This might seem like a dumb question --

[Donnachaidh]

But I HAVE to ask it here ---

Is there ANY way to take away or limit the President's right to pardon people? I'm thinking in terms of his ability to pardon government officials found guilty, ala Libby, or possibly (fingers crossed) Cheney.

I don't see why his ability to pardon shouldn't be limited, especially in cases of goovernment fraud, treason, etc. This is an area that really bothers me, especially if they are going to go to all the expense and time to do investigations.

Ford never should have pardoned Nixon. It set the stage for all the crap we're suffering through now. We really do need to rein in this dictator we have in the White House NOW, because I feel he figures he'll pardon all his cronies before he leaves office.

[hlthe2b]

1. No...

except to take it out against his party during the next election....

[EllenZ]

2. No

Written into the Constitution I believe.

[Cabcere]

5. But isn't

the Constitution "just a g-d- piece of paper" anyway? :sarcasm:

[file83]

3. Yes, and it's called....

Impeachment

[jgraz]

4. I would love to see this amended

This is old-fashioned monarchy written into our laws. At the very least, Congress should be able to override a presidential pardon.

[EllenZ]

6. Looking it up

at www.usconsitution.net, Section 2, article 2 gives the president the power to pardon all offenses except those of impeachment.

So, first we impeach the VP for getting Scooter to out that CIA operative, then before Bush can put a replacement in, impeach him also. That puts Nancy in the White House.

[MonkeyFunk]

7. we'd need

to amend the constitution, but I'm in favor of it.

I believe congress should be able to override a pardon, just like a veto, and I think the President should not be able pardon people in his own administration.

Also, it should be made clear that pre-emptive pardons are not allowed. A pardon should only apply to actual convictions.

[Donnachaidh]

9. Do you think we'd have any Reps who would be willing to get this going?

I'm very serious about this --

No President should be able to pardon ANYONE from his administration. And I really do think that if he retains any form of pardon power, it should be in voted on by Congress.

It's a freaking *get out of jail free* card. It has to be stopped.

[MadMaddie]

11. And your suggestion would ensure checks and balances...

[TreasonousBastard]

8. Really, why would you want to do that...

just because there might be a pardon you might not like?

The pardon is really a precious thing left over from the old royalty days when the King was the "court of last resort" for justice to be done. Granted that most Presidents and Governors now use the pardon for mostly political games, but it's still a handy thing to have around.

[Donnachaidh]

10. Precious thing?

You're kidding, right?

When was the last time the presidential pardon was done for anything OTHER than cutting cronies loose?
There's nothing precious about it.

[TreasonousBastard]

12. Yup! The concept of pardon is...

still a good thing. If it's not being used properly, that's another matter entirely.

As a mtter of trivia you might be interested in (and which supports your argument, btw,) the Texas Governor is one of the few who does not have the right to pardon. That right was taken away when a Governor years ago (sorry, don't remember his name) was caught selling pardons out of the back door of the statehouse.

When our current President-like object was Governor, all he could do was issue a 30 stay of execution-- everything else was decided by the Board of Pardons and Paroles and he just signed the papers.

[frogcycle]

15. disagree!

it never should have existed. it gives excessive power to pres (and to govs)

[TreasonousBastard]

16. Excessive power? We let them...

be in charge of the Pentagon, the police, and the Guard-- what could give them more power than that?

Nope-- the pardon has been around for a very long time and is simply another balance of power. It is a safeguard against the power of the mob to convict wrongfully.

The question is not the existence of the pardon, it is how it is used.

[frogcycle]

17. well it is abused

and not just by the current squatter

the other "powers" you allude to at least hypothetically are subject to oversight.
pres can pardon jack the ripper on a whim and it is irreversible.

make it subject to some sort of oversight - by SCOTUS, or Cong committee, or SOMETHING so it is not just a blank check, and yeah, there is a place for it.

[Vidar]

13. I agree with you.

[zbdent]

14. Ask a right-winger

but do it in the context of Clinton's pardon of Marc Rich ... in fact, go look up what the Repukes had to say then about "unrestricted presidential pardons" ...

They were royally pissed at the time that Clinton pardoned someone ... and conveniently ignored the fact that Bush41 pardoned everybody who could have fingered him for Iran-Contra ...