anyway as he has the support of the dem party in Vermont.

[elperromagico]

20. Sorry, but this is a dumb reply.

I didn't say there weren't lots of Dem fighters. I said who is the best. Of all our fighters, who can be most consistently relied upon to fight the hardest?

I thought I'd made the question quite simple. Apparently I made it dumb.

[blm]

31. Relied on consistently - Kerry in Senate. Waxman in the House.

.

[bvar22]

44. Add Dennis Kucinich, and I'll 2nd your list.

The Democratic Party is a BIG TENT, but there is NO ROOM for those
who advance the agenda of THE RICH (Corporate Owners) at the EXPENSE of LABOR and the POOR.

[FrenchieCat]

13. John Conyers/ Charlie Range/Barbara Lee --n/t

Conyers for guts to say what needs to be said...

Charlie Rangel for guts to say what needs to be said all up and down their faces.

Barbara Lee coz she's my congresswoman and I know her personally!

[Bjorn Against]

46. Barbara Lee may be the one

I don't know her personally, although I wish I did because I have an enormous amount of respect for her.

She was the ONLY member of Congress to vote against the war in Afghanistan right after 9/11. That was the right vote, and it was a very gutsy vote.

She seems to consistantly vote the right way on pretty much every issue even when it is a lonely vote, and I don't think I can say that about very many other member of Congress.

I also have to say that Feingold, Conyers, Kucinich, and Bernie Sanders rate up near the top as well though.

[nickyt]

14. Rep. John Murtha has caught a lot of flack on his Iraq stance, and is

hanging tough. Plus, he added "Five deferment Cheney" to the lexicon...

[Dulcinea]

62. Murtha gets my vote.

He tells it like it is, every day. I hope to see him as Sec. of Defense in a Democratic administration. He actually cares about what the troops are going through, unlike that charlatan in there now.

[longship]

16. Senate - Feingold. House - Conyers.

No doubt about it.

Honorable mentions to Senators Kennedy, Durbin, and Boxer.

Honorable mentions to many, many Reps, including Frank, Kucinich, Lee, and Rangel.

Special "Bunched shorts" award to Peter DeFazio because when he gets his shorts in a bunch on an issue he actually looks and sounds like his shorts are in a bunch.

Special "Dignified Outrage award" to David Obey for his ability to communicate extreme anger without losing his dignity.

[karynnj]

17. John Kerry, Russ Feingold

Kerry has been fantatic taking Bush on concerning National Security, Iraq, secret prisons and torture. Fengold on all the constitutional issues that Bush has created as he routinely pretends we don't have a constitution.

(By the way, I do of course know that Feingold has been out there on Iraq forever and that he and Kerry did K/F. In the last few months, it has been Kerry who's been more out there hitting Bush on it. Kerry also did lead the Alito filibuster - largely based on the "unitary President" issue, but in the last few months, I've seen mostly Feingold on that.

Boxer is always great, she would be third.

Hillary? Not really, but she gets the most press on it. She attacks Rumsfeld - like others did almost 3 yrs ago and it's front page news.

[blm]

18. Congressional record on the TOUGHEST battles - Kerry, Waxman, Conyers.

Who sticks their neck out alot but with little notice? Waters, Lee, Kucinich, McDermott, McGovern, Frank.

[Vidar]

21. Conyers & Feingold.

[Totally Committed]

22. John Conyers!

Hands down... John Conyers.

TC

[paulk]

24. who is "our"?

everyone has their own pet issues...

----------------

[elperromagico]

25. Yes, and everyone has their own opinion,

which is what I was asking for.

Insert your word of choice in place of the offending "our."

[paulk]

32. but... why?

what possible purpose does it serve?

an appeal for consensus? Or the opposite?

I don't see how a thread like this serves any good purpose.

[elperromagico]

36. Then feel free not to reply to it again.

You've chosen to reply to it twice, first dickering over semantics and then complaining about the post itself. If you didn't feel the question itself served a purpose, why did you bother complaining about the way the question was phrased? That's like a vegetarian complaining about a hamburger because it has pickles on it.

Are you trying every complaint until one sticks?

I posted this question neither to create consensus nor to destroy it. I posted this question to get an idea of which leaders, by their passion and dedication to Democratic causes, inspire my fellow Democrats. You may think that pointless; I don't. This is where our opinions unfortunately differ.

But, as long as we're discussing pointlessness: What good purpose does your complaining serve?

[paulk]

40. your snideness aside

I think I asked a legitimate question, which you did answer.

"I posted this question neither to create consensus nor to destroy it. I posted this question to get an idea of which leaders, by their passion and dedication to Democratic causes, inspire my fellow Democrats."

What are you going to do with this information?

[elperromagico]

63. Why do you care?

Have you never asked someone for their opinion simply to know their opinion? Is being interested in the opinions of others pointless to you? There is very little I can do to remedy that. I'm interested in what others think, even when I disagree strongly with them, and I'm not planning on changing any time soon.

There is no purpose to this thread other than to learn the opinions of others. There has never been another purpose. I apologize if this doesn't pass muster in your mind. I'm sure you can find plenty of threads on DU that meet your self-righteous standards of "good purpose."

I've said all I'm going to say on this matter. Thank you for your time.

[paulk]

66. your rudeness aside

any thread that pits supporters of one Democrat against another (as this one has done, judging by some of the posts upthread) should be questioned, irregardless of the good intentions of the OP.

IMO.

