HILL: I'M THE JFK OF 2008-VOWS TO BEAT ODDS

[babylonsister]

:eyes:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/03112007/news/nationalnews/hill__im_the_jfk_of_2008_nationalnews_maggie_haberman_post_correspondent.htm

HILL: I'M THE JFK OF 2008
VOWS TO BEAT ODDS
By MAGGIE HABERMAN Post Correspondent


March 11, 2007 -- NASHUA, N.H. - Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton invoked the campaign of the nation's lone Catholic president, John Kennedy, last night as she talked about her challenge in becoming the first female commander-in-chief.

"He was smart, he was dynamic, he was inspiring and he was Catholic. A lot of people back then <1960> said, 'America will never elect a Catholic as president,' " the White House hopeful told the New Hampshire Democrats' 100 Club fund-raiser here.

"But those who gathered here almost a half century ago knew better," she said. "They believed America was bigger than that and Americans would give Sen. John F. Kennedy a fair shake, and the rest, as they say, is history."

Noting women are "the majority" of voters and are in the workforce in "record numbers," she added, "So when people tell me 'a woman can never be president,' I say, we'll never know unless we try."

Kennedy's name is most often invoked by supporters of Clinton's main Democratic rival, Sen. Barack Obama, usually comparing their charisma.

more...

[Greeby]

1. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy

:eyes:

[DemKR]

2. And the guy who said that lost big

[NewYorkerfromMass]

57. Quayle WAS a loser

to_the_guy_who_said_it.

[MonkeyFunk]

61. In the debate, yes

but Quayle became Vice-President. Lloyd Bentsen didn't.

[sendero]

89. Doesn't make it..

.. any less true.

HRCs problem isn't that she's a female, her problem is that she stands for nothing.

[MGKrebs]

80. How so?

JFK was no saint, he had issues, and lots of enemies.

Given the vitriol towards HC, she may be more like JFK than she wants.

[DemKR]

3. Citing the NY post huh?

Well there's a paper that's on our side.

[babylonsister]

11. So, you think they 'made up' that quote? nt

[MonkeyFunk]

17. The headline is

made up entirely of whole-cloth.

Nowhere in the article does the quote appear.

She was talking about bigotry and voting, and used the example of Kennedy to clarify her point.

She never said "I'm the JFK of 2008"

Good God, you don't think the Post would mislead?

[babylonsister]

26. Yes, the Post is well-known for misleading. But Hillary was

begging for people to make the comparison by invoking JFK's name. And I'm not dissing her, just putting this out there for DU consumption.
If Obama or Edwards had made a similary statement, I would have posted that also had I found it.

[MonkeyFunk]

27. But she doesn't even compare herself to JFK

that is entirely made up.

Are you saying nobody can talk about the notion of anti-catholic bigotry among voters for fear of being compared to JFK?

Can Obama mention Lincoln was from Illinois without meaning he's the next Lincoln?

Sorry, but any objection to the real statements made by Clinton in this article are based entirely on the totally false headline.

[babylonsister]

29. I 'get it' that you are a Clinton supporter, and that's fine.

If she didn't want people to bring up her speech and her invocation of JFK, she should never have mentioned his name. It's not necessarily a bad thing either. She'll get lots of attention, and people like yourself will agree. And please don't accuse us of being 'liberal idiots' because we don't share your point of view. It makes you look petty.

[MonkeyFunk]

32. I've said repeatedly that

she is NOT my favorite choice. Right now, I'd prefer Gore, Clark or Obama to get the nomination.

But it is pure liberal idiocy to take this headline at face value, and it is even greater liberal idiocy to push lies and distortions against someone who may well be our party's nominee.

Disagree on substantive issues, but don't push lies like this one.

[mtnsnake]

42. WOW!! Did you ever take the bait!!

Do you really think Hillary said that she's the JFK of 2008? You can't possibly be that gullible. Yikes!!

[zulchzulu]

43. Another source

http://www.gothamist.com/2007/03/11/hillary_tries_t.php

Granted, we are in a time-space continuum where what Senator Clinton said is not actually what she said or meant.

Perhaps her words came from a vortex that is not really within the constraints of Earthly domain. Perhaps the event actually never existed and we live in an alternative parallel universe clearly out of reach of certain known but inevitably unproveable quantum realizations...

[rocktivity]

59. This story is the MUCH more professional of the two

Hillary Tries to Drive Home JFK Allusions

While campaigning New Hampshire yesterday, Senator Hillary Clinton...tried to use President John F. Kennedy as an example for her campaign:

"He was smart, he was dynamic, he was inspiring and he was Catholic. A lot of people...said, 'America will never elect a Catholic as president.' But those who gathered here almost a half century ago knew better. They believed America was bigger than that...and the rest, as they say, is history."

THIS is what journalism looks like, New York Post!

:headbang:
rocknation

[draft_mario_cuomo]

52. Its owner Rupert Murdoch held a fundraiser for Hillary, right?

I wonder why the NY Post/Faux News' owner hasn't held a $1,000 a plate fundraiser for any of the other Democratic candidates. ;)

[MonkeyFunk]

54. Yep!

She's a powerful NY Senator. Guess where the NY Post is head-quartered?

[draft_mario_cuomo]

58. States of Murdoch-backed Senate candidates since 2005 (to keep the list short)

Maryland (Michael Steele, Republican)
Pennsylvania (Rick Santorum, Republican)
Missouri (James Talent, Republican)
Virginia (George Allen, Republican)
Montana (Conrad Burns, Republican)
Tennessee (Bob Corker, Republican)
New York (Hillary Clinton, Democrat)
Tennessee (Harold Ford, Democrat and DLC chair in the primary. He backed Corker (R) in the general election)
Alaska (Ted Stevens, Republican)
New Hampshire (John Sununu, Republican)
Kentucky (Mitch McConnel, Republican)


Anyone notice a pattern here?

Fox News is his crown media jewel and is a national organization. Instead of hedging his bets and also holding a fundraiser for Obama, Clinton's chief rival, his media machine viciously attacked Obama. It seems he is more interested in pushing his ideology than his business interests (has he backed the Senate Majority Leader and House Speaker, who are very powerful? One would think he would do that if his main purpose was to protect his business interests).

[MannyGoldstein]

4. Oh Dear God

This is so disturbing, on so many levels, that I don't know where to start.

[MannyGoldstein]

6. 'There are those that look at things...

...the way they are, and ask why?

I dream of things that never were, and ask what's the safest position? What do the polls say? How can I get some shekels from it?"

[babylonsister]

15. Manny,

are you talking to yourself? :rofl: :spank:
I think she's going to regret the day she ever said that; I predict she'll take a lot of heat. Whatever possessed her?

[sandnsea]

53. roflmao

:rofl:

That was good.

[MonkeyFunk]

19. You could start

by reading the article and noting that Clinton never said the words attributed to her in the headline, nor did she even echo the sentiment.

[Larkspur]

5. Another delusion of grandeur by Hillary

She must be feeling the heat from Obama.

[MonkeyFunk]

22. Find me a real quote from

the article that shows delusions of grandeur.

The headline was entirely made up by a right-wing rag. Clinton never said that.

[graywarrior]

7. The more she talks, the more I lean toward Obama.

Hillary is the same old same old.

But my first vote goes to Kucinich.

[Evergreen Emerald]

70. is it the more she talks, or the more the media spins?

[Colobo]

8. JFK's speechwriter

Doesn't think that way, Hill. :)

[skipos]

9. America could elect a female president

I just have serious doubts that they would elect Hillary.

[elizm]

30. Yes...like Barbara Boxer.

I'd definitely vote for Boxer for President. But NEVER for Hillary.

[BlueStateModerate]

10. No, ma'am

With the charisma of a brick wall, she sullies JFK's name by comparing herself to him.

[longship]

12. It's called hubris

Pshaw!