[NJ Democrats]

26. Russ!

[Mass]

29. Lieberman. Kissing Bush is certainly gutsy for a Democrat.

:rofl:

[mtnsnake]

35. No one stands out. Maybe Kennedy to a degree. Good question

[calimary]

37. Well, this guy's pretty damned good, too. At least today...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2827576

Of course I'd also have to give my roar of approval to Feingold, and to a lesser extent Barbara Boxer. In the House - John Conyers, Henry Waxman, Jim McDermott, Louise Slaughter, Dennis Kucinich, Maxine Waters, and Barbara Lee.

[Catchawave]

38. Murtha, Feingold, Boxer, Conyers

:patriot:

[goclark]

41. John Conyers

[KeepItReal]

42. Elliot Spitzer...Having power and acutally *USING IT*

Most ofther Democrats (especially the ones in the GOP-run Congress) are outnumbered and outgunned.

[AnnieBW]

45. Murtha!

Don't get me wrong - I love Russ, Conyers, etc. But Murtha's speaking out where he could have stayed silent. He's never been a "liberal" before now.

[cadmium]

47. All mentioned have had their great moments

Murtha, Conyers, Kerry, Kennedy, Feingold, Boxer, Frank Lahey, Lee and a few others and in no definite order.

I would like to add Bernie Sanders.

[Sugarcoated]

48. In the House, Louise Slaughter

And the Senate, I'll just say it used to be, "What Would Wellstone Do", now it's "What Would Feingold Do".

:patriot:

Edited to add: Paul Hackett - the kick ass Dem who could've been.

[Stardust]

49. Conyers! Man ,what a scrappy guy!

[SoCalDemGrrl]

50. Feingold & Boxer by far

[Rowdyboy]

51. Gutsiest Democrat in office today? Gov Brian Sweitzer of Montana

America's classiest governor....

[NoPasaran]

85. He certainly seems to be one of our rising stars

I hope he has a long and successful career.

[carpetbagger]

52. Harry Reid.

Many of the people who are mentioned here (e.g. Kennedy, Boxer, Clinton, Conyers) could eat a kitten on live TV and still carry their districts or states. The gutsier ones are the ones who stick their necks out in moderate and conservative places, like Feingold, Dorgan, Rockefeller etc.

But Harry Reid takes on fights from a moderate state, and heards cats as well. While he doesn't always take on the fights we'd like, each time he does, he does so with only about 35 or so democrats on his side, the others either still smoking the wimp pipe, spending their days attacking the party, or representing very red states.

[LWolf]

53. Kucinich. n/t

[leesa]

54. Feingold, Waxman, Conyers, Boxer

[cleveramerican]

55. Joe Biden

I like the guy every time I hear him speak he says what I'm thinking.
he's smart and sensible and strategic

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

56. Waxman.

[PassingFair]

57. Not "in office" but my money's on the CHAIRMAN, DEAN

I'll follow him anywhere.

He truly continues to speak for me.

[Armstead]

60. Bernie Sanders..

Not a Democrat but the gutiest legislator in DC.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

74. Oh, he's a Democrat.

But the party just doesn't realize it yet.

[Greyhound]

61. Dennis Kucinich and Russ Feingold at the moment. n/t

[Clark2008]

68. In office, Feingold or Conyers, but our best fighter is Wes Clark.

Clark takes on the lions, erm.... Foxes... right in their own damn den!

:hi:

[Cookie wookie]

69. Russ Feingold and John Conyers!

Feingold from the senate floor Feb 2006:

This goes way beyond party, and way beyond politics. What the President has done here is to break faith with the American people. In the State of the Union, he also said that “we must always be clear in our principles” to get support from friends and allies that we need to fight terrorism. So let’s be clear about a basic American principle: When someone breaks the law, when someone misleads the public in an attempt to justify his actions, he needs to be held accountable. The President of the United States has broken the law. The President of the United States is trying to mislead the American people. And he needs to be held accountable.

Dec 2005:
“None of your civil liberties matter much after you’re dead.” -- Sen. John Cornyn (R-TX), quoted by The Hill.

“Give me liberty or give me death.”-- Sen. Russ Feingold (D-WI), responding to Cornyn with the quote made famous by Patrick Henry during the American Revolution.

[Catherine Vincent]

70. It was McKinney.

[GreenInNC]

72. Me!

Just kidding, not that kicking developer ass isn't tough (sure is fun though). I vote for Feingold

[gulliver]

75. Murtha

But I like a lot of the others like Feingold, Waxman, Levin, occasionally Reid...

[barbtries]

77. john conyers

was the first name to spring to my mind

[lisainmilo]

79. Kerry, Kennedy, Feingold n/t

[dsc]

81. I think gutsiet is more than our best fighter

I think the seat matters here. It is very easy to be a hard core Democrat when you have a district like Lee's, Conyers', Rangle's, Kucinich's or Frank's to name several. It is much harder to do that when you represent a whole state or a moderate district. What is so impressive about the likes of Feingold and was so impressive about Wellstone was that they stuck to principals even as they might cost them a career. It was one of the big reasons I supported Dean. Dean could have easily lost in 2000 and had a pile of ashes instead of a political career all due to civil unions. Instead he won a narrow victory in a tough race. I knew he would fight for me again if he had won the Presidency.

[samsingh]

82. Russ?

[wiley]

83. Clinton

at least the smartest and most effective (one of them). Feingold, as well, of course.

[seabeyond]

84. kerry and conyers.... by far. feingold up there. murtha

then boxer .... waters waxel (sp)