Dear Hillary,

What are we going to do with you? You want our support but you seem to be doing and saying everything you can to get people to dislike you. Us Democrats want to be able to support a bright candidate like you, and a woman no less, which is something devoutly to be wished. But you really have to start looking before you leap. And your position on the Iraq war is about as clear as mud.

Us progressives will likely be with you no matter what if you manage to get the nomination. However, at this point nobody seems to be too sure that you can manage to get that nomination.

Maybe you need to get some fresh blood into that campaign of yours. You have plenty of time to do that, but remember that the longer you wait the more damage you'll have to undo.

Sincerely,
Watching and waiting, supporting nobody yet.

[Forkboy]

13. Yeah,and I'm Stephen Hawking.

[Ninja Jordan]

14. Obama reminds me of JFK

[MonkeyFunk]

16. Of course

the headline isn't a quote at all. She never said "I'm the JFK of 2008".

She's talking about overcoming bigotry-based voting, and used an example from 1960.

But that won't stop the Hillary-haters from claiming she said it, even though they have to quote a made-up New York Fucking Post headline to do it.

[Cameron27]

18. It's amazing isn't it?

She's not even one of my favorites and I feel compelled to defend her.

[MonkeyFunk]

20. Same here

she's about third on my list, and I find myself spending more time defending her against ridiculous smears here than I do discussing any other candidate.

[ruggerson]

41. I can think of a few people I prefer to her

I just don't think she's that good a politician.

But I feel compelled to defend her as well. This trashing of her is idiotic.

[MGKrebs]

82. I'm in the same boat.

My BS detector sometimes trumps my issue palette.

[wyldwolf]

21. What was that David Obey said about "liberals?"

Hillary Clinton never uttered the words attributed to her, yet "liberals" are piling on as though she did and (purposely?) missing her point.

[ruggerson]

23. This headline is a rightwingers INTERPRETATION of what she said

slanted by the NY Post to be as demeaning to Hillary as possible.

It is not a quote from the candidate. She never said those words.

Why is this posted here and why do some of you fall into the trap of agreeing with Rupert Murdoch and the rest of the far rightwing's spin on Hillary?

[MonkeyFunk]

24. Because

there are plenty of "liberal idiots" as evidenced by this thread.

People want to slam and destroy Clinton at all costs, even though she may well be our nominee.

It's one thing to promote your own candidate and make reasonable criticisms of others - but promoting this kind of bullshit is guaranteed to do nothing but hurt the party as a whole.

[ruggerson]

37. Yep. Your analysis is dead on correct. n/t

[IndianaGreen]

25. Hillary is Nixon, not Jack Kennedy!

Jack Kennedy was inspirational, and his New Frontier speech motivated tens of thousands to ask themselves what they could do for their country.

Hillary is polarizing and calculating, just like Nixon was, and the only people she will motivate are those in the Left and the Right that despise her. Hillary's own words in which she compares herself to JFK is in the Nixonian vein.

[MonkeyFunk]

28. Can you find

me a quote wherein she compares herself to JFK?

[IndianaGreen]

33. If you disregard the NY Post headline, and just read her statement, you see her Nixonian trait

JFK confronted concerns about his Catholicism head on by saying that he was not beholden to the Vatican and that if elected he would follow his conscience and the Constitution's separation of church and state. JFK never once said or implied that those that opposed him were anti-Catholic!

Hillary uses the JFK analogy to strongly imply to her audience that any opposition to her is because she is a woman, not because there are legitimate disagreements with her positions on the war, her endless pandering to the Iraeli rightwing and their American megaphones, and her shameless support of neoliberalism and "free trade."

[MonkeyFunk]

46. I did read the actual article

and nowhere in it does she compare herself to JFK.

The only comparison to JFK is in the fevered imaginations of the headline writer and the certifiable Clinton-haters here and in other places.

Curiously, if you read the thread on Freerepublic about this topic, they say the same exact things the "liberal idiots" here are saying. Hrmm....

[IndianaGreen]

49. Now, what could possibly possess you to go to Frei Republik and read that crap?

There is nothing in Freeperland that could be of interest to any rational person.

[MonkeyFunk]

51. Nice way to gloss over my point:

that they make the same mindless anti-clinton slurs as many people here.

I read all sorts of sites, not that it's much of your business.

[SaveElmer]

73. Selective memory...the Kennedys were as ruthless as they come...

Do a little reading for once before making foolish statements...if you think JFK's rise to power was on a wave of inspirational rhetoric you may want to pick up a history book....

[IndianaGreen]

76. Are you saying that Hillary is ruthless? Haven't we had enough ruthlessness already?

I rather have as President a man or woman that will adhere to the oath of office to "protect and defend the Constitution." We have had a series of Presidents that have failed in that regard, Bush being the most extremist manifestation of executive power run amok.

[SaveElmer]

77. I am rebutting your ridiculous talking point...

That Hillary is Nixonian and JFK was this shining beacon of rectitude prior to his election...

I do agree that Bush has ignored his duties re: constitution...

A worry I do not have in regards to Hillary

[IndianaGreen]

87. Has Hillary renounced and denounced her vote for PATRIOT?

I do agree that Bush has ignored his duties re: constitution...

A worry I do not have in regards to Hillary

The most dangerous thing the Bush regime has done to our country was its subversion of the Constitution and the consolidation in the Executive of powers the Constitution had bestowed in the judiciary and the legislative branches.

I want to hear every Democratic candidate declare that they will restore the Constitution as the Law of the Land, and reverse all of the actions taken by the Bush regime to infringe on our civil liberties, usurp the powers of Congress, and undermine the independence of the judiciary.

[JNelson6563]

31. I've no probelm with her actual quote

and I'm not a Hillary supporter. In context of what she is actually saying (discussing electoral firsts) it's a good comparison for her to use. I think it's shameful the way the Post chose to misrepresent it.

Julie

[ShortnFiery]

34. Oh, that's disgusting ... totally out of touch ... Madame Hubris!

:thumbsdown:

[MonkeyFunk]

35. Did you read the article?

It's a right-wing rag's smear piece on her.

She never said the words in the headline, or even echoed the sentiment.

I'm sorry this crap is allowed on DU - it's a baseless smear, and "liberal idiots" are tripping over themselves to believe it.

[ShortnFiery]

36. Even in context, HRC exudes an "I'm entitled" aura.

I'm tired of the same families running for President. We need new blood in Our Presidency if we wish to maintain a semblance of a democratic republic. :shrug:

On Edit: Congressman Obey is an horse's ass who needs to be ousted from office at his next Democratic Primary. :grr:

[MonkeyFunk]

38. It only seems that way

to people who are inclined to feel she believes she's "entitled".

That's why you have to use words like "aura".

And Congressman Obey has been doing more for the party for far longer than anybody hanging around here, and he will be easily re-elected for as long as he wants.

[ShortnFiery]

39. I hope not, IMO, Obey's a hot headed asshole whose time is up. n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

47. Nope

he's a solid liberal who's served since '69.

He said nothing worse than what gets said here a thousand times a day, and in HIS case, he was undeniably right.

[ShortnFiery]

66. Bullshit! Then he disrespects himself. Time for Obey to Go! n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

67. Scream it all you want

he ain't going.

He called an idiot an idiot - that's no reason to get rid of him. And he apologized. Demanding he be kicked out is childish.

[ShortnFiery]

74. I'm not screaming. And despite your arrogance for him, Obey is an a** due to change jobs. n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

75. Seriously...

explain why.

He's been a staunch liberal in the House for almost 40 years. So because of ONE comment he makes after being assaulted with a hidden camera - for which he immediately apologized - he should be thrown overboard?

Have you never said anything in the heat of the moment that you regretted? Should you have been fired for it?

I don't understand this type of thinking.

[ShortnFiery]

85. Seriously ...

You have a troubling habit of having to have the last word.

Go for it with my condolences. :hi:

[mtnsnake]

40. haha, the Post used a deceptive headline, and look at all the suckers falling for it

Why am I not surprised.

[w4rma]

62. Shows how polarizing she is. (nt)

[MonkeyFunk]

64. wait...

that half the people in this thread can't even read an article shows how polarizing Clinton is?

One doesn't follow from the other.

[mtnsnake]

69. Amazing isn't it

All the suckers fall for a totally deceptive headline from the NY Post. And why? Because of "how polarizing she is". WOW!!

That lady sure has some amazing powers. So now on top of everything else, Hillary is responsible for turning a large number of people into gullible fools. Too funny!

[w4rma]

78. Do you know what the effect of being polarizing is? People don't listen to you.

People tune you out. People don't trust you enough to listen past the first sentence and they even take that sentence in the worst possible light.

And then there are the zealots who believe that person can do nothing wrong. Or that that person is the equivalent of JFK ...

[mtnsnake]

79. What you defined isn't what the effect of being polarizing is

but you did define what being narrow minded is all about.

BTW, there isn't a person on this thread who believes Hillary compared herself to JFK, nor are there any posters on this thread who THINK she is the "equivalent of JFK".

It's one thing to be critical, but it's another to be ridiculous in your baseless assertions. Good gawd.

[paulk]

83. shows how polarizing some people want

her to be.

[oasis]

44. Hillary will make her own mark. All JFK, Eleanor/FDR, Margaret Thatcher or Bill Clinton

comparisons will quickly fade after her first term as president.

[monmouth]

45. Hillary is not my first choice either, but think about it......She is a highly

intelligent, very careful person. Never, ever, would she make such a stupid statement. This is why I'm reading DU or my local paper on a Sunday morning. Smears like this do not deserve the attention. Like Foxxxx, ignore it.

[cleveramerican]

48. If Hillary wins the nomination

you will see a third party candidate from the left enter the race and hammer her endlessly on the war, and her role in it.

[wyldwolf]

50. Why not the same for Edwards?

[AshevilleGuy]

60. Great. That would guarantee a repuke landslide.

Not that I think Hilary would win the general, but the last thing in the world we need next year is another third party spoiler from the Left. Which means it will probably happen. :eyes:

[cleveramerican]

68. all good reasons not to nominate HRC

[wyldwolf]

71. Again, "clever" American, why not the same for Edwards?

[cleveramerican]

84. Edwards is more humble

Hillary wears an air of entitlement, thats she cultivates. Its her main political weakness.


Again?

[wyldwolf]

90. so, in other words, Edwards sufficiently kissed your ass.

Hillary wears an air of entitlement, thats she cultivates. Its her main political weakness.

What has she done to give you this impression?

Again?

I asked you twice.

[cleveramerican]

92. Its not only me

there are just loads of dems( many right here) who know exactly what I mean.

Its not a thing she has done, its the tone she employs, so carefully crafted that she seems less than genuine.She doesn't seem to ever speak an unrehearsed line.


This is THE THING that irks people about her.

I'm quite sure you know what I mean.


Edwards hasn't kissed ass, but somehow he comes off as twice as genuine with half the effort.

[BenDavid]

55. ny post, faux news, anything to do with

news corp is bogus so why get all upset because they are doing exactly what they been doing for years and folks have let them get by with it, but that all changed the day William Jefferson Clinton appeared on Faux News Sunday and handed Chris Wallace his ass back to him on a platter. Now Dems will not take bs from faux news and if we could get alan colmes to at least come across as a liberal then we might gain something.....But all are correct, HRC never said she was the next JFK...all she said was "But those who gathered here almost a half century ago knew better," she said. "They believed America was bigger than that and Americans would give Sen. John F. Kennedy a fair shake, and the rest, as they say, is history."

[draft_mario_cuomo]

56. The owner of News Corp held a fundraiser for Hillary Clinton

If we are going to stand up to Faux News perhaps we should not nominate Rupert Murdoch's preferred candidate?

[Colobo]

63. From the HuffPost

"Hillary Quayle"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3157077

[MonkeyFunk]

65. That's a link

to a DU thread about Dennis Kucinich and the Fox debates.

[SaveElmer]

72. She has an excellent point...and as usual...

The "progressives" here avoid the point of her statement in an orgy of self gratifying bashing...

She is simply making the point, as is obvious, that as a woman running for President she faces a hurdle that has never been crossed before...

Just as JFK did as the first Catholic...

[PresidentObama]

81. She's not so much comparing herself to JFK, but relating to the situation he faced n/t

[Ronnie]

86. So many people here

seem to purposely miss the point. Or maybe they have problems with basic reading comprehension.

[cleveramerican]

88. Just maybe its you missing the point

perception is reality in politics. If it sounds bad, if you have to go back and "fix" it, even if it was completely misunderstood, it makes you look foolish, like she does.

[wyldwolf]

91. no... I think it is you

perception is reality in politics.

Only if you let the media dictate your perceptions.

[cleveramerican]

93. Face it, its sounded bad.

The only unforgivable sin in politics is looking foolish too often. This is one of those times.


Go ahead say I missed the nuance of it, That what we REALLY need.

[Ronnie]

94. What sounded bad?

The lie in the headline or what she actually said? Face it. You have a problem with comprehension. Or you pretend to. That is what looks foolish to me.

[cleveramerican]

98. if its only me

then why did she feel the need to "fix" it afterward?



when she drifts into senate-speak, we all must stand up and scream DON"T DO THAT.

[BenDavid]

95. I believe it's time I

write my thoughts about HRC and the constant negative statements by those that do not support her. For some reason, some Democrats in here can't say, "I prefer Edwards or Obama." No, that won't do - that would take a measure of adulthood. It is always something negative about HRC, but that is your right to express exactly what you desire. but I too get to write what I feel too....

I wonder if these same folks that respond to anything HRC puts out are the same ones that say she must apologize for her vote on Iraq and in some way claim she is enabling this war? Ask yourself how stupid it would sound to say,Max Cleland's enabling the Iraq war disaster, Joe Biden's enabling the Iraq war disaster, Tom Harken's enabling the Iraq war disaster, John Kerry's enabling the Iraq war disaster, Chuck Schumers enabling the Iraq war disaster.(On the Joint Resolution (H.J.Res. 114 voted Yea)

You see? It's no fun to hold Harken or Kerry responsible for BUSH's disaster, but the freshman senator from New York, SHE's responsible for BUSH's disaster all on her own. It was HER vote thats killed 3200 soldiers and Cleland, Kerry and Edwards had NOTHING to do with it.

If this is not you, then why is it that folks keep up the rant that HRC must apologize.....This fever reminds me of the GOP's impeachment fever back in 1998. Bill's impeachment was like a criminal assault and battery. NOTHING was going to stop that impeachment because they had the fever.
The GOP was "caught up" with impeachment fever - that's all they could see or hear. Bill's approval rating was in the 70s - and voters clearly didn't want him to be impeached, but like the criminal who can't stop until he assaults enough, it was GOING to happen.

Hell, the GOP lost seats in November of 1998 - but that didn't matter to them. NOTHING was going to stop that impeachment because they had the fever. They lived and breathed impeachment the way some people are now living and breathing "Stop her!"

IF YOU,LIKE ANOTHER CANDIDATE BETTER THAN HRC,VOTE FOR HIM OR HER...... But when I read some of the vitriol directed towards HRC, you got the fever and that tells me something.

And to THOSE DEMOCRATS, "I'll vote Republican before I'll vote for Her," Democrats need to worry because your "Stop her!" fever is turning you into what the GOP was in 1998.

[Clarkie1]

96. I prefer Obama. nt

[cleveramerican]

97. I think she's on her way to the nomination

I think she is the OVERWHELMING favorite at this point in the process.
I also think she has a major problem with how she is perceived outside Democratic Party circles.She seems completely unaware of this fact.

I will support the nominee, I hope it isn't her.


I'm not supporting anyone yet, I am watching the campaigns unfold. By the time primary season rolls around,(still pretty far off) my choice will be clear.